DB Day at the Combine

Posted: February 23rd, 2015 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 276 Comments »

Even if the Eagles address the secondary through free agency, they’ll still need to add a DB or 2 in the draft. They need depth.

Landon Collins from Alabama is the Safety to pay the most attention to. Chip Kelly likes SEC guys and Collins is a terrific prospect.

There are lots of CBs to watch. I like PJ Williams quite a bit, but scouts seem to think he’s slow. I’ll be interested to see how he runs. Ideally, you want all your CBs to be below 4.55. Anything above that and they better be 6-2, 215 or something like that.

I’ll be putting up a post later on that covers the DL and LBs.

I’ll watch the DBs when I get home tonight and then write about them on Tuesday.

276 Comments on “DB Day at the Combine”

1 GEAGLE said at 9:06 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
landon collins is a safety to watch? a safety who teams blatantly picked on in coverage?… everything i think about what the eagles look for in a safety says Landon Collins may not even be on our drafted board… we like converted corners at safety, dont see how they could spend a first round pick on a strong safety, with little ability in man coverage who college teams went after in the passing game… Anthony HArris for me is a more realistic safety option for us, he came in somewhat Light, but i assume we prefer his coverage over Landons size
..
intruiged by the eskridge safety from Syracuse. I need to get around to watching his tape one of these days…
…
CB, I love Peters after the way he competed against Jalen Strong, but id be pretty pleasantly surprised if the eagles took him… think its more realistic that the Eagles look to Jalen Collins LSU, Alex Carter Stanford… i assume we would like Wayans, but i dont really see him falling. I would assume he is the number 1 CB off the board and the top CB usually is drafted in the 8-13 range.
..
Ifo Olomu measured in at 5’9 coming off a knee injury.. eagles beat reporters need to stop mocking him to us, its not going to happen..
..
Disappointed in Rollins size. Had hoped he will be closer to 6’1 then 5’11…but he is still probably in play for round 2
….
really hate this DB draft class….have to sign a starting safety, and if they cut Cary(which im not really ready to assume) they will be forced to have to sing a starting CB. but Tom is right that no matter what happens in free agency we still have to draft a corner.. need a good balance of veteran producing now and youth being developed at each position. we have no young outside corners being groomed on this roster and rookie CBs typically suck… if you want to draft a starting Caliber CB, you are forced to draft him atleast a year before you need him to play for you, because it usually isnt an easy NFL transition for CBs
..
assuming Chris Johnsons record wont be broken today
2 RogerPodacter said at 10:47 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
do we still expect our safeties to be somewhat interchangeable? i mean, with less of a distinction between FS & SS?
was that a McDermott thing or a Davis thing? ugh. can’t remember.
3 A_T_G said at 11:11 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Davis has spoken of his desire to have a mirrored defense to allow for disguise and flexibility. The comment gets applied to the OLBs most often, but I think he spoke in more general terms.
4 anon said at 11:31 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
agree, but Jenkins played in the box more often and nate was generally the high safety (or maybe all the big plays happened when he was the FS so i noticed him back there more)
5 GEAGLE said at 12:29 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
yes, we want a left and right safety not a free and strong safety
6 GEAGLE said at 9:16 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Pernell McPhee – LB – Ravens
NFL sources tell the Baltimore Sun that free agent OLB Pernell McPhee is expected to command $8-$10M per season.-roto
..
Giants allegedly will Tag JPP if they cant reach an agreement
..
Bengals are being projected to possibly sign Greg Hardy, but if the Bucs cut micheal johnson after signing him to a big contract next year i would assume the Bengals would try to get him back..
…
if we have to give BG 8 mil, Id much rather give it to McPhee
..
one thing i hate to lose about BG, forget that his performance playing not even half the stats measures up to the free agents who played the entire game but BG developed a real knack for forcing fumbles, and i will miss that part of his game if we lose him…
…
If we have to lose our OLBs, this is the year to do it when you have a plathera of edge rush talent available in free agency. rather have to replace OLB this year when there are 10 quality options, then to get another year or two out of them and get stuck replacing them in a weak edge rusher free agent year that only provides two or three edge rush options… if we have to “reconfigure” our OLB group, THIS is the free agency to do it
7 GermanEagle said at 9:25 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
if we have to give BG 8 mil, Id much rather give it to McPhee
…Worilds or Hughes.
8 oreofestar said at 1:26 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Hell put Sheard in the there for people I’d pay over Graham
9 GEAGLE said at 4:44 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
8mil isnt enough to get you Hughes… not like I think they would hire Rex and immediately take away such an awesome edge rusher from a defensive guru..
…
Worlids or McPhee… if i cant have those two, id probably rather pay BG than Sheard 8mil. Sheard been underachieving, while BG has been overachieving in limited snaps, BG developed a knack for forcing fumbles, and he even has grown into a quality ST player…. ive been a sheard fan since Pit, but for 8mil I think i trust BG more than investing that much in Sheard… Sheard i would want if he costs a little less than BG
10 GermanEagle said at 5:08 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Agree with you on all accounts.
11 Mitchell said at 10:16 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
I’m getting sick of Mayock saying how crappy these DB’s are. We get it, shut up, lol.
12 Insomniac said at 10:39 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Drummond looks pretty good in the change of direction drill. Waynes put up 19 bench reps. That’s work ethic.
13 Insomniac said at 10:41 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Clayton Geathers could be a round 2 pick if he can do a sub 7s 3 come. Dude is strong and can move.
14 Mitchell said at 10:52 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
I have it on DVR and just watch him do the “go” route drill. Looks like his hips turn real smooth.
15 A_T_G said at 11:09 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Apparently he did NOT have his snowblower shoot the crankshaft through the engine housing 30 seconds after starting it up and, as a result, have to shovel his entire driveway yesterday. Just an observation as I sit here, stiffly, reading.
16 Insomniac said at 11:10 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
His hands and ball skills look decent as well. He doesn’t let it get into his body.
17 Mitchell said at 11:11 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Would you let him eat crackers in your bed?…….. I would.
18 A_T_G said at 11:12 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Is that because of his hands, or his ball skills? Or both?
19 Mitchell said at 11:13 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
LOL!!!
20 Bert's Bells said at 11:30 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Not without letting it get into his body I wouldn’t.
21 Insomniac said at 11:08 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Darby making some money today. Drummond just looks so smooth.
22 Mitchell said at 11:10 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Byron Jones jumped a 12’3″ in the broad jump….. best since 2003!
23 Anders said at 11:12 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Byron Jones, Darby and GEAGLES’s favorite Collins are all posting great numbers for their size.
24 GEAGLE said at 12:25 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
cant believe how poor marcus P ran… he isnt big enough to be that slow
25 Mitchell said at 11:16 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Drummond may have not run super fast but he still got a 4.65 as a S and looks pretty damn smooth in these coverage drills. He shows patient hands with his ball skills too. To add to that Anthony Jefferson has looked smooth in position drills, just didn’t run very fast.
26 anon said at 11:34 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
some of the athletes at the combine are crazy. Too bad it doesn’t always translate to the field.
27 Insomniac said at 11:45 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Peters ran sub 4.6..that is not good.
28 Avery Greene said at 11:46 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
That might be if we can nab him in the 2nd…
29 Insomniac said at 11:48 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
He’s not big enough to be that slow. He’s going to get beat like a drum in the NFL.
30 Mitchell said at 11:56 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
You are paying too much attention to 40 times. If you watch him play, he is a 1st round pick. The only thing that would drop him into the second is his character concerns or if he ran like a 4.9 or something dumb like that.
31 Insomniac said at 12:01 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He’s good not great.
32 GermanEagle said at 11:48 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
If his second time is that slow also this will cost him 1st round draft status…
33 GermanEagle said at 1:02 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
His second time (4.54) helped him though!!!
34 Anders said at 11:58 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Joe Haden runs the same time. That is why I hate the combine. People will “drop” greats players if they do not run optimal
35 Insomniac said at 11:59 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Haden is a 4.4 guy. Look at his pro day.
36 Anders said at 12:01 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Everybody runs faster at his pro day.
37 Insomniac said at 12:05 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Or maybe he’s as fast as his competition at the college level.
38 Anders said at 12:08 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Well Im not putting too much stock into the forty because the same player can run 10 in a row and will run 10 different times.
If a slow player on tape runs a fast 40, you do not grade him up and the same way if a fast player on tape runs a slow 40.
39 Insomniac said at 12:09 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
You would end up with Jarvis Jones and Manti Te’o because of that logic.
40 Anders said at 12:10 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
No because both players was slow on tape as well.
Same with PJ Williams, he looks slow on tape and tested slow.
41 GermanEagle said at 12:22 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
So why pay attention to the 40’s at the Combine at all then?!
42 Anders said at 12:23 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Because they are on even ground. Its why you do not pay attention to pro days
43 GermanEagle said at 12:24 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I was rather referring to you downplaying Peters’ weak 40 time…
44 Anders said at 12:25 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Some of the drills are relevant and lets say a guy look slow on tape, but runs super fast, that means you go back and see if there is a reason why he didnt look as fast on tape.
45 GermanEagle said at 12:28 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Or we reverse the logic and try to see if there is a reason why he didn’t time as fast at the Combine?! I got you!!!
46 Anders said at 1:09 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
100% yes, but you cant just dismiss somebody purely on their 40.
47 Avery Greene said at 11:46 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
I’m watching the combine online. My first. People at work will probably think I’m crazy.
48 SteveH said at 11:48 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Maybe this is way off base but my thoughts on the 40 have kind of evolved.
It seems to me like rather than looking at just a strait 40 time, it might be better to break it down into 3 categories.
The first is acceleration, which can be measured I think fairly well in the 10 yard split.
The second is how quickly you reach top speed. I don’t think there are any online measurements that determine at what yardage the prospect hits top speed, but I’m sure NFL teams could figure that out easily enough using the film of the run and using landmarks to figure that out.
The last is what exactly is the prospects top speed in MPH? does the guy really get flying once he hits his stride at 20-25 yards after a slow start, is he a faster starter but someone who tops at a lower MPH?
