A Couple of Big CBs

Posted: April 11th, 2014 | Author: | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 44 Comments »

The Eagles prefer big CBs. Bill Davis wants his corners to jam receivers at the line of scrimmage and throw off the timing of their routes. That half-second can give other cover guys time to get in position and more importantly, it gives the pass rushers extra time to get to the QB.

Two big CBs that will be available outside the 1st round are Keith McGill and Stanley Jean-Baptiste. I much prefer McGill. I see a corner with size and some quickness. SJB is huge and has some impressive moments, but he looks to stiff to me.

By the numbers…

Keith McGill
6-3, 211
arm – 33 1/4
hand – 10 1/4
40 –  4.51
VJ – 39.0
BJ – 129.0
3-cone – 7.29
SS – 4.18

Stanley Jean-Baptiste
6-3, 218
arm – 32 3/8
hand – 8 5/8
40 – 4.61
VJ – 41.5
BJ – 128.0
3-cone – (didn’t do it in Indy)
SS – 4.33

Neither guy has ideal agility. Jason Kelce’s SS was 4.14. That was freakishly good for an O-lineman, but those aren’t good times by McGill or SJB.

Set aside the numbers and check out the tape.

vs

SJB looks stiff and a bit slow. McGill will never be called Mr. Agility, but I think you can see that there is a clear difference in the 2 players. I don’t know if the Eagles like either guy or who they prefer, but I would think McGill should be higher on their list.

SJB didn’t impress me at the Senior Bowl either. You could see he lacked athletic ability down there.

I focused on these CBs since they are huge and Davis likes big guys at that spot. There are players who will go before them that are much better. There are other big corners who will go after them that could be better value picks. McGill and SJB are big CBs with big names. I’ve gotten a few questions about them so figured it would be good to take a look at them.

Of the two, give me McGill.

_


  • Baloophi

    Jean-Baptiste looks a little “contact averse.” Like, he’s happy to be around the pile in case the ball squirts out, but doesn’t have much interest in run support or engaging the ball carrier. He had one corner blitz in the video (1:43) and was very tentative going in there, ultimately trying to Marlon Favorite the RB. He’d be an awesome two-hand touch player.

    McGill at least offered some effort in that department, though it seems like the scheme against UCLA was to play off, so we didn’t get to see much press. He did make a Dawkins-esque dive to stop his man at the 1 yard line, which based upon the 2 minutes of replays on the ensuing QB sneak may have saved a TD… at least at that moment.

    • A_T_G

      Up voted for a good observation about contact adverse, but more so for using Marlon Favorite as a verb.

      • Baloophi

        Doesn’t Merriam Webster induct a few new words into the lexicon every year? How do we get the campaign going? Kickstarter?

        Speaking of which, how about a Kickstarter to end Henery’s kicking?

        • Crus57

          So more of a KickerStopper?

  • Insomniac

    How about Dontae Johnson? Neither of the guys mentioned in the post is highly ideal. McGill is 25 years old. That’s a red flag for me.

    • Anders

      I think Johnson is safety in the Jenkins mold. McGill been 25 is a turn off for me. Same goes for Trevor Reilly. He looks great, has perfect body, but he is an old prospect.

      Rashad Hageman is the same, but he is 24 that is the limit for me in age

  • Anders

    I prefer Pierre Desir over those two of we are talking cb with length

    • Arby1

      I’m not at all impressed with that McGill tape. Was hoping for better.

    • http://www.corcommunity.com/ theycallmerob

      Agree

  • Taylor Bolton

    Honestly I like both of these gentleman and I truly hope that we pull the trigger on one of them as early as the 3rd round. I have had a bit of a preference for SJB only because I believe his background as a WR in the “Sherman” mold. Not saying that I wouldn’t be happy with McGill but I just have a bit of a bias towards the ball skills of SJB. The reason I am so big on getting a Raw”Bigger Corner” in the draft is that I believe we have a perfect system to let him learn for a year or two behind Williams, Fletcher, and Carroll and then take over the job by season 3. I would also be ok with spending a pick on a kyle fuller in round 1 if the eagles deem him the BPA as tommy Lawlor pointed out in his mock draft… MAN I can’t wait for the draft

  • ACViking

    Re: Accelerated Bonuses / June 1 Designation / Trades

    According to CBA Art. 13, Sec. 6(b)(ii), the unamortized portion of a traded player’s signing bonus is NOT subject to a June 1st designation for being allocated over two seasons.

