The Pulse of the Team
Posted: March 30th, 2014 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 213 Comments »We can argue exactly why DeSean Jackson was cut. We can debate whether it was a good thing or not. We can talk about how he’ll be replaced (coming soon in a post this week). One thing I think that isn’t up for debate is that Chip Kelly has a good feel for the pulse of the team.
Kelly has had some hot button issues in his year on the job. He had to decide whether to bring back Michael Vick last offseason and then how to handle a competition between Vick and Nick Foles. Kelly had the Riley Cooper incident to deal with. Now he’s had the DeSean Jackson situation.
In every case, Kelly made a tough decision, but one that the players got behind.
Kelly could have easily cut Cooper after the concert video got out to the public. Instead, Kelly let the players help him make the decision. Jason Avant stood up strongly for Cooper. Then Vick did the same thing. Not everyone was on board with the move, but there was enough support from enough veteran players that the team stuck with Cooper. They needed him on the field and that fact certainly played a part in the situation, for both players and coaches.
Cooper did and said the right things to get back in the good graces of his teammates and had a terrific season for the Eagles.
We have no idea how the DeSean situation will turn out, but so far his teammates are not exactly bemoaning his loss.
We just made an extremely unpopular decision, but I couldn't be more excited and happy with where this organization is going!! #FlyEaglesFly
— Jason Kelce (@Jkelce) March 28, 2014
“@Jeff_McLane: Day 3 of Chip Kelly Watch: Request to interview #Eagles coach met with same response from team: " hint hint: quit asking lol
— Brent Celek (@BrentCelek) March 30, 2014
I don’t think Kelce is ripping DeSean with his words, but rather he’s showing support for Chip Kelly and the overall direction of the team. In a later tweet, Kelce wished DeSean well with his new team.
Jeff McLane offered this nugget in a column from yesterday.
Two Eagles players who requested anonymity said that Jackson wasn’t a clubhouse cancer, but he had become a distraction. They would not offer specifics. Both questioned whether his loss would hurt the offense and opined that he wouldn’t be difficult to replace.
I’ve heard that Jackson wasn’t liked by more than a few teammates. This would certainly seem true by the lukewarm support he got from them publicly. No one came out and threw DeSean under the bus (insert Shady joke here), but no one really stood up for him in a compelling way.
Plenty of guys around the league and former players are standing up for DeSean, but the point is that they didn’t have to deal with him on a daily basis.
A big part of being a good coach is knowing your team. You can’t make bold moves unless you know how your players will react to them. So far Kelly has shown that he does have a good feel for his players. Heck, I think this goes all the way back to last year when Kelly was first hired. He replaced a very popular coach in Andy Reid. Kelly had some radical ideas on how to train and how to practice.
Kelly had to sell himself and his ideas to the team. He obviously did a good job as he had players buying in to his ideas, even though they were very different. Kelly, like all coaches, is a bit of a control freak and he’s got some very specific ideas on how he wants things done. His ability to communicate with his players and judge their attitudes is a big help as Kelly tries to build the Eagles into the kind of team he really wants.
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Happiness with each other is not necessarily a requirement to winning a Super Bowl. Some teams can’t stand each other but find ways to put their differences aside. Talent wins. And the Eagles got rid of it, for nothing in return.
The Eagles didn’t exactly go 10-6 against a murderous schedule last season. They better know what they are doing.
Insert blind faith comments about Chip below.
Insert an opinion about a subject which you don’t know the facts below! Nobody on this blog has been in the locker room, played with him, or trained with him on a day to day basis. Chip Kelly and the FO has. They know all the facts, and not from some “undisclosed source”. Let’s leave the decisions to them. I’d rather have them make the calls than geniuses like you!
You just proved my point. Good day sir.
Oh, so you are in the locker room every day? You knows what goes on in the meeting rooms and board room? Or are you just a “professional” tool?
How petty and immature do you have to be to resort to name calling? You don’t know anything about what really happened either. Opposing viewpoint and someone who’d prefer the truth over blind faith? Must be a tool. You’re a troll and I hope no one else gives you anymore attention.
Nice try, DESEAN.
Oh, so you are in the locker room every day?
Hmmmm, are you?
How great would that be if one of the posters on here was actually a sock puppet screen name for a team employee?
oh so you are??? lol.. since he isnt oin the locker room and you arent.. then why are u talking to each other??
And making that call is ultimately their decision, but I don’t see skepticism (absent an explanation) as a wrong view.
the FO has been there since day 1.. lol.. they gave a brand new contract.. and he played up to that contract..
id rather us question everything then rely on blind faith.. doesnt that make a heck of a lot of sense?
Blind faith huh?
You better do a little research about Chip Kellys backround first. This Coach has demolished scoring records wherever he goes. He took a decent Oregon Football team and turned them into winners as soon as he arrived.
He arrives in Philly and in year 1 he takes a 4-12 team to 10-6 and wins the division. He makes the playoffs and fails to advance with a 3 point score deficit.
Am I the only one watching his offensive schemes?
This coach is getting our playmakers open, in space and they are all getting touches.
His teams in College averaged 44.7 points a game over a 4 year span.
His first season the Eagles averaged 27.6 points per game which puts us at 4th in the league.
I think I’ll give him a little more credit than what you call blind faith.
I find it pretty tiresome when people complain about the lack of “anything in return”. You can’t trade in a vacuum. If no one is willing to trade, and you’re convinced you’re going to move on, then you have to release him. Happened a lot this year, with players like Johnson and Revis.
It’s the same as complaining about the Eagles not trading up or down. If you can’t find an appropriate partner, there’s no trade to be made.
Argue all you want about the wisdom of deciding to move on without Jackson. But you can’t complain about the lack of trade (except to regret it), if there was no trade to be had.
