Monday Morning Stuff
Posted: October 17th, 2011 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 55 Comments »I’m working on the DGR. I’m hoping to get that posted tonight. I can’t tell you how much more fun it is to study a win. The past 4 weeks felt more like autopsies than game reviews.
One of the big questions people wanted answered was about the Wide-9. Here’s the deal. The Eagles did make some adjustments with that. One DE stayed out wide basically all the time. The other DE was on the TE on some run situations. If pass, the DE went back out wide. Mostly it was Babin at LDE playing more on the TE. There were a few times when it was done with the RDE. Honestly, I didn’t think this made much of a difference.
The key to the good run defense was the DTs. Mike Patterson had a terrific game. Cullen Jenkins and Derek Landri had good games. They got penetration on a regular basis and were disruptive.
I’d love to tell you the LBs made significant strides, but didn’t look that way to me. Jamar Chaney played his best game so far, but still has a long way to go. I was disappointed in Moise Fokou. This was his kind of matchup, but he didn’t deliver.
Tackling was huge. 2 parts to this. There weren’t nearly as many missed tackles as in past games. Guys did a good job of making stops. On those plays when a player did get away from the initial defender, we had players in pursuit that were able to clean up the misses. This is critical. NFL skill players aren’t easy to tackle. It is essential that other players swarm to the ball to finish plays. Brian Rolle, Nate Allen, and Kurt Coleman were very big in this regard.
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Any good trade rumors? Not that I’m hearing.
Any talk about Denver and Dawk is bogus. That was based on a comment by Adam Schefter and he made it clear that it was purely hypothetical. Just an idea, not a rumor. Dawk isn’t coming back to Philly. And I know you don’t want to hear this…but he wouldn’t be the upgrade that many people think. He was a great player, but age has caught up with our hero.
No word on any LB moves. Eagles haven’t worked any free agent LBs out. I don’t know than anyone of real value would be available in a trade.
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One thing that did make me happy yesterday…more press coverage. I think that played a part in the Skins going 1 for 10 on 3rd downs. Asante wasn’t giving up freebies like last week.
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Brandon Graham is eligible to come off the PUP list. I’ll write up a post on him.
If we do activate him, we need to clear a roster spot. I’d gladly cut Jarrad Page.
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Watching Dallas play the Pats yesterday was highly confusing. The Boys looked really good for parts of that game. Their defense gave Tom Brady fits. Dallas also made a ton of mistakes. They couldn’t score points and that let NE stay in position to steal the win.
I was on a radio interview last week and the host asked me who would win the NFC East. I literally didn’t know what to say. I don’t trust any of the 4 teams. The Giants are in front now, but haven’t closed a season strongly in a while. The Skins don’t have a QB. We are similar to Dallas. Talented roster, but highly inconsistent team. Pick your poison.
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Talked to a buddy about Shady last night after the game. Is he better than Brian Westbrook? He’s on pace to be. Key is that we need to see Shady do this all year. Westy carried the team in 2006 and 2007. If Shady continues to play at this level, he’ll be one of the top RBs in the league. Brian was more of a weapon. PR. Receiver. RB.
Shady is a great RB. Love the fact we’ve been lucky enough to have both of these guys play for us.
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In the last 6 quarters the defense has put up these numbers:
Points – 23
Total Yards – 440
Rushing – 32-115 … 2 TD runs (John Beck, Brad Smith)
3rd downs – 2 for 17
Red Zone – 2 for 5
We are seeing some progress.
I have no idea if moving one DE in a little bit makes a difference, but it certainly sounded like Reid liked the change. Of course, that could also be a coaching providing answers to reporters questions just to answer the question. The one thing I did notice in ARs press conference today was that he never talked about Castillo or Washburn separately. I am curious if there was some kind of change in Castillo’s/Washburn’s responsibility in order to make sure that they were on the same page more often. Don’t take my words out of context though, I’m not saying Washburn is calling the plays, or Castillo was demoted or anything like that. I just thought it was interesting that he mentioned the two together throughout the press conference.
Yesterday was amazing from a defensive perspective, but the second half offense was baffling. I really would like to know what happens in the locker room at halftime that causes our offense to refuse to score points.
judging by some of the things ive read today, it sounds like we surprised the skins with our offensive game plan – playing the short & intermediate passes instead of the deep throws that we burned them so badly with last game.
my guess is that they took some time during the half to analyze what we were doing and figure out how they wanted to counter this.
the problem then becomes this – why didnt we have a counter of our own? is it stupid to just expect the same gameplan to continue to work (expect the D to not make any changes at all)? i sure think it is. why not prepare a secondary game plan – the gameplan you move to when the primary game plan has been countered by an adaptive defense.