Then you have to look at those 3 factors and weigh in how they can get off the line of scrimmage. If the prospect is a burner who has fast acceleration, but who struggles to get off the line of scrimmage, are you going to have to project him to your scheme in a way that gets him a free release? Is the guy a medium speed guy in all respects but can beat press coverage regularly and has good size? You can project that guy differently.
Imo the fast 10 yard split guys who also show good in the agility drills are the kind of players that the Patriots have been using to kill teams since they picked up Wes Welker back in… whenever they got him. They murdered Seattle with that in the Super Bowl, just tons of short quick routes with quicker than fast guys who could get open against more lumbering linebacker types.
Gus like Vareen and Edelman are masters at that, getting open quickly, and even if they only pick up 5 or 7 yards, it keeps them very much on schedule.
Just some thoughts about 40 times and how you can actually use them projecting a player.
49 b3nz0z said at 12:20 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
that’s the 10 and 20 yard split, isn’t it?
50 GEAGLE said at 12:33 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
what do you expect when we are still using stop watches in 2015, when ESPN has the sport science equipment that measures everything down to the proportion of your weight distribution during certain movements… hopefully the combine will get out of the stone age one of these years
51 Insomniac said at 11:50 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Rollins 4.67. Good bye draft stock,
52 GermanEagle said at 12:25 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
But hey he plays faster on tape…*lookingatgroundstompingupdustwithhisfeet
53 Anders said at 12:27 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Rollins never won with speed. Im looking for his 3 cone, jumps and 20 shuttle
54 Insomniac said at 12:35 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
That ceiling looks a lot smaller now.
55 Insomniac said at 12:31 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He’ll get a shot in the NFL but there’s even more concerns now.
56 GermanEagle said at 12:32 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
4th round?!
57 GEAGLE said at 12:30 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
goodbye CB, hello safety
58 Avery Greene said at 11:53 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Eric Rowe – guy looks smooth running his 40.
59 Insomniac said at 11:54 AM on February 23rd, 2015:
Awful tackler though.
60 anon said at 12:07 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
That’s one thing that were good at doing.
61 BreakinAnklez said at 12:46 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I havnt heard that? Dude racked up over 250 tackles…can’t be that bad.
62 D3FB said at 8:45 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Watch his junior film when he played FS. It’s awful.
63 Avery Greene said at 12:05 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Trae Waynes – 4.35
64 Insomniac said at 12:25 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
4.32 the second time. 38 vertical jump.
He’s not making it out of the top 20.
65 Avery Greene said at 12:26 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He might not make it out of the top 12-15.
66 oreofestar said at 1:13 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Might go top 10
67 GermanEagle said at 12:35 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Top 12 pick.
68 Insomniac said at 12:37 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
They’re comparing him to the Cromarties lol. DRC would have been a top 10 pick if he had the balls to tackle like Waynes does.
69 Anders said at 1:17 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Better comp for DRC is Jaylen Collins in terms of raw skills
70 Avery Greene said at 12:10 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Do people here think Jalen Collins is going in the 1st or 2nd?
71 Anders said at 12:11 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He might go in the late 1st consider there is Tray Waynes and everybody else
72 GEAGLE said at 12:31 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
1st unfortunately… kid will be the 2nd corner drafted
73 Avery Greene said at 12:33 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I see why you like him. He’s got good speed, and the combine seems it’s only going to help his draft stock.
74 GEAGLE said at 12:37 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
unfortunately… i knew all the 2nd round nonsense would disappear once he performed today, especially in such a weak corner class… idiots hear one amateur opinion against the kid, take it and run with it as if its the be all end all SMH… easily a top 2 CB in this draft class… wayans experience puts him ahead of his raw ability… smooth athlete tho…. i even liked him when i was watching Amari Cooper eat him up… you can just see a quality piece of NFL cornerback clay for the pros to mold
75 Avery Greene said at 12:38 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He may drop to 20 though. That’s what we want. I’d be willing to hold #1 if he’s there.
76 GEAGLE said at 12:41 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
yeah he could def be available at 20… if wayans goes high like 10 or 11, there is a chance Collins wont last til 20… but if i had to bet, id say its a little more likely that he makes it to 20, and goes in the 20-27 range, then him going top 17, but with the steelers being so desperate for CBs, we need him to get passed them to have a chance. I assume Browns, niners, Cheifs all want WRs
77 Insomniac said at 12:15 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Whoever taught the guys how to run the 40 using that awkward high knee running was probably paid to sabotage some draft stock,
78 Mitchell said at 12:17 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
…… You mean like Olympic sprinters? That is the correct way to run. High knees head up and back straight. You come out of the start low then by about 15 yards you should be chest up.
79 Insomniac said at 12:29 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Proper Running Form
Instead of focusing on knee height for speed, focus on a good running form to conserve energy and increase speed. When you run, your foot should land directly underneath your body. If your foot extends too far in front of your body, your stride is too long and can slow you down. If your stride is too short, you will waste energy with extra foot steps that could be used for speed.
This is what basically happened to Pruitt/Max Valles
80 Mitchell said at 12:30 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Yeh, Pruitt took it to the extreme. His was bad.
81 Avery Greene said at 12:41 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I forget who mentioned Shaq, but I like his athleticism. I’m sure they can find to make it work with him. Just watched some highlights, and it’s gotta be something that he played both sides of the ball.
82 GEAGLE said at 12:46 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
struggle seeing in our defense what we can count on him doing besides being a 3rd down linebacker that can play next to kendricks in Nickel… I dont ever believe he would be a 3down safety for us… if you cant see a player matched up man to man on a slot WR, then he probably wont play safety for the Eagles…and im not completely convinced he can be a 3 down LB in our 3-4…. for us to spend a pick on him in round 1, we have to be convinced he is a 3 down player at either safety or LB, and i dont see how we can bank on him in either 3down role in our defense.
…
but i am a big fan, and if we think we have a good way to use him that im not seeing that brings 1st round value, id be hype to hear his name called.. i just struggle seeing how we can like him so much in our defense that we would spend a first rounder on him
83 Avery Greene said at 12:51 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I wasn’t thinking 1st round. That’s high for a tweener type of guy. If they were sure he could take S or ILB, than it would be different.
84 GEAGLE said at 12:54 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
agreed… but i guess if we are going to say that Landon Collins is a realistic safety prospect for us,which i dont buy at all, then i guess we also have to say Shaq is a realistic safety for us… Landon Collins is a big boy, Shaq is practically the same size,,, if we are going to say Landon is an option then i guess we cant rule out Shaq… but i wouldnt bet on us taking either
85 botto said at 12:55 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
they were saying people tell shaq to play running back and forget defense all together.
86 GEAGLE said at 12:57 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
i mean, if we had Earl Thomas, i would love to have shaq in Kam Chancellor role, but our defense doesnt work that way, atleast its not supposed to..then again Im a fan of the bernard Pollard headhunters
87 GEAGLE said at 12:42 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
WTF… leonard williams doesnt have a drivers licencse yet, because he gets around campus on a skateboard? this i would pay to see
88 Avery Greene said at 12:43 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Before we write someone off who ran a slower 40 time, Richard Sherman ran a 4.56 before coming into the league.
89 GermanEagle said at 12:45 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
he’s a bum…
90 GEAGLE said at 12:48 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
find me a 6’4 corner with long spider limbs and i promise i wont even look at his 40 time 🙂
91 GermanEagle said at 12:49 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Or someone with 33-3/8” arms who runs a 4.42 and who goes by the name of Byron Maxwell!!!
92 GEAGLE said at 12:50 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
that’ll work
93 A_T_G said at 1:00 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
So you are saying prospects can chemically enhance their abilities.
94 Anders said at 1:12 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
His 3 cone and jumps are elite at his height/weight
http://mockdraftable.com/player/551/
Also played WR before CB, so he has the hands/eye coordination to track a ball in the air.
95 Avery Greene said at 2:07 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
CBs need to be fast enough, but the better ones know how to play the ball.
96 botto said at 12:54 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
watching the interview on tv on MM and JWinston was interesting. MM is a total dud that doesn’t speak while Winston seems like a pretty normal guy that players probably like. I do understand a bit now of how people question whether MM can command the huddle with grown men. I think Winston can for sure but MM I wonder about. does the kid speak or what?
and I think Petty looed pretty good throwing, I could see us taking him.
I also think hundley would actually be good on the eagles and maybe we should get him.
97 Insomniac said at 1:10 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
An excerpt about speed for CBs.
“Straight-line speed is the No. 1 attribute for success when it comes to corners. The reason is simple: A corner who can’t keep up with a wide receiver is going to be in trouble. Now, there are guys who have a special feel for the ball, or guys who know how to break on the ball and so forth, but when a team tries to cover a 4.4 wide receiver with a 4.65 cornerback and doesn’t get a great pass rush, chances are it’s going to give up seven points.”
The counter-argument. People know that I’m down on Peters and Rollins for their slow 40 times however this pretty much raises some flags that add to their flags already. My 2nd favorite CB Kevin Johnson didn’t run fast at all but he knows how to play the game. Brent Grimes isn’t big or fast but he has an elite feeling for the game. Peters could have that. Rollins doesn’t have enough of play time to determine if he does.
98 Anders said at 1:12 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
What flag does Peters has outside of the character? He has zero flags in his tape so the 40 should change nothing
99 Insomniac said at 1:24 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Long speed is a flag Anders especially in this division. Unless you want him as a slot CB (which I think he will be great at).
100 GermanEagle said at 1:44 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Guys relax. Peters second time was a 4.54(u). R-E-L-A-X.
101 Insomniac said at 1:59 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He can keep up with Garcon and maybe Randle now!!
102 Anders said at 2:15 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Yea because that tenth of a second is all that matters over a great jam or great trail technique
103 Insomniac said at 2:29 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He can keep trailing behind Desean and ODB then since all it takes is one mistake and he’s done.
104 Anders said at 2:32 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
If you only want CBs that are as fast as Desean, GL ever finding a good one.
105 Insomniac said at 2:35 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
You only need one to keep up for the first 30 yards where you have safety help.
