Feeling Good About Safety
Posted: October 17th, 2015 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 73 Comments »Brian Dawkins was a great player for the Eagles and should be in the Hall of Fame in the near future. He left the Eagles after the 2008 season and the Safety position hasn’t been good since then.
Until now.
Malcolm Jenkins and Walter Thurmond are playing at a high level, making it easy to forget Macho Harris, Kurt Coleman, Nate Allen, Jarrad Page, Quintin Demps, Patrick Chung, Kenny Phillips, Marlin Jackson, Jaiquawn Jarrett, OJ Atogwe, David Sims and Sean Jones. How is that for a trip down memory lane?
The funny thing about Jenkins and Thurmond is that they didn’t come here with much fanfare. Jenkins was signed in March 2014. Most people wanted the Eagles to go for ballhawk Jairus Byrd or hard hitting T.J. Ward. Neither guy fit what the Eagles wanted. Jenkins did, so the Eagles went after him aggressively.
Thurmond was signed to compete for a job at CB. The Eagles planned for Jaylen Watkins, Earl Wolff and Jerome Couplin to compete for the Safety spot opposite of Jenkins. After the coaches spent time with Thurmond and saw the others, plans changed. Thurmond became the FS. Watkins and Wolff are now gone. Couplin’s development was slowed due to an appendectomy in the summer. The Eagles like him a lot, but he needs more time.
Jenkins and Thurmond are playing at a high level. The Eagles might be getting the best Safety play of any team in the entire NFL. I know that sounds crazy, but it’s true.
Jenkins leads the Eagles in tackles. Thurmond is second. Jenkins has 7 TFLs. Thurmond has 3 INTs. Jenkins has a pair of FFs. Both guys have been outstanding in coverage. They have each played in the slot, as well as sitting deep in centerfield.
Chip Kelly and Bill Davis don’t use Safeties in the traditional way. You used to want a SS that was like a LB and then the FS was more of a centerfielder type. The Eagles had this with Michael Lewis and Brian Dawkins from 2002-2006. Kelly and Davis prefer interchangeable players that both have outstanding cover skills. Jenkins and Thurmond both played CB in college. Neither guy is a big hitter. That’s gone (which is probably smart due to the current NFL rules).
At this point, there are a couple of key questions. The key thing in holding back Thurmond to this point in his career has been injuries. Can he stay healthy? I think it is also fair to question if Jenkins and Thurmond can continue to play at such a high level. Can they do this for a whole season?
As to health, keep your fingers crossed. So far, so good. Can they keep up the level of play? I think they can. The key here is that neither guy is doing something beyond his ability. Thurmond has terrific hands and very good instincts. He was a playmaker at Oregon. He picked off passes in the OTAs, Training Camp, the preseason and now the regular season. That’s not a fluke.
Jenkins was a good player for the Saints. He wasn’t as much of a playmaker as they ideally wanted and that’s why they let him walk and went after Byrd. What a colossal mistake. Byrd has been a huge bust. Knee and back issues have limited him to 7 games over the past 2 years. He has yet to pick off a pass for the Saints. Beyond that, the Saints lost a great leader in Jenkins. I don’t think they understood the value Jenkins had off the field. He’s been a terrific presence for the Eagles, on and off the field.
One big advantage the Eagles have with Thurmond and Jenkins is age. Thurmond is 28. Jenkins will turn 28 in a couple of months. They are still in their prime physically. They have enough experience to know what they’re doing and they also understand how to read offenses. A huge part of playing Safety is the ability to read things, quickly and correctly. Young players can struggle because they don’t know what they’re seeing. Jenkins and Thurmond are smart. That’s hugely important.
The Eagles need to develop players behind Jenkins and Thurmond. Couplin showed real good physical ability this summer. He is talented. He needs time to master the defense and learn now to read NFL offenses. Ed Reynolds is on the practice squad. He was better this summer than last year, but still hasn’t looked like someone you expect to be a starter in the NFL. Expect the team to draft a Safety next spring.
Right now just enjoy how well Jenkins and Thurmond are playing.
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Les Bowen wrote a good piece on Thurmond, the playmaker and filmmaker.
Want to get a better understanding of STs? The guys at ChipWagon put together a great piece on KORs.
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T-Law:
You wrote:
One big advantage the Eagles have with Thurmond and Jenkins is age. Thurmond is 28. Jenkins will turn 28 in a couple of months. They are still in their prime physically.
True, both players are hitting their prime.
On the other hand, Thurmond’s with the Eagles on a 1-year contract — so he’ll be a free agent after this year. And Jenkins’ contract runs only through 2016 — making him a free agent after next season.
Both Fletcher Cox and Logan’s contracts are up after 2016.
If Bradford pans out, he’s up for a new deal after this year.
Lots of players who may need to get paid.