On Shady v. Westbrook: I think there’s a difference between competence at position and being a dangerous weapon. DeSean Jackson is our most dangerous weapon right now, but I really think Maclin is the better all around receiver. Reggie Bush: dangerous weapon, shitty RB.
I think Westbrook was clearly our most dangerous weapon then–one of the most dangerous in the league and one of the most dangerous we’ve ever had. But he was never the between-the-tackles runner McCoy is. Westbrook was a good RB who was an extremely dangerous weapon. McCoy is a good weapon, but an extremely good running back who’s showing flashes of greatness.
Along with what you posted, I think real difference is in durability, and how fast they developed.
Westy learned to be a between the tackles runner starting in about 2005, and really hit his prime in 2006. Since it took so long for him to “get there” and since he was bitten with the injury bug, he didn’t have many prime years.
Shady became a workhorse a lot faster than Westy did. He also has been more durable. He’ll probably never be the weapon that westbrook was, but he’ll have a more productive career.
To pile on, I love both of their mentalities. Both of them seem, or seemed, more interested in celebrating with their teammates than showboating.
I used to love how Westy would just toss the ball to the ref and jog to the sideline after a touchdown. “Yep, I scored another touchdown, part of the job.”
Shady’s scores have the same feel, if not quite as business like. On the sideline, you can see that he is having fun and enjoying being with his team.
Great role models, both of them.
Also thanks to the Deadskins fans that put up the sign near the endzone “Dream Team – Reid this – 1-5” – good way to rally your opponents…I was hoping for a TD from DJax who would slam the ball on that poster….also Tommy quite a few times Haslett in the end zone went into the zero blitz look with no one in the middle of the field…why was it that we could not take advantage? I would like MM and AR work with Vick specifically on that look, because I am pretty sure Dallas and the Giants will run the same look at us
I’m kind of confused we didn’t run any slants in those situations. Seemed to me the one time we wanted to run a slant to the right to Maclin. I think he may have ran the wrong route. The offensive line crashed left and gave Vick a clear passing lane to Maclin one on one and no back help for the Redskins.
Pass went incomplete.
I *wish* we would get that look more often. I thought it was Haslett playing with fire.
On one hand you rush Vick and try to cause turnovers, which seems sound. On the other, you leave your DBs one on one with Jackson, Maclin, Avant et. al. … only calling it in short yardage might negate the ability for Jackson to beat you deep, but it plays into Avant’s hands.
I think the shovel pass was the response. Let the rushers pass the running back, then send him up the middle. It worked once and it should have worked twice.
Still, I agree that a slant would have been nice to see.
Or let Celek or Harbor “miss” their block, then release straight up the middle while Shady picks up his guy.
I feel like Vick is starting to look like Donny did when he was in the red zone. Lots of looking, no decision making. It concerns me.
Maybe the problem is the scheme. Not the QB
That 3rd down conversion stat is insane, really really hope we can keep that up.
Vick still makes me nervous in press conferences, he sometimes seems to be half humble and realistic/half cocky and complacent.
There was a Vick quote in a few articles today (can’t find it now >.<) along the lines of
"It was only one game and we still have a lot of work to do, but i'm really happy with where we are now"
Really happy with where we are now?? 2-4??
Vick has had a few comments I didn’t like, but I think you are parsing that comment a bit too much. He is saying that we still have things we need to improve on, but we made major strides towards turning the season around. That’s not all that controversial of a statement.
Yeah, I don’t see any problem with that at all. And don’t we want our leader to be confident? Geeze. McNabb got killed for not sounding like that for a decade.
It’s not an exact quote and actually looks better the way I’ve written it. Probably overreacting massively but its one of many comments that sow a slight seed of doubt. Win again and I’ll start to believe it’s me being a crazy man!
I’m assuming after the bye they will go back to the more conventional wide 9. If Graham can play, they’ll have their 6 DE rotation they’d like to have.
I’m concerned about Celek. I can understand his productivity going down when he’s in to block, but he was targetted this game and it seems his hands have turned to stone.
Take that play early in the game where he juggled and caught the ball as he fell backwards. Sure, it took some concentration to pull that off and it made a great highlight, but that was dangerous. He should have caught it in the first place. So many of our turnovers have been off batted/juggled passes and that was dangerously close to another. Later in the game he had another juggled/dropped pass that should have been routine.