106 Anders said at 2:35 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
and Peters can do that because he will makes sure to have Jackson jammed (of course if Billy D asks him to play off coverage any CB is toast versus him)
107 Insomniac said at 2:38 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I don’t doubt that he can. I just doubt that he’ll reach that level with a defense that isn’t the 49ers or Seahawks.
108 Anders said at 2:38 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
By that token, we shouldnt draft any DBs because of the fear they wont reach it.
109 Insomniac said at 2:43 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Lets continue to ignore the entire picture Anders.
110 Anders said at 2:49 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Then I have missed the entire picture
111 KAJomo said at 4:21 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Didnt you just say that Jalen Collins sucks because he’s raw just yesterday?
112 bill said at 2:25 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Long speed doesn’t have as much impact if you have a system (and appropriate personnel) where there’s a deep safety that can assist on the deep ball. Furthermore, even without safety help, it’s rare (not impossible, but certainly not near 100%) that a deep WR is hit in stride, usually there’s at least a little adjustment to the pass (something Desean was very good at, btw).
Obsessing over a few hundredths of a second in an artificial setting is a case of losing sight of the forest for the trees. It’s part of the story, but shouldn’t be the whole story. Depending on your scheme, there are other skills/attributes that are equally, if not more, important, when looking to build your roster.
113 Insomniac said at 2:27 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Which we don’t have.
114 bill said at 2:30 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
No doubt the Eagles don’t currently have the right personnel – but they are trying to obtain the pieces to play the system that they want to play. Knowing Chip, they have the measurables for each position mapped out already, and I would guess that long speed is somewhat devalued there, because they plan on eventually obtaining a deep safety that can help there.
115 Insomniac said at 2:35 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I wouldn’t have any problems if we could mask Peters weaknesses until he can adapt to the NFL level. FA starts soon and maybe we could get a Maxwell or McCourty to relieve some pressure from the rookie. Rookie CBs will take their lumps and need to have a short memory.
116 bill said at 2:39 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Yeah, I think they are pretty much required to address the secondary in a big way during FA this year. One big signing or a bevvy of mid-range signings. Not normally something I advocate, but they’re in a position where they need 3 new starters going into next season. At least one of those guys has to be an impact vet, or you need the shotgun approach with multiple mid-tier vets to hedge your bets.
117 BreakinAnklez said at 1:18 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Anyone seeing a safety solution from this draft?
118 Mitchell said at 1:20 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Drummond, Derron Smith (who wasn’t there surprisingly), Geathers, Rowe. I think there are no immediate solutions but some good pieces to develop.
119 BreakinAnklez said at 1:29 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Have been impressed with Rowe from what I’ve seen today. Wish Derron Smith and Anthony Harris were working out. Collins struggled catching in the gauntlet big time. Didn’t look natural. Drummond ran a slow 40. I want to see how he does in the SS, 3-corn stuff as well. Seems like his range is an issue.
Looks like FA might be our best bet.
120 Mitchell said at 1:44 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
It always was our best bet. However Drummond still ran a .65 as a S which is not too bad. I forgot about Harris as well.
121 b3nz0z said at 1:21 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
better cornerbacks
122 GEAGLE said at 7:09 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
anthony Harris was really the only safety i wanted to see… shame
123 D3FB said at 8:36 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Bad class. Alot of low ceiling high floor guys or subterranean basement floors, penthouse ceilings type guys.
124 b3nz0z said at 1:23 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
just a thought so don’t rip me if it strikes you as dumb, but if the eagles could trade back in a way that allows them to pick up, in rounds 1-2, S gerod holliman, LB shaq thompson, and QB brett hundley, would you be happy? assuming we pick up a CB prior to the draft . . .
125 Bert's Bells said at 2:14 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
If they turned out to be good NFL players, I’d be thrilled. It’d be a brilliant move.
If they sucked, I’d hate it and scream for everyone to be fired.
126 b3nz0z said at 2:15 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
haha me too. but i meant, like, that weekend.
127 Nailed it! said at 2:28 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Replace Shaq with Kendricks and I am there.
128 mksp said at 2:28 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
i really don’t like holliman. safeties need to be able to tackle better than he does.
129 b3nz0z said at 2:31 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
hadn’t heard that. yeah the last thing we need is bad tackles from a safety
130 Anders said at 2:31 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He had 44 tackles and 20 missed tackles
131 b3nz0z said at 2:31 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
i wish i had known that
132 A_T_G said at 2:50 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Wow, that is laughably bad.
133 unhinged said at 5:06 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
If he has the nose for the ball that is Ed Reedish, he’ll have fewer tackles to make because he’s breaking up passes and getting picks. And whoever takes him will put him through tackling hell – tackling is teachable.
134 Anders said at 2:53 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I have begun to see people mocking Jalen Collins to the Seahawks. If there is one team who could harness his raw ability, it is that team
135 NickS, Combine Warrior said at 3:35 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Wonder if our new DB coach could develop him.
136 Avery Greene said at 4:29 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He won’t make it to 31.
137 KAJomo said at 4:31 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Dont bother. Anders hates long, athletic corners that are raw. Everyone here yesterday told me Collins was a 2-3 round guy when I was worrying if he’d make it to #20.
138 Avery Greene said at 4:33 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
After today, I’d be surprised to see him drop. It’s a shame we need so much, because I’d like to f hanother 2nd & 3rd, but
139 Anders said at 5:23 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
No I do not hate them, I just do not wanna use a first round pick on somebody who has zero technique. Look at Patrick Peterson, still is super raw and therefor gets toasted by good route runners like maclin
140 Media Mike said at 5:28 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Not jumping into the argument here, but hearing Richard Sherman mock Peterson is really funny.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/12/21/richard-sherman-says-patrick-peterson-would-be-benched-in-seattle/
141 GEAGLE said at 7:13 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
nope… 25th at the latest. Lucky if he gets passed the steelers and even makes it to 20
142 Anders said at 3:03 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
You can probably test out some draftniks by asking them what they think of Quintorris Jones & Sharod White for '15 draft (AKA Julio & Roddy)— Scott Kacsmar (@FO_ScottKacsmar) 23. februar 2015
143 GermanEagle said at 3:16 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Please make it happen Howie:
http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2015/2/23/8091899/nfl-free-agency-rumors-sources-eagles-byron-maxwell-seahawks
144 anon said at 3:28 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Todd Mcshay (I know) giving Winston andrew luck like draft grades. James Casey heading to Arizona. AP not going back to Vikings — which probably means we’ll see him in Dallas, damn.
Gotta wonder how much the vikings care. In one sense AP’s cap numbers are horrible and they can use that $$ elsewhere. In another sense keeping AP puts them close to the playoffs especially if they take a WR high.
145 NickS, Combine Warrior said at 3:34 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Bruce Arians wants to know what that college offense is all about.
146 anon said at 3:48 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He’s also going to denver, maybe denver likes hm and lets green go.
147 Insomniac said at 4:00 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I wonder if he’ll chase a ring or the money,
148 BreakinAnklez said at 4:26 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
How is he going to Dalls? I’m pretty sure they have like no cap space and like a third of their roster is a FA, including Dez who is going to need some major coin. I doubt AP will play for pennies.
149 unhinged said at 4:48 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
They could stack his contract so the hurt comes later, but the hurt will be big. Jerry might swing for the fences, 12M to tag Dez, big money to AP and he’s going to need a starter on defense from the draft.
150 KAJomo said at 4:10 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I had to work all day, so I missed the combine. Who stuck out? How was my boy Jalen Collins?
151 Javi Echie said at 4:13 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Collins blazed a sub 4.4 forty and with the rest of his combine I think he just solidified himself as a 1st round corner.
152 KAJomo said at 4:16 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
awesome. he is a too target for me at #20 and I am afraid he will already be gone. Everyone was telling me I was crazy and he wouldnt be a 1st round pick
Any sleepers emerge from the workouts?
153 Javi Echie said at 4:19 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I’ve been a huge fan of his all throughout the year and especially now in free agency. I am in the thinking now that he will be the 2nd corner taken in the draft behind Waynes.
154 KAJomo said at 4:23 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Yep. Sign Maxwell and draft this guy and the position is set for years.
155 Javi Echie said at 4:28 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I would be ecstatic if that happened. If we do pass on a corner in the 1st I would take a long look and Kevin Johnson out of Wake Forest in the 2nd round. Kid can definitely ball and has the size at 6’1 that Chip covets.
156 KAJomo said at 4:29 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Byron Jones may be a good target. He’s got the height and arm length teams covet. Another raw guy, but could develope into a good starter
157 Javi Echie said at 4:32 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
The guy just set a record for the broad jump by jumping 12’3″, which is ridiculous. I think his combine alone jumped him up at least one round. See him getting plucked in the 5th no later and I would take him as a developmental project.
158 KAJomo said at 4:34 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I think he’ll go 2-3 round as long as he runs well at his pro day. He was a safety and swicthed to CB so he is raw, but he’s obviously athletic and his length is a problem for offenses.
159 GEAGLE said at 7:12 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
crazy like a fox. you are talking about what will be the 2nd corner drafted, we need him to get passed the steelers to stand a chance of him making it to 20… hopefully wayans doesnt come off the board til like 12 or #13, giving us a decent shot of the next corner not being taken in the next 6 picks… but Steelers will most likely decide if he gets to us or not
160 oreofestar said at 7:35 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Steelers pick after us you know….
161 GEAGLE said at 7:55 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
huh? dont they have the 15th pick?
162 oreofestar said at 8:42 AM on February 24th, 2015:
No they mAde the playoffs remember
163 ACViking said at 5:06 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Collins has less than 1 season of starts in 3 years of college.
Spending a 1st on him may be a luxury — which only stacked teams could afford.