You can’t trade with anyone if it isn’t available, but you can decide to keep him if you don’t get anything.
The decision to cut Jackson or trade Jackson aren’t the only options. The third is to keep Jackson and make it work.
It better be a really miserable situation to pick that first option.
It might have been too late to save Jackson. We signed Mark Sanchez..who’s a damn wreck.
The Sanchez thing doesn’t bother me. They needed another QB option and he has as much potential as anyone else out there. Might as well give him a shot.
Yeah, we’re talking about a 3rd string QB if Barkley continues to progress or a 2nd string QB if Barkley doesn’t progress. In either case, Foles is a 16 game starter.
I agree, but I was really saying that once you’ve made the decision to move on, you’ve pretty much said option 3 isn’t going to work.
Don’t get me wrong; I would certainly have preferred they keep him even if he was/is a huge prick. And I sure as hell would have liked something in a trade. But if the team is deciding he’s simply not worth it, and no one’s biting on a trade, then they’ve made their bed. As you say, things have to be pretty shitty to justify that. We don’t know for sure, and we’ll never no.
For now I’ll stick to the idea that if you feel THAT strongly that you want him gone, there’s a reason, and I’ll trust that. For now, until proven otherwise, and I hope I won’t be proven otherwise.
Maybe Eagles didn’t use the 3rd option because, the fact may Eagles have “kept” DeSean before.
Agree w/you there…Not only that, but Jackson put up good numbers. Now he`s on his own to negotiate as much as he can get, use last season as a bargaining chip and move on…No bad feelings , at least not from his side of the proposition.
You mean threw out of the bus right Tommy? If Shady threw the girl under the bus well..he wouldn’t be an Eagle.
Just trying to make a joke.
It was a funny one at that. The Shady bus story is a classic. I like it almost as much as “Knoshon sucks” from twitter.
Brent Celek is a massive tool. Kelly and the organization have a 100% responsibility to speak to the public / media about this move.
Oh god. Here we go again with “responsibility” to the media and fans. Again, for the 1000th time: the Eagles’ responsibility to fans is to win games, and to entertain them. That is all. Your sense of entitlement does not translate directly to “rights” you have as a fan; it is simply your opinion of what you are owed, and does not line up with reality.
Blow that out of your backside hoss. Your lack of reality on what pays the bills for a team is laughable. Media exposure allows these folks to earn what they do and in return they have a responsibility to explain their actions via the press. They have taken tax dollars for their stadium and enjoy an anti-trust exemption; the return for those indulgences from the public is that they answer for their actions.
No. You’re wrong. 100%, unequivocally wrong. You bring up things like anti-trust and tax dollars to give your opinion the veneer of some sort of legal justification or respectability, but it’s still just your own narrow opinion of what you are owed. They do not legally, professionally, or morally owe you any kind of explanation. You have bleated incessantly on multiple boards about what the team “MUST” do with regard to information, but it’s just your entitled opinion. Nothing else.
And your opinion is your own as well. If you’d like to show a proper level of respect, as Bob Brewer did, in disagreeing with me; so be it. Your tone and direct lecture is utterly without merit and ill-placed. Mind your words.
You’re correct. I should have shown the level of tact and respect that you’ve shown me and others with replies like “drop dead” and “blow it out your backside”. That would have raised the level of discourse.
Let’s agree to disagree, shall we? Then you can get back to being the loud mouthed guy at the end of the bar that everyone feels vaguely uncomfortable around when he starts crying about his sports teams.
You were told to blow it out your backside because you went beyond disagreement and went into naming yourself some type of arbiter of reality. If yodu’d have stayed on topic, that comment wouldn’t have been made in reply. It was not made as an opening comment in your direction or in reply to your post.
“drop dead” was directed at a person who made a trolling screen name as a personal attack in my direction. Again, that wasn’t said over a topical disagreement.
I pay a lot of money on replica jerseys and gameday Ortleibs. I demand justice!
Nice one-time invented screen name to use for trolling purposes. Drop dead.
..
http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/249/829/562.jpg
And I suppose your name is actually Media Mike?
It’s a screen name used for regular identification purposes, not specifically designed to troll another person screen name. Key difference.
Ignore the troll.
Taxpayers paid for the Linc. The responsibilities of accepting taxpayer money come with the benefits. Transparency is needed for public investments. Some things need to be kept quiet for a temporary period of time, but fans can’t be kept in the dark forever.
A minor portion of but yeah the fact that the public subsidizes any NFL stadium construction is ridiculous. Ditto the NPF tax status of the NFL too along with a few other perks the NFL enjoys that is either directly or indirectly subsided by the public.
Completely different set of issues too. If the Eagles don’t want to say anything, that is their prerogative. Probably a combo of the fact that they don’t have a ‘smoking gun’ cause to release him nor do they want to create any more wake on situation they handled and executed poorly on from the start.
The government heavily subsidizes the gas and oil industry too, but they don’t feel the need to tell us about spills until the information leaks out on them. Why should pro sports franchises be held to a different standard?
I don’t support that either but those are at least required industries critical to make our society function.
Building a sports stadium and basically transferring tens of millions from public coffers directly to private ones (in this case Lurie) is a completely BS one.
If the public get an equivalent ownership stake in the team and was able to reap a reward when Lurie ultimately sells the team, that is fine.
Just is a basic and straight transfer from public to private coffers which is egregious.
I don’t see much of a difference. We live in a society where corporations pay little to no taxes, sometimes even negative taxes after subsidies. You claim the Oil companies are different because of their importance to our economy. NFL franchises would say the same thing about their importance to the local economies in which they operate.
It is a huge difference but I won’t go off to a tangent on it. Ditto the issue of effective tax rates and US corporations.