To me, that means others will be gone. Perhaps Austin, Cooper and
D Ryans to begin with. Not sure if those are the guys and how they effect the cap – but if folks need to get paid, there’s only one way to do it. We could be in for another interesting off-season…
Cooper and a little bit with D Ryans will make some cap impact, but Cox, Logan, Thurmond, and Jenkins still mean huge contracts that those two will not be sufficient in covering. And that does not even include Bradford. We have some flexibility in cap next year, especially if it goes up as expected, but ACVikings point is definitely still something that will be a challenge. it will be interesting to see how the Eagles move things around, but my guess is it wont be easy to sign those guys, let alone others who may emerge.
Bradford is already making some decent money this year, though he’d cost more if he plays really well the rest of the way. If he’s so-so, he may not cost more than he does now. But yes, there will be guys coming up who will dent the cap.
One thing though is that we have 14.7 million in dead money this year though. We have 1.6 in dead money for 2016 already, which will go up, but I’m not sure we’ll see the same level of purges of players with guaranteed money. Normally the Eagles have a lot less dead money. Say we “gain” 8 million from that aspect versus this year, plus maybe 10 with the cap going up, then Cooper + Austin, that might be 25 million extra over this year’s levels without making any harder decisions. There is some room there. Celek has a $5 million cap figure… that will be an interesting decision next year.
We’re currently on the books for $132million next year. Figuring in some minor contract housecleaning and that’s going to be closer to $125 million.
Salary cap will be at minimum 150 and some think could surpass 160. So we will say 155 for our purposes.
Add in$15million in cap carryover.
That’s a working cap of $170. Subract 125, and we have $45 million in cap space for next year.
That means there will be some guys we have to let go to optimize spending (Thorton, Curry). But we’re also in solid financial standing going forwards.
Given the poor statistical year Curry is putting forth; he’s going to be cheaper to keep than we planned or easier to let walk.
Someone will still pay him decent money. I just would have a hard time justifying paying 4-5 million to a backup.
Given what we do in a 3-4, I’d tend to agree. And we’re already overpaying Graham to not provide full time pass rush based on prior part time numbers.
Other than Bradford and Murray, Graham has been the biggest disappointment this year. I was all aboard that hype train.
Another $8mm of carry-over money would be nice.
DeMarco Murray signing gonna be heavily scrutinized this summer.
Early in the offseason I was wondering if trade Curry would be the right decision. D-Line is very deep. And Curry at OLB is something I see like a emergency.
OLB and OL must be the priority in next draft.
Trading curry wouldn’t have netted enough of a return to justify it.
I think that we are witnessing one of those rare contract years in which a previously injury prone player suddenly stays healthy for a full year. I would be extremely worried if he wants top of the market contract after an outlier of a season. On one hand, he’s playing for his old college coach, and there has to be a level of familiarity and trust established. On the other hand, he may only have one chance to cash in big time with guarantees that will last him a lifetime (properly managed of course).
So, I’m torn– we have missed that type of presence in our secondary since the pinnacle of the Reid era…. But on the other hand, how many teams have been burned by handing out massive contracts to One year outliers? My opinion isn’t complete, so here’s to hoping we have an amazing season and this is a debate to revisit in the offseason….. All while enjoying our Super Bowl victory
One of the problems with having good players is having to pay them. Will be tricky to be sure.
something I made long ago, pre-Boykin trade (although I did not have him re-signed anyway):
[a few minor notes: I assumed big seasons, and contracts, for Bradford and Thurmond; I actually accounted for a bigger contract and cap hit than Kendricks received; I have Ertz and Kiko signing for bigger contracts/cap hits than they’re likely to receive unless they play lights out the remaining season]
lastly, none of the conversation yet accounts for the additional savings if any or all of the Celek, Cooper, and Ryans trio depart.
Kiko is under contract for 2.5 more years. Because injury was NFI, the contract yeard didn’t count. He’s effectively in his second year.
There is no question that our safeties have played great so far this season. It’s been fantastic to see, especially considering had you looked at things before TC, you could see safety being a major issue for the Eagles (at least opposite Jenkins). The one thing that I am curious to see though is the continued play of both safeties. Seems to me that we have had so many safeties since Dawkins left that had a promising first year and then became a huge liability the rest of their career. The situations are completely different in that Thurmond isn’t a rookie like Macho Harris, Quintin Demps, Nate Allen, and Earl Wolff, but considering that every one of those players had promising first years and fell off, each of them with different coaches, different schemes, and being different players, I do wonder if maybe part of the challenge from year 1 to year 2 is how offenses scheme differently for those players after an offseason to look at film. So while I hope the rest of at least this season we see high quality play, I will be curious about the following season to see continued success.
Harris and Demps were middling talents that had early success and didn’t put forward the work necessary to maintain their early success.
Allen was ruined by the wide 9 his knee.
Wolffs knee is shot. He was never really healthy after his rookie season.
Thurmond is more talented than any of those guys (maybe Allen), and he’s a vet. So there is less reason to worry about dropoff in play.
Fully agree that there is less reason to worry. Still, this is just a scenario that until it happens I am not willing to assume it will. For all we know Thurmond gets injures and never recovers fully. My point is more that we have gotten excited too many times over safeties to get disappointed later for me to not at least remain hesitant, especially using only 5 games as my sample size.
