Mock Draft Time
Posted: March 22nd, 2015 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 131 Comments »I put together my first Eagles mock draft of the offseason. Remember…this isn’t my ideal scenario, but rather one possibility based on the kind of players the Eagles like and where they are likely to go in the draft.
I used the mock for my PE.com column this week.
The hardest part of doing a mock is trying to address all the positions with early picks. I think the 1st round pick needs to be about the best player, not the most needed position. If we did go with position, which one would you choose? You could make a strong argument for WR, RG, CB, FS or QB. There is no definitive right answer and that’s what makes roster building so tricky. Are you drafting for right now, next year or 3 years from now? If you draft a stud WR, will he make the current OL better? If you draft a stud RG, will he make the current WR better? And so on.
The only thing I feel definitive about is that the Eagles need to draft a couple of OL and a Safety. They don’t have to be early picks, but you don’t want them to be 6th and 7th’s.
Fire away with your questions and comments and I’ll answer them in a post later today.
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I like it. The only thing is I think Chip probably will rate Jake Fisher higher than T.J. Clemmings and similarly talented OL that he’s less familiar with.
I feel compelled to note that Chip Kelly usually stays out of discussions when it comes to Oregon players. He’s on record saying he kind of sits back and lets others say what they have to say about them.
If people can convince him that Clemmings is a better prospect then I am sure he will listen.
IMO, they overdrafted both Huff and Hart last year and I hardly think that was due to Roseman’s influence.
I’m not focusing on Roseman. I think the whole room had a voice in things and had them as rated as highly as they did for whatever reason.
Then Chip made the call. And that was before he shoved Roseman out of the way, and dumped some scouts. For another year, Ducks will get picked ahead of where the consensus says they should. We’re all hoping he guesses right.
It sounds as if you assume that Chip has behaved just like you would.
Nah I’m 99% sure that Chip said he wanted Hart in the 3rd but Howie told him that he would be there later
How do you know they overdrafted Huff and Hart last year?
Huff, yes. Hart, no. Basing that purely on my opinion of them at this time last year, not hindsight.
That was when someone else was in charge. Nothing in the past month indicates any other person has any impact on his roster. The guy just traded a top-2 RB for a Duck with a broken knee. There is sero chance that was a consensus after reasoned discussion. His palace coup plus his cuts and trades of anyone who didn’t agree with his system sent the message that you get on board his train or you get fired.
Much as we are told what goes on at Novacare Central by beloved writers, hacks and morons, I really believe that Kelly does engage in reasoned discussion about prospects. He has said that the draft is a crap shoot, (which may make him more determined to get his guy too early), but his ego doesn’t seem so fragile that he cannot get the views of people he respects. What you term a palace coup struck me as more of a money dump. He actually said “…It’s really all about money.” Do you think the Cole, Casey and Herremans and Williams cuts, 2 of whom he signed, were about disagreement or culture fit?
Interesting discussion; why not get both?
Looks like Greg Jennings might be signed by Carolina. He visited them yesterday and then posted this today:
Greg Jennings
@GregJennings
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33m
33 minutes ago
Not sure why, but for some reason I have a desire to listen to “Good Charlotte” today! Hmm… https://sqor.com/posts/9da47a39-bddb-4c92-8e0e-f7f5bd7848e7/uid/8543 …
he and Avant will combine to be the classiest, slowest receivers in the NFL
All of that effort getting old WRs year after year to play with the same brutal QB.
Not sure about others but all things being equal I’d be pretty damn pleased if they actually ended up with this draft. I really like Mayle & Gwacham.
I would as well. Not too confident in chips ability to not overdraft individuals and reach for his Oregon ties as well. Not meaning to be grim, there have just been several head scratching moments.
” I think the 1st round pick needs to be about the best player, not the most needed position”
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while I completely agree and i friggin WISH that sentence Holds True…. we are talking about a GM that had every intention of spending our first round pick last year on Jordan Mathews…
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I think all the ways we used to view the draft, importance of BPA, value.. I think all that goes out the window… when its time for chip to pick, i highly highly doubt we end up wit the guy the consensus would call the BEST PLAYER! chip seems to not operate this way…
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seems to me like chip is going to put together a pretty specific wish list, and do whatever he feels is the best way to get as many of the guys on his list as possible,,,
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I dont expect bud dupree to fall past #12…. but if he miraculuosly fell to #20, i think he would easily be the consensus best player available. and i have no confidence in chip drafting him, unless he was part of chips “player specific list”, and if Bud Dupree was a name on his list, i doubt chip would just sit at 20 and pray he falls to 20. I think chip will trade up, he will reach, he will do whatever he has to, to come out of this draft with the guys he is Targeting,…. so if Dupree where to surprisingly fall to #20, I have NO CONFIDENCE that chip will take him, more likely Chip is going to spend a first round pick on a guy like Jake Fisher, who NO ONE will mock in the top 20, but who chip will view as THE PERFECT pick for his OL…
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i expect a discrepency between what round we think a player should be drafted in, and what round chip drafts the kid in…..is that a good idea? bad idea? who knows…. there can be an argument for even if the guys he wants prove to be great picks, he is still making a mistake in value because maybe you can get them a round later.. but you can also lose a player you think will be fantastic in your scheme because you tried to play the value game and waited another round to try and get the kid…
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at the end of the day, Im expecting that there will be a bigtime negative initial reaction to the Eagles draft this year. The kids we pick wont match up with the value Kiper has placed on each kid and brainwashed that value in our heads for months.,..so I expect Philly to be ripping Chip for this upcoming draft, becaus ethe mock experts wont agree with it, and they managed to trick us into thinking they are some talent authority when in reality if they were THAT good at their job they would be working in a front office,. we will RIP CHIPS first draft as GM…and in the end we will see who was right, chips evaluation of these players or Kipers different opinions of his kids…. if the guys chip “reaches” for go on to be probowlers, chip will be viewed as Brilliant… if the kids he draft cant play, he will look really bad…
Serious business.