Just look at this article on Deadspin did on it which contains great facts.
http://deadspin.com/5964116/animated-infographic-watch-as-americas-stadiums-pile-up-on-the-backs-of-taxpayers/all
There is always some consulting firm that will take money to perform a study that shows an NFL team is beneficial to a local economy but it is a huge boondoogle especially if it is a football-only facility. Better off in a lot of cases just taking a truck around town and dumping cash randomly in the streets.
This all really started in a large way in the late 50s/early 60s as a way to combat urbanization trends with people fleeing to the suburbs & as an effect to revitalize certain urban neighborhoods. Good policy maybe on paper, horrible one in actuality and it has only gotten more out of hand over time as the amount of public subsidies has skyrocketed as stadiums have become more and more elaborate & expensive.
If local gov’ts got an equity stake in the team that was commensurate with their investment in the stadium, that would be fine. They don’t and instead we have shifted billions of dollars almost directly from public to specific private individuals.
With almost all local and state gov’ts increasing feeling the pinch of pensioners costs and other spending issues rising faster than general revenues, it might begin to slow down or stagnate but I wouldn’t bet on it
Yep, I wrote a term paper last year on public financing of stadiums and relocation. The leagues tend to keep expansion to a minimal in an effort to have a few cities that effectively allow a threat of relocation. Owners then force to public to subsidize their stadiums, while citing some great economic benefit.
In reality there is no real benefit, economically speaking, to having a major sports team in your city. The number of games played are relatively limited, and most spending comes from those living in the area. The money being spent is disposable income that would be spent anyways, and is simply now being spent at Xfinity live or for 14 dollar beers at the game going to major corporations who can afford to be in the stadium or surrounding area. That money is spent there rather than at a bowling alley or the local bar, and is less likely to be returned into the local economy, minimizing any multiplier effects.
They shouldn’t. Gas and oil industries SHOULD have to tell us about spills.
Yes, fans can be kept in the dark forever. You throw out terms like “taxpayers” and “transparency”, but it’s all hand waving that attempts to add legal legitimacy to your point. There is no legal requirement for the Eagles to reveal anything about this situation. None. Zero. Regardless of the amount of taxpayer dollars invested. They also do not have to be transparent about their operations regarding player transactions. At all. No legal requirement. None.
You can feel they “owe” you something, but they are under no actual, enforceable requirement to give you that something. It’s simply your opinion of what you are owed, and not tied to any actual, concrete obligation. The only penalty for them not giving you want you want is that you’ll get really mad and maybe hold your breath or something.
100% this. I’ve been a huge Eagles fan for most of my life. I live in Massachusetts so I have the “pleasure” of watching Patriots games and press conferences. Belichick says nothing but the bare minimum to the media and only that much when required to. No one cares about the lack of information the organization shares. For crying out loud, we count how many times he smiles in a season during his press conferences(it was seven last season) Its funny what winning does to a fan base.
That’s because Belichick, unlike the Eagles front office in the past and possibly right now, established that he knows what he’s doing.
If the situation was that bad they the Eagles felt they had to cut Jackson, it does zero good in revealing that with the media.
Eagles are right to bite the bullet on discussing it, I’m just not confident they are right in the initial decision.
I can’t agree with you. They need to explain this move. TO and McNabb leaving were explained, this needs to be as well.
Why? What good will it do? If there was a serious problem, all it would do would be to hurt Jackson and at this point they just amicably want to part ties and move along. Jackson was professional in his remarks yesterday (we’ll wait to see it that stands when he signs), the Eagles are happy to leave it as it is. I’m not so sure why you think the Eagles owe YOU an explanation. I’m guessing you also expect the TV to talk back to you when you yell at it.
Ruben Frank, Jeff McLane, Les Bowen, etc. have all be asking for the same thing. They don’t owe me, public explanations are the nature of owning a professional sports franchise.
Really? Ask Bill Belichick what he thinks about that!
He might tell me he’s earned the benefit of the doubt with 3 rings. He also gave a full press conference after the dust settled on Hernandez. Once indictments came down, Belichick spoke. There is no dust on Jackson because both the LAPD and Philadelphia PD cleared him of any criminal involvement.
Guess you`need` to wait like the rest of us, until they decide to tell all.
Oh, I’m sure we’ll be waiting but I’ll still keep up asking like the reporters are.
Good luck with that.
Jackson is interviewing with teams right now. The Eagles most likely have to be careful of saying anything that could be considered slanderous that would hurt Jackson’s negotiations or they could have a lawsuit on their hands.
I get that possible concern, but generally speaking public figures have to prove malicious intent in order to sue for slander and/or libel. The legal threshold is steep.
its because they could be sued, they think desean is a gang member, they need proof of that, hanging out with a gang member, knowing gang members, and flashing signs on instagram is not proof, so if they come out and say that that would be the reason, desean could sue the eagles.
I think the suit aspect is a bit overblown, but they can get into a lot of other aspects without that legal risk.
Well if they really think he is a gang member then maybe they are more worried about a drive-by shooting…
Is that `need` a legal obligation ?
Just .
Purely moral / common courtesy. I don’t see them ever needing to base roster decisions on public opinion, but keeping your public informed on a regular basis after you make those decisions helps hold fan interest more so than if you don’t
I would say their decision to not speak is keeping fan interest through the roof based on this discussion.
Not that I’m saying this was a contributing factor, but I recall during the Vick-Foles QB competition only one player making a public statement that differed with Chip. It was DeSean Jackson. He either said Vick deserved to / should be named the starter or that the “team needed to know who it’s QB would be”. I don’t recall if it was during camp or if it was just before the 2nd preseason game.