I don’t think any of those Safeties who you claim to have had promising first years EVER had a stretch of 5 games at the level Thrumond has shown..Nate is probably the top safety on your list and thurmond might have more big plays in 5 games than Nate had in 5 years.. If Thurmond can play 16 games, his numbers should blow away any yeat Nate has ever had as an eagle…… And all those past safety Failures had years of playing the positions where as Thurmond is playing at this level when he really has only been a safety since like August 1st, so one can reasonably assume that he is only going to get more comfortable at this new position as he racks up some game experiemce playing his new position.. It’s safe to assume that a guy who has only been a safety for 3 months still has some growing and improving to do at the position, hopefully he stays healthy so we can see just how great he can become..
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But like many of our players, Thurmond staying healthy is our real concern.. He has had a lot of bad luck, hopefully he can now enjoy 3-4 years of good health
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Anyone have any idea what’s up with Earl Wolff and whether he has any plans of even trying to continue his NFL career or not? Will he even try to Attend a teams training camp next year? Sad story to see a kid who never had injury issues, come to the Eagles, not suffer a torn ACL, Achilles or Patela, yet his entire NFL career is In serious Jeopordy? Feel bad for the kid, hopefully he can play again one day, that is if he is even trying to….
The safety play has been a great thing to watch this year. Hopefully the corners tighten up their play a bit so we end this bad string of the other team’s WR1 torching our D.
Does that mean we can give Billy some credit for recognizing Thurmond’s potential at safety?
That’s a tall order hoss.
I’m giving credit to Undlin.
Yous owe billy a lot more credit than just that..
GM Chip, Billy, Undlin all deserve credit. Mostly though, you have to credit Thurmond for taking on the challenge and excelling.
I don’t think anyone has any fight to question Jenkins, he has been a stud who took. Leadership role of this defense the moment he arrived, It’s not like Jenkins wasn’t a beast last year, there is nothing to question, shouldn’t be a surprise to see him turn it up a bit in year two in this defense..
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Thurmond on the other hand is an absolutely durability concern, but his play has been fantastic.. jenkins talked about how Thurmond has some ball hawk skill that you can’t coach, and that a lot of our players Thurmonds responsibility is just to be a “robber, that comes with no coaching points, just cut him loose and let him do what he does”.. jenkins also talked about Billy doing a great job not asking for Thurmond to do anytng outside his skill set, and that “Walter ISNT being held back by stupid coaching, Overcoaching.. billy is just letting him do his thing as an instinctual ball hawk”..
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This isn’t luck, it’s not a mirage, this Elite safety play Should be sustainable as long as Walters durability issues are behind him.. It would be huge for both the Eagles and his career if he could put together a year of good health, not missing any games,, im sure the Giants know how talented he is and wish they could have kept him on the field last year..
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Think Nolan, ROWE and B-Max all will play better as Maxwell gets more comfortable and learns the defense inside out, Nolan will get better as he gains experience as a starting outside corner and ROWE will improve because that’s what Intelligent hard working young Players do… Those 3 will provide two quality outside corners these next 3 years, and the odd man out has versatility to play insdke while providing outside depth. And if JaCorey and Denzel are as talented as the coaches think, we are set at Corner even if they haven’t proven it just yet on the field… They will…
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On the other hand, we do Need to get a young starting caliber safety talent developing on the bench behind our two top safeties,, im not sold on Couplin, and Maragos is here because of ST play…
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We just need to give these guys time to gel and grow into this defense,, Id bet that two years from now our secondary will be made up of ATleast 90% of the personenell That is currently in place…..
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like,Bradford, hopefully Thurmonds bad injury luck is behind him, which would be huge for this franchie.. If we think Thurmond is playing well now, wait TIL he really gets settled in and has some aCtually experiemce playing safety…
Looking a little closer at this Giants team, their run defense is a fraud… It’s been solid but it damn sure ain’t the #2 Run defense in the NFL.. That’s a Fughaze run defense,, a BIG reason why their run numbers are so good, is because their league worst pass defense is so bad that teams are throwing more than Running against them… Let’s say their run defense is good but not great (that even may be an exaggeration). Why run against a good run defense when you can throw against the league worst pass defense, who’s defensive front is TERRIBLE at pressuring QBs?… They have some solid run defenders like Big Jonathon Hankins, and most of their LBs and Safeties are like Landon Collins in that they are much better against the Run than they are in coverage.. Which to me says that we should have some really favorable matchups in the passing game on 3rd down to keep the chains moving..