Nice work.
JM in the first comment… Wasnt that his choice after his first six were gone?
thats my understanding…. Howie had to school him and show chip how to get another player and still end up with the Pope..I think chip was high on Marcus, because i dont think howie had the balls to take a player that wasnt pre approved by chip before the draft… i just assume that Jordan was higher then Marcus on his list…… Chip Loved Dion and Barr, you can bet he liked Marcus potential/skill set, athleticism, arm length, QB experience, graduate.. so i kind of think chip was slimey for saying it was a howie pick, because while its true that chip wanted Jordan, I am convinced that ANYT “Howie Pick” was going to be one of the guys chip pre approved and added to the draft board anyway… so it was kind of whack to pawn Marcus off on Howie when all howie did was get him another player chip pre-approved, and still got chip the player he wanted Jordan…
Chip’s has had 2 drafts to partake in and to reflect on. Chip said that this will be the first year where he has the final say on who gets picked in each round. The real mystery is who is on his board? I think that active free agency that Eagles just went through probably was good for CK, as it pertains to the draft. Kelly knows that you do not build a championship team by having an NFL pro-bowler at every position, and perhaps the more he has to gauge the monetary commitment to positions, the less arbitrary will be his drafting decisions. Last season, if I recall correctly, and I may be wrong on one or two of these guys, but Beckham, Barr, Fuller, Clinton Dix, Lee, Mosley and Cooks were all on the Eagles first round board. We don’t know if that was Chip’s board or HR’s, but any one of them would have probably gotten pretty high praise from the bleachers. If this year’s board is similar in tone, we may all find that Chip has no need to veer from consensus player rankings, though I do think if a Collins becomes an Eagle in round 1 he’ll be from LSU, not Alabama.
i dont believe that there was a single player on the board that wasnt pre approved by chip,…. so when we say a “howie pick”, we are talking abouty a guy chip preapproved and put on the bigboard anyway…. when I hear “howie pick”, I assume i really means chip had someone else higher rated, but howie took a lkower rated guy on chips list because he thought he could still get that guy in another round… For example chip wanted Hart, howie talked him out of it we got Jaylen, and still ended up with Hart…but Jaylen wasnt a real howie guy, he was one of the players chip preapproved.. just so happens chip liked Hart more, and howie stepped inb and showed him we could get jaylen, and still get his GUY!
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same exact thing I think happened with Marcus Smith.. marcus is a raw version of everything chip wants in an OLB.. no shot that howie justy picked him and chip was againbst it,.,.. Chip wanted Jordan, he had him higher then Marcus..howie stepped in, and showed chip that he could still get a guy like Marcus, and still enbd up with Jordan….
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but i think every single player every drafted these past two years were guys chip preapproved. I donbt think there was a single eagle pick who chip didnt put on the bigboard himself… a HOWIE pick, just mneans we drafted a guy who chip had lower on his big board, but inb most cases we ended up with the guy chip wanted anyway…we didnt lose Huff, we didnt lose Jordan, we didnt lose Hart…where did Marcus, Jaylen, reynolds come from? CHIP PREAPPROVED THEM!!! no shot in hell that they were guys howie put on the board that chip was completely against… every player to make our board these past 3 years chip preapproved…no doubt!
I love this draft… make it so!
This mock is a great nexus between value and need. We know they very rarely work out that way. So if it falls this way – terrific.
If, however, after round three, we went: RG, WR, S, I’ll be suspicious of reaches. Ideally, we plug at least two of the remaining holes w/ FA or trades prior to the draft.
its decent, not bad, not too far off from mine.. heres mine.. 1 Jake Fisher 2 Devin Funchess 3 Tyler Lockett 4 Damarious Randall 5 Jamil Douglas 5 Bryan Bennett 6 Jake Ryan 7 Ladarius Gunter
I’m not so sure about this mirrored safety thing anymore. Maxwell spent the majority of his time pre-FA talking about wanting to play in the same scheme he did in Seattle. Both he and Thurmond talked about the similarities between that and what the Eagles wants to do in their meetings with the press after they signed.
I can’t see how the cover 3 would work with, or at least require, interchangeable safeties. The whole things seems odd to me, what we straight up lied to a key FA signing to get him here? Or did we start to widen our outlook on the safety position? It just seems strange to me that we would spend on Maxwell, when we already have Malcolm Jenkins and supposedly still looking for a safety with coverage ability. Are we gonna play with 4 deep zones, or have the defense unbalanced with the CB opposite Maxwell play a short zone, or are we planning on playing Jenkins in another way?
Something doesnt smell right to me, and sadly i can’t really convince myself that Billy Davis got it covered.