I remember being surprised, because it should DeSean wasn’t on the same page as his coach, and didn’t keep that to himself.
Vick was the one who said something like the “team needed to know who it’s QB would be”. Jackson simply said he thought Vick would eventually win the QB competition, which he did. So, I don’t see how DeSean and Chip weren’t on the same page… in fact they were in agreement. Chip named Vick the starter.
At the time of the comment, competition was still going on. Jackson gave his 2 cents worth when they weren`t asked for.
Wasn`t his place to talk.
Exactly. Any current player who speaks out in favor of DeSean Jackson is speaking “out of place.” Instead, current players are left silent, and their silence is interpreted to mean whatever the interpreters wish, though, more often, it seems to be interpreted as agreement (with the organization).
Good point.
Player that just signed a huge contract extension says he is happy with the direction of the organization.
I’m not really putting too much stock in that. If we begin to see it echoed by more team members then it will be more significant.
OK, here you are, coach of the Philadelphia Eagles. You interact with Desean everyday. What would it take to make you decide to cut him?
This should be where everyone starts when you’re thinking about how the eagles did something wrong. You and the team might not agree on what’s so serious, but you have to at least acknowledge that they felt the way the thing you thought of made you feel.
Ok, if he was bad for the team i get it, but to get nothing in return and having the possibility of having to play 2-3 times a year is something different. Complete butcher job the entire way of this process except the timing of his release in conjunction with the article. 45 minutes after it was posted.. so suspect. But it helped ease the hard truth that desean was CUT… it will be difficult to play vs desean and rg3 and garcon nd that running game… we have literally nobody in the secondary that can cover and run with desean. Nobody. And he already knows how to beat them, i have seen training camp, desean owned every single one of our DBs. smfh
The Skins lack the cap money to make the strongest $ play for DeSean.
no they dont, they have 7 million. they could give hiom 10 million a year with say a 7 million signing bonus and a 3 million base salary, for this season… leaving 4 million in space.. so many things they can do and they have the 1st meeting lined up..
I was going to say that would leave them with no money to sign draft picks, but that’s really problem of the Rams right now.
redskin have cap flexability.. more so then they have had for the last.. i dont even know how many years.. lol..
I think that $7 million boxes them in a lot more than you think unless they want to write a Jerry Jones type contract for Jackson over 5 years with a massive ($25 mil) signing bonus. I don’t know if they’re still in that business.
a jerry jones contract?? dude that a daniel snyder contract.. lmfao.. NOBODy will give him a 25 million signing bonus.. lol.. he wont get 25 million in gurantees
I don’t think 25 million in guarantees would be out of the question. If I were to hazard a guess, I’d say he might end up signing something very close to the Jarius Byrd contract: $10+ million signing bonus, $25ish million guaranteed, $4ish million cap hit for the current season.
dude WE didnt give him that much guarantees lol…
I see by your posts in this thread that you’ve reached the 3rd step of grief/loss: bargaining. Hang tough brother, if you can get through the next step, Depression, you will reach #5, Acceptance.
I’m not getting there until step #5 is called Lombardi.
You’re gonna be depressed for a while, then. At least 10 months and probably 22 or 34.
I had Lombardi booked for February of 2016. For this season we need at least 10 wins, another division title, and a playoff game win as appropriate growth.
Im on the “we didnt get anything for our young star WR coming off a career year and one of the best eagles season all time” stage.. and will be there forever.
You can’t make other teams trade with you. I gave the example the other day that Chris Johnson is going to get cut and Darrelle Revis was already cut. All 3 are star players, but their contracts and some other issues made them impossible to trade.
clearly the way they went about trading didnt work, therefore they failed to generate interest and manipulate the market.
Once teams knew he was a problem/being shopped/knew they could release/cut him, then thats where there is no market. Thats where they failed. Not to get anything for one of the best players in the history of the eagles, who is in his prime coming off a career year nearly breaking eagles all time records… and we cut him.. and got nothing. This is an epic fail and there is no other way to write/report it as such.
I’m just curious as to how you would go about trading a player like Desean. Not only did he have a terrible contract but when a player of his caliber goes on the market its impossible not to raise red flags. I don’t think it’s possible to create a market for a star player without making people think twice especially with a very expensive contract.
I not sure either, but I wish I knew what the Jets and Vikings did when they got first rounders (plus other stuff) for Reavis and Harvin last year. I’d love to see an article on how one creates trade interest for a player you can’t keep.
The reason they were able to get those deals was because the reasons for the trade were known. Revis wanted a new contract or he would hold out again and the Bucs were willing to overpay and Harvin made it known he wasn’t resigning in MIN but they would keep him for the year if no one gave them what they wanted. Its a lot different when a player like Desean who just signed a big contract goes on the market.
Money left on the deal certainly is a part of it, but the money on his deal is less than market if you look at guys like Vincent Jackson and Mike Wallace. I’m not ripping the team for not getting anything in a trade for Jackson, I’m just curious to see how they might have been able to do so. That part of the D-Jax situation is more academic for me than anything else.
I think it’s more of along the lines of teams would rather overpay for Jackson giving the rising cap ceiling than give up draft picks in a loaded draft.
i am 100 percent ripping the team for not getting anything for jackson. every eagle fan should.
I’m definitely curious as to how they could have done so but I’m not certain there actually was a way. I think if there was a way to even get like a 7th Howie would have done so.
I think timing is also important. If the Eagles were doing this at a point prior to free agency, maybe teams looking for WR help see a trade for Jackson as a better option that Decker, Tate, etc. Once the dust settled on other signings, teams can be a lot more picky.
That is also pat of why I want some major questions answers. Like if they were going to cut him, why do so after the chance to sign other players had passed?