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Tempo hasn’t been a Big part of this season, but It becomes even more important this week than Normal weeks because Steve Spagnuolo is being asked to be a magician hiding the flaws of a very underwhelming defensive roster. What has been a staple of the Giants, front 4 pass rush is now literally the worst in the league, and he has a bunch of Big Linebackers and safeties that can’t cover…. So why is Tempo more Imporant this week? Because in order to hide the flaws of his personnel, Spags is substituting a TON.. Giants have 8 DL who have gotten at least 12 snaps a game, and they have 5 LBs who all got at least 18 snaps a game… So this is a defense THATS using a ton of substitutions to hide its players weakness and let them play to their strengths in situational football, running different players on and off the field every play… So while Tempo will help wear down some Big massive Run stopping Defemders, it will also limit Spags and not allow him to substitute as much as he has, which means we should cause his him to get stuck leaving defenders on the field in unfavorable situations that chip can Isolate and go after…
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First I heard they were leaving Trumain McBride in the slot to match up wifh Jordan the Pope, but today I heard that McBride is out with an injury, anyone know his status with certainty? Independant of their plans with McBride, they are starting a 5’10 178lb corner outside in place of Prince Amakamura. DRC isn’t a physical corner to begin with, and opposite of him will be a corner under 180lbs? Josh Huff and Riley Cooper need to bully this kid all day, Run right thru him on screens and everytime we run the ball, our physical WRs need to go after the kid and punish him on every run play making his day miserable and wearing him down.. jordan Mathews should be able to have a big day against McBride, but if a backüp has to come in, Jordan needs to step up and take the game over…
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Throwing to Shane Vereen has become an important part of the Giants offense, Jordan Hicks is going to have to continue to stun us with his play, if he can keep Vereen in check during the passing game, it will be a big loss to the Giants offense.. But knowing Vereen is so important to their attack, and the fact THAT Landon Collins and the LBs can’t cover, we have to make sure Sproles gives them nightmares and Sproles has to give us more production than the Giants get out of Vereen, and those same safeties and LB that struggle to cover need to also be exploited by Zack Ertz, this is a great matchuo for Ertz and Sproles, throw it to whichever has Landon Collins matched up against them
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Agholar has been ruled out, so Josh Huff needs to step in up, produce and build on last weeks breakout performamce
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Gotta score at least 40pts on the Giants defense
Everything to do with the Giants, their fans, and all New York teams is a fraud.
Great post – agree about Giants’ run defense, I hope Chip and Pat use the pass to set up the run. But, if they are determined to establish the run, if the Giants have early success stopping, I hope Chip and Pat make early adjustments and not wait ’til halftime.
My favorite part of your post is recognizing the substitution patterns the Giants are using on defense to hide weaknesses and put players in a position to succeed. Chip and Pat need to exploit this and don’t have to necessarily use tempo exclusively – just lining up (no huddle) and forcing the D to be prepared for the snap should do the trick, and if Bradford is under center and they try to sub in, he should be able to get some 12 players on the field penalties.
Regardless, it’s time for the Eagles offense to put 4 quarters together.
Thank you sir, I will almost Excuse anything during the first 4 games of the season, understanding that september really has become the new preseason… But we are in the second quarter, time to start getting this thing rolling, put together 4 quarters of solid football, and stack a few good games on top of each other….
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After the way every analyst and former players ridiculed us, laughed at us, ripped our coach and took so much joy from our early season struggles, this is the perfect opportunity to shut the blowhards up by taking advantage of the next 3 games all being Prime time night games, to go on a 3 game win streak against some solid opponents and make the blowhards eat their words, while putting the league on notice that we have started to gel and we are now ready to show off the talent of this roster .. Everyone is loving Eli and the Giants these days, they are the new media darlings of the NFC east…. So badly want to destroy this team with the entire nation watching…
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Teams may have started the season ahead of us while we needed some time to gel these new parts and get settled in, but I think our roster is on another level than the Giants, and I hope we make that crystal clear on Monday night.
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Honestly, how many players on the Giants roster would we want to replace current Eagles with? The Giants DONT have a defender I would rather have than our starters.. Maybe they can make a case for Prince and DRC being better corners, but our defenders are better than theirs across the board..
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On Offense they can make a case that Eli is better than SAM, and we damn sure would love to replace our WR’s with ODB, but after ODB, they don’t have anyone else I’d really want.. Maybe the rookie LT grows into a good player, but no one wants PUGH or the rest of tbeir OL, No one would take Rashard Jennings over Murray and Mathews, Vereen is a nice player, but Sproles is the king of the scat backs, Larry Donnell vs. Ertz and Celek is a good matchup but I’d still take Ertz upside over Donnell…
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This isn’t even about me being a homer, I literally believe our players are better than theirs, at most Id take 5 of their players over our guys..
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Hopefully we play to our potential so we can make our supperior talent level obvious for everyone to see… Make big statements in these next 3 National prime time games, beat Giants, Panthers and Cowboys and shut all the blowhards up, and put the League on NOTICE that the Eagles are coming…
Evan Mathis is probably going to sit out with a hamstring injury… It’s like the curse of guys chip gets rid of… Hamstrings is an injury that I just don’t understand,. In all my years of growing up playing various sports hamstring is just something I NEVER experienced any problems with whatsoever.. Never pulled or even strained a hamstring.. I dealt with Groin and other issues, but I don’t know what it feels like to have hamstring issues…
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Agholar has been ruled out this week, but they didn’t rule out Ryan Mathews, he was listed as questionable.. I expect this to be Demarcos breakout game regardless, so if they want to sit Ryan out, I’m fine with it, but I think he plays Monday.