I think we wouldnt have both safeties doing the same thing at the same time. One could play deep while the other covers the slot. Then the next play, they switch. Or something like that. The whole unpredictability and versatility thing, ya know
Sure, and even if we draft a guy like Landon Collins, who by no means is a coverage safety, its not insane to expect him to cover either the slot or deep.
it just seems strange to me that we signed yet another slot corner, bringing our total to 3, with 1 of them starting outside, and we want to add a coverage safety to partner Malcolm Jenkins whos strenghts is covering deep or man coverage.
It might end up making sense, since its a passing league now, but I just wonder how they’ll scheme it. Especially since we got 3 LBs who are really strong in coverage too.
Yeah im not sure about the slot corner thing either. I guess Chip knows Thurmond has more in him than just slot potential.
Im not as worried about 2 coverage safeties because our front 7 has got the run covered. Or at least they did last year. ‘Specially that beast Cox
I also think Chip thinks Boykin won’t be on the team by next year.
This isn’t even a personel issue, although i too have doubts about Boykin, Carroll and Thurmond starting.
Its about the scheme, and having 2 CBs and 2 Safeties covering deep, leaving our LBs to cover underneath seems like an invitation to the good QBs to pick us apart and dink and dunk all the way down the field.
We know from Maxwell/Thurmond that they we’re brought in to do what they did in Seattle, which was covering deep in their cover 3.
Jenkins was used in the box primarily because Nate Allen is… well Nate Allen. Now we plan on bringing in another Malcolm Jenkins.
Even if we tell our CBs to play more agressive than Seattle, since they got double the backup behind them, it would still create a whole lot of opponents WR matching up against our LBs or finding holes in the zone coverage. Do that against the premiere QBs in the NFL and they’ll bend us over the table and show us things not even allowed in prison.
We run more cover 1 and cover 3 than 2 deep and 4 deep i believe. When we say coverage safeties we mean MAN coverage because one will have to drop down and cover (slot or tight end etc). Not 2 safeties playing deep all the time
Which brings us back to the issue about why do we have 3 players who might be best fitting in the slot and only 1 CB capable of covering outside, if we intend on using out safeties in man coverage? Are we gonna match our safety against Calvin Johnson and Jordy Nelson on the outside?
All im saying is I wouldn’t be surprised if Chip was pulling on over on us and had serious interest in safeties more like Landon Collins, because scheme wise there is some mismatches about the players we have right now and the way we use them. Sadly, it wouldn’t surprise me either if Billy Davis had no clue what the plan is.
The eagles used their safeties to cover the slot last year. We are talking about the actual scheme that was used on the field. Not some hypothetical. So Landon makes no sense based on what the eagles actually did, not what they want to do.
Last season Malcolm was in the box a lot, and Nate was deep too often. If BD likes Jenkins ability to see and react early, he may have had Nate deep by default. If you buy that, a ball hawk trumps a thumper.
Gotta have 90 bodies in camp.
We play a lot more cover 1 than cover 3. But those are the two main coverages we have just like seattle.
It’s not a lie. In any way, shape, or form.
Seattle uses Chancellor to play robber. We use our non deep safety to cover the slot or TE in man coverage. The overall “shell” of the deep defense is the same. It’s the underneath coverage that is different. The advantage of the way we run it is it allows us to stay in base in non obvious throwing downs. This increases your ability to disguise. It also helps prevent mismatches like a TE splitting out. It allows our safeties to simply rotate to adjust for any presnap motion as opposed to scrambling to switch positions.
Maxwell and Thurmond are professional defensive backs. They understand the differences. It’s the same family, different approach. But they aren’t going to sit there and go through the X’s and O’s of the scheme, because the beat writers and 99% of the fan base wouldn’t understand.
It’s a fundamentally sound defensive scheme.
Tommy, how far if at all would you be willing to trade up for L. Collins? Last year we would have had to give up an extra 4 to get Haha last year. Correct me if I’m wrong but wasn’t that jaylen watkins? I would def give up Marcus smith and Watkins for Haha. This year I really like Collins, knowing he’s not a mirror to Jenkins. I think he would be a nice complement/ stud enforcer for our defense. FIX THIS PROBLEM!!!
probably a good chance that Landon Collins wont even be on our draft board. No Safety we have, or have rumored to have interest in, resembles anything close to Landon Collins… sucks that the top safety probably wont even be considered for our scheme, I know… but thats probably the reality of the situation,,,
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never even thought of the possibility of packaging picks for Landon Collins… that one caught me off guard
Maybe he meant La El Collins.
Perhaps but the OP goes on to talk about Clinton Dix.
I’m not even convinced he IS the top safety. The absolute highest I would even pick him is the second. His coverage skills are far too lacking imo.
i dont think much of Bama DBs to begin with, but if we needed a strong safety, who would lay people out like my main man, pots and pans, Bernard “remove you from your consciousness” Pollard then sure, Id love to add a young thumper to knock blocks off at strong safety, but it seems that this regime has no interest in that type of a player. If we dont trust you at all to cover a slot WR, you probably wont be an eagle… and I dont see how they could possibly spend a first round pick on a safety who college teams picked on in coverage…. imagine what chip kelly would do to Collins if he was on the opposing defense in the NFL… he would torture him. Get him matched up on sproles, Ertz, Jordan and go after that kid all day long…. how can chip spend a first round pick on that?