Who knows? Perhaps they just got the report from the NFL’s PI. Or their own. Isn’t anyone ever allowed to change their mind as more facts come in and/or more thought is given?
Allowed to; yes. Avoiding judgement if they don’t replace talent for talent; no. What’s killing me is the lack of explanation of the impetus behind the move. If there are really tangible off the field liability issues; I’ll own being dead wrong on this. If they don’t think his production will be hard to replace; we’ll see if they’re right.
I don’t think they’re planning to tell us what, if any, off-field issue may have compelled them to do this. Obviously, something changed since last week, and I doubt it was just finding out that NJ.COM was going to publish. If it’s the latter, and it still coulllllld beeee, Maclin isn’t quite the receiver Jaccson is, but I expected them to draft a WR first anyway….thinking he would replace FA Maclin in 2015.
I still want that explanation, but I’ll agree with you on both fronts. The NJ.com report was totally old news to them and I also saw a first rd WR as a possibility this year. I just would have preferred to see that guy be paired opposite Jackson for the balance of Jackson’s contract.
harvin was seriously injuried and didnt play all year.. lmfao..
Harvin wasn’t hurt all of 2012 he was actually having a very good year through the first eight weeks before getting injured. And the market changes year to year. Yes SEA overpaid for Harvin but that was in a draft that was considered very low on high end talent and SEA felt that no guy in the draft would give them Harvin’s potential production.
dude, 2013, his 1st year with the team that traded for him he was injured damn near whole season.. lol..
so a lame WR draft = 1st 3rd 5th for injured player good WR draft = NOTHINg for a better healthy WR
seeriously? The FO blundered this entire thing and is sitting back with egg on face.
So you expected SEA to see into the future and realize that Harvin was going to be injured the whole year? And maybe just maybe other front offices learned from SEA and decided not to over pay again.
Did Seattle overpay? Harvin was a major factor in the Superbowl.
No he wasnt. lol..
I don’t personally think they over payed that badly with such a weak class especially at receiver. Plus its hard to argue with their results.
you are crazy. They over payed GREATLY!! Harvin got 6 years 67 million with 25 million guranteed.. along with the 1st 3rd 5th rounders
Yes its called checking his medicals. lol.. plus harvin has a lot of concussions and a migraine problem… and thats not even talking about the hip injury.. lol.. ok dont over pay, ill take a 3rd of what they gave up for harvin, but nah we GOT NOTHING!!!!! damn like some of yall need to let that sink in… i still love chip but we have the right to bitch and complain about bullshit. This is bullshit.
Yes Harvin has migraine problems but that hasn’t really been much of an issue in a few years. The only concussion he had was not with the Vikings. The torn labrum in his hip occurred during training post trade. I don’t think that will show up on the medicals, if you’re a doctor and tell me it will then fine I’m wrong but I’m guessing it wouldn’t. And you can complain but you should also consider all the circumstances that led to the Eagles getting nothing and realize if they could have gotten something they would have
I’m 99% sure a few of those “migraines” over the year (especially post-draft and before his rookie year started) were partying related. He had a nice rep for himself down there in Florida that he grew out of.
the harvin trade is crazy.. and desean is a better WR then harvin too.. smfh.. we got NOTHING they got a 1st 3rd 5th for a injured player.. absurd
They found trading partners willing to trade.
That`s it.
Nobody was there for the Eagles.
Philly decided it was in their best interest to let him go.
That it.
terrible contract?/ He had ZERO guranteed dollars left.. 10 mil a year but his talent is worth that. And see u dont just put a player on the market you gotta be slick and be a used car salemen type approch, clearly eagles not slick enough…
He actually had 6 million guaranteed left, hence the eagles taking on the 6 million cap hit in dead money. And again how do you go about offering a player of Desean Jackson’s caliber to another team without raising red flags. This isn’t the same as selling a used car, everyone knows the salesman is trying to sell the used car. The Eagles trying to trade Desean came from nowhere and clearly left some teams very leery.
Not to be picking nits, but the guarantee reverts to the Eagles in a trade. Hence our legacy costs from moving Kolb via trade. It don’t think that changes your point on red flags, but there are some advantages to trading for a guy in terms of leaving his dead money with his old employer.
I actually didn’t know that thanks for pointing that one out to me.
Yeah, looking at Kolb on our 2011 cap figure was befuddling until I read about the guarantees / dead money existing for trades in addition to cuts.
NO! He had a 6 million cap hit for us, and still does so even after cutting him. that 6 mill was paid to him when he signed the contract… as a signing bonus.
Well you go to them, ateam with WR needs, and say u want to move up in the draft and there is a plyer u love! And to do offer a player, start with a less exciting player and work up to desean.. thats just one way/idea of going about it.
And yes it came from no where, therefore bad job by the FO… is there really any other way of looking at it? lol
Jackson was a $12.5 million cap hit, but the “dead” part that remains after the cut is $6 million. They added $6.5 mil back on the cap and are now almost $24 mil under.
no shit, and the guy said he had 6 million guaranteed, thats false that money is already sitting in desean room in hundred dollar bills next to gold chains.. lol..
Was it? I can’t remember if they put that guarantee in there as a signing bonus or simply had a portion of his salary guaranteed for this year. They could have done either.
its from the signing bonus when he signed contract
I get that after Media Mike pointed that out to me, but what your proposing would never happen in the NFL. No team would even reveal a fraction of the draft board or let it slip they are trying to move up unless there’s a player that is clearly worth it, a la RG3.
sure they do, the discuss movement al the time in preperation for who falls on draft board, most all those deals are prearranged. a player clearly worth it depends on teams, one team will like a palyer more then another.. whos to say> thats why u gotta sell it to them.. cmon now
They discuss movement but you’re not just proposing swapping draft picks like happens on draft day.
