Dilfer Speaks + Q&A

Posted: October 31st, 2012 | Author: | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 78 Comments »

You guys asked a lot of good questions.  I’ll cover as many as I can here.  First, though…I heard ESPN analyst Trent Dilfer on the radio on Tuesday and he covered the Eagles QB situation.  Trent said that he thinks Vick played more within the system back in 2010.  He indicated that Vick was probably trying to still earn the coaches trust and was more likely to do exactly what they wanted.  Dilfer then went off on a tangent where he talked about the fact that a lot of QBs stray from the scheme as they get more comfortable.

This all sounded odd to me.  My perception is that Vick was going a lot off instinct back in 2010 and has struggled some in the last couple of years as he tried to play within the system.  Dilfer watches a ton of tape on QBs so I respect his opinion.  This isn’t Warren Sapp or Phil Simms  just throwing a theory out there for the heck of it.

I do also think that the Vikings and Antoine Winfield gave the world a gameplan for how to attack Vick in that infamous Tuesday night game.  That has had a huge impact on the past couple of seasons.

Dilfer did say that he is a huge fan of Nick Foles.  Dilfer had him rated as a 1st round prospect.  That got me to go look up some stuff.  Here is a nice set of comments…from last December.

Foles, who rewrote the Arizona passing records and some in the conference, also earned praise recently from ESPN analyst Trent Dilfer via Twitter.

Dilfer wrote, after studying nine Arizona games, that he liked Foles’ college game tapes better than those from former Oklahoma quarterback Sam Bradford, who was the first overall pick in the 2010 draft. Dilfer on Foles: “Less arm, but equal accuracy & MUCH better instincts.”

Also from Dilfer: “Foles has as good of pocket instincts & climb as any SPREAD QB I have studied the past 10 years. Doesn’t lock on #1 & bail early.”

One more from Dilfer: He said he had “NEVER seen a QB this good get LESS help from his teammates. If Foles was in the SEC he would be a Heisman finalist.”

Trent certainly got my attention.

* * * * *

Talk about CB-WR matchups.  The Eagles have generally tried to put DRC on the fastest WR.  He shadowed Torrey Smith in the BAL game.  He spent most of the time on Mike Wallace in the PIT game.  I know Nnamdi gave up the long TD to Jones on Sunday.  Problem in that game is that both Jones and White have good speed.  Jones is faster.  I didn’t keep track of who was on who more.  I did see Nnamdi covering both guys.

Do we overrate guys like DJax, Mac, Shady, Avant, and Celek?   No, I don’t think so.  Defensive coaches are scared to death of DeSean.  That’s not a guess or my opinion.  Coaches have specific gameplans to deal with his speed.  Shady is a great RB.  He hasn’t posted great numbers in the last few weeks, but he is a special player.

Avant is a good role player.  Nothing more, nothing less.

Mac and Celek are good players, but they aren’t difference makers.  I love Brent Celek to death, but he’s not a Top 10 TE.  Guys like Gronk, Graham, Vern, Witten, Gates, Gonzo, etc are in a different class.  Mac is the one player I have a hard time rating.  He’s above average, but exactly how good is still up for discussion.

One part of my point that you may have overlooked is that you have to look at these guys as a whole.  This is an outstanding set of skill players.  That doesn’t mean they’re all great.

Is Vick still an elusive QB?  Yes, absolutely.  However, he’s not the guy he used to be.  Think of him as a pitcher.  He used to throw 99 mph.  Now he’s down to 95-96.  That’s still very good, but it isn’t the same.  You can’t just throw it down the plate and blow guys away.  You must adjust.  I don’t know that Vick has fully adjusted for the decline in his skills.

As to the point about moving in the pocket…Vick has never been consistently good at that.  Some QBs can move a foot or two and totally change a play.  Vick isn’t like that.  He goes way left or right or drops back further.  He likes to operate in space, where he can run or throw.  The pocket is all about congestion.