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Doesn’t sound like Bair will play, but I haven’t seen how he was listed on the injury report
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Kendricks won’t play, even if he wakes up Monday feeling fantastic, I assume he would sit out concerned about suffering another setback
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Very Thankful that the same 5 lineman who played well last week will get to start again this week. Hopefully we are done with OL injuries and this current group can start to get some continuity together so they can gel like we need them to, specifically Lane Johnson who has had to play next to 3 different Guards in 5 weeks..
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The Eagles coaches keep saying that ODB will play, and that they will have all hands on deck on offense, which is fine,.. But it looks like they will definitely be missing some defenders Prince, The LB Kenard, Beason, will all probably miss the game, not sure what the status is for McBride…. last time we played the Giants was the last game of last season, in that game ODB was targeted 23 times which is INSANE for a WR… I don’t care who your WR is, if he gets 23 targets, he is going to put up some numbers
I’m worried about a shootout TBH. Eli is getting the ball out as fast as I’ve seen him in his career. That’s very tough to defend. We need our secondary to jam and disrupt routes to make Eli hold the ball an extra second or two. Our pass rush has to get home, and try and force him into some bad throws.
Eli is certainly playing better than we are used to,, they seem to have found a solid balance of getting the ball out under 2 seconds and also taking their shots down field.. Chip said to expect them to throw BOMBS all night at us, 8-10 shots down field, and when he isn’t going dowhfield, he is getting rid of the ball pretty fast..
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The biggest Improvement is he isn’t holding on to the ball all day, and when he is pressured he is starting to just take the intentional grounding instead of rushiñg his throws and throwing some stupid INTs when he is under heavy pressure like he used to…. So we definitely have to respect how he is playing so far this year…
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But I like to think we are in the middle of arriving as a top defense, and I expect them to play eli tougher than his previous opponents like crappy Niners Defense… The Great Drew Brees also gets the ball out fast going into our game last week, yet the corners clamped down, we took away his first read, made him hold the ball for an extra second which was all our DL needed to get their hands on him… So I’m expecting to see the same thng this week. Our Front 7 has been terrorizing eli and the Giants for years, I think we are bad matchuo for the Giants and Panthers …. eli is doing a great job avoiding sacks and not throwing INTs, our defense is doing a great job of forcing turnovers… Something will have to GIVE on Monday night, and I like our chances to have another impressive defensive performance where we Ragdoll Eli similar to what we did to Brees, more than I like Eli’s chances to continue his clean play against our Defense… Cox has been feasting on PUGH for years, and I really expect this defense to prove that it’s starting to really come together and take the next step to growing into a defense that is to be respected…
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I expect to see Bradfird and Murray have a big game and lead us to a 40pt performance, and I need to see someone hang 40 on this eagle defense to believe it….. I actually view Curry, Barwin, BG having a quiet year in the sack column as a good thing, because the lack of sacks HASNT Done Justice to the job they are doing getting some pressure on QBs, Cox was able to have such a good day, because logan and the rest of our beasts were also winning their matchups and cutting off Brees escape routes, he had no where to step up, or side step and Cox was able to feast on him… I think one of our defense best tributes that they don’t get enough credit for is that they really are a Talemted selfless group of Defenders who take Pride in rushing the passer as a cohesive unit..l you don’t see 4 guys just trying to do whatever it takes to get the Sack, our boys play within their gap responsibilities, you really Never see any selfish pass rushers, and you will really see the merits of this when we face a Super athlete at QB like Cam Newton… I love how this front 7 is selfless and rush the passer as a cohesive unit…
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the Cliche that sacks come in bunches usually rings true, so when I see our solid pass rushers winning their share of Battles, getting decent pressure on QBs yet they aren’t registering Sacks, it doesn’t bother me because it makes me think that big sack performamces are still ahead of us. hopefully Cox turned the sack Faucet on this past games and the sacks will start to flow..
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This theory will get put to the test about a QB who is avoiding sacks and not turning the ball over as well as any QB so far this year.,, we are forcing turnovers better than the majority of teams, something will have to give Monday night… And I dont believe our modest sack numbers are any accurate reflection of our ability to get after passes and I expect to see a defensive explosion where we build on last weeks game and go on a run of playing some of the better defense in the league.. like the hard to sack Drew Bree’s, my money is on Eli getying fuckin Battered in Philly Monday night.. I see this front 7 giving him a beating like he hasn’t seen since last time he had to face the Eagles Blackout and we shut his team out,,, I think we will sack Eli at least 5 times, and the defense will come away with 3 turnovers which is their goal every week.., It won’t be as glorious as the shutout out last year, but I don’t think this will be a close game coming down to the wire… defense steps up, turns the corner and officially arrives as a top 10 unit regardless of what the stats say
I hope. I feel confident against their defense. Our OL has taken some licks in the early going, but seem to find some footing last week. They are much better than they have played, and I think they aren’t getting much respect nationally because of the slow start. When we rush for 150 yards on their defense, people will start to take notice.