You mean RGKnee? RG3&10? RG3&out? RG who would have been drafted after Barkley?
Shame the Rams have yet to make the theft of that many picks for a draft bust pay off just yet.
Yeah it looks life theft now but no one thought RG3 would be anything but a star coming out of the draft.
he still could be, esp with desean.
I was calling it theft then because it exceeded the draft pick value chart by an astronomical number. I can’t say I knew he’d be that bad in year two, but the Skins gave up too much.
you are not taking into account the ethical question of trading damaged goods…what does it do to their trading credibility if they give someone else a major headache?
how is he damaged? because chip kelly doesnt want a flashy diva WR? lol Love chip but theres plenty of other HC who can and dont mind.
we don’t know the extent of it – but the fact that none of his teammates stood up for him, and he may be in some legal trouble makes him damaged goods…it is more than just his little attitude, but that sure doesn’t help
the weird thing is, if every player that has done what desean has done, at least 30 percent of the NFL should be cut to…
Ask the Dolphins and Redskins! Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Thanks for the 2nd round picks guys!
I think there’s also something to be said for cutting a star player and not just dealing him for 3rd day pick.
If you value a commodity at certain price, you don’t necessarily take whatever’s offered. We see in unfettered markets (which the NFL, of course, is not) how commodities are sometimes allowed to go bankrupt in order to preserve the future value of other assets.
Guys, please stop with the personal attacks. Disagree with each other, but don’t make it personal.
Thanks.
Thank you. Eagles need to speak vs. no they don’t is a topic. Good cut vs. bad cut is a topic. I don’t trust this team vs. I trust this team is a topic.
C’mon Tommy, you can do better than this. Don’t keep putting up quotes from current Eagles players that have recently signed a nice long term contract. Also it wouldn’t surprise me if these two unnamed sources throwing Desean under the bus happened to be two guys fighting for a roster spot this season, let alone from the same or similar position, ie Damaris Johnson and/or James Casey.
But I guess we continue to say ‘in Chip we trust’ until the time we start losing games because of the recent off season decisions.
I HATE this move, but it isn’t like Tommy has links to articles from guys on the team ripping the move.
It must have been BJ Cunningham and Momah!
And I’d actually think one of those players was Maclin.
I’m confused by this contrived critique. If they hadn’t just signed an extension, the critique would be that they were trolling for an extension. Now, the critique is that they just got an extension.
Me, personally? I think that AFTER you sign a contract with a big guarantee is the time that you are able to be freest with your critical statements.
I have been waiting for some player to speak up strongly against the move. And this isn’t about fear of Chip either. Vick is gone and said less than flattering things about DeSean.
I’ll gladly cover another side to this when I’ve got a good angle or something to go on.
And you can trust me that McLane’s sources aren’t scrubs sitting behind DeSean.
Fair enough, I don’t wanna doubt Mclane’s sources. However can we please keep the positives quotes from vets like Cole, Herremans and Barwin noticed. Thanks.
well now maclin has a chance to be #1, more balls for ertz celek cooper, why would they say anything? They want to be stars like desean. plus kenrick wanted desean to stay, and if there is a player that is really pissed he wont come out because then he will be cut next…
What’s the over/under on # games Maclin starts?
he will get 70 rec for 900 yards…
I don’t think there’s any chance of player speaking up and getting cut. As T-Law it’s not a fear factor of Chip.
no fear factor?? Chip just cut our best WR coming off a career year that almost was the best year for a WR of all time.. they all should fear for their jobs.
I don’t know Chip at all. I never followed him at Oregon. I just go by what I read. I just see Chip running a ship saying you can’t speak up. I think Chip values the players opinions. He did call Celek prior to signing other TE’s. IF Chip is as you say(and it’s possible) he’s not going to last here for sure…
Almost best year for a WR all time? Seriously? You mean a season that was 126th from a yardage standpoint? That was 68% of the yards that Megatron put up in 2012? 9 TD’s is not remotely impressive from a historical standpoint. Terrible argument.
best year for an EAGLES WR buddy.. slow ya role homeslice
I’m not sure Vick had said anything particularly strong to any effect?
Also, the cutting in this fashion was far more of a distraction than Desean probably ever was, behind the scenes, if nothing else leaks.
What I’m seeing on the wide band of NFL fandom was that the Eagles took a fairly large reputational hit. There isn’t a whole lot of sympathy for the Eagles org out there, and people are pretty genuinely upset. In every conversation, Riley Cooper is a big part of it.
The stuff from Ward was classic. I especially liked when he mocked Teddy Bruschi for being hated for all of his teammates for being Belichick’s locker room informant. That was an all-time rant.
My reading of Vick’s comments was that he knew exactly why Desean was gonna get cut. It wasn’t strongly worded, but that was unmistakable.
The juxtaposition of Riley getting the long term deal and Jackson getting cut for nothing is the big deal to me, as well. I hate the release, hate hate hate hate hate it, but I could accept it on faith. TBH I still can’t believe they didn’t cut Riley Cooper immediately. Saying the n-word is one thing, albeit a bad thing. Saying you are gonna fight every n-word around is much worse.
sooooo……Cooper did a very bad thing and yet it was over come. Now you know what someone(or more than one) think of DJ.
This isn’t entirely true…if you LISTEN to how Maclin answered questions, he was pretty baffled by it, but if you read what he wrote, it sounds like he threw him under the bus.. Then again, I couldn’t really care less so I prob shouldn’t be commenting..
,,,
But let’s not kid ourselves, if Djax called Howie and told him he would restructure and take a pay cut to stay with the eagles, Desean would most likely be here
All that is being reported right now publicly and Tommy posts so frequently he’ll post other quotes that say otherwise.
