Backup DL
Posted: March 20th, 2016 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 274 Comments »One of the things I’m curious about is the kind of DL Jim Schwartz will go after as backups. I say Schwartz, but obviously Howie Roseman and Doug Pederson will have a say in this as well. One of the big factors in my mind is whether the team thinks it has much of a chance to afford Bennie Logan in the future.
The Eagles pay good money to DEs Brandon Graham and Vinny Curry. Fletcher Cox makes a fair amount now and will be getting mega-bucks sometime in the next year. Can you afford to also play the 4th starter big dollars? I think Logan will play well in the new scheme and won’t be cheap to keep around.
If the Eagles have concerns about him, they could look for a NT to draft and develop this year. Remember, Logan was a 3rd round pick. You don’t have to go for a DT high to hit on a quality player. That’s especially true in a draft as loaded at DT as this one.
One interesting mid-round target is Javon Hargrave of South Carolina State. He is 6-1, 309. He has thick thighs and a big butt, giving him the ability to anchor against the run. Hargrave is quick off the ball and a gifted pass rusher. He finished his career with 37 sacks, an insane total for a DT. I don’t care that he did that vs I-AA competition. That’s still impressive.
Hargrave is the kind of player Schwartz could like. He can play NT, but is also athletic and disruptive enough to be the 3-technique if needed. Schwartz generally seems to prefer taller DL, but that versatility and level of production might be enough to make him want a 6-1 DT.
Maliek Collins flashed 1st round ability at times during his Nebraska career, but he was inconsistent. He has good size at 6-2, 311. He can get up the field and make plays. He’s more natural as a 3-tech, but could be a NT in the Eagles system. The NT is still allowed to attack. He just has to deal with more double teams.
Teammate Vincent Valentine is huge at 6-4, 329. He’ll be drafted more on potential than what he has shown so far. He did start 24 games in 3 years. Nagging injuries kept him from maximizing his potential.
There are lots more DT candidates the Eagles can go after. I am making one assumption in all of this. I don’t see Beau Allen as someone that Jim Schwartz will want to keep. Allen is a squatty, run-stuffing type of NT. He’s a very limited playmaker. Maybe Schwartz will see potential for Allen to grow in that area and end up keeping him.
Allen isn’t going to have much trade value if the Eagles decide to deal him. I could see him being sent to a 3-4 team in order to move up in the draft a few spots. That’s probably the best value you’d get. We’ll find out soon enough if he’s part of the future.
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Out of curiosity, why would you want a tall DT in a one-gap 4-3? I can see it as a 3-4 DE, maybe even athletic-type edge rusher, but seems the leverage is against you once you get above 6’2 or so
Taller player normally means longer arms. Longer arms are used to keep an OL off of you so they cannot utilize leverage. Furthermore most OL are over 6’2 anyway.
Besides helping to keep OL off of you being tall is handy in blocking passing lanes, and due to arm length approved ability to reach out to QB or ball
Arm length and height aren’t very highly correlated. Look at Bennie logan, dude looks like a gorilla with a shorter (well, 6’2″), stout build and 34″ pythons.
They measure arm length independently of height, so it’s not as though you’d just want someone tall because they probably have long arms.
Also, long arms are great for an edge rusher, a cornerback, a WR, but there is a cost to having long arms and it’s evident when you look at their reduced reps on the bench press.
Arm length and height are directly correlated. The taller you are the longer your arms will be on average. http://medind.nic.in/jbc/t12/i2/jbct12i2p87.pdf Figure 2. To the second point, having long arms may make you worse at bench press but luckily bench press doesn’t really carry over to football very well. In the 2013 combine (I picked 2013 because its far enough away to kinda see how these players are panning out) the DL bench press champs are Margus Hunt 38, Brandon Williams 38, Akeem Spence 37 and Josh Boyd 32. Are any of these guys that great in the league now? I looked at 2012 and it’s the same story, save Dontarie Poe. Cox only got 30 reps on the bench and he’s a monster. Just trying to illustrate that bench press is pretty irrelevant to the NFL.
Brandon Williams is really good. But yes BP is a historically shitty indicator of success.
Yeah, Brandon Williams is a beast. Bench press has to be one of the least important events at the combine. If you are that worried about a player that has a low bench # then go to the tape and see if they show the functional strength necessary.
Example: Cody Whitehair. Only put up 16 reps on the bench, but once he gets his hands on you its over. They are big strong hands paired with great core strength.
BP is also a historically shitty company when it comes to drilling in the Gulf of Mexico.
Some of the most dominant DTs in the league right now are only 6’1. Taller DTs will have pad level issues unlike the squatty fastballs of power like Donald and Atkins.
My favorite recent 4-3 DT pair were Jon Henderson (6-7) and Marcus Stroud (6-6) in Jacksonville.
6’4 is about the tallest you would prefer a DT. Any taller than that and you’re going to start having issues with pad level and leverage.
Looking at some of the guys Schwartz has had
Suh: 6’4
Fairley: 6’4
Sammie Hill: 6’4
Corey Williams: 6’4
CJ Mosley: 6’3
Andre Fluellen: 6’2
Grady Jackson: 6’2
Chuck Darby: 6’0
Landon Cohen: 6’3
Kyle Willaims: 6’1
Dareus: 6’3
Corbin Bryant: 6’4
Stefan Charles: 6’5
Tony Brown: 6’3
Kevin Vickerson: 6’5
Haynesworth: 6’6
Randy Starks: 6’3
Corey Simon: 6’0
Didn’t you ever hear the term “Big people beat up little people”?
Too soon?
Would hate to lose Ginger Thor but as soon as the new staff came on board I more or less resigned myself to him being a goner.
I’m curious how Logan will fit in with the new system since he’s been primarily a run stuffer NT for us over the past couple of seasons. I honestly don’t know but will his skillset translate into the new system? I like Logan so it’d be a shame to lose him but, these are the grim realities when switching systems. I honestly have a lot of questions about where players will fit…
Barwin has never played in a true 4-3 has he? How will Kendricks adapt to a new position? Graham is finally switching back into his more natural 4-3, will he blossom? Will MS2 become anything in Schwartz’s system? He was drafted as much for his ability to cover and move in space as his pass rushing ability right?
Allen is kind of a marginal player at best even if his hair is pro bowl caliber, so if we could move up a few spots in a late round deal for him I’d be very for that.
