What to Make of Wentz, Pt. 1

Posted: June 19th, 2017 | Author: | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 96 Comments »

We know Carson Wentz is the Eagles franchise QB. What we don’t know is exactly what that means. Tom Brady is a franchise QB with handful of Super Bowl rings. Matt Stafford is a franchise QB who has yet to win a playoff game and only has one Pro Bowl to his credit. Wentz could be embarking on a Hall of Fame career or he could be the next Ryan Tannehill.

2017 won’t be a defining season for Wentz. There is no exact timetable for QBs. Some players are special early on and others take time. Packers beat writer Bob McGinn had some interesting comments about Aaron Rodgers recently.

“He was a very poor player here for his first two summers and regular-season practices. Fortunately for him, and he knows that down deep, he didn’t have to play early. His delivery was a mess, bad body language, he didn’t know how to deal with teammates. He learned so much from Brett Favre on how to in some ways be one of the guys and relate, and he became much more of a leader. He was really poor and how many great players have ever had a start like that? Not that many. A lot of scouts look at that exhibition tape those first two years and he was a little bit better the third year, but not to any degree, and then he just really developed. He lost a lot of close games in ’08, but by ’09 he was playing great and by 2010 he was maybe the best in the business. And then there have been a lot of playoff disappointments and poor performances. It’s a quarterback league and all the rules are designed for that quarterback to dominate, and he hasn’t done it in the most important times since 2010.

Think about this for a second. After four years in the NFL, Rodgers had thrown a total of 595 passes. Wentz threw 607 as a rookie. Rodgers developed into a great player. Some of the analysts who pick apart Wentz’s game seem to lose sight of this. Wentz does have issues. Wentz does have flaws. He needs to be given time to work on them. If the Wentz of 2019 is still having questions about his accuracy or mechanics, then you have a serious issue.

For now, Wentz is a young QB, trying to figure things out while also trying to win games for his team.

Doug Farrar of Bleacher Report wrote a very good piece on Wentz. Farrar was fair in his assessment, offering both praise and criticism. Wentz is not a great player. He might turn out to be disappointing. I don’t anticipate that, but we have to acknowledge that it is possible.

Farrar talked to old friend Mike Tanier to get Tanier’s thoughts on what he saw at the Eagles OTAs and minicamp. Crazy idea to actually ask someone who was there what he saw, right? That’s why Farrar is such a good analyst/writer. He doesn’t get caught up in theories. Instead, he watches game tape or finds someone who he trusts who saw the player in action.

I asked Mike Tanier, my B/R NFL colleague, for an assessment of Wentz’s improvements, if any, through the Eagles’ 2017 OTAs and minicamp. Mike has seen Wentz develop since his first minicamp.

“Everything about his quarterbacking is much better now than it was this time last year, when he was still officially a third-stringer,” Mike told me. “His release is more compact, and he holds the ball higher. He has had some drills under duress, so this isn’t just a ‘throwing in shorts against air’ observation.

 “In terms of calling plays, audibles, cadence and the like, it’s night and day. He now handles himself like an established starting QB up until the moment he cocks to throw. As to footwork, it’s hard to see that in live drills from field level. We still see some off-target stuff when he resets. I doubt he is ever going to be super-smooth when it comes to sliding around the pocket.

“Overall, Wentz looks much more solid on a variety of levels now than he looked in OTAs or training camp last year, when he appeared to be simultaneously mastering a rebuilt throwing style and figuring out an NFL playbook. He also looked better in minicamp than in Stage 3 OTAs, which should be expected.

“A few passes from this week really struck me: Wentz switching to a three-quarter arm delivery to deliver a pass into a tight window, and Wentz throwing low on a sideline route intentionally so only his receiver had an opportunity to catch it. There are still some clunkers, but these are the kinds of high-difficulty throws Wentz has to make to take a significant leap forward.”

Wentz is trending in the right direction. We don’t know what his peak is or how long it will take him to get there. Farrar compares Wentz to Ben Roethlisberger, a player I have also used as a point of comparison. Go read the piece to find out Farrar’s thoughts on when we can expect Wentz to hit his peak.