Agreed! That amazing catch of his should’ve never even happened. The ball hit him right in the hands before he dropped the catch and made it hard on himself.
Yeah, this was discussed before, too. It seems to match up pretty well with his hand injury, and with McNabb leaving. Who knows, maybe it is that his thumb isn’t right, maybe it is chemistry, maybe it is that he spends a lot more time practicing blocking nowadays.
I’m concerned too. And, Tommy, tell your friend that no one has started Celek in a fantasy league in a year and a half.
TOMMY:
On an historical note . . . the Eagles could be in rare company to have McCoy follow Westbrook. Time will tell.
Think back through (modern) NFL history of teams w/ great RBs — a category I put Westbrook in because he could, and, dominate games.
Then think about who replaced these great RBs.
For example, in Pittsburgh, Franco Harris and Jerome Bettis were followed by Frank Pollard/Walter Abercrombie [for Harris] and Willie Parker, respectively.
In Detroit, Barry Sanders was followed by Greg Hill.
In Tennessee, Eddie George was followed by Chris Brown.
The Redskins John Riggins was followed by George Rogers (who had only two good seasons behind that great O-line).
The Colts had Marshall Faulk, whom they moved to make room for Edgerrin James — while Faulk was in his prime (so I count these two as one player). Then it’s been Joseph Addai and Donald Brown.
The ‘Boys had Tony Dorsett and Emmitt Smith: their replacements were Hershel Walker and Troy Hambrick, respectively.
In Buffalo, OJ Simpson’s and Thurmon Thomas’s successors were Terry Miller (a 1-year wonder) and Antowain Smith.
The Jets had Curtis Martin — but had to trade for Thomas Jones to find a temporary replacement.
The Eagles of the Dick Vermeil era had Wilbert Montgomery . . . followed by Ernest Jackson, Antony Toney, Keith Byars, Hershel Walker, Ricky Watters, Duce Staley — then finally Westbrook.
The Raiders cut loose Marcus Allen for . . . Bo Jackson. That would have been brilliant move by Al Davis but for Jackson’s injury. Then came a used-up Roger Craig, Navy great Napoleon McCallum, who suffered the worst knee/leg injury I ever saw (except for Joe Theismann’s on MNF), and a used-up Eric Dickerson.
Reaching farther back . . . in Green Bay, Jim Taylor and Paul Hornung (and back up Elijah Pitts) were followed by Jim Grabowski and Donnie Anderson — called the “Gold Dust” twins because they leveraged their college success to get GB to outbid the AFL for their services.
And the Bears’ Gale Sayers was followed by the likes of Don Shy, Ross Montgomery, ex-Eagle Cyril Pinder, and Carl Garrett.
[I’m excluding Terrell Davis for a couple reasons. First, his short career. Second, during that era in Denver, every RB that Shanahan plugged in was a 1200+ yard rusher — which, for me, separates Gale Sayers, who was a great receiver and maybe the best KO returner/Punt returner in NLF history, from Davis.]
[I’ve left out some others, I’m sure.]
HERE ARE THE WINNERS — and there’s just a small handful:
1. Rams had Marshall Faulk then Steven Jackson — back to back.
2. The Bears’ Walter Payton was followed by Neal Anderson — back to back.
3. Denver had Floyd Little (HOF) followed by Otis Armstrong.
But the best . . . BY FAR . . . the Cleveland Browns had Jim Brown (HOF) followed by Leroy Kelly (HOF). That was back in the mid-’60s.
BOTTOM LINE:
Replacing a great/HOF running back is not quite as hard as finding a franchise QB.
But it’s clearly not very easy either. [I’m sure I’ve left out someone or another. But I don’t think it would change the conclusion.]
Now the Eagles have Westbrook followed by McCoy . . . and as long as McCoy stays healthy, the Eagles will be in rare company.
Reid — for all the grief he gets w/ his drafts — hit grand slams w/ Westbrook and McCoy.
Good stuff. Love research like that and NFL history talk.
Great post.
Wow. When I finished I had to scroll back up to see who wrote this. Fantastic research, good observations.
There is a certain amount of irony that 2 great backs have emerged under the one Eagles coach who seems to use them least.
Though Duce may not have been a great back, he was a very good one, 4th all-time rushing yards just ahead of the most fluid and trans-formative rusher. Before him was Watters who is 6th on that list. We certainly have been blessed of late, especially for those of us who remember the 80’s and early 90’s, when scraps were so sparse that Heath Sherman looked like the 2nd coming. What does this say about our RB coach Ted Williams? I say unsung genius.