164 GermanEagle said at 5:06 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Seattle jumps to my mind.
165 GEAGLE said at 7:16 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
irrelevant.. all rookie corners suck. you are better off sitting all rookie corners for atleast a year… If Im not comfortable starting polished rookie corners, why would i care whether the corner is raw or polished? not like GMs care anyway… all they are concerned with is getting the most talented piece of clay that their coaching staff can turn into the best player 3-4 years from now
166 GermanEagle said at 7:37 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I get what are you saying, but why is Seattle irrelevant? I don’t care if he starts from day one for them, but ACViking had a good point and Seattle just makes too much sense. Also it is believed they like long corners with long arms…
167 GEAGLE said at 7:58 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
no I mean its irrelevant whether a player is polished or Raw, NFL CEILING and the character that can be trusted to realize that full potential and reach the NFL ceiling is all that will dictate who gets picked in round 1… no such thing as a player being too raw to get picked in round 1, if he comes with serious round 1 talent and you trust that he has a character that you can work with and help reach his full potential… Seattle im sure would love to see him fall to them, but It would surprise me personally if the 2nd corner drafted doesnt come off the board til #30
168 Mitchell said at 5:09 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
This is my sentiment, if he was so darn good, why didn’t he start more. He is a big bag of potential and I think if someone wants to spend a pick on him it is someone with great DB’s already in place.
169 Insomniac said at 4:53 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Collins might have pushed himself into the late first round. He had a great combine. The other aside from Waynes didn’t do as well as expected.
170 Javi Echie said at 4:10 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
The Kansas City Chiefs are “considering” Mississippi State ILB Benardrick McKinney “as a possible replacement for Justin Houston,” according to TFY Draft Insider Tony Pauline.
“I presently rank Benardrick McKinney at outside linebacker and so do a number of teams. Sources tell me the Kansas City Chiefs are considering McKinney as a possible replacement for Justin Houston who they may lose in free agency,” Pauline writes. If the Chiefs aren’t willing to open the bank for Justin Houston, they may have to look towards the draft to fill a major need. However, it looks like the Chiefs are thinking that they could utilize McKinney’s combination of size, length and athleticism as an OLB.
….
Could the Chiefs really lose Justin Houston that they are thinking on drafting McKinney to stick him at OLB as a replacement?.
171 GENETiC-FREAK said at 4:13 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Wow for real.. Nah i dont see Chiefs letting Houston get away.. Simple tag will keep him if a deal isnt sorted soon
172 Javi Echie said at 4:14 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
That’s what I thought from the beginning, I think they are more thinking about next year. It still is nice to dream about him hitting FA.
173 anon said at 4:18 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
why keep hali’s $10m salary on the books
174 Javi Echie said at 4:18 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Hali has already stated that he is willing to restructure.
175 KAJomo said at 4:19 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Plus they just drafted Dee Ford last year
176 ACViking said at 5:03 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
If Pauline and KC’s personnel dept believe INSIDE LINEBACKER Bednarik [sic] McKinney can line up at OLB on 3rd down and provide a pass rush close to comparable to Justine Houston . . .
Then Bednarik should be rising up every draft board.
Where can you find a 6’4″ 250lb ILBs who play like OLBs?
177 GEAGLE said at 7:21 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
if a team were to do that, i guess it makes sense that it comes from the genius Andy Reid… how is his round 1 fast ball Dee Ford panning out? is he forgotten already lol… Dee Ford cant beat out a college inside LB as a replacement for the best OLB in the NFL? lol i wouldnt believe you unless you told me andy or the Browns were involved
178 KAJomo said at 4:12 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
pauline is tyoically clued in, but that seems like a stretch. They can franchise houston for atleast this season
179 anon said at 4:16 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
There’s a great article on ChipWagon reading Hundley and this offense.
180 Nailed it! said at 5:02 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Link?
181 anon said at 5:07 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
http://www.thechipwagon.com/eagles/2015/02/why-brett-hundley-likes-chips-offense.html
182 Nailed it! said at 5:28 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Thanks!
183 GEAGLE said at 7:23 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
love how only the good hundley opinions get posted on this site, as if there arent “experts” who dont think very highly of the kid at all…
184 Media Mike said at 7:27 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Well you don’t expect the guys who like him to post articles about not liking him? I’m not a fan of drafting Hundley at all, but I haven’t felt the need to nuke him via article. There are a ton you could use however.
185 Mitchell said at 4:26 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Round 1 Pick 20: Alvin Dupree, DE/OLB, Kentucky (B+)
Round 2 Pick 20: Sammie Coates, WR, Auburn (A)
Round 3 Pick 20: Stephone Anthony, ILB, Clemson (C)
Round 4 Pick 14: Sean Hickey, OT, Syracuse (D)
Round 4 Pick 20: Josh Shaw, CB, Southern California (A)
Round 5 Pick 20: Eric Rowe, CB/FS, Utah (C)
Round 6 Pick 20: Tre McBride, WR, William & Mary (C+)
Round 7 Pick 20: Tony Washington, OLB, Oregon (C)
Here is the post combine mock. I didn’t accept any unreasonable trade downs and tried to grab guys where I actually think they will go instead of, for example, taking Waynes at 20 (no way he will be there).
186 Media Mike said at 5:39 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
That seems too “logical” and “realistic.”
Here is one that I just did without any trades either
Round 1 Pick 20: Trae Waynes, CB, Michigan State (B)
Round 2 Pick 20: Jaelen Strong, WR, Arizona State (A)
Round 3 Pick 20: David Johnson, RB, Northern Iowa (B-)
Round 4 Pick 14: Stephone Anthony, ILB, Clemson (B-)
Round 4 Pick 20: Bryce Petty, QB, Baylor (B+)
Round 5 Pick 20: Clayton Geathers, SS, UCF (A-)
Round 6 Pick 20: Leterrius Walton, DT, Central Michigan (A-)
Round 7 Pick 20: Ben Beckwith, OG, Mississippi State (C+)
187 Mitchell said at 5:47 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
First 2 picks and we can just pack it in! I also see we have an affinity for Strong and Anthony. I would love love love to have those 2 players!
188 Media Mike said at 5:53 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Now here is some real drafting son!
Round 1 Pick 25 (CAR): Alvin Dupree, DE/OLB, Kentucky (A-)
Round 2 Pick 20: Jalen Collins, CB, LSU (B+)
Round 2 Pick 23 (ARI): Denzel Perryman, ILB/OLB, Miami (Fla.) (A)
Round 2 Pick 25 (CAR): Dorial Green-Beckham, WR, Oklahoma (A)
Round 3 Pick 20: Duke Johnson, RB, Miami (Fla.) (A)
Round 3 Pick 25 (CAR): Cedric Ogbuehi, OT, Texas A&M (B)
Round 4 Pick 14: Ben Koyack, TE, Notre Dame (A-)
Round 4 Pick 20: Rob Havenstein, OT, Wisconsin (C)
Round 4 Pick 25 (CAR): Ronald Darby, CB, Florida State (B+)
Round 5 Pick 20: Clayton Geathers, SS, UCF (A-)
Round 6 Pick 20: Leterrius Walton, DT, Central Michigan (A-)
Round 7 Pick 20: Titus Davis, WR, Central Michigan (C)
189 Mitchell said at 5:54 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
……ggwp.
190 Media Mike said at 6:05 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
The game makes you wonder what types of idiots are drafting for other teams to cause that level of talent to fall.
191 Insomniac said at 8:29 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Round 1 Pick 20: Trae Waynes, CB, Michigan State (B)
Round 2 Pick 20: Dorial Green-Beckham, WR, Oklahoma (A)
Round 3 Pick 20: Tevin Coleman, RB, Indiana (A)
Round 4 Pick 14: Ronald Darby, CB, Florida State (B-)
Round 4 Pick 20: Ali Marpet, OG, Hobart & William Smith (B)
Round 5 Pick 20: Clayton Geathers, SS, UCF (A-)
Round 6 Pick 20: Jake Ryan, OLB/ILB, Michigan (C+)
Round 7 Pick 20: Antwan Goodley, WR, Baylor (B-)
192 Mitchell said at 10:43 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
This certainly would be a good haul. Are you trying to follow the guidelines above or just doing one for funsies?
193 Richaud Jeaffreson said at 4:05 AM on February 25th, 2015:
Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 24 (ARI): Trae Waynes, CB, Michigan State (B+)
Round 2 Pick 22 (DET): Devin Smith, WR, Ohio State (A-)
Round 2 Pick 23 (ARI): Stephone Anthony, ILB, Clemson (D+)
Round 3 Pick 24 (DET): Byron Jones, CB, Connecticut (D)
Round 3 Pick 25 (CAR): Rob Havenstein, OT, Wisconsin (C+)
Round 4 Pick 14: Jake Ryan, OLB/ILB, Michigan (F)
Round 4 Pick 20: Josh Shaw, CB, Southern California (C)
Round 4 Pick 25 (CAR): Zack Hodges, OLB, Harvard (A-)
Round 5 Pick 20: Bryan Bennett, QB, Southeastern Louisiana (E)
Round 5 Pick 25 (CAR): Clayton Geathers, SS, UCF (A)
Round 6 Pick 20: Deon Simon, DT, Northwestern St. (F)
Round 6 Pick 25 (CAR): Sean Hickey, OT, Syracuse (C)
Round 7 Pick 20: Mitch Morse, OT, Missouri (F)
194 Richaud Jeaffreson said at 4:47 AM on February 25th, 2015:
Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 21 (CINN): Benardrick McKinney, ILB, Mississippi State (B-)
Round 2 Pick 20: Dorial Green-Beckham, WR, Oklahoma (A)
Round 3 Pick 20: Byron Jones, CB, Connecticut (C)
Round 3 Pick 21 (CINN): Kevin Johnson, CB, Wake Forest (B+)
Round 4 Pick 14: Ali Marpet, OG, Hobart & William Smith (B-)
Round 4 Pick 20: Zack Hodges, OLB, Harvard (B+)
Round 4 Pick 21 (CINN): Clayton Geathers, SS, UCF (C+)
Round 5 Pick 20: Tayo Fabuluje, OT, TCU (D+)
Round 6 Pick 20: Max Valles, OLB, Virginia (C-)
Round 7 Pick 20: Tre McBride, WR, William & Mary (A)
195 Richaud Jeaffreson said at 6:23 AM on February 25th, 2015:
Your score is: 4325 (GRADE: B+)
Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 20: D.J. Humphries, OT, Florida (B+)
Round 2 Pick 22 (DET): Jalen Collins, CB, LSU (A-)
Round 3 Pick 20: Byron Jones, CB, Connecticut (D-)
Round 3 Pick 24 (DET): Phillip Dorsett, WR, Miami (Fla.) (A)
Round 4 Pick 14: Cedric Ogbuehi, OT, Texas A&M (C+)
Round 4 Pick 20: Zach Hodges, OLB, Harvard (B-)
Round 5 Pick 20: Tre McBride, WR, William & Mary (D)
Round 6 Pick 20: Zach Wagenmann, DE, Montana (B-)
Round 7 Pick 20: Bryan Bennett, QB, Southeastern Louisiana (D)
196 Mitchell said at 11:31 AM on February 25th, 2015:
Seems pretty decent but I would have liked to see you take advantage of the top heavy pass rushers in the first. Unless they were all gone! I really like Byron Jones and have to watch more on him. If he plays anywhere decent on tape and he has that kind of athleticism, I can’t see how he makes it out of day 2.