To add to your point, if you want a thumper take a look at Geathers in the 4th/5th. Same kind of punch with a much lower investment. Plus he can cover better.
I do like that kid! also like the Rowe kid in Toms mock. cant tackle, but we can teach that. our coaches proved that much…take a flier on eskridge, or Beef up the Virginia kid Anthony Harris with 15lb of muscle..yoke him up
He is the highest rated safety based on a defenses scheme. I don’t believe he is the universal #1 safety.
He just isn’t a fit for what the Birds want at safety. The national writers that are projecting him to us are completely unaware or misinformed as to what we look at for a safety. Collins will be a liability in coverage for us. Another Jenkins is exactly what the Eagles want. Like Geagle said below he may not even be on our board, therefore there is no chance in hell that we trade down for him. We want a safety that can cover receivers 1on1, play deep, and roam centerfield. Collins is not that. Collins is pretty much a version of Michael Lewis when we had him. As far as run defense, with drafting him yes he would be good against the run, but really would hurt coverage. You would be basically adding to a strength and making a weakness even weaker. I have more faith in Nate Allen in coverage then Collins.
I don’t think Collins is going to be able to cover the ground we’ like a safety to be able to. He strikes me as Mark Barron 2.0; not worth a first rounder.
Rowe might not be there in the 3rd.. nvm the 4th round.
Tommy why the Pitt guy over Fisher? You have to assume a tie goes to Fisher (Chip knows him, knows he can go up tempo) and yet you wen with a different guy.
My guess would be a weighing of potential. It seems highly unlikely that Fisher will ever become a guy capable of starting at LT in the NFL, Clemmings has a decent chance of doing that.
Yeah. Fisher I think could truly excel at G for years, possibly be top 10. I think he could also develop into a very solid RT. I just don’t see him at LT though.
fortunately we have Lane Johnson who no one will beat out for the Left Tackle spot
You’re not wrong, but what if Lane gets a bad injury 3 years from now and has to sit out multiple games. I’d rather have a RT who I can definitely play at LT rather than what we had to do last year as guys went down.
Agree. I’m not projecting Clemmings at LT for the Eagles necessarily, just saying I think he is more capable of it then Fisher. However it would be nice if you had a RT that could step into LT and be effective in case of injury, lol or HGH use. I think if your RT is capable of playing LT at a high level then he is probably one of the better RTs in the league.
clemming wont start for us at LT…. no one will beat out Lane for that spot, and Fisher handle RT just fine…. be shocked to see a Guard picked instead of Fisher at 20….. and people better stop overlooking Grasu just because he didnt run at the combine.. hopefully the rest of the teams forget about him too lol(not round 1 obviously)
There is no tie. Clemmings is better than Fisher.
Here are the stats for the guys.
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/profiles/t.j.-clemmings?id=2552365
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/profiles/jake-fisher?id=2552360
I think Clemmings has a higher ceiling than Fisher, but I’d not turn down either one.
My general sense is that you’d more likely have to take Clemmings at 20, but Fisher would be a tad rich for that pick
Did i call UVA choking or did I call it?
boooooo
That was your call. I had them (in 3 of 4 brackets) in my Sweet 16 or Elite 8.
T-Law / Belichick / Community . . .
Who are the 5 or 6 or 7 [or ?] players whom Kelly has graded as a 1st Rd potential EAGLE selection?
(The premise is, regardless of talent, Kelly’s looking for something different, so his 1st Rd grade will be limited to players who fit his scheme — from playbook to cookbook.)
Besides Mariota . . . who are the others. In order of ranking.
I’m so tempted to put a list of guy together that I would say should be the guys we don’t want based on scheme.
Either/Or.
Wants:
Mariotta
Dupree
White
Waynes
Hundley
Cooper
Scherff
Parker
Clemmings
Fowler
Fisher
Strong
Byron Jones (darkhorse)
Avoids:
Ray
Shelton
Peat
Malcolm Brown
DGB
Well that’s kinda hard to do since Chip is a madman but I’ll give it a shot
Mariota
Dupree
White
Waynes
Scherff
Cooper
Erving/Fisher/Clemmings
The only realistic guys are the 3 OL.
T-Law
What about a pass rusher? Do you think the Eagles have any interest in, for ex, Bud Dupree?
Cost to trade up . . .
What are you willing to pay?
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QUESTION: where does Dupree fit — based on draft-day ranking (not how they did in NFL) — among: Dion Jordan and Anthony Barr?
Rank them in order, considering what Kelly wants in his OLBs.
Really tough to say, but I would rate them bud, barr and then Jordan, but think Kelly might rate them barr, Jordan, bud
Interesting order, both times.
QUESTION:
Can Bud cover?
yes… game winning INT for a TD but that was kind of a ipped ball… but yes, they used him in coverage.. and he is strong enough to play the run as a rookie, which is rare, usually need to spend year 1 getting strong enough to set the edge. see marcus smith lol
Now we’re talking some business.
Kelly’s been hot after a bigger, more athletic version of Barwin for 2 drafts.