One last comment, you mentioned Thurman Thomas and Barry Sanders, I wonder if and college had ever produced 2 such backs back to back? Certainly OSU has never had 2 greater backs.
TOMMY:
You wrote: “Is he [McCoy] better than Brian Westbrook? . . . Westy carried the team in 2006 and 2007.”
You’re clearly right. Westy did carry those teams.
But if Reid had added better WRs (and TEs) after the TO disaster to complement Westy — the way Maclin/D-Jax/Avant/Celeck complement McCoy — would Westy have had to carry the Eagles?
Reid seems to be a big spread-it-around guy. (McNabb’s best games were when he involved 8-9 receivers.)
Regardless, I thought Westy was the best Eagles back since Wilbert Montgomery. Maybe better. But just not as durable as Wilbert.
I think McCoy is showing he’s more durable than Westy. And a lot like Wilbert.
But I’ve not seen a RB who, game in and game out, can make 90-degree cuts without losing any speed like McCoy since the days of Gale Sayers.
The guys I watched the game with almost banished me from the room when I made the Shady-Westy comparison. I was called a blasphemer, which was the only word used larger than four letters. They finally let me get away with saying that Shady is Westbrook-esque. The debate turned to comparing Wilbert and Westy with no clear agreement. I proposed that I’d take Wilbert over the course of a season but Westy for any given day.
I’ll try out the Gale Sayers comparison and see how it goes. As a kid, Sayers was my favorite non-Eagle.
http://cdn0.sbnation.com/imported_assets/835835/qovh92.gif
Nanmdi lowering the boom – I can’t stop watching Brian Rolle runing at the end. It’s hypnotic.
lol
its like he’s running over while trying not to move his arms
Looks like Sheldon’s old number is working its magic.
I could watch that 100 times. That is the best counterargument to those that say the league is trying to legislate the physical side of the game away.
What were the 2nd half drive killers?
The 2 I remember are: VY interception and Vick throw going too high for Avant on 4th and 2 ending a promising drive.
6 drives in 2nd half:
1 – Vick INT
2 – VY INT
3 – 4th and 2 (also failing on a 3rd and 1 run). Possibly in FG range (WAS 32yd line)
4 – Sack and DoG penalty set up 3rd and 16. Shady run gets 9yds.
5 – Near midfield. 3yd Lewis run, inc pass to Celek (drop?), 4yd pass to Avant. Punt on 4th and 3
6 – Game ending drive
No word on any LB moves. Eagles haven’t worked any free agent LBs out. I don’t know than anyone of real value would be available in a trade.
One name: DJ Williams!
Adam Caplan said yesterday that DJ isn’t 100% healthy. He’s only played in 2 games. Might have an elbow injury if I remember correctly.
Bad contract as well. Expensive and hurt isn’t a good combo.
Fair enough hairy muff. I’d still consider giving up a cond. 4th rounder for him. Our starting LB trio is still one of the worst in the league, if NOT the worst!
Kind of surprised about one area that has gone un-Morton’ed.
* David Akers went 3/3 yesterday, including a 55 yarder.
* Sav Rocca leads the league in punts downed inside the 20yd line (14), helped by 2 against the Eagles yesterday. He also has 0 touchbacks and is tied for 3rd in fair catches.
Compare that to:
* AR chooses to go for it up 14 points on 4th and 2 rather than attempt a 50yd FG
* Chas Henry being the 4th worst in punts inside the 20yd line with just 3. He’s tied for 3rd worst in fair catches and 4th worst in touchbacks.
Surely there’s some hindsight-assisted rage due. I’ll get it started for you.
Damn that idiot [Banner/Roseman/Reid/Castillo] for going with rookies at [kicker/punter/guard/linebacker] while letting great players like [Akers/Rocca/Dawkins/S. Brown/Clemons/Babin/Sonny Jurgensen] go!!!
I don’t trust either kicker in a big situation. It’s already cost us one game (SF, although the D/Maclin didn’t help). It’ll happen again.
It is very telling when AR chose to go for it in that situation, but even I was thinking before the 4th down “they should probably go for it if they don’t convert.” So I’m not 100% sure he went for it based on our kicker alone. It just seemed like a good situation.
What a hilarious post: un-Morton’ed … due for hindsight-assisted rage.
And the template for complaint – that’s pure genius.
btw, did you see Sean Lee’s interception yesterday? I can’t see Moises Loki Chaney, Tommy’s long-lost son, having the athleticism to make that play.
i didnt see the INT, but chaney did have a pretty athletic INT not too long ago…
So what does you all see us doing on the o-line when everyone is healthy?