Logan can likely be a very good piece playing between Cox and grahm or Curry. I don’t see him as limited to just run stuffer at all.
Barwin has absolutely played in the 43. And Kendricks has played Will before. They both were good in those conditions.
Logan should fit it fine. When he was drafted a bunch of us were befuddled because he really was a 4-3 player, not a true NT.
Barwin played a 43 both in college and his first two years in the NFL.
Logan fits fine. He played both 1 and 3 tech in college. He was projected as a solid 3 tech or good attacking 1 tech coming out.
How could Schwartz use Barwin’s LB capabilities if he’s a DE? I’d hate to simply waste all the things he brings to the table other than rushing the passer.
DE also needs to set the edge against the run.
Perhaps one of the reasons the wide-9 looked so bad in its first incarnation in Philadelphia was because Jason Babin was so one dimensional. Barwin just may be the perfect guy to play it.
That said, why worry about it? Barwin will be 30 next season. It’s not like he is going to be manning the position for more than a few years at most.
I’m not worrying. I just really like the guy and want him to stick around. He’s a good pass rusher, and I think he can do well in the 4-3, but you hate to waste his other abilities
We won’t be seeing BARWIN at LB, with the exception of maybe if we got to a Big play off game. And we felt that sticking him on someone like Jimmy Graham was a wrinkle we could have some success with,,, during the regular season he will rush the passer like 90% of the time… Tho Schwartz did say BARWIN, BG, and Marcus ability to drop into coverage allows us to play a 5 man line at times, but rush 4 and keep changing which of the 5 drops into coverage trying to confuse Qbs and blocking schemes…. So there are ways that we can still easily put his talents to use, but the majority of the time he will be attacking, not dropping into coverage, and No DE, OLB would ever complain about being able to Attack
That’s good about Logan, hopefully he’s as good as a 3 tech as he was at nose.
I didn’t realize that about Barwin, I always thought he played linebacker in the pros.
All good news, I like Barwin and Logan so if they fit in well that’s perfect.
logan will be a 5tec…. Cox is 3tec
Non issue
Cant wait to see logan in the new scheme. He was getting regular pressure while he was two gapping..gonna be ridiculous to see how he does by just attacking a guard 1 on 1.
Hargrave would be a great mid round target to add to the rotation, noticed kyle crabb mentioning him a lot last week, powerful kid with a hell of a motor
[…] Tommy Lawlor One of the things I’m curious about is the kind of DL Jim Schwartz will go after as backups. […]
“One of the things I’m curious about is the kind of DL Jim Schwartz will go after as backups.”
Me too. But they haven’t made any signings in that position group to help us figure it out.
Here are some 4-3 DT rankings
http://www.drafttek.com/2016-NFL-Draft-Prospect-Rankings/Top-College-43-Defensive-Tackles-2016-Draft.asp
http://walterfootball.com/draft2016DT.php
Mayock from 2/11
Interior defensive line
1. DeForest Buckner, Oregon
2. Robert Nkemdiche, Ole Miss
3. Sheldon Rankins, Louisville
4. Jarran Reed, Alabama
5. A’Shawn Robinson, Alabama
Bucky Brooks from 2/5
Defensive tackles
1. A’Shawn Robinson, Alabama
2. Jarran Reed, Alabama
3. Robert Nkemdiche, Ole Miss
4. Andrew Billings, Baylor
5. Kenny Clark, UCLA
Logan is gone after 2016. Just accept it now, so it doesn’t hurt later on. We can’t afford him. Just to get Cox signed to his deal we are going to need to cut a handful of guys like Barwin, Peters, Mathews, etc.
We’ve got 6 million in space for 2017 using even the most conservative projections about the cap. We’ve got 12 million cap space right now (which should stay about the same because rookies will be almost completely offset by some of the quasi expensive vets who won’t make it out of camp) that will roll over, but again we’ll be conservative and call it 10.
That’s somewhere around 16 million in cap space
Barwin, Peters, Mathews and Bradford opens up about 33 million.
That’s 49 million conservatively.
We’re just fine cap wise.
I have read teams are expecting the cap to jump next year as well. Seemed to me it was already going up fast but…
Then again losing Bradford may mean we are hunting for a qb again
I think they are planning for it to not go up, but in reality it should go up considerably, just like it has the past couple of years. It’s part of the reason that in a year or two the deals for LJ, Ertz, and maybe even Bradford will look good, I think.
I wasn’t thinking of roll over, but still Bradford probably isn’t getting cut, so we would have more like 37 million in cap space, but then Cox is gonna cost like 20 million and Logan will be 10 million. Now, I know their cap hit their first year won’t be those figures which would be their average per year. Still that is a ton of money going towards the d-line considering we are already paying Graham, Curry, and have to pay Cox. It certainly seems more feasible factoring in the roll over.
That is some cold nfl reality . Bums me out actually
Better make sure it’s actually a reality before you let it bum you out.
Well too much in the past that still does…. the present for the last 2 years had been .. hated the idea of future was gonna
Not gonna happen…. Be easy
Doubt it
Peters might age out or get hurt, but I hope Barwin shines in his new role(s) under Schwartz and retires as an Eagle.
Lol sounds a lot like what everyone around here said about Mychal KEndricks this time last year,,, then he got extended, and the “just accept it now people” tucked their tails and STFU lol.. I also heard a lot of “just accept it now, they won’t extend Bradford” LOL
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Believe it or not, NFL teams are fully capabke of paying for 4 Quality defensive lineman… Letting a quality player in Thornton go, ensured we retain Logan, but I know that’s not the popular narrative… But we’ll see..
Cedric Thorton got 17 million/4 years with 6 mill guaranteed. Bennie may get more than Thorton, but it’s not like he’s a top player that teams are going to break the bank to acquire.
thank goodness for the mute button.
I am glad Tommy has finally picked up on Howie’s theme for the offseason: pairs. After adding McLeod (Bethel-Thompson) and (Rodney) McLeod, retaining Bradford and adding Bradham, and signing a pair of Brooks in FA, the draft seems pretty easy to predict: Hargreaves and Hargrave.
Help me out here- is there a true NT in a one gap 4-3? I just thought you had two interior DTs. What defines an NT?
Not a war daddy Vince Wilfork type NT but 1tech’s are also referred to as NT’s. Think Mike Patterson or Pat Williams.
Think Hollis Thomas as our 4-3 Tackle
Gonna be an interesting week… chip kelly will have to address the media, and there will be some local philly reporters asking him questions..