    That same provision states that only “terminated” contracts are subject to the the 2-year allocation rule.

    SORRY FOR THE ERROR IN THE PRIOR POST.

    • TheRogerPodacter

      i’m not sure i understand this correctly.
      If a player is traded, the entire unpaid signing bonus is allocated to the current year’s cap, regardless of it being before or after June 1st?

      • Anders

        Sounds like it

      • ACViking

        TRD:
        I will clarify. Sorry.

    • Baloophi

      “Accelerated Bonuses”

      AC –

      Never miss an opportunity to use “bonii” as the plural of “bonus.” Not only is it fun, but it can add a little spice to your typical CBA explication of fiduciary amortizations.

      • A Roy

        I wonder if any contract stipulates bonii for playing in multiple stadia.

        • Baloophi

          Ha! I’m sure that’s how gladiatorial contracts were inscribed…

          • A Roy

            Probably had something about appearing in Gladiatorial Bowl LXIV, too.

          • Baloophi

            In those days they had to actually perform the new commercials live to the crowd. Of course the bad ones were immediately put to death so you didn’t have to sit through them for another few months.

  • Malcolm Jones

    anyone hear Pauline talking about us considering moving up, nothing new, but more chatter?

    • Media Mike

      So much of that depends on the ebb and flow of the draft. Is there a guy we really have rated highly who we expected to be there at 22, but a run on that position might force us to go up? Is there a guy who we have rated 7th best in the draft still sitting there at 15? So hard to say until draft night.

  • A_T_G

    McGill wins hands down in the measurables. That said, I wasn’t extremely impressed by either one in the clips. I guess if they were impressive, they wouldn’t be mid-round targets. Are either of them worth a third rounder?

    • Baloophi

      McGill literally wins “hands” down, though as I often remind Mrs. Baloophi, length isn’t everything.

      RE: 3rd rounderness – I think these guys in particular will have very fluid value pending any “CB runs” in the draft. I also think teams could be seduced by the “Seattle just won the Super Bowl, and their CB’s are big, ergo, I need to draft a big CB to win the Super Bowl” argument and take one of them (SJB) even late 2nd. In a vacuum are either of them worth that or a 3rd? I’m not sure. (though it’s impossible to throw a ball in a vacuum so I guess they’d be worthless)

      Also, in terms of value to the Eagles, I’m not sure I’d take either of these guys with our 3rd. I’m curious how you (and others) rank the CB’s in terms of the Eagles board – i.e. – who would be on your board and in what order?

      • A_T_G

        I’m not sure it is impossible to throw a ball in a vacuum. I specifically remember from high school physics class throwing balls, firing cannons, shooting guns, all in vacuums to avoid calculating air resistance.

        Unless you meant throwing a ball inside an Electrolux, then I agree completely. In that case I think we should use our third rounder on one of those little robot vacuum cleaners. Those things probably freak out pets, with hilarity ensuing.

        • Baloophi

          Those robots would also freak out Nnamdi…

          And your high school physics class sounds like it was way more interesting than mine. The closest we came to that kind of excitement was operating the emergency eye wash station.

    • Arby1

      I was thinking McGill was worth a 3rd rounder and then I watched the tape – now he looks more like a 4th to me. I would think Jaylen Watkins would be ranked in the 3rd for us.

  • CheesesteakWilly

    I don’t consider myself to know much about draft prospects, but I’ve got a hypothetical. If you’re sitting in rounds 4 and 5 and have the ability to get both Colvin and Exum do you do it and hope one pans out? Or do you go for the “safe” pick and take someone like McGill?

    • Media Mike

      If you trust your coaching staff with that position group, I don’t see a problem with hitting up the same spot more than once in the same draft.

  • mksp

    Watching these cut-ups makes me want to go with Kyle Fuller in the 1st even more. Finding elite CB talent is not easy.

    I also prefer Desir to both these guys, though he will likely go higher. McGill might make a good safety though.

    How on earth did McGill let the UCLA get outside of him on the 2nd play? Nice play to recover and make the tackle, but damn.