Get ‘im!
man, I wish…. hopefully coach Minter is in his ear telling him how special he will be and that we get lucky and he atleast falls to like 15, but even thats not a given. kids is a real talent..i also think him and fowler are probably the two most ready to play as rookies which should make it hard for him to last,,, he better not endup a skin or giant.. hopefully fowler, gregory, Vic and Ray all go before him. hoping the skins draft another position and only the jets and falcons draft the position in the top 10(long shot)…. kid would be awesome for us with Barwin, BG and Marcus
coach Minter was his defensive coordnator a few years ago
The reason for my order is simply that Bud has the highest ceiling in terms of pass rush, Barr is a lot like Barwin (he plays 4-3 SAM now) and Jordan can cover, but his pass rush is meh.
Reason why I think Kelly might have Bud last is his lack of coverage skills compared to Barr and Jordan (I might be thinking that Kelly values coverage more than he does)
Bud is a better pass rusher than Dion. He’s not Dion in coverage but he’s pretty damn good.
Barr and Bud are probably equal from a pass rushing standpoint. Both have a variety of moves, although neither had a full bag of tricks completely hammered down. Both have explosive speed to win around the edge consistently. Bud gets the W because of his coverage ability.
Of the last 3 draft classes:
Mack
Bud
Barr
Dion
Fowler
Gregory
Beasley
Kiki Mingo
MSII
Eli Harold
Mack
Bud
Gregory
Barr
Fowler
Beasley
Dion
Mingo
this is interesting because there is so much talent at his position. personally, Fowler is the ONLY edge rusher I would pick in this class ahead of Bud….and smart money says he doesnt get out of the top 12…. but its a mind F**K because there are so many highly rated guys at his position that there is at least some chance that 4-5 edge rushers get drafted ahead of him and I dont see how I can ever just rule out the 5 player drafted at a position being gone before #20… im hoping, that Im personally over rating by having him as #2 behind only Fowler… hopefully the Redskins are the first team that drafts an edge rusher, but they end up going with an OL or something.. it would be Huge if the first one doesnt come off the board til #6 jets. Figure the Falcons would take the 2nd(hopefully its not dupree lol)… I try to rationalize ways he could fall to #20, but he is a really serious talent, probably a serious long shot.
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Re: OT Cummings v. OT Fisher
T-Law / Belichick / Community . . .
What exactly about TJ Cummings ranks him much higher (at this point) than Jake Fisher?
Fisher seems to be athletically superior to Cummings. With room to grow as a player — just as Cummings does.
HELP!
I would be surprised to see Clemmings picked over Fisher by Chip… arm length isnt enough of an advantage to piss away knowing how a 300lb slob will play at our consistent high tempo, and handle a completely different practice style then any hehas ever experienced. Just knowing Jake Fisher can keep the weight on practicing and playing at our tempo is a huge advantage…clemmings is the better prospect to the majority of the GMs im sure, but I doubt Chip kelly will see it that way. He would have to blow Fisher away as a prospect to overcome the Luxury of having a prospecty who has turned himself into a top prospect playing and practicing the way we will ask him
…to…..
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maybe if chip was going off a straight draft board board, TJ might be rated higher, but I assume chip will have his specific list of names and just go out and try to get as many of the names on the list as he can
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we loved the duck familiarity for years. we wanted Dion, Kyle Long, we traded for Kiko…all the oregon players jammed down our throats, and now that t he familiarity is a HUGE advantage when projecting how 300lb slobs are going to handle playing and practicing at our pace which can best be described as “Football on Meth”
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If chip is going to take a Guard over Fisher he would have to drastically outclass him. Clemmings might be better, but not THAT much better. I assume we would have to see something crazy like Sherf fall to 20, for chip to pick a Guard over Fisher, a kid who became a top prospect playing and practicing in our very unique way.
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I assume chip will have a specific list of guys and he is going to go get them… how can you pull that off? being at peace with probably having to draft guys 15-20 picks ear;lier then you might need to, or he can relive the first draft where he lost Dionm, Kyle Long and Kiko…
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i assume we will initially hate his draftg because there will be some “reaches” compared to the percieved value kiper brainwashes us to believe… but its probably foolish to think that Kiper could possibly accuately evaluate these kids exactrly the way chip see’s it… if kiper could do thatr, he would be working in a front office…so even tho we will probably reach a few times, Im going to give the benefit of the doubt thatr chip might actually be smarter when it comes to his offense then Mel Kiper…
arm length, little more polish… Fisher really didnt jump on the scene til Tyler Johnstone jacked up his knee…. doubt he is good enough to make chip pass on Fisher… At Guard, I assume Sherf is the only one who could do that…
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we also completely under rate Hironiss grasu, his intelligence, character, versatility and athleticism all because he didnt run at the combine…. mistake, hopefully it causes him to fall a bit and we can get him at good value… He would be the perfect bacup for Kelce, very athletic, but bigger 297lbs… people who dont like him at Guard will point to his 32 arm length which isnts special/ideal… but IU think he can handle NFL guard just fine, and he would be the perfect backup to Kelce. Heck, Kelce is lucky we love him, because Grasu is a SERIOUS center prospect, 297lbs(bigger stronger) then Kelce. Maybe he isnt more athletic then the smaller Kelce, but id bet Kelce doesnt athletically blow him away… dont sleep on Grasu. Its a good thing for us that he didnt run at the combine… Heck I wish Fisher didnt run at the combine lol
I am not going to pretend to know what make Clemmings better, but I have seen his name in quite few mock drafts round 1, and I have not seen Fisher’s in any. That could well change. If I had to guess, I think Clemmings gets points for high ceiling. He’s a converted DT, and he’s athletic, and nobody’s in love with him today, but down the road…
Fisher vs. Clemmings
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Height : 6’6. .6’5 Advantage Fisher
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Arm Length: 33’3/4……35’1/8 Advantage TJ
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Hand size: 10’3/8……10 3/8 TIE
10 yard: 1.75……… 1.84 Advantage Fisher
40 time: 5.01……….5.14 Advantage Fisher
Bench: 25 reps.. 22 reps.Advantage Fisher
Vertical: 32.5 32.5 TIE
3 cone: 7.25 7.68 Advantage Fisher
sh shuttle 4.33 4.54 Advantage Fisher
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the ONLY thing TJ measures better in is arm length, and Fishers isnt bad
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and with the 20th pick in the 2015 Draft. The Philadelphia Eagles select Jake Fisher, Tackle/Guard out of Oregon. Boooooooooo! Boooooooooo! lol you know the drill… Booooooo! Boooooooo!