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The niners have like 55$ mil in cap space, weird that they haven’t been able to sign uch talent other than average at best Zane Beadles… At least the Browns strategy is to lose all their free agents, don’t sigń many replacements which allows them to stock up on compensatory picks… The niners only lost boone really, so not only are they not adding free agent talent, but they aren’t collecting comoensatory picks either…. Pretty weird offseason by the Niners..
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LURIE will also address the media, wonder if our media will throw a bunch of softballs, or ask him some tough questions like LURIE not following up on his “promise” from the post chip kelly firing press Confrence, so much for his plea to “trust him”, And his “promise that he would clear up everything shortly”,,,
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Shame Andy Reid ismt availabke to answer questions about Pederson and Chase, along with having to answer questions about tampering with Maclin
Watching the highlights, I am reminded of Cox. One play he is strong enough to shove the OL back two yards with his first step, the next play he is fast enough to knife between two guys before they are out of their stance.
The fact that Cox is doing these things to grown NFL men while Hargrave is doing them to I-AA kids cannot be overstated, but you can only destroy the guy that the other team puts out there.
I’m in love with Matt Judon.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ode88l04180
My two biggest questions from this video are (1) are college numbers assigned specifically to confuse me and (2) did Wayne State pattern their logo after Wu-tang Clan?
#9 looks pretty good, too.
YOU WILL RESPECT WAYNE STATE! THEY GAVE US JOIQUE BELL FOR LIKE 6 WEEKS IN 2010!
Eagles had a private visit with him at his pro day.
First time in my life I’m turned on by a Cox.
Everyone remembers the first time.
Hmmmm!
The best part about watching Cox is how hard he slaps OLineman
hargrave looks like a beast. would like him in the 3rd
I love the potential of Curry but he hasn’t produced a ton yet and I think Graham is…eh, ok. So saying well we might lose Logan b/c of those two really hurts. Get rid of Graham.
You should wait until the season comes to pass judgement on Graham. He’s been playing out of position in the 3-4 the last couple of years and is finally back to his natural 4-3 DE position and healthy playing that position at that. He is also the best 4-3 DE on this team so in no way would I sacrifice Graham for Logan. Curry also hasn’t produced due to him seeing such limited snaps and also playing out of position in the 3-4. I like Logan a lot but I wouldn’t get rid of any talented pass rushers off the edge to keep him. I would think Barwin would be gone next year if they need to cut ties with one of the d-lineman in order to keep Logan.
I hope all these guys flourish in the 4-3. I really do.
With the 3-4 it’s like Chip had to try the Triple Lindy when a cannonball would do. He just upped and upped the difficulty level of what he was trying to do.
Exactly. Why even waste time talking about what will happen next offseason before we see these guys play in a 4-3?
Actually Graham has played tons of snaps as a 4-3 DE, but Eagle fans like to pretend we weren’t in a 4man line during the majority of 3rd down pass situations these past 3 years …. Maybe Graham played the run a lot as an OLB, but he got plenty of pass rush opportunites from the DE spot in a 4man line to project what he is…really good player, not a game changer….. This post ISNT ment to devalue BG because I think highly of him…
I just realized, Chip hasn’t done anything despite 60 million in cap space this FA… Wonder if he’s re-evaluating how he does things.
And I wonder if no one wants to play for him.
I guess it’s further confirmation that Trent Balke is in full control.
Also, the 49ers don’t have many good players for Chip to trade away for nothing anyway.
With Baalkes job security probably being in question, im not sure failing to add Free Agent talent was by design… If it was hard for Chip to fill out his coaching staff (DIDNT an assistant just leave him to Join Lovie smith in college?), maybe NFL free agents werent linning up to play for Chip, Gabbert/Kaepernick or what has turned into a dumpster fire of an organization?
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They had Money, but so did a lot of other teams
first attempt of 2016. could be better, but the front half shook out rather nicely:
Round 1 Pick 14 (OAK): Jared Goff, QB, California (A+)
Round 2 Pick 13 (OAK): Will Fuller, WR, Notre Dame (A)
Round 3 Pick 12 (OAK): Kenneth Dixon, RB, Louisiana Tech (A+)
Round 3 Pick 14: Carl Nassib, DE, Penn State (A+)
Round 3 Pick 16: Shawn Oakman, DE, Baylor (B)
Round 4 Pick 2: Connor McGovern, OG, Missouri (A-)
Round 5 Pick 14: Ben Braunecker, TE, Harvard (B)
Round 5 Pick 25: Ken Crawley, CB, Colorado (B-)
Round 6 Pick 13: Brandon Doughty, QB, Western Kentucky (B+)
Round 7 Pick 12: Deiondre’ Hall, CB, Northern Iowa (A+)
Round 7 Pick 30: Nick Richter, OT, Richmond (B+)
off topic but I’m becoming obsessed with the possibility of us drafting Jack, I just read scout Kyle crabbs evaluation of him, says it’s the highest evaluation he’s given to a prospect in 3 years..here’s a sample.
OBLB Myles Jack is an elite prospect who’s skillset is tailored perfectly to the style of play in the modern NFL. Jack should be considered a blue chip prospect regardless of scheme.The ability to play with physicality when necessary blended with the fluidity and finesse to be a high end coverage linebacker is a rare combination. Jack is a high energy player who brings passion to the field of play; this energy is regularly channeled well for pursuits to the ball and to scrums to save yardage. Jack missed a majority of the 2015 CFB season with a knee injury only playing in 3 games. Provided these health issues are resolved and Jack checks out medically for a full return to 100% there should be no issues with discussing Jack as an option at any point for a pick in the 2016 draft. Jacks best fit ideally is as a SAM in a 4-3 defense where his coverage abilities can be maximized and he can erase tight ends from the game while also assisting in setting the edge against the run”
Evaluation rd value: 8:5-9: “multiple pro bowl player, top 10 selection”
I’m all in…I would absolutely love if we could get him…make Bradham start at SAM if he’s not 100% by the time the season starts, and then eventually have him at SAM, Hicks at MIKE and Kendricks at WILL.
Really don’t think they have any shot at him. Top 5 for sure.
Yeah, I think Jack would be on their list of “not going to be available, but if he is, grab him”, along with Tunsil and Ramsey. I’m not sure if Bosa is on that list.
I would say so
Smokescreen or real talk?
Smokin’ Howie!!