197 GEAGLE said at 4:34 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
wow!! BREAKING NEWS!!! you guys might want to sit down for this one… you ready? The Great Brady Quinn is “eyeing a comeback”………. who needs marriotta now? lol
…
dodged this bullet :Colts released DE Ricky Jean-Francois.
Jean-Francois registered a career-high 28 tackles in 2014, but he was costing the Colts too much money. Releasing Jean-Francois opens up $4.875 million in cap space. The Colts will likely move forward with promising third-year DE Montori Hughes as their starting five-technique across from Arthur Jones.-roto
198 Mac said at 4:42 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
The medicine woman?
199 GEAGLE said at 4:45 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
id probably rather have that chick as our QB instead of Brady
200 ACViking said at 4:47 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Re: Trade Down / Trade Up . . . What’s Kelly to Do?
Kelly’s gonna trade UP in 2015.
I think, from what Kelly’s seen and reputedly said, he’s concluded that the draft — while a crap-shoot, to be sure — is a process in which you increase your odds of long-term success as a team by getting not only EXACTLY whom you want in Rd 1. But one of the BEST off the board.
_______________
Travel back to the 2013 draft. Kelly’s been an NFL coach for 4+ months.
The meme seemed to be that Kelly had targeted — and expected to land — the athletically freakish OLB Dion Jordan with the 4th overall pick. A guy who’s tall, fast, can cover, can rush the passer — a perfect bookend at OLB to the next 10 years.
Of course, Miami jumped the Eagles — going from 12th to 3rd — and selected Jordan.
So Kelly — in the blue-chip part of the draft — chose the next guy up for him in OT Lane Johnson.
(This is not about how things look in hindsight. Only on draft day.)
The Birds’ pick easily could have been Eric Fisher or DE Z-Ansah or OT LJoekel, or even a trade, if JAX or KC had made a different decision.
It’s hard to say Kelly snookered anyone at No. 4 by drafting Johnson. He was among the BEST of the BEST in the 2013 draft and the next guy up at OT.
Did Kelly, coming from Oregon talking about Big Guys Beat Little Guys and versatile players, really want Dion Jordan?
We don’t know for sure. But Kelly knew Jordan. He didn’t know Johnson beyond the pre-draft process.
________________
On to the 2014 draft.
For Rd 1, the prevailing narrative seems to be that Chip Kelly had only 6 players ranked as Eagles-worthy 1st Rd picks. Guys he really WANTED.
But all 6 were gone when the Eagles were up at #22. And the last 2 in the most frustrating way for Kelly.
Cooks and Clinton-Dix, two of the rumored six, went off the board at Nos. 20 and 21 — the two picks preceding the Birds’ choice.
Deja vu for Kelly. The Saints traded ahead of the Birds to #20 to get the remarkably explosive Cooks.
(Yes, Matthews is very good. But — again — project Cooks, in May 2014, in Kelly’s offense.)
________________
Jump to Rd 2 of last year’s draft.
At No. 39, JAX drafts USC WR Marquise Lee — whom, some have argued, was the next guy on Kelly’s draft list. (No way to know.)
Three picks later, Kelly moves up from 54 to 42 to select Matthews. (Eagles traded with TN, swapping the Birds’ 2nd and 4th Rd picks.)
Only 2 other WRs were drafted between the TN’s choice and the Birds’ original spot at 54: Seattle choosing deep-threat Paul Richardson at 45; and the Packers selecting Davante Adams at 53.
QUESTION: Should the Eagles have waited ’til pick No. 54? Or waited to trade-up for less than the 4th Rd pick it cost?
Also . . . would Seattle or GB, or another team, have taken Matthews before the Eagles drafted in the 54th spot if they stood pat?
Still on the board at 54 when TN selected were WRs JLandry, CLatimer, and ARobinson (all eventual 2nd Rd picks).
__________________
ANSWER: No way to know.
And that is precisely my point.
Kelly didn’t know.
Roseman didn’t know (although he may have been arguing in favor of waiting based on the “group” of receivers whom he considered to have relatively equal value).
No one knows. NO ONE — except those who actually work at NovaCare.
BUT . . . Here’s what Kelly did know:
Kelly wanted Matthews.
He liked him more than any other receiver left on the board.
_______________
So, the argument goes . . .
Kelly wasn’t going to lose out on Matthews because another team traded up ahead of the Eagles.
Kelly’d missed out on Jordan in 2013.
Kelly missed out on all 6 of this 1st Rd guys in 2014 — with Cooks disappearing on a trade up, as Jordan did.
Kelly wasn’t taking any more risks — because he wanted whom he wanted.
He didn’t want “one of the guys” comparably valued using *traditional* draft methodologies.
________________
So now the 2015 draft is a couple months away.
Kelly’s on record calling the draft a crap shot. Does he believe that?
Who knows.
But what seems apparent, based on the info pieced together about Kelly’s view of the draft, is . . .
He’s very selective about whom he wants. Very.
And — because other teams took the risk of trading up — Kelly’s missed on his guys in 2013 (arguably) and 2014
In 2015, Kelly is NOT going to miss out again.
So no “trade downs” for more picks and a less talented guy in Rd 1.
Spend some picks . . . Trade UP . . . and come away with big-time, big-impact player.
That’s were I think the data points.
201 Mac said at 4:56 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
If you can fill roster holes and special teams with FA signings, then it absolutely makes sense to get premier talent in the draft. Problem is… if you swing and miss on a pick (at the cost of 2 or 3 picks) then your miss is even more painful for not having more cards to hand in and roll the dice on some just a guys.
Time will tell if Chip can make the pick worth the expense, but I think you’re onto something with this theory.
202 Media Mike said at 5:22 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Damn, I just wrote the same thing. Sorry I didn’t see you put it down first. In either case, I agree with you.
203 KAJomo said at 4:57 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
110% agree with this. We beat bad teams because we have a bunch of good players. However we dont beat the elite teams becuase we lack elite players. Players you need to gameplan for and can take over games.
Its why anyone who thinks its a good idea to draft Eric Kendricks in the first is nuts. There are Eric Kendricks type players available every year. We want those elite guys with special traits. Give me an elite Eli Harold or Jalen Collings or DGB. They will need time to develope, but can betuly dominant rather than just good.
204 Mitchell said at 5:07 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
However, I think last years draft had all of the top players taken before or at 20. It could be argued when we picked there was no one left worth a first round pick. So I think last year, we should have traded up to nab someone. Switch to this years draft and I think, no matter how the draft plays out, there is going to be a player that will look fantastic on this offense or defense. Some examples are Dupree, Strong, Harold, or one of the many OL. Last year there was a much greater drop off in talent simply between number 21 and 22. In summation I think last year we should have traded up to get more of an impact player when the drop off in talent was much more steep. Compare that to this year where the drop off from the first 5-10 players is less noticeable.
205 ACViking said at 5:19 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
M:
One of my premises is Kelly is HIGHLY selective.
So selective that players who’d fit within a “group” of 1st Rd picks using — let’s say, for the sake of discussion — Roseman’s approach . . . will NOT be 1st Rd picks for Kelly.
Maybe for other teams. Just not Kelly.
Again, just a premise which I think points to Kelly being pro-active to get one of the guys, among 2-3, in Rd 1 whom he really, really wants.
On the other hand, if the 1st Rd is loaded with guys Kelly considers 1st Rd values using Kelly’s measuring stick . . . then I think your point is very well taken.
206 Media Mike said at 5:20 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
How aggressive they are in free agency should help dictate if they’ll want to move up or not. If they add a bunch of guys in free agency, they’ll have fewer roster spots to fill via the draft; thus making a trade up scenario make sense. If they don’t really sign anybody of note and then move up in the draft; we’re going to be stuck with more salad tossers like Casey Matthews, Todd Herremans, Nate Allen, Bradley Fletcher, and Cary Williams on this roster.
I’m totally good with a trade up, but we need to make sure we’re not doing so at the expense of improving the team in the multiple areas of need.
207 ACViking said at 5:41 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
MM:
Good breakdown. FA would definitely ease the hard cost of a trade up.
I just think that Kelly wants to get a couple very high-impact young players.
But who knows (outside of NovaCare)?
208 Media Mike said at 6:56 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
In either case, I’m saving all of my wrath or praise for whoever they actually draft.
209 ACViking said at 7:09 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
MM:
That’s a line worth repeating.
210 Insomniac said at 4:51 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
2 breakdowns of Chris Conley are out.
My thoughts so far
I don’t think he plays to his 4.35 time on the field but he can stretch the field vertically. He has nice soft hands that pluck the ball out of the air but he doesn’t offer much as YAC besides outrunning people. Body control is great and his blocking is good. Routes are limited and a bit sloppy but he was beating CBs down the field (QB didn’t throw to him). His emergence, H/W/S and play style is pretty similar to Cody Latimer.
211 ACViking said at 5:00 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
A cheaper, smarter version of Cooper?
212 KAJomo said at 5:21 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He’s nothing like Cooper. Just cant think of a good comp for him right now. Maybe Terrance Willams?
213 ACViking said at 5:38 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Why is he nothing like Cooper?
What’s Cooper? What’s Conley at this point after 4 college season?