Been really surprised that there has been a single definitive statement from a current Eagles’ player that either threw the Eagles under the bus or was more strongly supportive of Jackson.
Been more lukewarm or mealy-mouthed responses that didn’t say much one way or the other.
Being a team that can afford a lawyer or two, they can’t and won’t say anything about Desean’s extracurricular activities unless he is officially charged with a crime. It would be the easiest slander/libel lawsuit for Desean ever. So until that happens, you’re going to see a whole lot of no comments coming out of the organization.
If that was the only thing to say, but a lot of speculation is that it isn’t.
I think the issue is that there is really no good way for the team to come out and say something along the lines of “DeSean was one of the highest paid and more experienced players on the team, but his work ethic was not good enough and he didn’t set the right example for the team. We could tolerate some off the field controversy if he were a model citizen in the locker room or maybe if we weren’t committed to paying him $10M this year.” I think if you gave Howie truth serum that is the response we would get. But, what does that serve? It doesn’t make the fan base any more satisfied. And, it seems like kicking him when he is down.
And, as much as I hate not getting draft pick compensation, you can’t truly conclude they got nothing in return. Think of it as trading him for $22M (6 in savings this year, plus 6 in carry-over next year plus the 10 next year they aren’t paying). That 16M next year could be Foles’ extension plus another player. At least, that’s how I console myself.
Upvote for understanding the importance of cap rollover when talking about the salary cap.
I think those are all great points, but I’d still like to hear them directly. Being able to roll a ton of roster bonus money for Foles, Cox, Kendricks, and Boykins into 2015 is a major plus that cutting Jackson helps make possible, I’d just like to hear it from the team.
Unfortunately, announcing or explaining anything doesn’t do any good for the parties involved (desean and the eagles). So I don’t think it’s gonna happen.
Salary discussion and reasons for it makes little/no sense and the Eagles have no idea if Kendricks can even be a consistent starter yet or if Boykins can play outside.
They can speak in generalities of the cap,rollover money, future extensions, and balance of cap money on both sides of the ball without fouling up any specific plans.
In what universe does Kendricks deserve a high paying contract?
The theoretical universe where he has a great season next year. It could happen!
I’ll give you/him the benefit of the doubt, but I don’t see it. He plays far too recklessly. This results in a handful of gorgeous splash plays where you’re just “WOW”, but unfortunately that means lots of missed tackles. I also think his speed is overrated; he was torched last year by people he should have no issue keeping up with, like Jimmy Graham, Vincent Jackson, Antonio Gates, et al.
I think you have to cut him some slack for last year… 2nd year guy, new system. But those excuses go away this year and no slack shall be cut!
He has to step up. I think with the addition of Jenkins, we’ll see Ryans off the field more in passing situations and more cover 3 as well with Jenkins, Wolff/Allen, Boykin covering the middle of the field. That means more Boykin overall & more Kendricks opportunities to inside blitz.
I think there may have been hesitation to cut him outright, but aside from the monetary gain, they basically allowed NJ.com to be the bad guy and provide motive without them really having to give an excuse why our rush to the podium to explain themselves. Their silence more or less says, “Do we really need to explain it any further than what you’ve already read? Was our timing not telling enough?”
Chip is building HIS team. That means he can keep and cut whoever he wants. It also means that he takes full responsibility for it’s success or failure. He deserves at least 3-4 years to build it.
Excellent point. I doubt Chip and Howie look at this year as the year to go all in. If they thought he would put them over the top, they might look at him differently (or at least have a higher level of tolerance).
I totally agree with you ,but I’d wish he’d take more Q&A ownership of the move with the reporters in a group interview or full out press conference.
I really enjoyed his explanation of moving to a 3-4, even though I’m a 4-3 guy. I’d love to hear more on this move.
I don’t think Kelly is that kind of coach. He’s seems to be a lot like Reid where he protects his players and likes to keep all the drama in the the locker room. Do you really want a coach who will trash his players through the media? I understand people want an explanation, but anything Chip says will be blown out of proportion by the media. Then he’ll have to clarify, and then the media will read between the lines. Ugh, who needs that crap!?
I see that risk, but my general impression was that Reid (even in saying little) was more frequently in front of reporters answering questions.
I think most coaches would NEVER talk to the media if they didn’t have to.
Of course they wouldn’t. That’s why they have to.
Neither did AR. He like a card board cut out standing there. It’s not going to happen. I’d like to know the truth behind all this but nobody is going to come out and say it.
I don’t know what people expect the Eagles to say. They don’t want him on their team and they think he’s not worth the money they were paying him. They know more about Jackson than any casual fan does. No matter what they say there will be people calling them liars, libelers, cheapskates, idiots, etc., so why should they open themselves up to more criticism. As soon as spring training starts and our rookie receiver makes a few sensational catches, everyone won’t care about Jackson – at least until we play against him.
I expect them to answer a few simple questions when they are inevitably put to them by reporters, specifically:
1) Why did you release one of your best players?
2) Why were you unable to make a trade once you had decided to part with Jackson?
You really think that desiring responses to those questions is unreasonable?
I think both questions have obvious answers. More so for #2.
Yeah, so do most of the people writing blogs and posting on forums about it. The trouble is that many of these answers are very different. But I am happy that you have found the truth that works for you.
Desiring responses is very reasonable, but how does answering either of those questions help the team? Once the decision was made and executed, the leadership moved on.
Like other billion dollar corporations, any Eagles communication on this will be legally coached and sanitized for public consumption.
I think it would also set a bad precedent. I understand the “slippery slope” is a logical fallacy but every year there is somebody who gets cut in camp that the fans all love (Acho), and now everybody wants to know exactly why this player isn’t on the team.