One thing Farrar didn’t mention and I don’t see many people bring up is the fact that Wentz had no foundational piece on offense last year. There was no dominant RB to feed the ball to. There was no great TE to act as a security blanket over the middle. There was nothing close to a #1 WR to throw jump balls to. There was no deep threat to make game-changing plays. The O-line was good when healthy, but injuries and Lane Johnson’s suspension meant protection was an issue for more than half the season.

That will change this year. LeGarrette Blount, Alshon Jeffery, Torrey Smith and a deep, talented OL should offer a lot of help for Wentz. That allows Darren Sproles, Jordan Matthews and Zach Ertz to be the complementary players that they are.

All that help won’t help Wentz if he can’t help himself. Effort isn’t enough at QB, but it does help. And it sounds like Wentz is listening to his coaches and doing everything that is asked of him. The coaches are pushing Wentz to get better in a variety of ways. From Jeff McLane.

“You cannot waste plays. Every rep is just so important that you have to just [have] so much focus on every play,” DeFilippo said. “And I’ve really challenged Carson this offseason to what we say, ‘Uncover where all the bones are [buried] in every play.’ “

During his parting meeting with Wentz in January, DeFilippo set offseason goals for the quarterback. Some of them had to do with his throwing mechanics and others had to do with situational decision making.


That is why the Eagles continually fine-tune Wentz’s mechanics. Much has been made of Wentz’s 10-day session with quarterback guru Adam Dedeaux in February, but DeFilippo has been working on tightening up his motion from Day 1.

He has had Wentz hold the ball a little higher. He has had him take the ball back as he prepares to throw rather than dropping it. And he has widened the base of his footwork. There’s always room to quicken the release and become more accurate.

“I saw a quarterback that had really taken some things to heart that he and I had talked about,” DeFilippo said.

Unlike some other young QBs in the past who were more concerned about becoming celebrities, dating playmates or partying, Wentz seems genuinely focused on football. As Mike Mayock would say, Wentz is a gym rat. He’s going to be watching tape, studying his playbook, lifting weights or practicing. He’s going to do what it takes to become a good QB.

Matt Mullin wrote a good piece on Wentz and the idea of a Sophomore Slump.

“Sophomore slump” is a phrase people like to throw around without ever taking the time to see if it’s actually a real thing. It’s simply a way to label something that doesn’t otherwise make sense or – and this is the one that really bugs me – to build a false narrative about a certain player.

The majority of times a player is hit with that moniker in his second season, it often fails to account for any number of environmental factors, those out of the QB’s control, that could be affecting his play. Other times, a player has such an impressive rookie season, that an average year suddenly looks like a slump. Careers wax and wane, sometimes that happens sooner rather than later.

But when was the last time you saw a quarterback (or any player at any position in any sport) follow a perfect career arc, where their stats incrementally improve year-over-year until they peak, then slowly decline each year thereafter, until retirement?

It doesn’t happen like that.

Furthermore, when talking about guys like Wentz – for the sake of this story, that means quarterbacks who were drafted in the first round and started at least 12 games in each of their first two seasons – there’s rarely a drop-off of any kind in Year 2.

Go read the whole piece to get some good stats and more details.

It will be great when Training Camp and the preseason get here so we can finally start seeing Wentz in action and find out just where his game is.


I referred to this at Part 1 because we’ll be re-visiting this subject quite a lot in the coming week, months and even years.


96 Comments on “What to Make of Wentz, Pt. 1”

  1. 1 Sean Stott said at 2:38 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    This comment is the first one

  2. 2 Kaedwon said at 7:21 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    More quick than fast

  3. 3 teltschikfakeout88 said at 10:09 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    well said yoda…or John Wooden light…

  4. 4 D Smith said at 4:50 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    You go Sean!!!

  5. 5 unhinged said at 3:33 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Interesting stuff on Rodgers. I am reminded of Paul Masson wine ads. Regarding Brady, I read some time ago that he was Mr. Casual Backup QB when old Bill told him he was about to be cut if he didn’t get on the bus.

  6. 6 Media Mike said at 6:57 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Andrew Brant has said on the radio before that Rodgers also significantly improved his arm strength once in an NFL strength and conditioning program. Makes you wonder how poor he would have been if he had to play day 1.