That’s what I as thinking too — has to be smoke screen, shady was a second round pick, no?
depends on definition of “high picks” — he didn’t say first round or high first round. He only mentioned 5th/6th/7th. Maybe he’s meaning “high picks” as the 1st three rounds…
Most likely he was separating top 100 picks, from rounds 4-7, but people want to go crazy reading into things as if they are going to tell us who will be the pick..
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I doubt Roseman even has his top 10 best prospecs mapped out yet”
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All I took From it, is if there is a rare special RB available, he will be considered… DOESNT mean Zeke will be the highest rated player available when we make our pick. DOESNT mean Zeke will be removed from our board because we value RBs so little
Exactly…people have never said you could get a good RB in the 5-7th rds that I’ve heard. You can get them in rds 2-4 though and you do NOT need to get one in the 1st.
What would he hope to accomplish with this “smokescreen”??
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Hasnt said anything that would poïnt to Zeke Elliot being the highest graded player when we pick… Sounds like he was just being honest about his Philosophy, don’t see much to accomplish with a smokescreen… What’s the most he can accomplish with a “smokescreen”?? If Zeke gets to 7 causing a team to trade ahead of us for Zeke? Hardly a big enough reward for some calculated smokescreen…
HR has long been fond of getting more picks, and he was able to move up w/o giving any picks up. If he wants a late first and an early second, he’s in a better position at 8 than at 13. I know he said that there are 10 players that he’d be happy to take at 8, but historically, unless there is one guy that floats his boat, he’s looking for more picks. He might love Elliot, but I’m thinking he may want to see if Ramsey, Tunsil or Jacks drops to 8. After going hard for Sam and Chase, he may surprise and jump on a QB at 8, but that seems like a long shot to me. The only way I see him staying at 8 is if the draft unfolds in a way that keeps a player he covets available. He’s in a nice position.
Yes his elaborate smoke screen today just earned him extra picks
In other words: Want Ezekial Elliot? Better give Howie a call with a bunch of draft picks to spend.
Actually, if you wanted to connect the dots, it would mean “better trade ahead of Philly if you want Zeke”
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sounds like we reading into things a little to much, but that’s nothing new
that’s fine too, pushes someone else down to us
Think we are reaching
Jimmy actually has a rare (somewhat good) article up on why #8 probably won’t be an OL.
http://www.phillyvoice.com/eagles-unlikely-draft-offensive-line-help-pick-number-8/
“The numbers that we have on our board are much greater than we’ve had the past couple of years. ”
“I think the defensive line- the interior defensive line, the defensive tackle group – it’s probably the best that’s come out in a long time,” Roseman said. “We’ve gone back and studied ‘What does that mean?’ Does that mean you can get later into the draft and get a guy or that everyone kind of tries to get their own guy. It’s a really interesting group of guys on the interior defensive line, for us the defensive tackle position. Then you look through it, and the offensive line group is pretty good. The numbers that we have on our board are much greater than we’ve had the past couple of years. So those positions kind of stand out, and as your building a team along the lines, that’s kind of exciting.”
http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/news/article-1/Four-Takeaways-From-Howie-Roseman/8055dbc8-ddc1-40de-8926-649e782917bc
Eagles, Giants have talked to Alfred Morris, but he is in Dallas today….sounding like Patrik Robinson will be a cowboy
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Roseman crapped all over The narrative that you can just find great RB later in the draft…
Thanks for the updates, none of us other guys have internet so…..
“I like when my GM doesn’t turn over stones looking for cheap talent.” Said no one on this board, ever.
Doesn’t change the fact that great RBs can be found later in the draft.
Great players can be found at every position later in the draft… Bet teams get more role player RB later in the draft, then they get GREAT RBs..
Go look at jimmy’s article, most high end rbs comes from the first round just like with talent at all other positions
Where in the first round?
You realize that last week he put out an article with the exact opposite theory right?
Just show that opinions with out facts to back then up are just hot air.
Or that “facts” are mostly “crap?”
Morris is past his prime
Robinson is up and down
Fairley plays well when surrounded by other talented linemen
don’t break the bank for any of them
I hate Alfred… Fairley won’t be an eagle..
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Btw, no one is “breaking the bank” for anyone at this stage of FA
6 elite talents in this draft, none of them QB
Tunsil
Ramsey
Bosa
Jack
Elliott
Buckner
Assuming 2 QBs taken at least one of these guys will be sitting there
Yup… We call that “sitting pretty” where I come from
Which one of these things is not like the others……………..
I think you have a top 5 there. Elliot isn’t a guy I’d put up that high.
IF the birds end up drafting Elliott, you’ll be too busy grinning at the flashy plays he makes to remember that you doubted picking a RB at #8
I hope
And if the next few guys taken after him all have longer and better careers……………………
If Elliott last like most high end rbs he will last 8-10 years
And if I was a foot taller I could lead the NBA in rebounds.
I just don’t see Elliot as a high end RB in the Peterson class for a guy to be taken in the top 10.
I hope you’re right, because I think DAL will take him
What are you? 6’5?
That is 100% fair, but I think Elliott is by far the best rb since Peterson. He is more complete than gurley was
We’ll have to diverge there. I’d take Gurley over Elliot easily.
even if he lasts 100 years, the player is only really “yours” for 6, maybe 7 years. A 1st round pick, you get the 4 years, the 5th year option, and for an affordable position like RB, you can franchise them once, maybe twice. After that, it’s the highest bidder.
Not directly related to the subject, but do we start seeing a few more elite players or up and comers retiring early because of health issues, lack of desire for the game, money made etc. With Borland, Willis, Woirlds and Johnson the last couple of years, wonder if there will be a couple or more each off season.
Yea and when the guy taken 11th makes 4 pro bowls after Elliot retires in 2023, suddenly all the OMG he’s the bestest people will claim they hated it all along.
Interest in Alfred Morris tells you a different story…
Comp: Edge James
That’s a rather rich comp. I don’t see it.
Bucky Brooks has him as Frank Gore.
Not bad. Comps aren’t an exact science, that’s for sure. Elliott plays with a punishing violent style, has great balance, great vision, explosiveness, good first step, blocks well and runs good routes. My worry would be that in dishing out so much punishment he is putting a toll on his own body. So there’s a burn out risk
Agreed x 2. Which is why I can’t vibe on taking him that early.
watched some of DL yesterday and really liked Hargrove too and Reed from Alabama but Robinson not so much. Also I don’t know if he fits and scout say he will scare teams but I can just imagine Nkemdiche next to #91. I know there are thing to corect as far using hands better but this guy is a physical freak that could be molded by the right DL coach. Not going to happen but still.
