The Reading Room
Posted: October 19th, 2013 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 74 Comments »Lots of great stuff to read and check out.
Bo Wulf did a great job with his Wulf’s Den piece for this week. He talked to a slew of people about the 44-6 win over Dallas from 2008. That is always a fun game to look back at. This note cracked me up.
Merrill Reese: In fact, I said on the air, and Andy Bloom, who’s the operations manager for CBS Radio, he still remembers me saying – I gave the score, and it was so one-sided that I felt compelled to say, “I’m not drunk. This is the actual score.”
Go read the whole piece. Lots of great stories from Dawk, Runyan and other guys. Fun trip down memory lane.
* * * * *
My weekly BGN piece centered on Todd Herremans and Lane Johnson and their improved play. There was a lot of discussion about Herremans and how he might need to be replaced. Luckily Todd fixed some technique issues and is playing much better.
* * * * *
Jeff McLane wrote a good article on the Chip Kelly-LeSean McCoy relationship and how that has evolved. The most interesting nugget was actually this.
That phrase – “to buy in” – is a nebulous one. But after five years in the locker room, when certain veterans, away from cameras and with microphones off, tell you they’ve bought in, you can tell what seems genuine and what seems fake.
Three victories in six games – one fewer win than the Eagles had all of last season – have helped. So has Kelly’s explosive offense, which appears legit enough to keep opposing defensive coordinators obsessed with stopping it. There will be trials, like last month’s three-game skid, but Kelly has passed the sniff test and has the trust of the players as much as one can gather.
Jeff also posted his weekly notes column. The opening part is on Fletcher Cox.
Cox doesn’t turn 23 until December. If five games were all it took for him to adapt to a new scheme, the Eagles could have the building block they thought they were getting when they moved up to draft him out of Mississippi State.
I certainly think Cox is going to be a key part of this defense for the foreseeable future. He hasn’t become a star yet, but anyone who thinks Cox is a bust or anything like that is flat out nuts. He is a good young player. The question is how good he can become. Last Sunday he was a difference-maker. It would be great to see that type of performance on a more regular basis.
* * * * *
Fran Duffy did his weekly piece, breaking down the last game and previewing the Dallas game for PE.com. Fran is terrific with X’s and O’s.
He covered Fletch in that breakdown. The guys from Eagles Game Plan also did that in their video segment. It is fun to see Cox and Ced Thornton wreaking havoc with O-linemen.
* * * * *
I’ll post a game preview later.
_
The Nick FOles non believers are in for another surprise. Funny how so many smart writers and fans came to the conclusion that he could only be a career backup after 6 games in a rookie year sorrounded by trash….oh that’s right, he was picked in the 3rd round..
…
FOles isn’t ready to set the world on fire, but once he gets some continuity and experience he will be the man to take us to the promised land…fans might as well stop wasting their time watching college QBs lol
…
Fly Folesy Fly!!!
Foles will play Jesus in the next controversial Hollywood adaptation. Unless all his time is taken up getting better.
I’m sure he can afford to come in late to the Manning Passing Camp next year… playing Jesus seems a much more legit excuse than they’re willing to cover for…
I know your thing is to go over the top, and I think it adds to the conversations here nicely.
I am a little worried, though, that the professionals that are supposed to be the sound voices of reason seem to be going the same direction. Foles is going to have down games. If he is really the future and really going to grow into the team’s stable QB, we need to temper expectations and allow some room for growing pains. The reaction to Derek’s work recently was particularly troubling.
This is a building year, we don’t need him to be great, just to show we can be confident he will be consistently good. We don’t want public opinion to be a pendulum, but rather a pyramid with a solid, broad foundation that can build into a wonder. Too much hype will only provide fodder for the naysayers.
Wise words, ATG.