  7. 7 Tom33 said at 5:52 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Nice read Tommy – a couple of thoughts

    1. I found it interesting that you referred to Ertz as a “complementary player” and said Wentz didn’t have a ” great TE to act as a security blanket over the middle.” Despite missing 2 games (and playing hurt for a bunch more), Ertz finished 5th in catches and yards for TE’s, and would have been close to the top in both categories had he played all 16 games like the guys ahead of him. He finished with more catches than guys like Witten, Graham, Fleener, and Clay, even though they played full seasons. I think only Kelce and Gronk (if he stays healthy) are clearly better than Ertz right now. Just my 2 cents.

    2. In the Farrar piece he talks a lot about Wentz’s trouble recognizing and reading defenses last year. I don’t really remember a lot being written about that before – struggles were more about accuracy/mechanics and drops/piss-poor receivers. Just curious if others think that’s an issue for him (other than normal adjustments for players going from college to the NFL).

  8. 8 Media Mike said at 7:01 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    I’m not sure if that says more about Ertz than the state of TE in the NFL. I’d also tell you that if you could give me 16 games of healthy Jordan Reed, he’d be better than Ertz. I think the overall perception of Ertz is like when Bobby Abreu was on the Phillies; a lot of emptier stats that don’t seem to be produced when we really need them. Although I’m not sure that perception matches reality (in Ertz’s case, I know for a fact Abreu was a lazy bum) when it comes to Ertz.

  9. 9 Gary Barnes said at 10:41 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Disagree on Abreu and Ertz.

    I’ve never understood how stats i.e. actual production on the field of play can be “empty”? Is a TD scored in the 2nd quarter worth less than one in the 3rd? Are 3rd down conversion catches worth less in the 1st half than 2nd half? Similar questions about HR, RBI, 2B and the numerous baseball stats – they are what they are regardless of when they are produced.

    Abreu was quite effective in clutch situations as his stats clearly show. Ertz also, when healthy, has been highly effective as a TE and improved his blocking.

    One common element Abreu and Ertz share is they are very good athletes that make playing “look easy” in comparison to the lunch pail grit guys like Utley or Celek as examples. Some fans take this to mean Abreu and Ertz are “lazy bums” and that Utley and Celek types are “better” when in reality the production by the “lazy bums” are better or at least comparable.

    The other common element is both Abreu & Ertz are laid back, non-rah rah types which again can lead some to assume they do not “care” as much as other players. I’ve met Abreu and baseball was his entire life since a very early age. He had to make it out of Venezuela and then get a MLB team to give him a shot. I would bet Ertz had to also work his ass off to get to where he is and does not take anything for granted.

  10. 10 teltschikfakeout88 said at 1:57 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Come one Abreu was…UN..FRIGGING..CLUTCH…if you believe that statement by Phillies fans that can only remember a game or two when he lived up to that billing…LOL…

  11. 11 Gary Barnes said at 2:18 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Here are his career stats for the clutch stats:


    The data clearly shows the claim Abreu is “un-clutch” is a myth.

  12. 12 teltschikfakeout88 said at 7:29 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    I was kinda joking..#sarcasm

  13. 13 Stephen E. said at 3:54 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Well, all I can say is that the fact Ertz’s production goes through the roof in the last 5-8 weeks of the season has actually been used AS A KNOCK AGAINST HIM, if you can believe it. Meanwhile, if his stats were just spread out evenly or higher early in the season, whiny fans would be claiming that he didn’t show up in “games that count”.

  14. 14 Rellihcs said at 7:23 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Reed and Olson definitely better than Ertz.

  15. 15 A_T_G said at 8:12 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Clark, I think.

    Vernon Davis was super reliable? I don’t remember him that way. The others were, but I think that is their style. Those guys were the older TE mold: big blocker/receiver that settles underneath for catches and sometimes bowls for yardage after the catch.

    Ertz is never going to be that guy. He is faster, more dynamic, more of a down the field guy that can also slip underneath. He isn’t going to always be there as a safety valve because it would take away much of his skill set.

  16. 16 Rellihcs said at 8:37 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Good points.

  17. 17 Tom33 said at 11:47 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    I guess i just wonder what constitutes a “break-out” season. If the standard is Tony Gonzalez or Jason Witten in his prime, I suppose we won’t be happy until they are preparing his spot in Canton.