Great article at BGN by Mark Saltveit — really great — postulating that Kelly’s not really the hit-man here. But Roseman. Kelly didn’t object. But the impetus for the Jackson move came from upstairs.
http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2014/3/30/5563026/chip-kelly-howie-roseman-desean-jackson-released
______________
Mark —
If you’re checking comments here . . . I really like that piece of writing. Excellent dot-connections. Really excellent.
I agree. I enjoyed that piece too. Of course, like everything else, it’s all still conjecture at this point.
But what great conjecture . . . MS went in a new direction away from the (tired) “Chip’s middle name is ‘my-way-high-way’.”
So, yeah, I agree you.
Hmmm, great question. I just don’t know if Chip signs on to take on the Eagles and allows Howie to say who stays/who goes. I’d like to think someone had a huge issue with DJ. Said person met with another Eagles brass and so on. I have to imagine someone else said — IF you do that, you better be 1) VERY SURE and 2) you have plan. It’s possible DJ went to T-Laws house for dinner and spilled PBR on his floor. T-Law called Chip and well, here we are….
This was all a cultural misunderstanding! He didn’t spill it, he was pouring some out for his dead homies. Get DJax on the phone, we can patch this back together.
Er…… http://i.imgur.com/WDUOc.gif
Ur……no, no it isn’t. A racist statement, by definition, contains an implication that one race is superior or inferior to others. I implied nothing of the sort.
I am curious, however. Which race did you infer was I putting down? You Hispanic sterotype-laden gif makes it hard to tell.
I made that same point numerous times once the rumours started flying about the Birds shopping DJax. In the end, no matter which way you slice it, I don’t think this was a move made with too much opposition amongst the FO (namely Kelly & Howie). One or the other discussed this with the other & I’m sure Lurie was of course brought into the loop. Seems like someone may have been on the fence as far as outright releasing him & once the NJ.com story broke, they just cut their bate line knowing what would follow that breaking would destroy the locker room and set them back even further than releasing him outright would.
Raise your hand if you’re staying up ’til 3am to read the first run of MMQB by Peter King to see his insights on the DJax saga.
Lol… No.
I haven’t read Peter King’s MMQB in years and years, but I do enjoy the lampooning of it every week by Kissing Suzy Kolber.
I only read the KSK version
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-lB-9jAXAl6g/UCtC8eQ0akI/AAAAAAAAdpw/hpsA4HPg8fk/s1600/horshack+22.jpg
OOH! OOH!
Now that we’re all pretty much over the DeSean Jackson thing, who wants to join me on the Arrelious Benn bandwagon?!
http://youtu.be/hJAEoKz-AWQ
LOL. I had high hopes for him last year. Oh well.
Well, he’s been rehabbing in Philadelphia side-by-side with Maclin, both of them recovering from their second ACL injury. Maybe at least one of them won’t re-injure it immediately in camp this year.
If by some miracle he can stay healthy, in this offense…talk about a STEAL!! Major IF tho
Eagles just warned Dorenbos that if he continues to throw up Amish mafia gang signs aft PATs, he will be next on the chopping block
Have you guys seen the new 2014 Eagles soccer jersey, Iggles Blitz edition? It’s pretty sweet.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/UYW0HwA.png[/IMG]
Sweet!
Brilliant.
Interesting reading here Tommy – for a minute, I thought I was on the CSN Eagles comments section. I guess I’ll come back in a week or so when cooler heads prevail (and the others go away) and you’re back talking about the draft.
I disagree with the idea that Eagles have not spoken in favor of Jackson. As Sheil Kapadia reported (http://www.phillymag.com/birds247/2014/03/27/desean-jacksons-teammates-want-back/), Trent Cole was especially supportive of Desean Jackson. The Connor Barwin comment on Jackson pretty much details the bottom line: it’s not the players’ position to speak out against the organization with regard to personnel moves.
There has been no new evidence in support of the Eagles offered damning Jackson that his teammates would not have already known. Furthermore, the LAPD and Philadelphia Police Departments have both made statements to the effect that there is no belief that DeSean Jackson is a member of a gang or involved in any crimes. Jackson has made a similar statement. Therefore, to the best of our knowledge, guys like Trent Cole or Connor Barwin would have no new information to suggest that they would change their opinions on Jackson (since prior to his release).
Consider this:
How many Eagles’ players spoke up against the Eagles when Jason Avant was released? Does that mean that Jason Avant was a bad locker room guy?
Arguably, any current Eagles player who “takes it outside of the house” and voices their concerns regarding the matter (in favor of Jackson, a former teammate, and against the organization) to the public risks upsetting the “culture” of the locker room and defying the authority of the organization.
It seems safer to assume that players know not to speak out (as seen in the Brent Celek tweet suggesting that reporters should “stop asking”) than it does to assume that there is no division of opinion on DeSean Jackson and his release.
So, no, I do not think that the relative silence on the matter since his release is in any way indicative of Chip Kelly and Howie Roseman having the pulse of the Eagles’ locker room. Instead, I think the silence is more due to this being a league in which contracts are not guaranteed.
[…] The Pulse of the Team – Tommy Lawlor, Iggles BlitzWe can argue exactly why DeSean Jackson was cut. We can debate whether it was a good thing or not. We can talk about how he’ll be replaced (coming soon in a post this week). One thing I think that isn’t up for debate is that Chip Kelly has a good feel for the pulse of the team. Kelly has had some hot button issues in his year on the job. He had to decide whether to bring back Michael Vick last offseason and then how to handle a competition between Vick and Nick Foles. Kelly had the Riley Cooper incident to deal with. Now he’s had the DeSean Jackson situation. In every case, Kelly made a tough decision, but one that the players got behind. […]