I’m hoping MS2 either gets his first sack or INT this week.
I hear that…. I really feel good about these next two games. I have felt that Giants and Panthers are really good matchups for us, but that’s going to be put to the test because we can count on the Gaints and Panthers all remember the beating and embarressment we put on them last time they came to philly, and both teams should be jacked up looking for Revenge on a National Prime time stage.. These two teams Damn sure won’t overlook us, and its a great October test to see how we measure up against two of the tougher but beatable teams In the NFC
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Man it would be HUGE if MS2 could have some real success on Monday night football against our Rival, it would be big for his development because it’s probably not realistic to expect the kid to be playing with a ton of confidence,, he is starting to Flash as it is, having some success that would give him some confidence could be a big boost going forward, and we are light at OLB, the rotation could use Marcus consistently giving us a spark off the bench, and we need that kid to really Develope because we are an OLB injury away from having to move him into then starting lineup..
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I’m looking to see the Defensive line really mature into a unit that will dominate and take over games like we saw last week when they are facing inferior OLs like the Giants.. PUGH might be playing better, but no reason that Bennie or Cox should let him have any success against us,… I need us to treat the Giants and make them look like the inferior OL that they are
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As well as our Defense is starting to play, with as many shots as the Giants take down field, our X play defense is going to be put to the test by Eli, but if they want to take shots, they have to hold on to ball and allow the routes to unfold, and we Need to really make this team pay for taking shots down field at us… When they try to ayyavk us deep, the play needs to end with Eli getting spiked into the dirt, whether he got the ball out or not, and our ballhwaking Safeties Need to be sharp and pick off some deep balls and make them pay for thinking they could be so aggressive against us
happens when people don’t do all of TC / Preseason, they just aren’t in game shape. look at people w/ hamstring issues most of them sat out preseason for one reason or another.
That’s not lost on me that those guys are the ones that get injured.
It probably does factor into it,.. Unfortunately, knowing this and knowing that we will struggke in September if we don’t play in the preseason, Id probably still elect to sit our players out in the preseason…. I’d rather deal with Hamstrings and a slow start to the season than lose a key player to a blown Achilles or ACL in the preseason…. We might get on chip now for guys not being ready to play in September, but I’m sure we would rip him much worse had we lost KEndricks or Bradford or someone for the season during the preseason….. Lessor of two evils sort of deal..
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This game is just too physical, injuries are too big a part that it’s hard to risk key players in live action that has no bearing on the season… I can’t argue against chip holding guys out of the preseason, and I hope he does the same thing again Next August…
dealing with a hamstring now. they are very fickle. they seem to come out of nowhere, not caused by a hit, or falling, or twisting, just can be running as usual in a straight line and boom, you feel a tightening and pain. Rest, rest, rest, get back to slow jogging, feels fine, then boom, out of nowhere, it tightens up. one difference with a groin, or ankle, might be that when a hamstring feels just fine, all better, it can come back quickly, so hard to trust it, figure out when it really is fine.
Tommy, I’m sending you my cleaning bill from the Apple Store. My lunch got revisited on my keyboard after that memory lane from hell sentence. Jarrad Page, Patrick Chung, OJ Atogwe, … urp….
If our run game produces more than the Giants (since our run defense is unpenatrable)..
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If Ertz/Celek produce more than Donnell
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If Sproles has a bigger game than Vereen
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Can they Giants WRs really produce so much more than our WRs to overcome losing all those match ups? There is no excuse for our defense Not slowing down TE Donnell and RB Shane Vereen more than the Giants defense is able to hold up in pass defense against Ertz/Celek and Sproles… I like to look at the matchups of where the offensive production is supposed to come from because it automatically includes the QB play, OL vs. DL and the individual matchups for example: Landon Collins trying to matchup with Sproles, or Malcom jenkins/Barwin trying to slow down TE Donnell
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Our RBs BETTER have a more productive day than Rashad Jennings and the Giants RB’s,,..I don’t care what the rankings say, Id bet my car that our run defense is better than the Giants run defense. Their OL shouldn’t be any better than ours and Murray/Sproles/Ryan are just better than Jennings and Vereen,,
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Our OL should keep Bradford clean and give him all day to throw against such terrible giant pass rushers, where as Eli needs to be perfect and really help his OL trying to avoid getting sacked by our Front 7
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Across the board our defense is better than the Giants, and outside of FG kicking, our ST is better than theirs… When I look at the matchups I can’t help but see it really tilted in our favor for the most part… And when we add that to the Fact that we are playing at home, and we should be more desperate to win this game than the Giants, I can’t help but to thiis game will play out similar to last weeks saints game…. So Much is in our favor this week and we should be desperate to not lose another division game all year so their is no way we should see us have an emotional łet down, or come out flat this week…. Play up to our potential and we should get this win,,, time for our team to settle down, start coming together and begin to show just how talented this roster is,
Malcolm jenkins was asked if they get extra amped up because It’s the Giants. who we have a rivalry with and he said “It seems like all the division games are big Rivalry games when you play in the NFC East”..