    78 catches is the 2nd best season ever for an Eagles TE (after Keith Jackson’s 81 in 1988) and his 75 in 2015 was the 4th best (Celek had 76 in 2009). 153 catches over 2 years is probably in the top 5 for any Eagles player ever. Hell, his 5.5 rcpts/game last year is the 2nd best total for any Eagles player after Westbrook in 2007 (6 rpg).

    I’m not saying he’s perfect, but it’s a long way from the days of LJ Smith. Maybe we just have to reexamine our expectations.

  18. 18 Rellihcs said at 1:19 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Yeah, believe me, I’m an Ertz fan – big time.

    I think we are somewhat lost in semantics – which closely follows your point about expectations.

    But in the context of Tommy talking about Wentz’s rookie year and not having a “great TE to act as a security blanket over the middle”, I think it’s fair to say that Ertz isn’t that “rookie QB” helper TE that Tommy was referring to.

  19. 19 ChoTime said at 10:09 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    No, it’s not fair.

    Receptions per game #1
    Yards per game #4
    Catch rate #6

    There are 32 starting TEs in the league. What do we really need here, him to catch a TD every time Wentz throws it up? The guy is not a monster on the level of Gronkowski or JJ Watt or Megatron, but he’s a legit star.


  20. 20 Ryan Rambo said at 11:55 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Dallas Clark

  21. 21 Rellihcs said at 1:17 PM on June 20th, 2017:


  22. 22 ChoTime said at 12:06 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Actually, he IS super-reliable. He was the most reliable TE in the league last year. Check out my post above for the stats.

    I don’t understand why people rely on the eye-test so much. It always fails.

  23. 23 Rellihcs said at 1:16 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Semantics. Was he reliable when he was hurt on the bench?

  24. 24 Insomniac said at 1:22 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Reliable and consistency usually come hand in hand but in Ertz’s case he’s only consistent in December. That’s not what I think of when it comes to an elite player.

  25. 25 Rellihcs said at 1:23 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Agreed. But alas, you complicated the semantics by adding “elite” into the current discussion.

  26. 26 Insomniac said at 1:33 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Well how long did his butt stay on the bench for the game?

  27. 27 Insomniac said at 1:21 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Can you name us a few “elite” players that don’t pass the eye test? Dominance is easy to spot unless it’s in the trenches where it’s harder to focus on.

  28. 28 ChoTime said at 5:03 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Matt Ryan? Tom Brady? Kirk Cousins?

    Anyway, I didn’t say dominant or elite, I specifically said super-reliable. Let’s not move the goalposts.

  29. 29 Insomniac said at 2:20 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Matt Ryan has passed the eye test since like his rookie year. Brady? Arguably the best QB in history has never passed the eye test? Cousins is a valid argument since he’s the closest comparison to Ertz as a QB.

    Oh yea those 2 QBs aren’t super reliable either.

  30. 30 teltschikfakeout88 said at 1:58 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Witten is still a problem…he is a frigging first down generator for Dallas even mores with all the weapons they have…I keep waiting for that moment where he can’t make a play….doesn’t happen…rewatch the Pittsburgh from last year…

  31. 31 Stephen E. said at 3:57 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Davis is basically the opposite of reliable.

    He put up worse numbers than Chad Lewis for years. And Chad Lewis cracked 500 yards like once.

  32. 32 ChoTime said at 12:05 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    I also raised my eyebrow at the comment about Ertz. He is not a mere role-player.

    Not only did he rack up a lot of volume on a poor offense with a QB who didn’t play well for the season (<80 QB rating), he excelled in the stat Receiving Plus/Minus, which measures how well players catch passes in various situations, compared to the average player. In fact, he led the league at this stat.


    What he is indeed very bad at is breaking tackles and picking up YAC.


    People want more out of him, but he is already an excellent player and by no means a fungible piece.

  33. 33 Media Mike said at 6:56 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    ““Sophomore slump” is a phrase people like to throw around without ever taking the time to see if it’s actually a real thing.”

    It is very real. Go see Prescott, Dak. His stats will slump, Dallas’s win total will slump, and one of our DEs is going to leave him slumped over on the training table.

  34. 34 Rellihcs said at 7:22 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    With all due respect, you just said “look at this phenomenon, it’s real” – and backed it up with a prediction, not an observation… that’s not a way to make a strong argument…

    I want to root against Dak just as much as the next guy, but with a strong OL, elite RB, and nothing but added talent at WR (Switzer), I think your point about him slumping has nothing behind it at all except for wishful thinking.