I know, and I say it tongue and cheek…there are so little rational fans and writers these days that I can’t worry about fueling their irrational fire of instant gratification..when you get me to talk seriously, I always talk about the natural progression of players and teams needing to come together…when I shouted from the top of the mountain that we are closer then we think to having the players in place to get back to a true philly defense, you never seen me waiver from that oppinion during the tough early season performances. I don’t have time to coddle people about not having their oppinions skewed because a few QBs had success at rookies last year….when I praise FOles and many of the defenders that we have in place, I’m not talking about today, I’m talking about who they will eventually grow to be. Today means very little to me, it’s about getting the right young players in place and letting them take their lumps so they can grow to be that philly style of team that we can love. my belief in FOles isn’t about today…it’s about two years from now. I see “IT” in the kid, even when it’s not pretty….and there is nothing anyone can say, or anything that can happen in Sundays game to waiver from that…I spent too much time watching him play for mysf? a going back and watching most of his arizona games, and watching all his snaps as an eagle in detail for me to care what anyone else sees in him.. I defer to others when it’s a player I haven’t put in enough time watching to have a valuable oppinion that I can trust… I put in the work for FOles, I know what I saw…so while I don’t expect him to arrive overnight! I’m convinced that he eventually pays dividends for us…..a great or horrible performance by him on Sunday won’t change…I’m just thrilled that he will get chance to take some lumps so he can grow from them…if we weren’t playing our most hated rival,the. I wouldn’t even care what happened.
..
i don’t expect instant gratification, this year is about gaining that experience and cohesion that is needed so that we can really make judgments on what we have
But my oppinions have been in the minority, so I took a lot of heat for them…so when guys show why I believed in them, y’all are going to have to hear it? I had to rip my hair out all the times I had to hear no talent on defense, or already making plans to draft a QB in round 1, or the popular “the future QB of the Eagles isn’t on our roster yet”…That’s all I heard for 6 months til I wanted to bang my head against the wall..so now I’m going to make them hear it! Lol
…
Fly Folesy Fly on the road to Victory…fight fight Fight!!!
And I don’t begrudge you shouting his praises from the rooftops, as a fan that is fantastic (ahem).
I asked you this question before, but you didn’t answer: why always FOles? What’s the point behind that?
Ugh…autocorrect
Lol. I thought if you write it all the time, you’d see it. So I thought it’s a weird nickname or something like that. FOles, the foe for all the opponents. Or something like that. 😀
I think what a lot of fans and outsiders are seeing is that Foles is *capable* of running this offense at the very least, and at this point in the team’s rebuilding process, its incredibly important to give Foles the opportunity to get reps, experience, and “see what we have here.”
Foles does a lot of things well – he demonstrates poise, functional movement in the pocket (h/t greg cossell), a willingness to go through his progressions, and accuracy. Now lets see him in pressure situations, lets see if he can make the big throws, the “NFL throws” (deep outs, seam routes, etc) that separate the true starting caliber QBs from the game manager types. He’s shown glimpses of being able to do these things, but not on a consistent basis by any means. So agreed, lets allow him some room for growing pains, without criticizing every slightly sub-optimal throw (e.g. the “underthrown” TD pass) or getting too excited about every big league throw he makes.
As far as Derek’s comments go, I stand by my comments on the other thread. I have no problem with Derek criticizing Foles, that’s his job. I just think he should get off his soapbox and stop implying that anyone who thinks Foles *could* be a starting QB in this league has half a brain. I don’t see whats troublesome about that, if you’re going to put yourself out there as a “voice” in the media, you should expect to be criticized as well. Welcome to 2013.
Well said Mate… The anti FOles sentiment is so prevalent that the few rational fans that know that he needs time and experience to grow before we ever get to find out, have to be vocal even if we prefer to sit and wait to try to balance the scales….when you have the majority of writers and fans talking about FOles being traded and that he could never play for Chip Kelly since the day Kelly got hired! it’s tough not to get excited when he shuts people up. The truth is that it could still go either way with the kid. he has both boom and bust potential…and since I love this damn team and it’s players! I won’t ever go with Bust until it’s proven on the field…that hasn’t happened yet with FOles so the doom and gloom is annoying
Well, I think we completely agree about Foles. As for Derek, I don’t read his stuff as implying the same thing that you inferred. I have read Derek for a while, and he certainly does not call fans dumb.