214 Insomniac said at 5:43 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
He flashes once in awhile but with a bit of polish I could see him as someone like DeAndre Hopkins.
215 KAJomo said at 5:47 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I assumed you were talking about Riley Cooper
216 BreakinAnklez said at 5:02 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Also has had a lot of injuries. That WR corp has been crushed every year with injuries.
217 KAJomo said at 5:18 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I just watched both videos and agrre with your eval. He’d be a great pick in round 5. He brings the speed we are missing and isnt a liability in the redzone like most fast guys.
218 GEAGLE said at 5:04 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
i dont need anyone to tell me what a great Tackle Lane Johnson is going to be, and I knew he has a solid season, but i had no idea just how high everyone graded him this year.. forget who gave him which grades but someone graded him at as a top 3 RT this year/ didnt realize how much he was being praised…. Crazy how Raw this kid was when we got him, and how well we already have him performing after two years..
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IT’s bad enough that one of these years we will have to trash the continuity and move him on the left side to replace the BOSS HOG aka Jason Peters.. but amazing how he graded out so high while 3 different guards lined up next to him..
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anyone hear any Todd Herremans rumors? I have no idea how long he has left as an Eagle, but Id like to think that such a long tenured Eagle like Herremans, if chip was going to cut him, he would have already done it like he did James Casey so they have a chance to land on their feet and find a solid job. Heck Cardfinals already rumored to sniff around James Casey. If Herremans is going to get Cut, I assume that would have to happen by Friday, giving his agent almost 14 days to prepare for Free agency..
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im not at all against Bringing herremans back. Personally, losing Herremans and replacing him with a nice player does us no good. we need to build OL depth, you arent building depth if you sign a good player but lose a good player at the same position… but if we are bringing herremans back, I ask that we soon find our RG of the future because at some point Lane is going to have to build some real chemistry with the young RG playing next to him…
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I see no reason why Fisher cant start his career at Guard. I like his RT potential more than I liked Kyle Longs, but like Kyle Long, i think he can be a solid guard to start his career…if we are going to have to break up the continuity Lane gets with the RG in a year or two when we have to move lane to the Left side, not a horrible idea to stick a RG next to him who is going to have to move to a new position(RT) anyway when you break up the chemistry by moving Lane to the left side…
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our RGs I think have some time at a high level left in the Tank, but We really need to start finding a young RG of the future, because for me Tobin looked so much better at LG then RG, so Im wondering if he will be one of those kids that just cant switch sides as well as some other players..
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one annoying piece of the puzzle is that like RB, Guard is one of the few positions that can be plug and play, kids you can draft and actually start as rookies.. so if we do keep herremans, we really dont have to get his replacement til the draft after you cut him, but since we lack depth anyway. If there is a RG we absolutely love, or a future RT like Jake Fisher who can start off at Guard, we can draft them now and let them improve our depth while herremans is still here, or we can wait til like the 5th round to draft a G, if he will spend a season on the bench anyway.. and we can spend higher picks on kids we need to draft ASAP because they need a year of growth before we can count on starting them
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anyone even hear any TODDfather rumors?
219 RichC, brings duck to cockfigh said at 5:11 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Right on Johnny. Lane got an All Pro vote this year, that’s WITH missing 4 games. Remember the LJ/Fisher/Joeckal debates? Is there a serious question today? We got the best of the three, and he’s a good one.
I’m happy to keep Todd at G for another season. I think he outplayed Mathis down the stretch.
Obviously the birds need to do some O-line estate planning. Fisher would be a great 2nd round pick. Problem is, did he combine his way into top 50?
220 GEAGLE said at 5:24 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
lol ahhh the joekel/fisher debates.. i missed those days when short sited people actually thought they had a chance of becoming what Lane will be… I still Maintain that the only players chip was considering in the top 10 that year were Dion, Lane, Johnathon Cooper, and possibly Ziggy depending on how we viewed him as a fit… Could be wrong tho since my evaluation of how good Johnathon Cooper will be isnt looking so good these days, but with breaking his leg, i wouldnt rule out seeing him get it together this year or the next… I would still trade for him in a heartbeat if the Cardinals wanted to deal him.
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Oh Im fine keeping Todd, I think he still has legit starting NFL ability, what scares me is friggin Herremans and Kelce both missed atleast a 3rd of the season to injuries 2 of the past 3 years. Its easier to overlook it with Kelce because of his young age, but Herremans been battling in the trenches for a long time.. Starting to question how likely it is to keep him healthy for 16 games and hopefully a few playoff games… his durability is the only reason im having these thoughts, they have nothing to do with the player i think we would be getting on the field if we keep him…
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yeah I liked Talking about how much I like Jake Fisher much more in October back when poeple thought he could be had in the 3rd round… Now Im not even sure he will last til our pick in round 2 unfortunately.. i was pissed to see him have such an awesome combine. That was bad for us. we didnt need to see him put on a show for our coach to know how good he is, Sucks that he had such a good combine… Fisher saved Oregons ass when Johnstone got hurt at LT…
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fortunately there is some quality at T and G in this draft, so hopefully teams value enough guys ahead of Fisher that he has a chance to fall to us, having our RT and LT of the future in place already would eliminate a big concern in our longterm planning
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but I definitely was a much happier Jake Fisher fan before he put on a show at the damn combine.. I didnt need to see him make the combine his bitch to know he was a player, so you can bet Chip, the man who recruited him did not need to see the combine to know he was going to have a big day… Disgusted by how well he performed at the combine..
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I can smell Kyle Long all over again. Figured we could get dion at 4, and still get Long at the beginning of round 2… Blessing in disguise to be forced to draft Lane with Kyle Long not even making it to pick 25 in rd 1…hate to see us miss out on Fisher like we missed out on Kyle
221 Media Mike said at 5:26 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
The problem with Ziggy is that he’s like 30 already due to his fraudulent passport from disorganized Ghana. I would have red flagged him faster than you can say “Freddy Adu.”
222 GEAGLE said at 5:27 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
how old is he for real?
223 Media Mike said at 5:31 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
26 in May according to that nonsense passport from Ghana. I think he’s actually 30 however.
http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?817659-Answers-to-Ansah-s-age
224 GEAGLE said at 6:49 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
lol… if he is really 30, ill die laughing
225 Media Mike said at 6:50 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Trust no age from Ghana.
226 GEAGLE said at 6:50 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
sounds like good life advice to go by
227 ACViking said at 6:03 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
“Now Im not even sure he will last til our pick in round 2”
_________
No chance Fisher makes it to No. 52.
You’ve been beating the drum for this guy. Secret’s out.
228 Media Mike said at 5:13 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Herremans, due to his use at 4 positions if we REALLY needed him to play any one of them, should be a candidate for a salary reduction / threat.
Or they can cut him after they find a better guard option in free agency.
Or they can cut him after they find a better guard option in the draft.
Or they can cut him after they have a guy beat him for the spot in camp.
229 GEAGLE said at 5:35 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
gotta look to see what the date was when we cut respected Eagle Jason Avant… Dont see chip doing the toddfather dirty and cutting him after most teams spend all their money and it becomes hard for him to land on his feet. forget that Todd was a long tenured warrior for us, he was one of the Vets that immediately embraced chip as a headcoach with no NFL experience and helped chip transition to nfl back when there where questions about Vets “buying in”…
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If Herremans was going to be cut, i think it would have happened already out of sheer respect. need to check the date of when we released avant, the last really respected eagle that was cut
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i havent heard a peep about him being waived, or him being approached about adjusting his contract, and i really think if its going to hsappen, it has to happen really soon, if not should have happened last week when Casey was waived so his agent could work on getting him his next job at the combine
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the only think at all I heard about Herremans was immediately after the season, I forget who, but one of the media members claimed Herremans was horrible this year, was a complete Liability and the eagles finding a RG was one of the most urgent things on this offseasons to do list..Dont remember who it was who said it, someone like Louis Riddick or something. but since that, i havent heard anything about his contract or his future
230 Media Mike said at 5:40 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I don’t know anything about when Kelly will cut a guy or not; we don’t have enough data.
231 GEAGLE said at 6:22 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
actually if you look back at his comments about cutting avant, he talked about wanting to do right by him and cut him early enough to find a job… actually he said the same thing about when we cut desean. instead of holding him hostage til the draft trying to get value and cut him in june after every team spent most of their offseason money…
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Then again we arent hearing a peep about trent coles contract, Carys contract, or Demecos contracts yet, so i guess you are right, unless we are all off base and none none of those 3 players contracts get altered.
232 Media Mike said at 6:23 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
And what happened with Jackson being cut after how many lies about Jackson being cut?
233 OregonDucker said at 5:57 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
ToddFather and Foles/Shady might be part of the deal. We will know soon for sure.
234 ACViking said at 5:59 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
OD:
Best drama in these parts since the HC search for Kelly!
Really enjoying these tension-filled morsels.
235 OregonDucker said at 6:03 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Yeah AC. The fan base and media are going to be super pissed after this trade. But you have to remember, Chip really does not give a D*MN.
The draft is all about guesses. FA has better hope for OL and DBs. Chip will make his proposal based on facts and probabilities. This guy is the Einstein of football along with Newton/Belichick.
Either way, he will move mountains for Mariota.
236 GEAGLE said at 6:11 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
yeah yeah, and then Chip ends up leaving our franchise in shambles, running away like the Charlatan Doug Collins.. sixers fans still pissed at trading away Vucevic because he was good but not sexy enough and didnt have the patience to allow the young man to develop…. If Eagles fans want to also learn the hard way, i better not have to hear them bitch for the next decade when we end up comparing the Chip era to the Doug Collins era lol,,,,and im a bigtime chip fan
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all I ask, is that if you are going to spend a top 100 pick on a QB, he better put his money where his mouth is and trade Foles.,.. If you dont value Nick enough to spend our most valuable picks adding high caliber talent around him that will help him succeed the next 5 years, then Id rather Nick be traded… THis one foot in with Nick, one foot out bullshit helps no one… commit to Nick or Trade him.. gonna take a bunch of picks away from our team building then have the confidence in what you are doing to trade Nick and recoup a pick or two that we traded away
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237 GEAGLE said at 6:17 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
to let people in on a secret, we will NEVER WIN A damn thing if we keep playing musical chairs with QBs every single offseason…. Continuity is such a big part of this game, and continuity never matters more than it does when it comes to QBs in a system, building chemistry with his WR’s…
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tired of caring about QBs, i dont even friggin like offense. do whatever the hell yous want with that side of the ball. all I ask is that this is the last offseason of dicking around playing musical Chairs with QBs.. Find a damn starter and his backup and let them grow in this system the next 3-4years. because we will never be a serious team if we are teaching the offense to a new QB or two every single damn offseason… that does no one any good… and find your damn Qb without trading away our defenders.. you wanna gfive up the farm, give away your offensive players for the silly QB, better leave Cox, Logan, Kendricks alone
238 OregonDucker said at 6:27 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Chip will take the risk GEagle. He’s BIG BALLS CHIP for a reason. Still, Chip’s football IQ is off the charts so the risk is not as great as we mere mortals think.