– Peters is one of the best tackles in football
– Mathis has been good this season, 2nd best LG according to PFF.
– Kelce is the center and that probably won’t change
– Danny finally won the starting position at RG
– At RT Herremans has been okay, Justice has been good in the past and looked good yesterday (to me at least) and finally Dunlap is a good backup to have.
I’m not sure how ready Winston’s leg is but Reid didn’t exactly say he would be back on the bench again. But where does Herremans go then? You can’t really bench him. Replace Mathis is possible, but as said Mathis has played well. Can you bench your 1st round pick… again?
I think everyone goes back to their positions they had in Week 1, with the exception of Watkins who will keep the RG job. Continuity in the offensive line is important and I don’t think the coaches want to keep juggling the line up unless it’s absolutely necessary as it was yesterday.
In short, Week 8’s offensive line will look like this:
Peters – Mathis – Kelce – Watkins – Herremans
Couple of random thoughts:
What a savvy play by London Fletcher getting Vick off the field during the third quarter. Also, I think Mike Kafka should be the backup QB not Vince Young. Young looked atrocious in his short time there.
I love the way Dion Lewis gets small and follows his blocking on run plays. Little guy just kinda squirts through there. Small guy but doesn’t run like a typical scat back.
Pass rush didn’t look so great yesterday. I wonder if its because we can’t rotate as heavily as we’d like. Missing Trent Cole doesn’t help either.
Kurt Coleman better not regress again, dude has talent thats for sure.
Did anyone hear Winston Justice’s name during the game or has anyone even mentioned his name since? Thats a good sign if you’re an OL, remember it wasn’t too long ago since he was considered one of the most colassal busts in recent memory.
Jeremy Maclin quietly had another good game. He’s not the most dangerous of our top 2 recievers but he’s definitely the most consistent.
Once again, eff London Fletcher, I love his game but hate that he plays for one of our rivals.
Hi Tommy,
What do you think about trading VY to the Raiders? They’re desperate for a QB and I think they like his abilities, size, strong arm, speed and mobility? I’m more comfortable with Kafka as the backup anyway. He seems to understand the offense better and showed more stability amd comfidence when he played than VY did. Might as well get something to improve the team for him since his contracts up in a couple mth. anyway.Do you think the Raiders would be interested in him right now since there starters out 4 the yr?
Would like to trade Asamte, but don’t think it’s a good idea due to the chemistry and his leadership in the locker room. I guess might have to wait til summer. Shouldn’t they trade JamJax, even if for a 5th rd pick, he’d be a major help to anyone that needs a C and we can bring in that C/G who was drafted by Mudd in Imdi(started 7 games for him as a rookie 4 yrs. ago) who was ome of there last cuts this yr.?
I wonder if the raiders would be crazy enough to give us a 1st rd pick 4 VY…..then again maybe that would be fair asking price? They need to trade a DE also I think….?
I would be ok with trading Young, but no way I want to trade Asante or JamJax. Asante is alot better that DRC. I think JamJax is important depth. Injuries can happen any time and no late round draft pick you could get for JamJax is worth not having a center if Kelce gets hurt.
That’s funny. Good work.
On that Revies 100 yard TD return, he was jogging from midfield. There is no one on the Dolphins offense with enough pride to make him run for his touchdown? Especially playing against a hated rival?
Tommy,
Do you think the INTs for the safeties may become a trend? With most QBs probably hesitant to throw near the sidelines because of Samuel and Asomugha, do you think we’ll see more in the middle of the field and deep middle?
Adam Schefter
Carson Palmer to the Raiders now official. Compensation expected to be a 1 in 2012 and a conditional 1 in 2013.
Chris Mortensen
The Raiders’ fallback if they couldn’t have landed Palmer? Vince Young.
DAMNIT
ahh man! i would have parted with VY for SOOOO much less than 2 1sts.
he really wasnt helping things with his play on sunday. imagine if he had come on to the field and played well? WE could be the ones getting two 1st rounders!! arghhhhh
Now if the Brown family actually spent money on a scouting department. The fact that they’ve hit so well lately is a testament to some of those low-payed guys they have now.
The Eagles should try fleecing some of those guys away.
Jason Campbell’s days in Oakland are numbered.
Just like Vince Young’s in Eagle green.
Campbell wouldn’t be a half-bad back-up next year in Philadelphia.
Well, VY would be gone after this year anyway.
Asante for Lance Briggs. You read it here first. 😉