New Cleveland Execs said they are proceeding as if Josh Gordon won’t be on the team … Interesting statement to make during The league Meetings about a guy who is up there with Joe Thomas as your most talented offensive player.,, was that a strategic statement designed to get teams to start making trade Offers?
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If we are ever going to take fliers on Charechter questions, I would hope it’s for someone of Gordon’s elite Talent level…. But it’s a tricky situation, you can take a flier on him, but you really can’t give up anything significant for a guy when you know that he is one mistake away from getting crucified by the NFL….
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The absolute most I would be willing to give up for Josh Gordon, is Josh Huff lol.. Maybe Id give up a 5th, but probably not a 4th…. Best value they can get forJosh is probably design a trade for a conditional pick who’s value depends on what Gordon ends up producing for his new team
CLE’s going to have crazy draft amo (via comp picks) next year — interesting to see how they waste them this time.
Seems like that was their strategy, sit out of free agency, łet their free agents walk, and load up on Comp picks
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No idea WTF the niners plan is
An NFL team playing a regular season game in China is the most money hungry crap I have ever heard,,, Goodell losing his damn mind, drunk on Dollars…
Why is that such a bad thing?
Seriously? A regular season game in China? Like an 18hour plane ride for injured players and 12 hour time differrence? Bet you can’t find 1 NFL coach that likes this idea
Ok, so now you’ve given some reasons. Unfortunately, none of them are especially compelling.
won’t be good football, but sort of doubt the league cares. Would make more sense to have exhibition or pre-season games abroad.
Maybe not for a suit… Probably can’t even get 5% of players and Coaches to not be against this…. Seems like excessive whoring out of playërs, but you are welcome to see it any way you please
It’s a game, and it’s for a profit.
BREAKING NEWS!!!!
You can go watch college football if you want to watch football that isn’t about money.
Ok, ok, I couldn’t keep a straight face on that one… lol
Hope they schedule the bye week for both teams either right before or right after the trip
I assume they would absolutely have to… Don’t they already do that for the teams they send to England,,… I have been on 16hour plane ride in first class, it’s not a pleasant experience…
I’ve been to Ireland a few times “normal class” and it’s really not a big deal.
I’ve been on 17 hour plane ride in coach. It’s not fun.
I take 6 to 8 hour coach rides all the time,., by like the 5th hour, im ready to snap
No, it’s not. I used to try to get a seat right behind the bulkhead so I could put my feet up on the wall
They would have to make it a Thursday game with a bye the week before. That way each team would get more than a week on each end.
It’s NFL owners secret plan to get them to start making the Concorde again.
To me it is one of many things that takes a game that many of us love, and scours the landscape looking for every last lucre. The NFL has become a train w/o a conductor. More pre-season games, no, more regular season games, more PPV games, more rules to protect the big owners’ big bucks, more analysts, more cameras on more players, more shrugging off the mindless violence that surrounds the lives of so many aspiring young men. The greed of the owners has outstripped the fascination and appetites of the rank and file fan base. The league has become far more concerned with marketing than with football. The irony of a billionaires club, too feeble to respond to the truth regarding the inherent contradictions of the game it is peddling is sad and a pro pos. Stars dying young, stars taking their lives, other stars beating the crap out of whoever gets in their way (usually a spouse). So what is the response? Expand…Grow….Press on, but fuck the retired players, fuck the medical poobahs who spell out the insanity of playing football, and, oh yeah, fuck all of those stupid fans who think this is about them.
You ever wonder if the rich guys see the writing on the wall and are trying to get every dollar they can out of this ride before it gets shut down?
That is exactly how it feels every time the “league” speaks. And there is a subtext of contempt for everything and everyone who disagrees.
Well said.
So, playing in a foreign country is where you draw the line?
More profit and expanding the market has almost no correlation with your complaints.
You can maybe host a Pro Bowl in Hong Kong but China is a dumb spot for a regular game.
Didn’t they already have a preseason game in Japan? But a regular season game is crazy.
..
Flying to England is one thing, not much different than flying to the wescoast,… But 18hr plane ride for a regular season game is crazy
It’s not the first time they wanted to do this in China apparently.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_National_Football_League_games_played_outside_the_United_States
and yea they had some games in Japan in the past.
on a money hungry corporate level, it makes perfect sense that the NFL has its eyes on China, but I imagine the league will meet resistance from playërs/coaches,.. Not sure the NFL will care… Can the players union fight this?
..
GOODELL claims he wants to continue increasing revenue by like 10-15% each year, who knows where they take this league 10 years from now
the thing about money and power is no one can ever have enough.
I’m not sure how much it trickles down, or how quickly, but more league revenues means higher salary cap for the players
Does the players union have a say in this?
I believe as part of the CBA certain percentages of league revenues go directly to the salary cap numbers. Salary floors were also negotiated to prevent teams from too much collusion
Yes I understand that… But does the players Union have a say in NFL deciding to send them to other continents? Or can the NFL just send the players wherever without needing the Union to sign off on it? Just curious
Good question…
Get ACViking to comb through the CBA. I’ve heard Mexico City is a probability. I wonder how they structure that
Man you Philly boys have such an East Coast bias. West Coast teams traveling to China isn’t much worse than East Coast teams travelling to London!
Lol
Is the sun biased that all of the planets revolve around it?
Eastern Standard Time 4 Life.
I actually had the thought that some of the west coast teams would probably jump at the chance to plant seeds of fandom across the pacific, the same way east coast teams like the jags welcome Europe. Sure, the pond is bigger, but still…
Jags owner also owns a team in London. would be interesting if they could get chinese $$ interested in American football teams – dramatically increase ROI for owners.
I’d welcome every pro sports team from a terrible American city and even worse fan base, like Pittsburgh, being purchased by the Chinese and sent there.
Fulham is a shit hole though.
No, it’s still much worse. I can fly to Europe in less time than I can fly to China. By quite a bit. 8 hours to Rome. 16 hours to Taipei.
Goodell and the rest of the greedy owners need to calm the fuck down with spreading the sport around. No international league that plays a game each week will ever be successful until there are hypersonic jets or teleportation.
so what you’re saying is… BRING BACK THE CONCORDE
Not sure if he was being sarcastic or not but this is true.