What is Vick’s future?   Barring a great finish to 2012, he’s done as an Eagle.  He’s due big money in 2013.  The Eagles will pay it if they think he can play well enough to earn it.  Right now, that seems like a longshot.  I doubt the Eagles could deal him.  He’s got a big contract and if he’s not good enough to stick here, I doubt another team would want to pay him mega-bucks.

I do expect Mike to be starting somewhere in 2013.  He’s got some issues, but is talented and the coaches/players like him.  He’s just struggling on the field.  A new team would think he might work in their system and/or on their team.

Why can’t you sub QBs?  Tom Landry did it with Dallas in 1970.  He would have Craig Morton and Roger Staubach going in and out and in and out.  Drove both of them crazy.  The team didn’t care for it either.  QB isn’t a normal position.  It isn’t RB or WR or LB.  The QB is the team’s leader.  Must be one guy.  Teammates need to know who to look to in crucial moments.

Any chance the Eagles deal for Bryant McKinnie?  No way in heck.  He’s not in good shape.  He got benched for a reason…he’s not playing well enough.  He also is a lousy fit for Mudd’s style of blocking.

I”m sure the Eagles will work the phones to see what they can come up with.  Are there any good players to be had?

If Reid is fired, will he take a break from coaching?  Maybe.  If the Chargers can Norv Turner, which seems likely, I could see Big Red heading there ASAP.  He’s a Cali guy.  That would be a great change of scenery for him.   Reid won’t take just any job.  He’ll be picky about the team due to location and/or quality of job.

Should the Eagles have kept Asante and dealt Nnamdi?   No.  The Eagles wanted to play press coverage.  They wanted the ability to be creative with the DBs.  Asante hates to press.  He wants to be only the LCB.  Limits what you can do.  Nnamdi has been disappointing.  No one would dispute that.  Could be his final year here.

Why haven’t the Eagles given Jamaal Jackson a shot?  The Cowboys were desperate for OL help this summer and brought JamJax in for a workout.  Apparently he looked bad and was out of shape.  He battled to stay in shape back in 2008 and 2009.  I can easily imagine where he’s just not ready to go.  Plus, the Eagles really want fit OL.  That really wasn’t JamJax on a good day, let alone in 2012.

78 Comments on “Dilfer Speaks + Q&A”

  1. 1 Songbird Rescue Cat said at 2:29 AM on October 31st, 2012:


    What type of offensive scheme do you think gives the Eagles the best chance to win with Vick at QB right now? Or Monday night vs the Saints at least?

    Vick has missed open WRs in the standard vertical attack, partly due to the o-line not providing great protection. We tried a more prototypical WCO vs the Falcons and couldn’t sustain drives. Not seeing open receivers and defenders, and accuracy problems have limited Vick’s effectiveness.

    What can Marty and Andy do to get the offense scoring points vs one of the worst defenses in the league?

  2. 2 DanJ3645 said at 12:27 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Given we are in a must win situation I would like to see AR and MM implementing some more of the option runs, similar to what the Redskins have done with RG3.

    There was one play against the Falcons, in the third Qtr, where Vick gained ~4 yards. Maclin missed his block on the safety or Vick would have had space to get a big gain.

    Avant was the slot reciever on the other side of the formation. I’d have liked to have seen Maclin and him swapped. Avant being a better blocker, and the offence has already shown some good combo routes with DJax and Mac together this year.

    It sounds like AR has strongly considered benching Vick already. Might as well use Vick’s running abilities a bit more and if Vick gets hurt then he wont have to deal with any locker room issues from benching Vick.

  3. 3 Kristopher Cebula said at 2:54 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Most people will hare this question, including myself, but how about a trade for Tebow? I know it won’t happen since Tebow can’t run WCO but if the season is going to spiral down the shutter, we might as well make it interestinf

  4. 4 Steven DiLeo said at 9:11 AM on October 31st, 2012:




    Seriously, Why?

  5. 5 Kristopher Cebula said at 9:35 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    It was late at night and I thought it would be funny. get everyone all worked up

  6. 6 Alex Karklins said at 11:56 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    If you’re gonna burn this team to the ground, may as well salt the earth too.