Derek was just an example, though. Tommy receives some comments when he doesn’t drool to the requisite level, according to some Foles supporters.
Yeah, I guess I just read his tweets a little differently. Especially during games. Its nothing worth getting into again.
I think most reasonable fans would see Foles and recognize potential for a good starting QB based off what we’ve seen. Potential certainly isn’t always (or even often) realized, so there is definitely a window of time where Foles will need to both show consistency and improve.
I know I don’t expect excellent Playoff football from Foles at this point and I am sure he’s going to have some down games along the way. He might not be the future starter after all is said and done, so to believe that he is before he’s proven it there has to be an element of faith involved.
It’s unfortunate that conversation on Foles generates such extremes. I take exception to the people saying that they already have enough evidence that Foles isn’t the answer and is fated to be a career back-up at best. But I think it’s perfectly reasonable to want to see him play so we can answer the consistency and improvement questions.
I also think as Eagles fans we should all be hoping he pans out to be great and our guy for the future. It’s the most optimal scenario for the team and the best allocation of resources we could hope for.
I’m surprised so much of the Foles praise has gone his way instead of toward Chip. While I acknowledge Derek’s point that Foles’ deep passing percentages are unsustainable, I think there’s a BIG kudos to Chip for calling those plays in high percentage situations that has gone underreported (especially considering the guy he replaced as playcaller…). Love to see that Chip adapts so well to his talent on offense.
Chip really has been masterful with his play calling as of late….but that doesn’t diminish what FOles was able to do, cold off the bench with one real week of practice
A lot of good points made in this conversation. One cause for fear I have is that I don’t trust Kelly to stick with Nick through the growing pains. Time will tell.
As for those so quick to write off Foles, the most irritating feature of that crowd is that they may be guessing correctly. If so, they will take that as validation that they knew all along. Having an opinion is one thing. Speaking with complete certainty that the evaluation period is over and you now know the player’s future is quite another. Especially when the preponderance of evidence is of the promising variety.
btw T-Law, your site is now blocked at my work place as email/spam. I’m not sure how sites get labeled by our filters, and I doubt there’s anything you can do about it, but hey, knowing is half that battle and whatnot.
Iggles Blitz blocked? Is your boss a Cowboys fan?
I can still get to Birds 24/7.
Sorry to hear that. I’ve not made any recent changes. And I’ve avoided allowing gambling ads, which I’m told will cause some companies to block sites.
Thank you for your sympathies. My lunch breaks just haven’t been the same.
try getting through via proxy.
The Eagles made a move at RB.
http://eaglesblog.net/2013/10/eagles-do-make-a-rb-move/
Probably a good move. I’m expecting heavy use of Shady in this game. I wonder if Bryce is starting to slip in the eyes of the coaching staff.
I wonder how much not playing much in college and really not playing much in this offense is a challenge for Bryce. He obviously has good physical ability, yet it seems that he is still trying to figure out a few things.
I’d like to see more power runs with Bryce and a few more screens (he has more home run speed than Shady).
Well he is pretty young. Faith in Duce to get him straight and make sure he’s picking up the blitz, blocking well and getting N/S rather than looking to bounce things wide.
I know CK doesn’t like to keep players based on potential, but I hope Bryce sticks until he figures it out. As you say – he looks like he has all the ability.
That move is based on Polk been injured
A bit of love for Chip Kelly.
http://eaglesblog.net/2013/10/some-love-for-chip-kelly/
I’m willing to bet that the smarter NFL coaches like Bill Belichick, Sean Payton, Mike McCarthy, and Jim Harbaugh are going to use packaged plays very soon. It will be interesting to see what happens on the day that the Eagles defense will have to take on an offense that uses them.
Kinda makes you see why Kelly wants a defense that can stop his own offense.