  35. 35 A_T_G said at 8:05 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Give Mike a little credit. It’s humor.

    An “example” of something that has not yet happened presented in his aggressive tone. He is not literally presenting some future event as proof. I thought it was well done.

  36. 36 Rellihcs said at 9:08 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Yeah yeah yeah

  37. 37 Media Mike said at 8:11 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Thank you. That was 100% me heaping scorn on Dak.

  38. 38 ChoTime said at 12:08 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    What probably will happen with Dak is that he will have a statistically worse season and perhaps lose a game or two more, simply because of regression to the mean. His season was so strong that it would be very unlikely to continue that way. But because he is an NFL QB and under the magnifying glass, a very normal fluctuation in results will be labeled with lots of dramatic narratives, and overall, people will think he’s having a “sophomore slump.”

    Of course, alternatively, things could always go swimmingly too, and since Dallas is the most popular team in the league, he’ll get nauseatingly great press once again.

  39. 39 P_P_K said at 8:32 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Hopefully, D Coordinators will have a better sense of how to hit his weak spots, their O line is a bit older and slower, and the heightened pressure to succeed will get to both Dak and Zeke.
    My great hope is that Wentz and Blount have stellar seasons and become the #1 NFC East qb and rb tandem.

  40. 40 Kaedwon said at 7:22 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    So something that hasn’t happened yet is proof. You realize you’re proving his point right?

  41. 41 A_T_G said at 8:06 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Pretty sure he does, yes, while taking the opportunity to jab at the Cowboys.

  42. 42 Media Mike said at 8:10 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    What ATG said. Just railing against Dallas.

  43. 43 P_P_K said at 10:17 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    You just made my day.

  44. 44 Media Mike said at 7:06 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Farrar is a really interesting follow / read. I agree with most of his stuff and the Wentz article seems really well thought out and very plausible, but then I stop and think that Farrar (along with co-idiot Mike Freeman) has wasted countless electrons this off season lying about Kaepernick being a being a good QB.

    The Wentz = Big Ben development arc would be interesting. We’re throwing a lot more passes and running a significantly more complimented offense than Ben did at an early point in his career and Ben didn’t throw his 600th pass until his 3rd year in the NFL. I’m hopeful it doesn’t take Wentz until 2019 to really hit his stride.

  45. 45 Buge Halls said at 8:34 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    “Zach Ertz to be the complementary player…” I’m glad at least one writer isn’t buying into the “this is Ertz’s year to excel” nonsense. Been hearing that for his entire career. He’s no Gonzalez/Witten/Gronkowski for sure – complementary is the best label I’ve heard for him.

  46. 46 DJH said at 9:26 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Yeah, first Peters as not hall worthy and now Ertz being a role player. Tommy is bringing it this offseason!

  47. 47 Buge Halls said at 8:57 AM on June 21st, 2017:

    No clue about what he said about Peters, but if you think Ertz i anything but a role player, you must not watch much NFL.

  48. 48 Mitchell said at 3:18 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    No, no, no. THIS is the year.

  49. 49 DJH said at 9:24 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Among others things, the piece on Rodgers makes you wonder how many QBs were given up on too soon and/or would have flourished in different situations. I’m sure there’s a lot of x-players sitting in bars who will tell you.

  50. 50 Sb2bowl said at 10:42 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Agreed. Most careers are made or broken by the situation to which a person is drafted into. Timing, coaching staff, scheme- all plays a huge role into the development of a prospect.

    Think about the career arc of Alex Smith vs Aaron Rodgers. Now switch their situations. What would that look like?

  51. 51 teltschikfakeout88 said at 10:14 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    Tommy…In the past you have you noted memorable HC and QB combos…McCarthy and Rodgers are one of those combos…we probably can’t understate the importance of McCarthy (a offensive and QB guru) has had on Rodgers…they will be forever linked as to the success that Rodgers has had…that is going to be important component for Wentz…is Pederson and Wentz that type of combo…maybe it can be more Harbaugh and Flacco and we can still be successful..

  52. 52 ACViking said at 11:42 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    How important is a head coach to a QB?

    In 1973, Don Coryell became HC of the Cards and inherited QB with a career 47% completion rate named Jim Hart.