I wasn’t being sarcastic, I just didn’t realize how damn big the Pacific Ocean is. I grew up in Philadelphia, I’m still learning my way around out here in CA
..what?
This would all be fixable if there was actual minor league football….. Oh wait the NCAA would lose money… Can’t have that.
I agree we need a minor league for the NFL, but I don’t think they care about the NCAA losing money. I think the owners don’t want to assume the risk.
I wish the NFL would get a better hold of the young talent pool. Hopefully the coaches complaining about QBs who can’t read Ds, run too much, and o-lineman who can’t sustain pass blocks will get the NFL thinking in a more strategic manner.
Goodell is a mouthpiece for the 32 billionaires that gave him his job. He’s their lackey and they love him.
This is being seriously proposed/considered??
Sam Bradford is hosting Eagles teammates Jordan Matthews and Zach Ertz at his Oklahoma house. Gotta be giving those dudes envy, how much house does $100m buy in oklahoma.
all of them
It would buy you the scenic overlook with the 30 foot elevation change.
I would prefer hearing that Agholar was also with them… Hopefully he will be included in the next offseason workouts…
There are some big ranches in OK (in terms of acreage) that would fetch a huge price.
Hands down one of the least favorite states in the U.S. although Tulsa isn’t that bad. Oklahoma City has some ‘ok places’ to eat but I hate going there for business.
Pederson listed DB, OL, interior/Edge pass rush as 3 positions we still have to address
Not RB?
Interest in Alfred Morris tells a different story
..
But you should be pleased to know Roseman mention Kenjon Barner by name as a returning RB
..
You are delusional if you think Elliot will be removed from our draft board because he plays RB and you are silly enough to devalue positions. But I’ll play along
We do have Ryan Matthews. I’d be fine with Ryan KB and Sproles honestly. That and a UDFA can get you through if the OL is right.
Barner is not fine. Ever.
Next season’s Henry Josey / Mostert. Knowing what we know now about Kelly those guys never had a chance despite what they did in preseason.
It’ll be nice to see production and skill earn a roster spot over clandestine BS and waterproof feathers.
Mathews will quickly get hurt, putting Sproles as our leading RB which is not good. I don’t want Barner anything more then my 3rd back with a few carries/catches a game
Like Roberto Aguayo!
Shut you’re whore mouth we’re taking Tom Hackett.
Doesn’t mean much, not like he’s gonna telegraph what they are gonna do
Awww shucks… I was hoping he would post the Eagles draft board online
Same
Wonder when that post will go up
What’s y’all opinion in Mackenzie Alexander I’ve been watching more of this kids tape and I don’t see how he isn’t better than Eli Apple, pretty easily
Strongly feel that Jalen Ramsey is the only DB worthy of a top 10 grade…. Id like to add DB talent, but can’t force it at #8.. Shit Id love to get chance Warmach type LG prospect at #8, but there is none available in this class. LG is probably the biggest starting need left on paper.. But if the draft doesn’t provide one of that caliber. Get a special player regardless of posituon, because we can use elite talent just about anywhere we can get it
That might be the case.
I’m just not as high on Hargreaves as some others…. I have to agree with you after Ramsey there’s a big drop. Wonder where CBs will be ranked the Doug releases his big board.
Funny thing is warmack is not even a top 5 ol drafted that year
Warmack being slow to acclimate to the NFL blew my mind. I wonder if he got lazy when he got paid or is on drugs and hasn’t been busted yet.
Because I know with 100% surety that it wasn’t my evaluation of him that was off.
Everybody had him as the best prospect in the draft by far
Warmack was crazy overhyped. Cooper was the better G in that draft. Decastro was better than him the year before. I said it then and people thought I was wacky.
G’s who play in massive power schemes like Bama, Wisconsin and especially Stanford will struggle almost due to the inverse of the reason of Air Raid and spread OL. They are so used to double teams and 6 inch splits that when you ask them to take a 2 foot split and base block a slippery 3tech it’s totally different.
It’s the reason Garnett scares the shit out of me. It’s why I would take Whitehair over him. I know Whitehairs game translates. I’m not sure Garnetts does.
Fun discussion. I think both dudes are high level NFL corners.
I hate having to wait 70 picks after 8…. Gonna see a lot of talent go by
If Chip would have followed through and obtained the picks in the Bradford deal that were reported instead of getting fleeced; you’d not be waiting that long.
I don’t think he’s top 10 worthy but would consider him if he was available at the 20s.
Oh definitely not a top 10 guy but better than Apple from all I’ve watched…. Seems many disagree though
Both guys rely on their athleticism instead of technique. Apple is probably higher on other people’s board because he can be a better pro than college player unlike Alexander.
That’s interesting. I hadn’t looked at both guys that way.
IMO its Ramsey, VH3, Alexander then Apple.
That’s how I personally have them ranked. Although I’m a little higher on Alexander then most.
Me as well, he just needs some help on his footwork. He’s got the foot quickness just needs the technique.
Not top 10 worthy.
Well you bring up a good point … who from the 2nd 10 or lower .. is worth the reach ?? Because who cares if his ‘value’ is 20 or even 50 ..when we have picks 8 and 88. ??
The odds are heavy that we grab a reach
If he turns out to be a star, we won’t care where he was drafted.
If he turns out to be Marcus Smith, we’ll be hearing about it for years…
As per Brandon Graham. . I can wait as long as he eventually becomes a player
I have him slightly above Hargraves but within the margin of error that if the staff feels strongly enough about VH3 I’d be cool with that too.
Re: Roseman’s RB Deception
What incentive does Roseman have to reveal his true views on drafting RBs?
That is, what do the Eagles gain by Roseman telling the world what he actually thinks on the topic?
So a handful of fans can break their arms trying to pat themselves on their backs for being right about what the Eagles *actually* think about Elliott?
Or is Roseman trying to accomplish something else?
And I ask that question on the premise that Roseman — especially at draft time — is not going to tell the truth about anything draft-related.
______________
Guessing . . . but Roseman has maybe 4 or 5 guys he wants. Could be less. Could be more.
Is it not in the Eagles’ interest to suggest publicly at least that — at No. 8 — Elliott may actually be a serious contender?
Why?
So teams behind the Birds who want Elliott — with a doubt now at least raised that Roseman may draft him — trade ahead of the Eagles.
If that happens, then maybe one of those 4-5 players whom Roseman actually wants get pushed down closer to the Eagles at No. 8.