    Also, thanks for writing this:

    “The Eagles prefer big CBs. Bill Davis wants his corners to jam receivers at the line of scrimmage and throw off the timing of their routes. That half-second can give other cover guys time to get in position and more importantly, it gives the pass rushers extra time to get to the QB.”

    People were all over me for claiming Alterraun Verner didn’t fit the Eagles scheme. He didn’t, still doesn’t.

    • Baloophi

      mksp –

      Where are you in terms of Kyle Fuller vs. Justin Gilbert?

      • mksp

        Fuller > Gilbert for me.

        More physical, more aggressive. Gilbert has better tools, but maybe not the instincts Fuller has.

        • Baloophi

          Cool… I was curious where you have the top few CB’s this year…

          • mksp

            I like Dennard, but he is hard to project because he was so physical at the college level – what can he get away with in the pros?

            I don’t know what to think of Roby.

            I think this is my mid-round target:

            http://mockdraftable.com/player/4456/

          • Baloophi

            I like Gaines…

            FWIW, Gil Brandt thinks he’ll be a 2nd – 3rd pick:

            “Gaines, who has 31 1/8-inch arms, ran really good at the NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis (he had the second-fastest 40-yard dash time among cornerbacks
            at 4.38 seconds). On a windy day in Houston for Rice’s pro day and on a
            new turf surface, Gaines only ran the 60-yard long shuttle (11.24
            seconds). Gaines surprised everybody with his speed and quality of his
            overall pro-day workout; performing beyond expectations, due to his
            speed, ability to cover and backpedaling ability. Gaines is everything
            teams look for in a defensive back, and he will likely be a mid-second-
            to mid-third-round draft choice.”

  • A Roy

    I find it hard to reconcile the talk that this is the best draft in 30 years and then listen to people say there are only two CBs and 2 Ss worth taking towards the front of the draft. Is it just that much of the talent coming out is at WR?

    • SteveH

      Yeah I kind of wonder about this too. It seems like the draft is stacked at a couple positions, but otherwise seems like any other draft. *shrug*

  • http://twitter.com/ezgreene ezgreene

    Isn’t McGill over-aged? That’s a pretty serious factor, no?

    • Baloophi

      This is an interesting point. He’s 25, so he’ll be 29 when his rookie contract expires (almost exactly; his birthday is 3/9/89). By comparison, Sconces is 29 right now, entering his 8th season.

      I don’t think I’ve seen one of those nifty “age vs. production” charts for CB’s, but somewhere in the recesses of my mind I recall DB’s being less prone to rust (not sure whether that was distinguishing between S and CB).

      That being said, with McGill, you’re effectively looking at a finished physical product (not as important at CB than, say DE) who – at best – will give you 2-3 seasons after his rookie contract, provided he turns into at least a rotational player. deserving of an extension.

      Seems like it comes down to whether you think he can play for you in the short term and not after a couple years of seasoning…

  • Sifter

    Just looking through Bill Davis’ coaching history, he really hasn’t left a stream of huge CBs in his wake. At Arizona he had DRC (6’2 but only 183lbs), and Bryant McFadden (5’11″,190). He drafted Greg Toler who’s 5’11″- 4th round, which is the highest CB I can find drafted under Davis as a DC. At the 49ers in 05 and 06 he had Shawnate Spencer (6’1, 181), and opposite him were Walt Harris (5’11,192) or Bruce Thornton (5’11,195). McGill and SJB would dwarf anyone he’s used before. Of course that doesn’t mean he wouldn’t have liked bigger CBs, just means he’s got by before with smaller ones, and never saw the burning need to draft bigger ones given Toler was his highest pick.

    • Anders

      5’11 seems to be the minimum for him and 5’11 is considered longer CB.

      Also just because you prefer a 6’3 CB does not mean you can find one.

  • HazletonEagle

    Tommy, glad to see we are in agreement on McGill vs SJB. The only problem with McGill is his injury history. Always banged up. But I really like him for us. SJB- not so much. I see McGill as a possible 3rd rounder and Jean-Baptiste as a 5th rounder.

  • Tom W

    Isn’t McGill like 25 like sheed and Benjamin?

  • Tom W

    Most nfl teams thinking about making McGill a safety per mayock during senior bowl practice coverage

  • Tom W

    I’d rather pass on these two bc they will be over drafted and look at exum from va tech, Terence Mitchell from Oregon, and Colvin from Oklahoma. Dontae Johnson at safety