    From ’74-’77, under Coryell (and in an offense whose concepts are still used today), Hart was an All Pro.

    In ’78, Coryell moved over to SD — where he turned a journeyman 6th year QB w/ a 12-30-1 record named Dan Fouts into a HOFer.

    These may be extreme examples.

    But the point stands — it definitely helps to be coached by a very good offensive coach.

  53. 53 ChoTime said at 12:10 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Imagine Donnie’s career if he’d been drafted onto some loser team instead of by Reid, who had a plan, and a good one.

  54. 54 teltschikfakeout88 said at 2:00 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Earthworms would be extinct???

  55. 55 P_P_K said at 3:36 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Even McNabb would have to laugh at this.

  56. 56 D3FB said at 5:53 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    You may be the first person I’ve encountered to posit that McCarthy is anything more than average as a coach.

  57. 57 teltschikfakeout88 said at 6:15 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    OK….sounds like you didn’t not think highly of him…seems to me he has won a lot of games…if your standard of a good coach is bellichick then I guess there aren’t too many good coaches in the NFL…

  58. 58 D3FB said at 6:21 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    He has the best QB to ever play the game and still manages to run an offense that is oftentimes comically bad.

    The fact that Rodgers only has 1 ring is a sizeable indictment of both that front office and staff.

    All I’m saying is if the Packers HC had been Jason Garrett or Marvin Lewis instead the results would have been pretty much the same.

  59. 59 SteveH said at 7:33 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    I know Rodgers is a bit of a dick but I still find the ability to feel sorry for the fact that he is saddled with that dumpsterfire of a head coach/organization.

    How can you have Aaron Rodgers and fail so much?

  60. 60 teltschikfakeout88 said at 8:30 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    They seem to light us up every time we play them… I see lots of criticism but not a whole lot backing it up… heck Brady doesn’t win it every year…

  61. 61 Ark87 said at 9:11 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    If we’re getting into burden of proof arguments, we’re going to have to agree to disagree. It’s an opinion formed by watching the Packers annually under-achieve. No one respects McCarthy, he’s mediocrity incarnate. The nicest thing people can say of him is he’s ultra-conservative in his approach which counter-balances Rodger’s aggressiveness to form a nice middle path. The script just doesn’t hold up though. Time after time you see Rodgers playing out of his mind to barely put out fires McCarthy lit by being dumb. He’s especially bad at making big decisions and calling plays. There are times you wonder “what’s wrong with Rodgers”, then put him in a 2-minute drill when he is calling his own plays and you wonder how they ever lose a game.

  62. 62 Tumtum said at 10:43 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    It feels to me like the Packers talent is annually over rated. Not so much that their coach under performs.

  63. 63 Ark87 said at 11:01 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Oh, no. Their roster isn’t that good at all. They routinely let talent leave in free agency unless they agree to stay for a song, and spurn free agency more than any team in the league. No team drafts well enough to shrug that off.

    That said, Rodgers usually has a solid group of O-linemen and can get his receivers punching above their weight with some impressive chemistry. I think they should be much better, I really don’t like McCarthy’s offense.

  64. 64 Bert's Bells said at 4:49 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Hell yes.

    Watching Rodgers run a hurry up is pretty much the best football there is right now.

  65. 65 Stephen E. said at 4:10 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    We beat them– on the road– in 2013. With Foles.

  66. 66 Tumtum said at 10:41 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Usually I agree with you, but I have to say I think you over rate Rodgers here and under rate McCarthy. Not saying Rogers isn’t on course for HoF, and McCarthy is some great master mind. Just feel like you aren’t that accurate here.

  67. 67 Gary Barnes said at 10:22 AM on June 20th, 2017:

    I think the most important common element for QB development & success is the organization’s ability to surround them with difference making talent and schemes.

    The good organizations know how to do this effectively and how to retain/supplement the core so multiple chances at the ring are possible.

    Wentz plays a vital role in his own development as well, but football is a team sport and no QB, despite media or fan mythology, can win without significant help.

    It is unclear if the Eagles are a good organization in this regard or not. They certainly had a sustainable run under Banner/Reid/McNabb, but those guys are no longer here. Roseman & Co. have no track record of success yet and Wentz is obviously only about to start his 2nd season. As usual, “we’ll see” applies to this situation. We all hope they can make it happen.