I wouldn’t boo, but I would not be surprised if he takes Clemmings either. With Chip’s talent for confounding the experts, DGB wouldn’t surprise me… well it wouldn’t shock me.
jake is the “surprise”,.,. no one has him going round 1….
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but i wouldnt mind TJ. I like his run blocking as long as he can handle our tempo and practices.
AC – Hroniss Grasu is Chip’s favorite. He’s the leader of the Duck OL. Mucho respect.
OD —
So what you’re saying is, MM in Rd 1 and Grasu in Rd 2.
With an OT in Rd 4-5 to be molded by Stoutland because LJ and JPete still have a couple years together.
Rd 3 reserved for a WR?
How ’bout that?
1) fisher T/G trade back and pick up a 4th
2) Sammie Coates WRS so Mitchell can shut up 😉
3) Grasu C/G Oregon
4) Jesse James TE
4) Eric Rowe CB/S
5) Chris Conley WR
5) Drummond S
6) Tony Washington OLB Oregon
I like this quite a bit but I would settle for a pass rusher in the second and Devante Davis from UNLV in the 6th 🙂
1) Mariota QB Oregon
2) traded
3) traded
4) traded
5) traded
5) traded
6) traded
7) traded
AC – Works for me and…..Chip….maybe……Three trades on the line I hear. Gonna be a wild day.
Well TJ Cummins has a better motor. Although it is a Dodge…
TJ Clemmings however is superior to Fisher. Fisher executes his block. He’s efficient, he does what the coaches want him to do. Clemmings wins his blocks, he reestablishes the point of attack. Despite only playing 2 years of OL Clemmings displays an incredibly high football IQ. On screens he is patient, he gets in position and rather than attacking the defender and possibly missing him, he understands that in order to get to the man with the ball, the defender has to come to him. Fisher may be the better athlete, but Clemmings is no slouch himself and understands how to maximize his athletic traits.
As far as concerns about Clemmings adjusting to the tempo because he played in a ground and pound offensive scheme in college, these are a bit dense. He had offers from Big East schools to play basketball. He started his career on the defensive line who are far more conditioned than offensive linemen, and as far as those who are daft enough to call him a “slob”, well to quote Inigo Montoya “You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means”.
http://thumb.usatodaysportsimages.com/image/thumb/650-510nw/8177132.jpg
Erving vs Clemmings? Both guys have the same background as DL converted to OL.
Abhorred Erving as an LT. I’ve warmed to his tape as an interior player. I would probably put him as my 5th OL behind Scherff, Clemmings, Fisher and Sambraillo.
it was Andre the Giant you are quoting.
” I think the 1st round pick needs to be about the best player, not the most needed position”……….. SOUNDS GREAT!! sure hope so….but when our GM needed to be talked out of spending a first round pick on Jordan Mathews, probably safe to throw conventional draft wisdom out the window…..
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forget everything you know about draft value, forget what rounds you expect these guys go in because of months of Kiper brainwashing us…. I doubt any of that applies anymore…. get used to the idea that we will probably initially HATE this Eagle draft, because of our “percieved value” of the prospects..If Mel Kiper could accurately rate these guys like chip kelly will, he would be working in a front office, not doing a new mock every week…takes some Hubris to think that mel Kiper could possibly have the same evaluation on these guys as chip Kelly… if thats true, then either Kiper is a genius who should be running a team, or Chip is a charlatan… get used to the idea that this draft will initially not look too good because it probably wont match the opinions of Mel Kiper, but in my book thats probably a good thing lol
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now that chip kelly has the Power, Gordon Bombay will just disappear and his first draft as the all powerful wizard of Novacare wont include a single Duck? yeah I highly doubt That..