He did give us a clue when he compared Mariota’s decision-making to Peyton.
239 GEAGLE said at 6:34 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
yeah well, i can post 3 peoples opinions who are now comparing Jackass Jameis QB brain with Peytons.. how convenient.. everyones favorite QBs have peyton manning brains these days, i must have missed the peyton manning brain Tree’s that are sprouting all over the place lol
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i dont even like offense enough to continue this QB crap,. do whatever the hell you guys want on offense. whatever you desire on offense, i truly hope you get it, just do it without screwing with my beloved eagles defense…and end the QB musical chairs game this OFFSEASON. cant keep adding a new QB or two every offseason.its absurd and it will get us NO where. QB aint shit without continuity, unless he is lucky enough to be surrounded with an embarrassment of riches like russell wilson
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find a damn QB and stick with him in the same damn offense, throwing to the same damn Wrs for the next 4 years… if we add another QB next summer, then i lose all confidence in chip
240 Media Mike said at 6:12 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
What if Mariota goes 1 to Tampa?
241 GEAGLE said at 6:17 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
i fucking celebrate!!!
242 Media Mike said at 6:21 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
ha ha ha ha. I’m not trying to wade into the “Chip is / is not going to nuke Foles and trade up for Mariota” argument, but Tampa being settled on Winston is far from done.
But if the Jets were to take the #20 and Foles for the #6, that would be what I’d consider not getting ripped off in trading up.
I’m cool for anybody Chips wants to trade up for if Chip likes the guy’s talent; but I’m not cool for paying over the value chart.
243 GEAGLE said at 6:24 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
im tired of caring about offense… do whatever the hell yous want at QB, just have the balls to trade foles and recoup value if you are going to blow top picks on QBs when we already have one that we win with, and leave our young defenders alone. if you need to trade away young players to get your damn QB, trade away your young offensive players, and leave Cox,kendricks and logan alone!..,. just figure it out this offseason… i dont want to hear a peep about QBs again next year. trade foles, trade half your offense away, trade our next 5 drafts away, do whatever the hell yous want, just do it without screwing with the defense
244 OregonDucker said at 6:30 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
GEagle, you have to remember that Chip hates turnovers. Foles has made too many. One could use the OL excuse but it holds no weight with Chip. He’s obsessive about turnovers. Some might consider him a little crazy on the subject.
245 GEAGLE said at 6:45 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
yeah yeah.. and whoever the hell you get at QB will make just as many turnovers if he is playing with 3 interior lineman that were almost all undrafted, making there first starts,,, if thats not bad enough they arent even lined up next to veterans.. 3 inexperienced kids in a row lined up next to each other in the interior of our line, if thats not bad enough, most of them played multiple different spots, with different guys next to them every game… dont give a shit if you get aaron Rodgers, he aint doing anything behind an OL like that either…. the best RB in the NFL struggled to gain a friggin yard, but forget the 14-4 record, Nick made too many turnovers in a situation no QBs would succeed in…. makes perfect sense… as if QB development is linear and will always just keep improving without having any rough patches, as if you can find a QB who made so many mistakes, playing with a flawed roster yet we always end up winning with anyway,…. during the bad times,.you win with Nick… Lets see if the next QB can win when shit hits the fan, has hard games and has the entire city of Philly at his neck like Nick did last year after we shit on him for getting concussed after the cowboys… lets see Marriotta break his hand, stay in the game and keep throwing bombs with his broken throwing hand, lets see Marriotta face about as much venom as i have seen thrown at a young player in this city after the tough bad dallas loss when he was cxoncussed, and lets see him respond to this cities stupidity and venom by traveling cross country where the eagles NEVER friggin win no matter how good we are and how bad the raiders are and fllood the black hole with 7 TDs in 3 quarters..
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im so tired of this city taking this young man for granted, im seriously ready to trade him,… Trade him. this city needs to learn the hard way…hope we trade Nick, Lane, our next 3 entire drafts and shady.. I really do.. I hope we give away everything for Marriotta. heck trade everything for the kid but our 2nd round pick and yous can use that on Hundley too…. bring in Marriotta and Hundley, trade Nick away so this city gets its wish and everyone can be happy… i just dont want to hear about it after wards like i hear about Vucevic or Earl THomas…. im ready, trade away Nick…
246 Nailed it! said at 6:49 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
You need to desalt and sweetin immediately.
247 GEAGLE said at 7:01 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
i want foles gone! tired of it. all i care about is getting to the point where hopefully next year i can enjoy an offseason with out QB drama… im baffled has how we are going into year 3 under chip, and have been through like 5 different QBs, and we are still adding QBs in the offseason when its the position that requires the most continuity… i know that no matter who we get at QB, it wont matter unless he gets a few years in the offense building chemistry with his team mates, yet Im being told we havent even found the guy yet? once we find THE GUY i have to wait 3-4 years for him to grow.. if the guy aint Nick, i cant wait another year for him to start getting groomed. this is ridiculous. especially when this roster isnt good enough to win a superbowl no matter who the QB is.. so not only dont we have a good enough SB team around the QB, but we dont even have the guy yet? and they GUY we want is going to put a major dent in our ability to build a team a QB can win a SB with… If Nick Foles isnt the guy, WTF are we wasting money on Jason Peters for? why not cut, JP, Mathis and Herremans, Brent Celek too and start finding young players who wont be too old by the time THE guy is developed and ready to have a shot at winning anything…
,.,,
im tired of talking about crippling our ability to build up this roster because of QBs, im tired of wasting years of development. Continuity is everything… if Nick Foles isnt the GUY, then we are atleast 3 years away from contending for a SB, because this isnt a stacked roster that can have a shot at carrying a young QB all the way to the SB… where as, if we actually have a serious free agent period, and a decent draft, with our OL back, we could improve enough to make a run with foles in the 3rd year of the same offense.. i cant wait til chip has NO CONNECTIONS left to any of the college kids. what should have been an advantage, im tired of
248 OregonDucker said at 7:13 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I hear ya GEagle. But Mariota gives you feet. He makes things happen, keeps the defense honest, and hurts a killer defense rush. No way he has the same turnovers BUT he could end up hurt trying to escape – I will grant you that. Still, he most likely would find the open receiver on his scramble. This guy is smarter than most QBs. He and Chip are magicians! If you want a SB, take a chance on Mariota.
249 GEAGLE said at 7:50 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
everyone is enamored with his combine, but i really dont understand why.. did people need to see the combine to know he was going to be a really good and fast athlete? cant impress me if i expected you to do that for the past two years…. The Kid earned a heisman trophy throwing to WIDE OPEN WRs.. atleast not “NFL OPEN” WR’s.. yet we get to the combine, and after watching him throw beautiful balls to open WRs for two years, everyone is now raving because he sets his feet and makes good throws when there isnt even 1 single defender on the field? how did his great combine solve concerns about inexperience throwing into “NFL Windowns”? “NFL Open” is very different than “College open”.. Not to mention the different coverages he will see in the NFL… everyone is raving about this combine when in reality i didnt learn a damn thing, It literally didnt answer a single question that mattered to me. i been seeing him throw great balls to open WRs for two years, yet im supposed to rave about him throwing without any defenders on the field?
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If I am being Honest, THE only POSITIVE i learned this weekend about Marriotta that I didnt know is that he is Bigger and looks stronger than he does in pads. Seems a bit bigger and more durable than I expected. Bet if you put him next to Kapernick there is an obvious difference with marriotta having a bigger frame, so he might be more durable than I expected, which shouldnt be dismissed as no big deal, because it does matter if we are talking about a running QB…
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but other than his size, everything i expected to play out did, and the questions and concerns i had, didnt even come close to being answered… I respect that you thought highly of the kid before the combine, and you think highly of the kid now.. i can dig that… but I laugh at how many eagles fans were against trading the farm for the kid last week, but because they saw him at the combine now they are willing to trade anything to get him… i dont understand, because to me, everything he showed at the combine was expected and was never a legitimate concern for me…. the only thing he did to improve his stock in my eyes is he is bigger than i thought which hopefully translates to more durable.
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I think there is a big big difference between playing QB in college, and playing QB in pro football, especially in a city like this..i have seen average college QBs go on to be great NFL QBs nd i have seen countless stud college QBs, high rated cant miss top picks amount to nothing in the pros..
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when it comes to the pro game, I can count on nick to handle playing in this crazy city and i can count on chip and Nick to still give us a chance to win in those games where nothing goes our way.. I dont take that for granted, and I damn sure dont assume that every top college QB will be able to handle playing in this city.
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I already know Nick can win in this league if you put a decent enough team around him… Marriotta for all i know may go on to become a great QB who like Luck can carry an average team, which Nick cant do yet, but I think Foles and our draft picks if used correctly will be better than starting over with a rookie, and taking away all the valuable picks from the positions around the QB that really need it.
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if i was sitting here watching a dominant defense, and a SB caliber team and all that was missing was a QB, id probably be way more ok with trading away what it will cost to get the kid… but my defense needs help, by next year we will need to replace 2 of our top 3 TEs. we still need to upgrade Coop, we need a ILB, we probably need an OLB or two which happens to be one of the most valued positions. we still need the RT of the future that will replace Lane when he moves to the left side, we have two older guards… May lose Vinny Curry next year which is a HUGE PROBLEM with Thornton not giving us any interior pass rush..