Just look at Oregon, they now have the 11th ranked defense according to footballoutsiders.
Except without the man coverage.
I’ve said this before so I apologize for boring you, but the 44-6 game was my son’s 1st time watching with me and my buddies. We live in VT, so we few and proud Eagles fans suffer the bragging of the Pats guys all the time. We pass on our Eagles love to our sons, who have to put up with the other kids at school bragging about Brady and all their SB wins.
We don’t curse around our home, so he has grown up understanding about proper language. Our one exception is during the Cowboys games, where anything goes, My son was 5 at the time of the game, so his cursing was limited to calling the Cowboys “poopy diaper butss.” Not a bad start on his way to more refined variations of “Dallas Sucks!” He probably weighed about 50 lbs. After every Eagles score, he asked that I toss him up in the air. We celebrated 44 tosses that day, best workout I ever had. The kid got off to a great start as an Eagles fan.
I do remember you telling that story before, but it is definitely worth repeating. Good stuff.
Thanks for understanding. I just hope his sons are not still waiting for a Super Bowl win.
Don’t know how to take that.
Yeah, it took me a few readings. He means that he hopes when his son grows up and has kids of his own we are all not still waiting around for that first SB win.
Yea, that’s what I meant.
I sure would like to experience the feeling of the Eagles winning a super bowl, before the obvious. keep an eye on the 6rs, follow the Phils, but this, this i’m obsessed with.
For comparison purposes only. I was in Edmonton when the Oilers won their first Stanley Cup. There has been nothing since quite like that first win. The downtown streets that were closed were packed with fans, bottle pickers made a fortune, a couple of cop cars were rocked, there was universal brotherly and sisterly love like never before. It was intoxicating. And not a single window was broken or storefront looted, to the best of my knowledge. Street people, farmers in town for the game, office workers, teenagers and tourists loved one another for several hours. Fantastic. Hope Eagles fans experience it very soon!!
My brother met his wife at the phillies World Series parade
After finally leaving the FSUClemson game Jameis’ capable hands, I switch to the OregonWashingtonSt game, and I see Mariota’s first two turnovers! My gaze is a curse!
By the by, Winston is a significant phenomenon. *How he is being successful* is showing just how robustly successful he will be, barring injury and all…
In terms of a really good read today…
“Remembering the loving but tough Bum Phillips” by Ray Didinger
http://www.csnphilly.com/football-philadelphia-eagles/remembering-loving-tough-bum-phillips
deleted and moved
Dirty stinkin Cowboy day…..beer in cornflakes? Brush your teeth with a bottle of jack?
..
Damn you TY law! you inspired a pudding craving at 2am…I think I ate too much lol
Anyone know how Khalil Mack! van Noy! and Barr played this week….missed every game yesterday
Jerry Jones: “Romo is the best in the 4th quarter”…… Say what? Bwahahahahahahah think Jones is getting Senile in his old age
G, did you see this article I posted the other day over here? Might make you think twice about Romo.
http://www.advancednflstats.com/2013/10/the-truth-about-tony-romo.html
I know his stats…I don’t have to read the article to know he has the 4th best 4th quarter numbers in regular season history…I’m assuming that’s the stat that the Linc provides….but I know stats don’t tell the entire story, and they don’t measure his CHOKEability….is game day! I don’t want to read anything positive about the dirty stinkin cowboys!!! 🙂
Re: More to Bum then a 10-gallon Hat
Bum Phillips may be best remembered for his quips captured on NFL Films — like the one in 1979 when asked if Earl Campbell was the best running back in the NFL: “He may not be at the top of the class, but it won’t take long to call role.”
But there are two other marks he left on the NFL and football generally.
_______________
First, Phillips’ importance in changing NFL defenses can’t be understated.
Phillips was the Oilers defensive coordinator under the legendary Sid Gilman in 1974. In mid-season, Houston management swapped the 1973 1st-overall pick, monstrously huge John Matuszak, to the KC Chiefs for DT Curly Culp, at that point, in his 7th season.