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Kind of makes you appreciate playing in this division when guys from other teams find this to be unique and different from their past situations, we are lucky that even during the down years of this division, we still end up seeing some real Wars.. Compare that to some of the more boring divisions take the colts for example, no matter how bad they are, they almost always sweep their division it feels like.. They don’t even have to be great to sweep the division, where as in the competitive NFC east, running the table on our division rivals would be such a big accomplishment that is rare, which is why as a fan it’s so high on my wish list, up there with shutting out opponents.. These days sweeping the division is probably nothing special to a colts fan… We play in the ONLY division where each team has won the division in the past 4 years.. The division is about as bad as it can get, yet as fans we are still treated to Dog fights where you can win and lose the games no matter how much better you are or worse you are than your Rivals,.,
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We can’t afford another division loss. With as close as this year looks to be, another division game means we could lose a bunch of the tie breakers. the Giants won last week, they have a ton of injuries that can excuse a loss, they don’t need this game as bad as we do, we have to play like they DONT want or need this game as we do..
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What I would give to see SAM lead us to an 9 play TD on our opening drive…
I just watched the ginas vs 9ers game. That sf OL was pretty pathetic in the run game at times. And i agree with your tempo synopsis. Make them play with the same 11 as long as we can, tire them out, frustrate them, take advantage of the matchups – and then do it again.
Lol San Fran basically was able to run on the Giants grossly over rated run defense using Hyde to run behind Joe Staley and Boone all game.. Most of the successful runs went right behind Staley and Boone.. As a whole, I thought Eagles OL run blocked better last week than the 49ers OL that had some success against the Giants…
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The saints and Niners for me are similar caliber crap teams last week, we blew the saints out, Niners were lucky to beat the niners at home..
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Who knows what ODB looks like, but we saw how a hamstring was able to slow down Julio who had been terrorizing the league.. Kendricks tried to play on his hammy and couldn’t make it thru a series.. Shady claims he won’t take the field Til he is 100% worried about the fickle nature of hamstring setbacks… Maybe ODB is feeling great and sat out of practice as a precaution.. Maybe he plays but ISNT capable of his normal Burst, speed, stop and start ability, or maybe be plays two series and can’t continue.. Maybe he doesn’t play at all…. No matter what, we should be able to beat the Giants at full strength…. But we will know how ODB really feels by how many looks he gets.. Last time we played him they threw the ball 23 times to him, which is almost unheard of..
Eagles are now 5.5 point favorites after opening as 3.5 point faves. A lot of money going on G-men…..me likey.
Might be due to the fact that ODB and Randle are hurt.
I think you have it backwards… Eagkes were minus 3, now they are minus 5-5.5… That means people are were putting a lot of money on the Eagles when the line was 3.5, and they had to make the eagle a bigger favorite because they are trying to encourage betters to put money on the Giants since the goal of oddsmakers are to get an even amount of money bet on both side, and collect the juice.. People will be less likely to bet on the Eagles -5.5 than they are at -3… So the movement you are seeing in the line means that Big Money has been bet on the Eagles and the line keeps increasing trying to discourage people from continuing to bet on Eagles and encourage betters to take the Giants getting 5.5
nah i’ve watched it from the beginning, a day after the line came out 60% of the bets were on New York. on wednesday the line went to 4.5, and 66% of the bets were on New York…now i looked at it today and it’s gone up another point and the money is on the G-men at 70%
I understand what Vegas tries to do by evening out the money, but there are also times when they let you know what their thinking….this is one of those times to me. Just like on Thursday when New Orleans were only 3.5 point dogs to Atlanta and over 75% of bets went to Atlanta, Vegas stood firm and kept the same line all week and cashed in big time
73% of the money on NYG as of this morning, crazy
Just a thought.
I’ve noticed that a lot of the Philly media likes to talk about all the mistakes the Eagles made this past Sunday. Yet they still scored 39 points. Yes, they keep getting in their own way and put 39 points on the board.
Just imagine what a flawless game would look like.
Heck just the two Redzone INTs held us back from a real BEATDOWN.. Those were both TD passes that Bradford can make 8 out of 10 times.. It wasn’t some great INTs by the saints, it was bonehead mistakes by Bradford, throwing Two INTs that could have easily been 2 extra TDs on the board…
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If bradford throws throws those two TDs and we,don’t give up the last second worthless TD that they were desperate to score just to make the score more respectable we could have easily seen a 53-10 Eagles win..lol
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bradford completes those two TD passes, and his WRs DONT drop 3 of his passes, and we would be talking about a 4 TD, no INT day where he threw over 40 passes and would have completed something crazy like 85% of passes..
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That’s what a thin line it is from a good game, to what could have easily been a spectacular game by Bradford and the Eagles… Add to that “all the meat Murray Let on the bone”, he clearly didn’t maximize the play of our OL… We had a good win, but it could have so easily been a spectacular win if we just cleaned up 5 stinking plays: 2 bad ENDZONE INTs, and 3 WR drops..