  7. 7 Matthew Verhoog said at 11:11 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    perhaps if they would take Vicks contract, and let us have Revis, then i’d think about bringing the circus to town and hitching a ride on the Foles train.

  8. 8 Kristopher Cebula said at 11:45 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    no one would take vick’s contract, not that they’d have to. it is structured so that we can cut him after this year with minimal loss and cap penalty. he’s a goner

  9. 9 Kristopher Cebula said at 2:57 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Wow…please excuse the many type’s. for the record it’s *hate, *shitter, and *interesting

  10. 10 GermanEagle said at 9:28 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    I think the typos in your message below caused the least head scratching…

  11. 11 Steven DiLeo said at 3:03 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    His actual message is what caused the head banging

  12. 12 GermanEagle said at 3:21 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Thanks Tommy for mentioning Maclin in your latest article as I was just going to ask you for your opinion re his contract situation. While I don’t think Jeremy will go all ‘Desean’ on us in his contract year his situation earns a column of his own. To be honest he’s been highly inconsistent in the last two years, both play and injury wise, which makes it hard to believe that the Eagles will give him a lucrative contract extension. In fact if he doesn’t settle for ‘less money’ he could be out in Philly in my eyes.
    What is your take?!

  13. 13 Steven DiLeo said at 9:24 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    If Maclin wants more than $5.5 million a year, I think the Eagles should look elsewhere. Wallace and Jennings are both free agents :).

    The only benefit Maclin has is his age (and his potential). I don’t think his contract year comes till 2014, so I wouldn’t look to extend him yet. When Jackson was negotiating his contract he had already established his reputation of being a playmaker. Maclin doesn’t have that same benefit. Maclin’s new contract will be based purely on potential.

  14. 14 GermanEagle said at 9:50 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    You are right, Maclin’s signed through 2013 and with his salary (almost 3m in ’13) the Eagles are in no rush to extend him any time soon.
    Nevertheless he still remains a dissapointment to me.

  15. 15 Jeffrey Stover said at 10:04 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Shoot, I would not mind him leaving myself. I have been a BJ Cunningham fan since MSU. If they start BJ in Maclin’s spot, I would not be mad at all. I would really like for Cooper to be the next Jordy Nelson, but that may be a longshot. But that would give us some “pop” in the slot.

  16. 16 SleepingDuck said at 3:34 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    How do you feel about Geno Smith as a potential QB target for the Eagles?

  17. 17 Kevin_aka_RC said at 10:51 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    We’d have to do a “Redskins” package for this to happen.

  18. 18 Ben Hert said at 11:32 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    As sad as it is, the season is far from over, and we might not need to move up that much =(

    I don’t think Geno will command anything close to RG3 price though. He really got exposed when they faced tougher Big 12 defenses.

  19. 19 SleepingDuck said at 1:51 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    There’s currently 3 teams that have the same record or worse as us that potentially could take a qb, so we might need to put together a “Skins” package..

  20. 20 mhrinda said at 4:15 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    I dont like Mudd as the offensive line coach. He is like a speciality car you drive that you cant buy parts for once the originals break. I wish we had castillos system where you could find adequate backups in times of injury or poor play. Reynolds and any of the center backups have no right to be playing especially on a team trying to win games. Again another sign the end of Reid and Howie is near. (bye bye mudd and *** Bonus: bye awful wide 9 — another speciality scheme we dont need)

  21. 21 Ark87 said at 8:09 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Wow…Dilfer said all that BEFORE the “qb controversy” is interesting. Typically people say that sort of stuff during the controversy to whip up good television. Of course Dilfer was part of a minority of people who were high on Foles. Gruden liked him a lot…but Gruden is high on everyone.

    Hell, Andy wanted Russel Wilson and seemed stunned that Foles was any good after that first preseason game. If he can polish Foles up and make him look the the future, Andy might have stumbled onto the kid that can save his job.