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If this were Andy Reids offense,k and Andy Reids practice methods, Mocking TJ Clemmings to us would make a ton of sense to me. I like that kid a lot, but it makes no sense to me to mock him to us when there is a player chip recruited who TJ doesnt completely outclass….we have had oregon jammed down our throats for two years and now that it makes more sense then EVER to add a Duck who we know can handle laying our tempo and keep the weight on with our unique style practices we are going to project how a slightly better prospect 300lb slob is going to handle our unique practice and tempo offense? yeah i dont buy that at all…
I think Clmmings would have to be two rounds better then Fisher to be our pick, and thats not the case, especially when chip doesnt care about polish, he cares which kid he can turn into the best player in his offense 2-3 years from now…I simply dont believe TJ is so much better of a prospect that we would piss away the familiarity of knowing how a 300lb man can handle a very different pace then he is used to…. we have a quality, versatile, athletic, lineman, whos character and practice habits we know well, and whop has made himself into a top prospect playing and practicing in a similar manner as what we will ask of him, and he will be available at pick #20, and Chip wont give a crap that Mel Kiper thinks we picked him 20 picks too soon, because I doubt chip risks him getting stolen before we pick in round 2… IMO, IMO, IMO IMO of course.. because if you forget to include that 300 hundred times in your posts people will misunderstand and think im sitting here looking at chips draft sheet apparently…
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i think it will take a heckuva prospect unexpectedly falling to 20, for Jake Fisher to not be the pick.. I certainly dont see us taking a slightly better prospect with longer arms from Pitt… i cant possibly believe that……but I like TJ, and view him as a legit 1st round prospect regardless of scheme, so I wouldnt mind, i just dont believe it will happen.. we’ll see ….IMO OF COURSE!!!!!!
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I disagree to a degree. Yes I think things will change a bit draft wise. I just don’t think that drastically. I think the Mathews example you stated was based more on lack of experience then anything else. I agree an Oregon guy or two will be drafted, but I think the more experience Chip has with the draft he will reach less. Generally when you reach like that it’s out of fear that your guy will be taken. With more knowledge now he will be better equipped to understand players value in their respective rounds. There may be a reach or two, but I don’t think it’s going to have the whole Eagles nation grabbing their TVs and throwing them out of the window.
I actually kinda hope he reaches (quite often, as Geagle seems to suggest) because hopefully he is getting his 1st choices and not leftovers like Marcus Smith.
Edit: and even with free agency… We know Chip wanted Keenan Lewis but he settled for cary williams and bradley fletcher. Lewis was the guy who shut down djax in the playoffs vs the saints and is now probably a 2nd tier corner in the NFL after the shermans, revis’s, vontae davis’s, etc.
Get Chip his top choices no matter what
No, if you are constantly reaching to an excess then you are not putting the best talent on the team. That is how you end up with more then likely a weak draft. The reason he couldn’t get the guys he wanted is due to it was the first round and the guys he wanted were taken before our pick and we couldn’t do anything about it. Arizona was reportedly about to take Smith shortly after our pick. Using the logic you stated we would have gotten Mathews in the first, when we got him in the second, and we would have gotten Hart in the 3rd instead of 5th. You say no matter what but that is a ridiculous thing to say. Even Chip said he won’t mortgage everything for Mariota. No matter what gets you in cap hell, and means you are going to pay crazy money for a player when maybe you can get 2 good players instead. Hence Chip saying I like to get as many good football players as possible. Not just one. Saying no matter what is very narrow minded and not focusing on the big picture. Maybe Chip didn’t get Lewis because he didn’t think he was worth the money he was demanding.
If we had taken matthews in the 1st like Chip wanted, we wouldn’t have landed marcus smith and we would have instead had a 2nd round pick to do with as we please. I know id rather have a 2nd round pick than marcus smith. And id rather have an expensive good cornerback (keenan lewis) than 2 mediocre or bad ones (sconces and fletcher)
I get it, you dont want to reach. But if reaching significantly improves your odds of hitting on a pick (and the examples seem to suggest this) then it is DEFINITELY worth it
Use that strategy year after year and you will miss out on some major talent.
Tommy – didn’t we trade our 7th this year (2015) to CAR for Kenjon Barner last year?
It was a conditional trade dependent on Barner being on the 53-man roster a certain amount of games. He didn’t reach the necessary threshold and thus no pick is conveyed.
Thankfully he didn’t cost us a pick. That was a terrible move.
I don’t think they ever intended to have him on the 53-man roster for the amount of time required to have to give up a pick.
Round 1: Fisher (Oregon)
Round 2: Ekpre Olumo ( Oregon; bonus: has a torn ACL!)
Round 1 Fisher Guard/Tackle Oregon
Round 2 Grasu Guard/Center Oregon!
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then come the WR’s and DB’s
Emory Hunt @FBallGameplan 5m5 minutes ago
Jerrod Johnson is killing it in these QB drills #NFLVeteranCombine
Chip is there. Would be an interesting signing. Didn’t realize he was signed by the Eagles as an UDFA in 2011 until I googled him.
MKSP:
Is the the man-mountain J-Johnson from Tx A&M?
Yessir. Played in Canada last year.
Just checked the CFL sites.
Seems JJ was a practice squader with Les Alouettes. (Couldn’t find any stats for him. Happy to be wrong.)
If Kelly can make this guy into an NFL QB, the Kelly should be enshrined in Canton next August.
That would be some story.
yep, but he had some serious shoulder injuries and read that he was never healthy until a year or 2 later
God no.
Chip is there to watch this qb or are you just saying.. Chip is there?
Caught Barrett Brooks on the radio today for like 5 minutes.. he is a pretty pro chip guy and was having an interesting convo asking the question:
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What are the “Black Eyes” on the Chip kelly era, on the field or personnel decisions?
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I cant say I agree with his “black eyes” but he gave 3 of them:
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1) getting rid of desean, especially for nothing in return…..