  68. 68 Ark87 said at 2:38 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    I always think calling players weapons is an apt metaphor. Particularly flawed or incomplete weapons.

    You give a team an awkward stick. Does your staff try to whack people with it, or do they recognize that it’s a bow, that it needs to be strung and shoot arrows at people. Ok once they do that, is it effective in the hands yielding it. Ok now that you’ve effectively made a bow and put it in effective hands, you have an archer, do you know how to use an archer? He’s incredibly vulnerable, if you just put him open field he will die. Now it’ becomes about putting barriers between the archers and swift death, be it infantry or ramparts etc. That’s a spear, don’t try to hack and slash people with it, that sword is flawed, it needs to be reforged and sharpened, so on and so forth.

    I think too many of us see archers in an open field get mowed down in a cavalry charge and conclude, man that bow /archer is a shitty bow/archer. Or that bows/archers suck in general. When in reality I think the scouts are doing their jobs, and the guys at the top don’t know what the hell they are doing, making the worst of what they have.

    Hence: the Browns. I don’t think they have a nose for busts. They don’t know what they’re doing

  69. 69 Benny6968 said at 1:35 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    I see Wentz in a different view than some of the media have portrayed him.
    To my untrained eye, he looks like a QB that can succeed if he is given protection and time to make good throws to competent wide outs.
    This season, getting back Lane Johnson may be the most significant piece that changes the amount of time Wentz has to locate the open receiver and the additions of Alshon and Smith should give Wentz good open and much more reliable targets to throw to in year two.
    Also, with the signing of Blount, that should also go a long way to improve our ability to move the chains,,especially in short yardage.
    I think with the upgrades mentioned above Wentz’s chances of success have doubled from year one to year two and also having a full off season as the a starter combined with the normal progression of a second year player, these are the reasons why I believe that Wentz can be much better if not great this coming season.

  70. 70 teltschikfakeout88 said at 2:19 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Damn…is that you Howie…glad to see you on the board…LOL….

  71. 71 daveH said at 7:27 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Ha! Perfect. Benny your writing literally made me start daydreaming of 4+ yards on every play and TDs on every drive! ☆i literally started to worry

  72. 72 Benny6968 said at 10:14 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Ha ! I could go on about the upgrades of Jernigan over Logan or the combination of Derek Barnett and Chris Long over Barwin, and how excited I am to see them wreak havoc but I am sure you guys already know how much better we SHOULD be.
    I heard we are experimenting with moving around players along our D line to throw off opposing offensive blocking schemes.
    I can’t wait to see how Schwartz will deploy this D.
    Imagine Cox going up against a Guard? Talk about mismatch city.
    I don’t know about you guys but at the very least you have to agree that this years Eagles team is going to be the team to watch.

  73. 73 Stephen E. said at 4:33 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Um, I’m pretty sure he’s been going up against guards pretty regularly as a DT. Maybe you mean tackles, when he swings out to DE?

  74. 74 ChoTime said at 10:11 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    “To my untrained eye, he looks like a QB that can succeed if he is given protection and time to make good throws to competent wide outs.”

    I agree. Of course, that describes every starting QB in the league.

    What separates the stars from the scrubs is the ability to succeed when things aren’t perfect.

  75. 75 Ark87 said at 6:39 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Heard today that BG only had 5.5 sacks but add up sacks hurries and knock downs and he lead the league. Then Curry was invisible on the stat sheet but the film shows him being active as well but just never quite makes it. If we can improve that secondary to buy them that fraction of a second, our D-line could have a great season, including a nice rookie season for Barnett.

    Although the other observation: Watching that field-level highlight film of BG, man that dude flies out there, seems like setting him out wide coming from a long ways away, seems to set a lot of QB’s running. We seemed like the kings of getting QB’s out of the pocket. Even when we caught them it seemed like they could always get the ball out even as they are going down. Not sure how you change “chasing QB’s out of the pocket” to blindsiding him for a sack.

  76. 76 A_T_G said at 1:10 AM on June 21st, 2017:

    Get a few picks and he might take one glance to many before throwing.

    Like you suggested, one hand washes the other.

  77. 77 P_P_K said at 10:11 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Unless you’re on the Giants. Like, Plaxico Burress, then one hand shoots the other foot. Or, JPP, one hand can’t wash anything.