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we need so much, yet not only do we want to replace a QB that we win with, but we want to really put a dent in being able to fill these positions of need?
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if we had a team that could carry a rookie QB to the superbowl like the seahawks this year or next year I would be way more receptive to this, but whatever…
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i just hope people understand what it really means to start all over with a rookie QB,,
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the only good part is 4 more years of cheap QB labor, but if the eagles arent going to go out like the seahawks and take advantage of paying a rookie QB and stacking the rest of the roster, than what good is paying a rookie QB cheap if we will just roll over 15 mil in cap every year.
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I gave Chip two years to do whatever he wanted,. I didnt rip him like half the morons. I gave him two years to start building his program.. year 3, you better start to deliver results like every single other headcoach would be expected to do in year 3, yet we are talking about starting all over with a rookie, that will cost us a ton,,,
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do whatever the hell they want at QB, all i ask is that we arent talking about signing or drafting QBs next year..QB requires 3-4 years of continuity, how many years are we going to waste playing musical chairs with QBs in the offseason?
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if Nick Foles isnt good enough to be the guy then why the fuck are we turning down 2nd round picks and top young players for him? so that we can piss away two years when we new we werent going to win, and then start all over?
250 OregonDucker said at 6:21 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
No way. They want BIG attendance with a Heisman Forida QB. Plus he impressed on Football IQ. No way they take a chance on Mariota.
251 Media Mike said at 6:22 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Greg Bedard doesn’t agree.
http://mmqb.si.com/2015/02/20/jameis-winston-marcus-mariota-nfl-draft-tampa-bay-buccaneers/
But we’ll know for sure on April 30th.
252 GEAGLE said at 6:03 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
toddfather and shady have no trade value
253 NinjaP said at 5:21 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I don’t think any safety in this draft fits our team if we run the same scheme we did last year. Collins would be eaten alive in man to man coverage against slot receivers.
254 KAJomo said at 5:24 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I am really leaning towards signing a guy like Rahim Moore. This safety class does nothing for me.
255 Media Mike said at 5:25 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
We’re not playing Baltimore soon, are we?
256 KAJomo said at 5:46 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I love how you base evaluations. Its hilarious
Rahim Moore = the flacco pass
All UVA plyers = Jon Harris
Evreything associated with the Giants = they suck (totally true)
257 Media Mike said at 5:52 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
K.I.S.S. principle at work.
And until whatever coach at UVA claimed Jon Harris was any good kills himself out of shame (and Ray Rhodes can kill himself too) for talking up Jon Harris; I’m holding my grudge.
258 RobNE said at 7:36 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
The eagles didn’t have to take him so early.
259 GEAGLE said at 5:53 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I much prefer Da’Norris Searcy, although i have to admit that part of that is me being very familiar with Searcys ability, while not having the best grasp of Rahim Moores game, cant get the images of him letting WRs behind him in the playoffs out of my mind, and i havent put in the time watching him to be able to think about something else whenever his name is mentioned..
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But Searcy Im comfortable pounding the table for. Its not a case of me viewing him as the best option, I view him as a pretty darn good fit:
1) High Charecter kid, known workaholic who improved each of his 4 years in the NFL. Started off with two years of ST and Subpackage play, While replacing Byrd in 2013 when he got injured, and starting this year. Kid was a quality player on the top pass defense in the NFL that gave up less TDs in the air then the Legion of Boom
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2) Really solid tackling, also known to deliver a boom or two
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3) Good ball skills, CBs can really count on him to provide the support they are expecting to get from the safeties. When he has over the top help aiding a CB, that WR aint catching the ball. its just not happening, you can count on him to be where he is supposed to be at all time, more importantly the CBs can trust him, which has been a clear problem with our defense besides Malcolm jenkins
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4) If it wasnt bad enough that x plays destroyed us all year, literally giving away games we should have won like the Cardinals, by giving up a bomb on 3rd down, late when we have the lead.. If giving up all the damn Xplays werent enough, if corners not being able to count on safety help wasnt enough, we were also ridiculously undisciplined pissing away half the 3rd down stops we managed to make by commiting moronic penalties balling out the offense on 3rd down… I cant take another year of defensive penalties, and i cant help but to drool over a kid that was involved in so many passing plays down field, yet didnt get flagged for a SINGLE penalty all year.
This kid, played in the secondary that gave up less TDs then the Legion of Boom, but unlike all the penalties the LOB racks up, he didnt get flagged for a single play this year and when you see how aggressive he plays the game, i dont even know how its possible. you put this kid next to Jenkins, and no matter who our CBs are, it will make our secondary better
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if you are wondering about his ability in man coverage, between all the subpackages he played in before he ever became a starter(nickels, dimes), and the year and a half starting, you have examples of him matching up in man coverage against just about every position you could ask a safety to line up against…
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This is a young stud who is entering his prime as a player. This is a safety version of Connar Barwin, a kid who has talent and ability but who will really blow up and realize his ceiling during this next contract he signs… this isnt a kid you have to pay because of reputation and past production, this is a kid you pay because you are getting him at the perfect time when he is about to play his best ball… Id rather have Searcy then Byron Maxwell. Maxwell is the better talent, but a quality safety we can count on to finally solve this safety crap once and for all IMO will have a bigger effect on our defense in todays NFL than a top CB would..
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But if the Eagles are going to make the CB our big money signing, then we probably have to forget about Searcy and turn to the next tier safeties and go with someone like Marcus Gilchrist who someone linked to us in a rumor last week
260 KAJomo said at 10:02 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I could get on board with searcy. I’m really intriqued by Moore’s playmaking ability, his lenhth, and the fact that he is only 24 years old. I havent watched a ton of any of the FA safeties other than McCourty.
261 Media Mike said at 5:25 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Guys I like at safety (as of right now) are Derron Smith (3rd round) and Clayton Geathers (5th round).
But I think there isn’t a reason to reach on a safety early.
Pat Kirwan was explaining how this was a weak year for safeties in the draft.
262 Mitchell said at 10:46 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Derron Smith is very impressive looking, I would almost think late second early third and I think Geathers combined his way into the late 3rd/4th.
263 ACViking said at 5:33 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Re: Jalen Collins – A Rare Bird in Rd 1
The last time an NFL team drafted a CB in Rd 1 who started only 1 full season in college it was the NYG.
In 2007, the Giants selected UTexas CB Aaron Ross with . . . coincidence or irony? . . . the 20th pick in Rd 1.
The 5’11” 190lb Ross started all 13 games for UT in the 2006 season — winning the Jim Thorpe award as the nation’s top DB — and 2 games in 2005.
(That’s 15 starts for Ross versus just 10 in three seasons for Collins.)
Once with the Giants, Ross was a part-time starter at CB in 2007 as a rookie.
A full-time starter at CB in 2008.
Then in 2009, Ross was moved to Safety. Started only 1 of 4 games before being injured.
Back to part-time CB in 2010.
To Safety again in 2011 — starting full time for only the 2nd season of his Giant career.
Then, after the SB, the Giants cut Ross loose.
_______________
As a 1st Rd pick, Collins would seem to be a big-time projection (if not gamble).
264 anon said at 5:37 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
could we take another look at RJF? probably much reduced price.
265 Media Mike said at 5:41 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
RJF?
266 Nailed it! said at 5:41 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Ricky Jean-Francious….
267 Media Mike said at 5:52 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
ohhhhhhhhhh. And no.
268 GEAGLE said at 5:56 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
nah… he isnt good enough to replace Thornton… If we really wanted to replace Thornton with a veteran who unlike Thornton could also provide a little interior pass rush, I assume we would look towards a 27yr old 3-4 DE like Jared Odrick… but we are so good at the DL and all our kids best ball is still ahead of them that it makes paying for a quality veteran pointless unless you have a chance at a real game changer like Ngata which wont be happening unfortunately…
269 Nailed it! said at 5:58 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Yeah, do not want him. Way to many impact players for us to get in FA!
270 GEAGLE said at 6:01 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
i love the UCLA kid, Omegawbe Ominghuiza or whatever his name is… not the ideal two gapper but an athletic young beast who could end up being the replacement for Vinny Curry as our interior 3rd down pass rusher if we lose him to free agency next year… If we pay Thornton, and lose Vinny Curry after the year, we will be left with a major hole next to Cox as our 3rd down interior pass rusher when we go to our 4man lines… The Monster from UCLA while isnt the ideal two gap DE(3-4). if we are going to pay thornton, someone with interior pass rush has to replace him on 3rd down next to cox, and if we are going to lose Curry, may not be a horrible idea to start grooming his replacement now before we have to count on him as our #2 interior pass rusher next year because we lost Curry
271 MagatBrackendale said at 7:42 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
FYI:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2372704-character-questions-are-overblown-for-top-cbs-marcus-peters-pj-williams
272 Mitchell said at 7:56 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
Very interesting stuff. There are corners out there for us to draft if we want them. Same with safety in the mid rounds.
273 A_T_G said at 11:07 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
I’m on board for Williams, but MP isn’t going to be an Eagle. Quoting from Jimmy, “He tried to strangle a coach on the sidelines,” one scout said. “Then they let him back on the team and he did it all over again. Try selling that to your head coach.”
That just isn’t excusable.
274 Jeff said at 9:52 PM on February 23rd, 2015:
This is the 3rd offseason under Chip. There seems to be less and less roster questions each year. This year it’s 1 or 2 new DB’s, and a few depths spots at OL and LB. All other positions can be upgraded if a deal comes up, but aren’t absolutely necessary.
Year one there were a lot more questions and turnover. Our DL and outside linebackers were a huge question mark, but are now a major strength heading into next season. Maybe this year (although I thought last year too) will be the year we see a more polished product, with less turnovers and cleaner execution due to continuity from last year.
275 anon said at 12:10 AM on February 24th, 2015:
Jets cut Percy Harvin, Billy B will pick him up. If you’re the jets you almost have to just pay that $.
276 Insomniac said at 12:24 AM on February 24th, 2015:
Harvin’s career might be over.