Phillips promptly, in midseason no less, changed the Oilers from a 4-3 defense to the first base 3-4 defensive team in NFL history. (The Dolphins, under the brilliant DC Bill Arnsparger, had used the 3-4 as a change-up defense on the great SB Dolphins teams of the early ’70s — calling it the “53 Defense” after the number worn by OLB Bob Matheson, who’d be the 4th LB in place of DT Bob Heinz.)
Following that season, Philips became head coach and in the 1975 draft, the Oilers selected Jackson State OLB — and future All Pro — Robert Brazile. He could run like a safety, hit like a LB, and pass-rush like a DE.
The 3-4 then began to spread, a plague to the offenses. Just 2 years later, Eagles head coach Dick Vermeil adopted the 3-4 under the guidance of new DC Marion Campbell. Three years later, a Super Bowl appearance.
__________________
Second, Philllips was an old fashioned coach who believed in pounding the rock first, throwing downfield second, and great special teams third. He had Earl Campbell at RB, the great long-passing combo of Dante Pastorini and Kenny “00” Burrough, and STer Billy White Shoes Johnson.
But Phillips wasn’t afraid to use some razzle dazzle — much more entertaining than Tom Landry’s end arounds, double reverses, and pass plays off the end around.
What made Bum Phillips great was the “Bum-erooski.”
The play was so devastatingly effective, the NFL has since banned it.
Here’s a clip of Bum calling the play . . . sweet music with his accent. (1:45 on the clip.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S20qvvDGBt0
Unfortunately, NFL Films didn’t film the Oilers running the play.
So here it is — called the “Fumble-rooski” — in the 1984 Orange Bowl, between Nebraska and Miami for the still-mythical national championship.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=fumblerooski&oq=fumbleroo&gs_l=youtube.3.0.0l10.2106.4174.0.5990.9.5.0.4.4.0.136.459.3j2.5.0…0.0…1ac.1.11.youtube.H3_tauK3DC0
_______________
RIP OABP.
Great stuff, as always, but I think you meant his importance can’t be overstated.
Let give that some thought.
“Overstated” generally’s used to describe people widely acclaimed for doing something (good or bad), when even that recognition doesn’t capture the impact.
But I’m not sure Bum Phillips gets the acclaim he deserves — certainly, if the subject is “where’d the 3-4 defense come from in the NFL.” I’m fairly sure not more than a couple TV announcers would know Phillips’ role. Maybe not many coaches either.
So I’m thinking that Phillips’ impact has been understated.
I’ll tinker with the language, though, to be more precise..
Re: Clemson v. FSU, Oregon and A&M
Jameis Winston looks like Randall Cunningham throwing the ball.
Tajh Boyd will play himself into a late 1st Rd pick if what he did last night happens a couple more times. (That’d be nice — Nick Foles arguments aside.)
Marcus Mariota is sooooo good throwing on the move when the pocket breaks down. He’s damn good standing tall in the pocket, too.
And Johnny Football . . . I still think he’ll be in green next year. KELLY GREEN, I hope.
I’m not sure Chip Kelly would go for someone with clear me-first maturity issues like Manziel.
To outsiders, like you and me, I agree that Manziel’s perception isn’t great.
In fact, I was all over the guy for what happened at the Manning passing camp. And then the “no money” for signing footballs incident.
My understanding since though is, in the clubhouse, he’s A-1.
Now that may be parsley on the steak. Time will tell.
I think regardless of how well Foles plays rest of the year, if Manziel or Mariota are available when the Eagles pick, Chip will grab one of those guys.
There’s virtually no chance Mariota is available. Manziel will depend on whether the Eagles are picking 20 or 12, and how Manziel’s “maturity issues” end up being viewed by FOs. I think he’s a top-10 talent all day.
Would you trade Nick Foles for an Alex Smith package? You could convince me Foles is worth a lot more considering his age.