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This team hasn’t even been close yet to playing a complete game that really does justice to the talent level of this roster… When we really start to click and play good complete games, this should be a very scary team to beat….hopefully we can get there by mid November allowing us to take care of business down the stretch which kept us from the playoffs last season
” Philadelphia is the only city where you experience the thrill of victory, and the agony of reading about it the next day” – Mike Schmidt
I think a lot of people feel embarrassed by going nuts in the preseason with expectations, and they are trying to keep this in perspective.
Okay, I’m officially excited. It’s like getting all my favorite things together. The new Star Wars trailer gets released for MNF. Makes sense since Disney owns both.
Saturday’s don’t have the same feel when we don’t play on Sunday, but the Ganady Golovkin fight will be an exciting distraction , Boxing sucks, few fighters are worth watching and Tripple G is must watch TV especially against an opponent tailor made to Brawl with him.. Should be fun, hopefully he wins and fights Canelo next
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I don’t usually watch penn state, but I’ll prob Check them out playing against Zeke, Bosa and Ohio st
Ok….i’ll take one for the team. #GOBIRDSGO
That’s just wrong, but I LOLed
Really interested in seeing if Chip and Pat continue to expand the offense’s play book. I don’t remember where, but I recall coming across an O player (Josh Huff?) stating that the Eagles have added more new plays and formations this week than last. If this is true, DCs will need to start wearing adult diapers on game day as they try to slow down this offense.
Chip is such a stickler and believer in using repetition as a foundation for cohesion and success, hence the practice style Chip developed and utilizes. My contention for some time has been that as the base offense tendencies became more recognizable, Chip and Pat needed to add to the playbook to keep defenses off balance and force DCs to game plan for a wider variety of plays and formations. The offense has practiced and run their base offense how many hundreds/thousands of times? Excited to see what Chip and Pat have come up with!
The thing is, the Eagles don’t have to solely be an uptempo, run first, Inside Zone / Outside Zone with West Coast passing principles offense. This is where Chip (I hope) is starting to grasp the difference between the college and pro games. Taking snaps from under center, 2 and 3 TE sets, moving the pocket, 2 back sets, pass first game planning, mixing tempos throughout the game…a proactive attacking approach as opposed to a probing reactive approach.
The continuing evolution of Chip.
Think Lane said we added a bunch of new stuff, but your point remains the same.. Think he also mentioned some new screens which will come in handy against the Giants who are starting a 178lb corner on the outside
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I assume this is something we will see every 4 games since the seasons are broken down in quarters and we do our main self scouting after every quarter along with the bye week…
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Hopefully we have success on first and second down so we have all the new plays as available options on 3rd down
holy shit the end of that michigan game!!!!!
miracle at michigan!!
What happened…
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:13911414
J.T. Barrett comes in and it’s a whole different ballgame…Good luck nittany lions
I’m not that impressed with hackenberg.
I usually defend him, (I’m a penn state homer as well) but this is one of those games where you ask if this kid even deserves to be drafted at all
This is the first game of his I watched so I don’t want to be too critica or claim to have an opinion either way, but taking sacks on 4th is pretty bad, especially that last one where he had Barkley open as his outlet. Barkley has been great, has he been this good all season?
Oh and I agree about Barrett, I don’t understand why he isn’t starting.
Barkley looks like the best Penn State back since Larry Johnson. He’s a Freshman and is nursing an ankle injury so they are limiting him tonight and have platooned him with Akeel Lynch so far, but he needs to be moved in as the starter. He runs tough and has the ability to make nice cuts, runs a 4.43 forty, he is only going to get better.
Hack has missed open receivers several times tonight. I think the kid has the physical talent, but i’m not sure what goes on between the ears sometimes. He got a leg injury earlier in this game, but it doesn’t excuse his decision making. He also seems to let things snowball on him and he loses his cool and doesn’t look like a guy who can handle pressure when things are not going his way. Not a whole bunch of talent around him, but he still makes too many stupid mistakes and his accuracy is sporadic, misses too many easy throws
I wanna see Burton get some meaningful opportunities to make plays for us. Huff needs to kick some a$$ Monday too Let’s put the NFC East on notice and go from there. Win big and build some momentum while Dallas is trying to sort out all their new pieces.
Tommy, one aspect of the Eagles Safety play is the fact that the combination of Jenkins and Thurmond also makes Maragos a much better and more viable Safety. When Billy Davis deploys Jenkins and Thurmond as effectively Slot CBs, h puts in Maragos as the Deep Safety, which is a very good match to Maragos’ strengths as a player. With all his Special Teams experience, Maragos is a solid open field tackler, who takes excellent angles with rapid pursuit and excellent wrap up tackling abilities.
Dawkins not only stopped Big Daunte Culpepper at the goal line once at the peak of his career but he made himhurt..he fumbled and that big athletic kid first considered a shorter career
Also Dawk did the best air guitar. Short and sweet. Is that where DMac got it ?from? Im out of town so never got to see him live
WFT loses. Dallas a bye. Own division with a win.