-tired of that debate so whatever
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2)Not winning a playoff game yet
-he only been here two year, i dont know if i can go there yet, but year 3 is usually SHOW ME RESULTS year of the coaching cycle
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3) Drafting Marcus Smith in round 1
I find this so ridiculous. we established he wouldnt last 10 more spots let alone to our next pick, and just because he provided NOTHING in year 1, MEANS NOTHING! anyone with a brain knew he wouldnt play as a rookie way before in the draft, yet they still either had a round 1, 2, or 3 grade on him, so to bash the pick because he didnt play is ABSURD at its finest, ESPECIALLY WHEN i KNOW that had we drafted Justin Gilbert, EVERYONE would have been THRILLED!!! we would be talking about what a steal we got with a top 12 talent falling all the way to 22. The same people who hate Marcus would have ADORE the justin Gilbert pick… and he couldnt even get on the field ahead of Jordan Poyer LOL. you might rip marcus for not being ready, but atleast you didnt spend a top 12 pick on a CB who you already hate in the locker room, has oor work ethic and allegedly lacks football IQ… yet he would have been a steal of a first round pick at #22 right? atleast Marcus needed to get stronger, whats Gilberts excuse?
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truth is, nothing has happened yet that should make us be down on Marcus. He hasnt fallen behind schedule yet in his development. It was no secret that like tons of edge rushers making the transition from college that he wasnt strong enough to play as a rookie,. this wasnt a secret, they believed in his talent enough to draft him for what they think he can be in 2-3 years wheh he has the strength to play the position at this level… the athleticism is there,, once he gets strong enough we will see what everyone has to say aboutt he young man they been crapping on since the moment they realized Goodell didnt say “Marquis Lee” LOL
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what are the Black eyes if any since chip joined the Eagles? (try to leave out the obvious nonsense like riley cooper incident), tho signing Riley to the extension certainly could fall under the “Black eye” category
Not running the ball from the one against SF.
how could that be a blackeye when it inspired the defending superbowl champions last play? LOL was so brilliant that Pete Carrol copied chip at his most important moment
Bennett would be a good developmental guy. Based on the still in the video you embedded, he looks about 12, so there is time to let him grow.
Seems like a risky dude in any round. He seems like a double negative of poor game play and weak measurables.
Bennett is a no go. Poor pocket awareness and bad decision making. Oh yeah, he is inaccurate at short, intermediate, and long throws. Not a Chip QB.
OD:
What about that other QB against whom Bennett competed at Oregon . . . Mariota?
Will Kelly go for him? I mean, really GO for him?
Inquiring minds want to know!
Why’s Sanchez getting paid then and why is Barkley here?
I really like that mock Tommy, but what do I know?
Walterfootballs latest mock:
1) Jalen Collins CB LSU
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2) Jake Fisher T/G Oregon
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3) Darren Waller WR G-Tech
6’6 238lbs
33 1/4 arm length
4.46 40time
37 inch vertical
NFL.com player comparison: Brian Quick
This kid would be an eventual replacement for Riley Cooper because he is a jump ball reciever.. basically we need to grow him into a weapon in back shoulder throws, jump balls, fades… for a raw route runner, he is pretty competitive going up and fighting for balls, will box out CB. He is RAW but atleast he already “plays to his height”. I despise the big weapons who you have to teach how to use their height… this kid does it pretty natural, looks like a former basketball player(not sure if thats true or not)… if we can get him in the 3rd, I like his upside, but I dont love him in round 2…
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4) Jordan Richards Safety Stanford…
5’11 210lbs, 4.65 40
NFL comparison: Kurt Coleman LOL
I dont like this kid at all, he was a 3yr starter, captain, high character, but i dont think he is even better then Ed Reynolds… i would hate him in the 4th
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5) Ty Montgomery.wr STANFORD
6’0 220LB 4.55 40TIME
Cant count on him to be a WR/ raw, bad hands, ll types of issues. but they think he can be a pro bowl returnman and sproles wont be around for ever… if we can get him in the 5th or 6th, might be a good pick to use as a percy harvin type of gadget weapon, where you throw him quick passes and let him use his yac yards, maybe a few reverses, jet sweeps. he is cock diesel 220lbs buiilt like a man beast, but you cant trust him as one of your top 3 WRs….doesnt solve our WR problem… vut could be a nice special team player and put in a package of a few percy harvin plays for him
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rd 5(pick 2) Troy Hill CB Oregon..,. 5’10 186 lbs.. Kid is really competitiv, fiesty, quick twitch, but he was suspended for violating team rules, and he was arrested for a domestic incident that he was able to plead down… he is weak and scrawny so you cant even turn him into a safety… hate this pick
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i wouldnt mind his first 3 picks, but i dont view getting jake in round 2 as realistic
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If we go with a GE tech WR, I hope its actually the good one in Smelter and not just the combine wonder
i struggle with what round the Gtech boys will go…. if Waller falls enough to where you can justify drafting such a raw talent to mold, id like the pick… 3rd round, I think we can do better
Love, love, love: Clemmings, Agholor, and Mitch Morse would be a great addition to the offensive line.
Meh about Rowe and Maehl. Rowe is versatile, and in the 4th round I would have no qualms, but I think some team is going to fall in love and take him earlier.
Randalls tape against Oregon State involved several pretty bad missed tackles, he’s versatile but certainly comes with his shortcomings.
I’d rather have Zach Wagenmann in the 6th and Connor Halliday as a UDFA over Bennett and Gwacham.