If Mariota’s deemed “about as accurate” as Bridgewater, then Mariota’s the 1st pick.
I like MM more because of his size.
Regardless, the teams that land either of those two will be set for the next 10-15 years at QB.
As for Jonathan Pigskin, Hundley, and Boyd, we’re moving into more of the projection territory.
Maybe Kelly should have started Barkley this year, traded Foles for a 2nd Rd pick, and never resigned Vick.
I think the Eagles in that scenario would be fighting for one of the top 3-4 picks.
I’ve been on the “Mariota is the best QB in this draft class” train for a while. Totally agreed. I’m not even sure he needs to be deemed “about as accurate.” His size, speed and projection may be enough to go before Teddy.
I think Manziel shown enough to not be lumped together with Hundley and Boyd. We know he can make NFL throws and we know he’s probably the best athlete at the position to come out since Michael Vick.
I don’t like Hundley, just doesn’t look like he can complete even basic throws with accuracy.
Boyd is confusing. I think for him it will come down to whats between the ears, and how his interviews go. Physically he looks like Russell Wilson.
Wait, there is a train for that? Where do I get a listing of these trains?
Chip built up the Oregon program without landing 5 star recruits for the most part. And BTW, that team is dominant now. I think he believes he can rebuild on the fly, even if we’re picking in the teens instead of the top-5. If this is the case, I’d rather the Eagles try to win games along the way.
Note that this comment is in the context of thinking that Hinkie and the Sixers are doing things exactly the right way. Different leagues….I think both these teams have set themselves up for the future very well.
The Phillies on the other hand….OY. Seeing how well run the Cardinals and Red Sox are makes my head hurt. Going to the World Series *and* have great farm systems.
Bout to bust out a free style rap for y’all…Everyone turn on the Rudolph the red nose reindeer beat, and bop your heads with me..
….
Uhh!! Yeah, Mic check, 1,2,1,2…
…
Folesy the eagles young QBS
Had a very accurate arm
When Vick inevitably got hurt,
He told Eagles nation not to be alarmed
…
All of the silly eagles fans,
Used to laugh and call him names,
They even told young Folesy,
Napoleon Dynamite will never make it to the Hall of fame…
..
Then one foggy Dallas eve,
Chippah came to say
Folesy with your spiral so tight,
Won’t you lead my offense tonight..
…
Then all the eagles fans loved him,
And they shouted out with Glee
We can improve our defense
Because there is no need to draft a QB…
…
FLY Folesy fly,,,,
Respectfully, the tune to RTRNRD is not rap.
But if your lyrics are spoken with a 1-2 beat, emphasis on 1, you’ll get the rap sound you want.
Keep tinkering.
Lol rappers sample everything these days…it’s only a matter of time before one raps to the Rudolph beat! Lol…hopefully I won’t be around to hear it lol
“..
Clearly I need to slow down the pregamming! Lol
Being that — at least to one commenter — I’m “Grandpa” around here, Rap is hard enough.
But hearing a 21st century Rudy-Red . . . enough to take a baseball bat to my the perpetrating music box.
Lol…that was pretty much the desired reaction I Was looking for!
So you’re trying to exploit my age, are you?
I’m getting there…partying isn’t as easy as it used to,,,I pretty much have to force myself these days to not allow myself to become boring..
Did anyone hear the Opera singing eagles fan from Austria sing an opera style version of Fly eagles fly on The radio yesterday? It was glorious!!!
You can put lipstick on a pig, right? But it’s still a pig.
Not sure, therefore, that an arrangement by Rossini and a rendition by Maria Callas can make the Eagles fight song fly.
I should qualify my answer.
There are various, umm, substances that might make the Eagles fight song fly.
Can’t put lipstick on a pig? Jerry Jones seems to try it every year!!
I’m not going to the stadium today….I hope that corporate hell hole is rocking even during the tough times….fans have become so traumatized, that as soon as they see adversity the entire place deflates…..700 level fans would be ashamed of our recent behavior