  78. 78 tball_man said at 8:01 AM on June 21st, 2017:

    Having another legitimate bookend to collapse the pocket is your answer….Barwin was awful last year. He must have played hurt. The falloff from OLB previous yr to a 4-3 RDE killed what Schwartz wanted to to do with D.

  79. 79 Tumtum said at 9:43 PM on June 20th, 2017:

    Another great feature by Tommy boy. Lets hope INTs get covered in the next section. Probably the biggest thing holding him back as an individual last season from my perspective. It felt as though he carried himself as a vet from day one. Those INTs though..

  80. 80 Media Mike said at 8:17 AM on June 21st, 2017:

    Hopefully the INTs get cut down to 10ish and the TDs hit mid 20s.

  81. 81 John Galt said at 7:32 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Have to remember he was a rookie. Most rookie QB’s who play 16 games have as many or more INT’s than he did. Here is an article breaking them all down. I think the author is a bit generous to Wentz on some of the analysis – but there is some good perspective there.


  82. 82 Tumtum said at 10:13 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Oh yeah, I don’t think Wentz was anything short of exactly what we hoped for in his rookie season. We just need him to progress and grow as a passer. Now I will go enjoy that article, thanks!

  83. 83 DrGeniusPhD said at 2:13 AM on June 21st, 2017:

    Carson Wentz will be the league MVP this year.

  84. 84 ChoTime said at 9:59 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Pretty negative of you to imply that he won’t get it in following years as well.

  85. 85 P_P_K said at 10:08 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Hey, Doc, I agree with ChoTime. What’s with the negative attitude? What about the Super Bowl MVP?

  86. 86 Media Mike said at 1:29 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    This is a good read that should be given the title “Our RBs can’t handle the football and Kelce really really sucks!”


  87. 87 Will Ft. Daft Punk said at 4:05 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    I think some of the hand offs were on Wentz. In the Vikings game he just lost the ball. I dont think its an issue going forward.

    Kelce is just Kelce

  88. 88 CrackSammich said at 11:52 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    This season’s MM whipping boy has been chosen. Is there a number 2?

  89. 89 Stephen E. said at 3:51 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Wait a second… is this Bob McGinn guy actually complaining about Rodgers? He throws a dig in the end suggesting Rodgers hasn’t gotten it done since 2010, when they won the Super Bowl.

    So this spoiled brat expects to win the Super Bowl every season. Well excuse me, Mr. Poopy Pants, but your team has 99 problems and Aaron Rodgers ain’t one.

    Take it from a fan whose team hasn’t won it all since the Chevy 409 ruled the streets, and hasn’t had the luxury of having only TWO starting quarterbacks since 1992: YOU ARE A WHINY PRICK.

  90. 90 Sean Stott said at 4:10 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Packers fans are the worst.

  91. 91 SteveH said at 6:18 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Anyone who complains about their quarterback being Aaron Rodgers needs to take a step back and re-evaluate their whole worldview.

  92. 92 daveH said at 8:43 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Don’t we have another Reggie White to send them ?? They won despite Mike Holmgren and Andy Reid ..

  93. 93 网赚 said at 8:13 PM on June 21st, 2017:


  94. 94 bushisamoron said at 8:39 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Wentz has traits and work ethic. Thats all you can ask

  95. 95 daveH said at 8:59 PM on June 21st, 2017:

    Same with every President ever. But you obviously don’t think that is enough so you are contradicting yourself a bit. ..

  96. 96 CrackSammich said at 12:10 AM on June 22nd, 2017:

    The talk of Wentz made wonder how Goff is doing. Comparatively, I think Wentz is doing just fine.

    “Technically speaking, Jared Goff was one of the worst quarterbacks to take the field in at least the last 15 years. It didn’t matter what his circumstances was, because as this data supports, even when things where all right and set up for him to actually succeed, he failed to take advantage.

    My benchmark for his progression has remained the same all offseason — Goff will improve, but it’s basically because he can’t really get any worse. However, in no way am I expecting some miraculous turnaround and he suddenly becomes a Pro Bowl QB. As I have said before, at best we should expect to see something similar to what Case Keenum gave as the starter.

    The odd thing about all this, is Goff playing on the same level as Keenum did between 2015 and 2016, would qualify as a massive upgrade, and it’s an upgrade that any person should be happy to see.”