_______________
If that’s not Roseman’s purpose, then it seems the question becomes . . .
What do the Eagles gain by telling the truth to the world that the team really is considering Elliott?
Why tell anyone who you consider to be in the Top 8?
That’s something Chip Kelly would do.
Not Roseman.
We’ve been scratching our heads about whether anyone really good at 8 spot. Maybe end game is to get that second rd pick, or another third by moving back? Doesn’t seem like there a Luke Keachly, or Fletcher Cox, etc. around the 10 spot.
Cox slid to 12th overall (right after Dontari Poe to KC at 11).
Looking at the 2012 draft class, though, given his position as a DT, it’s not really that crazy.
Yes, a few guys didn’t pan out . . . with RB Trent “Better than ZEKE(!) Coming out of College” Richardson at the top of the list.
But in positional value terms, 3 QBs, 2 CBs, an OLT, a WR, and a generational MLB going ahead of him makes sense.
It could be a smokescreen and he’s not interested in Elliott at 8. Or maybe it’s a reverse smokescreen in that he’s really interested in Elliott and knows if he implies that he’s interested everyone will assume it’s a smokescreen and that he’s not interested. Or it could be a double reverse smokescreen. The general idea is to make it so fellow GMs don’t have a clue what the Eagles are doing.
the double-cross . . .
like in “From Russia with Love.”
Is that the Chevy chase Dan Aykroyd movie ?
GR:
Totally agree the goal of every GM should be to confuse and confound the enemy.
Interesting that Roseman felt compelled to go on record about the RB position.
When he starts talking about guards, then I’ll be completely befuddled.
Great post AC. Another point not many people have brought up is how Pederson values his RBs. I know HR is in charge but I am sure Pederson has some say on the topic. If Pederson learned anything in KC last year is that you can absolutely get by with guys you pick up off the scrap heap. Jamal Charles goes down and they don’t panic in KC. They didn’t look to make any moves, they just rode the backs of West and Ware. One was an UDFA and the latter was a 6th round pick of the Seahawks who KC signed off the street. Basically all I am saying is that as good as it could be to have a highly touted and highly drafted RB, that you can get by with other guys. Hell give Philly Charcandrick West and I’d be happy.
The KC running back-by-committee situation sure seems like an under-discussed item when talking about ZEKE(!).
Great point.
Hey man
Exactly why I am not all for drafting Elliot.
And also the fact that next year’s RB class is one of most loaded in recent years.
Clearly you are not a poker player. Roseman has an obvious tell.
If you watch him closely when he is talking you can tell he is lying because he says stuff that doesn’t agree with my opinions. Likewise, you can tell that he is being honest when he says things with which I agree.
Frankly, I am surprised more people haven’t picked up on it.
ATG —
One of your best comments.
And that’s saying something.
You sir are on fire today
I have been thinking, and i think that so much of the move up to 8 is about getting in striking range of a QB. It is the position that the Eagles still (after spending serious $$$ at this offseason) still have no real long term solution at. I think Bradford is a possibility – but realistically an unlikely one that he puts it together and turns into a top 10 QB. Eagles are not paying the $$$ for Daniel that they are if they do not think he has starter upside as well.
However both of those options are not high %, and this is probably the last chance that Howie will have to draft an elite QB prospect. If Eagles end up this high in the draft again Howie is probably fired, and even then this is a rare draft where you have some elite upside QB’s, but all have enough question marks about their NFL transition that they may not end up going with the very top picks in the draft, and that only 1 team in the top 6 ‘need’ a QB.
Because of that Howie is talking about how much he likes the ‘top 10’ picks, how he is happy to let a player fall to him, that sure he could take a RB or whatever other position, because his fear is not the people in front – its the guys drafting later who need QB’s and who he does not want jumping in front of him to grab a QB.
I’d be doing cartwheels if we were able to land Goff at 8.
Me. Not. So. Much.
You like him a lot more than I
In my opinion all of these QBS have a very low chance of being a franchise QB. Wentz has the highest upside, but I am in no way sold on him.
I agree. I think there is less than 8 elite prospects on our board and roseman is being a hell of a salesman.
Agree, and I also agree with that Tommy stated in a previous post plus a player. To me there are only 4 truly elite talents in this draft. Elliot, Jack, Ramsey, and Tunsil. Tommy stated 3 with Tunsil being the one left out.
I think Jack and Elliot are the only 2 we have a chance of getting at 8 due to injury (Jack) and position value (Elliot).
Many are scared of Jack due to the injury and because we already have good starters at all 3 LB positions. I think if our medical staff thinks he is making a good recovery in which signs point to then I say grab him. He could possibly give us the best 7 man front in the league.
While I say Elliot is elite I would rather go Jack over him if both are available. I just beleive you can still get a very good back later in the draft. If none of the other truly top tier players are available then I wouldn’t mind getting Elliot. Drafting a RB in the top 10 like that does scare me though.
So we shud trade back ..m which i sort of think
It just struck me as some classic disinformation by a GM to produce some uncertainty. I didn’t take that much more from it than that.
Lol @ people who seriously put any weight in Eagles FO’s pre draft comments.
To quote ESP, “Wow.”
We’ve got 5 weeks to go and the paralysis by analysis is in full effect by the fans and the media. Mayock is probably only at the fourth game film for each QB.
If they are so good then why weren’t they thought of this highly … idk, 30 days ago?
This is flat out ridiculous. People knew Winston and Mariota were going to be #1/#2 long before this time last year. I don’t buy this one bit.
Well Goff has been the concensus #1 QB all year, Wentz’s hype train has been picking up steam recently. Mayock isn’t saying anything outlandish, just speaking his mind as a draft “expert”.
“[Trent] Richardson might be the best non-quarterback in the draft. He won’t make it past 6. He’s as close as I’ve seen to Adrian Peterson. He’s a three-down guy. He pass-protects. He’s a bear with the ball in his hands and he’s an adequate pass-catcher.”
– Mike Mayock
If you go back and think about Richardson in college, this quote wasn’t thar far off. Richardson was a 5 star recruit coming out of high school and a Heisman finalist before he went to the NFL. This quote was pretty spot on at the time. Can’t look at Richardson’s career now on hindsight and say Mayock was wrong.
I understand hindsight bias, I truly do. But we get to look at his comment and look at how laughably wrong it was. He says he’s basically Adrian Peterson and the best player in the draft.
Gotta get graded on your predictions eventually.
But the part of the prediction that is relevant here is Mayock’s ability to predict where he will be drafted. Did Trent make it past 6?
You do know that their predictions are based purely off a player’s college career stats. You can’t grade these guys over how a player’s career goes since all they’re doing is giving you their opinion on what they think of said player and where he might be drafted
Find a single “draft expert” that said TR wasn’t going to be a good player. Everyone collectively missed on Richardson..
“The kind of projection I want to make with Manziel is Steve Young,” Mayock says, referencing the Hall of Fame San Francisco 49ers quarterback.
-Mike Mayock
He was definitely wrong on that one.
Did ‘Ock make any good or great calls ?
I’m sure he did. He was super high on Khalil Mack, even over and above Clowney. But it’s not hard to be right when looking at top 20 talent and saying they’re going to be good.
Huge fan of Mayock … but that schit is very excellent
“I do think [Jimmy Clausen] has the physical skill-set to be a top 10 pick the draft,” he told Cleveland.com. “I think he’s going to go somewhere between 7 and 17 and I think he’s got the ability and makeup to be a good starting quarterback in the NFL.”
-Mike Mayock
“If I’m telling you he’s a top-10 pick, I’m willing to put my butt on the line and say he’s a top-one pick,” Mayock said. “I mean one’s part of 10. Bottom line to me, if I’m telling you a kid’s a top-10 pick, I believe in Blaine Gabbert.”
-Mike Mayock
Ok dude I understand what you’re getting at but anyone can go back and look at some of the things said by any of the experts and point out to where they were wrong. Once again if you knew Gabbert while he played in college, this was another that wasn’t that far off based.
The point is Mayock gushes over practically anyone. He throws shit at the wall and hopes anything will stick. I don’t understand how he doesn’t get any shit, yet Kiper gets it all.
Every expert is wrong about the draft at times. The draft is a complete crapshoot so no person can nail it exactly right.
He also has been right about plenty more things, if I quote every time you’ve been wrong or I’ve been wrong or any one of us has been wrong then we would also seem like we have no credibility too
““This year to me, Rueben Randle has some questions; Alshon Jeffrey has some questions; Brian Quick from Appalachian State,” he said.” [Justin Blackmon does not have questions]
-Mike Mayock
Please keep going, this is hilarious.
“Despite the fact that [Josh Freeman]’s made 16 starts, I think he’s the safest pick … His skill set translates easily to the NFL.”
-Mike Mayock
Josh Freeman also had a good rookie year Belpre flatlining in his NFL career.
So im watching path to the draft and MJD has us taking Cody whitehair 8th overall. At least he understands that our weakness is at guard but jesus thats a reach
Yea that’s absurd to think they’d take Whitehair at 8. Hell he may even be available in the 2nd.
hey bud whats your problem
I don’t talk stupid sorry. Now go away.
gnarly
Is there a ‘yo pal’ on the way ??
I’m kind of excited about Ryan Mathews next year. I see him as a 200+ carry, 1000+ yard back.
He hasn’t been healthy enough to get even 200 carries 3 of the the last 4 years.
Speaking of RB’s getting take high in the draft, WTH happened to Trent Richardson (besides getting drafted by the Browns or perhaps that’s all the explanation needed) and what differentiates him from Elliot? I honestly haven’t watched either of them but why did Richardson go SO high and what is the thought process that leads to Elliot being better than Richardson.
series of injuries
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1661936-cleveland-browns-why-fans-shouldnt-worry-about-trent-richardsons-injuries
got overweight
http://www.rollbamaroll.com/2015/8/3/9090643/trent-richardsons-non-football-injury-revealed
Hit some adversity and kind of just quit. Even the physical freaks have to really want it to hang around.
Also Banner has said they punted on him because they realized his vision was really bad.
I remember he was ok as a rookie, he had 950 yards and 11 TDs. Then I saw the YPC. Jesus. It was 3.6. That’s street free agent level bad.
Patience.
That’s what cornerback JaCorey Shepherd learned during his rookie year in the NFL. The promising sixth-round pick was in the mix to be the team’s nickel cornerback until he suffered an ACL injury during a = Training Camp practice. Shepherd was able to turn the injury into a positive and use the year on the sidelines as an opportunity to learn the ways of the NFL, a redshirt year so to speak.
“It was very tough. I’ve been playing tackle (football) since I was five and I’ve never had an injury where I had to miss a game, let alone a whole season,” Shepherd told Dave Spadaro on the Eagles Live podcast. “It was good to sit back and see things from outside-in. I was able to learn the game from a new perspective as far as how to study film, how to watch other guys, the veterans like Nolan Carroll and Malcolm Jenkins to see how they prepare. I was able to take that and use it in many ways while I was on the sidelines.”
Shepherd credited defensive backs coach Cory Undlin for keeping him involved in meetings and film study. The rookie was comfortable enough to offer his thoughts on what he saw on tape from other teams’ offenses and receivers.
The former Kansas Jayhawk said that his knee “is doing good right now” and that he’s “actually pretty close to being able to be full-go, being fully cleared.”
He’ll have to learn a new defense and the Eagles have added some experienced corners in free agency with Leodis McKelvin and Ron Brooks. That does not include how the Eagles re-signed Nolan Carroll last week. However, Shepherd is more confident than ever that he belongs in the NFL.
“I definitely feel like I was made to play in this league and be able to do very well,” Shepherd said. “I’m just as excited as I’m sure other people are to get out there and I’m finally looking forward to getting out there and playing a real game.”
http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/news/article-1/Podcast-Recap-Shepherd-Updates-His-Rehab/49cae88c-69a6-452b-82cd-f434be3ac17a
Roseman’s comments today and his earlier comments about ‘liking 10 players’ in the draft strike me as classic disinformation as the Eagles attempt to generate some leverage for a possible trade.
Roseman is trying to create the appearance that the Eagles moved up to 8 (from 13) and that they are going to take someone there whether it is Zeke, an OL, or a CB.
More and more, I see Roseman trying to bait a team to trade up to take the #8 pick for a #2 pick this year or a high pick next year. I could especially see that being for a DL the Eagles like in a deeper draft at that position early-mid 2nd round.
It fills a need, gives them a bit mover leverage in case Cox doesn’t agree to an extension this offseason and they trade him, etc.
even if cox doesn’t agree, we have him for at least 2016 and 2017