    Mind you, I’m still of the opinion that if the eagles finish 9-7 with Vick, and hit Lurie’s mark on a technicality, Reid is still going to be fired. Vick is in decline, Andy needs to have a convincing plan to be MUCH better next year. If he doesn’t have that, why keep him around. I’d argue Andy has a better chance going 8-8 or even 7-9 with Foles looking like a promising rookie than going 9-7 with a Veteran in decline.

    As for possible QB targets, I at least want to see what Foles can do before we spend high round draft picks on a QB. We need an offensive tackle so bad right now. Jason Peters +stud rookie tackle, throw Herremans back in at guard across from Mathis, get Kelce back in here healthy, Shady becomes the MVP 3 straight seasons in a row.

  22. 22 Aleandro green said at 8:42 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    How do figure it could be nnamdis last year? Just curious because I would be all for that. I assumed we would be stuck with him for a while

  23. 23 Anders said at 9:14 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Nnamdi’s cap hit next year is 15 mill, but only have 4 mill in dead space, so we would save 11 mill or what is needed to franchise DRC.
    Reason I also think Vick is done here no matter what. He got 18 mill cap space, but only 7 of that is dead space, so that save us another 11 mill.

  24. 24 Steven DiLeo said at 9:53 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Even if he is the Super Bowl MVP? That’s the only way I see him staying here next year/

  25. 25 Anders said at 8:53 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Tommy, 2 things
    I think you underrate Celek. Celek have shown that when he doesnt have to block all the time, that he is one of the biggest playmakers at the TE position.
    2nd, do you have the time to look back at Foles tape and see if you can see the same thing that Difler sees?

  26. 26 Ark87 said at 9:02 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Yeah the only 2 players I put out of Celek’s league this year are Gronk and Graham. Witten and Gonzo are pretty much certain HoFers, but I feel like in 2012 Celek holds up just fine to those 2.

  27. 27 Matthew Verhoog said at 11:09 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Does Celek benefit from Djax speed keeping the safties really, really deep?

  28. 28 Ark87 said at 11:29 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    In that they get a running start on his knees?(kidding)

    There might be something to Shady keeping some in close, and Djax keeping some deep leaving a soft spot in the middle for Celek to exploit. But he still runs route good enough to beat his coverage. But his real talent is just being physical. Run into guys until they don’t want any, then hurdle them when they try to do the coward’s tackle at the knees.

    It’s possible that we (I) overvalue him as fans because we (I) love that style. I’ll admit that most if not all of the TE’s on Tommy’s list are better. But only 2 are in a different league in my opinion.

  29. 29 Steven DiLeo said at 9:10 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    I think Andy, Vick, Nnamdi and some older players like Babin, Cole, and Jenkins are gone unless there is some major resurgence in the 2nd half of the season.

    I’m sort of apathetic about this season. If we miss the playoffs, I won’t mind since this team will be heading in a new direction after this season. If they make they the playoffs and go on a deep run, I will be happy since I’m an Eagles fan.

    This team needs a new defensive philosophy since Cole, Babin and Nnamdi have clearly slowed down. Guys like Hunt, Graham, Curry, Allen, and Hughes need to step up.

    If the Eagles do change their defensive philosophy next season (like switching to a 3-4 or abandoning the wide-9), I wonder what this means for our young players like Graham and Cox who are built for this system.

    I hate the comparisons to the NY Giants. They are an enigma. You can’t relate to that team because their model is not similar to other championship teams.

  30. 30 Ark87 said at 9:32 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Cox could be a very good 3-4 DE. I think curry could be good ok across from him. We don’t have anyone who would be a good NT, Pat would be our closest thing but I don’t even know if he’d be serviceable. Our LB corps is already low on talent to fill out 3-4 LB scheme. Maybe some of our DE’s could be outside LB’s in a 3-4. Kendricks comes from a 3-4 defense, but Demeco was underwhelming in the 3-4.

    Some pieces would fit nicely…but for the most point it will be square pegs in round holes in the front 7 I think.

  31. 31 Kristopher Cebula said at 11:50 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    it would take a season or 2 for us to transition to a 3-4. I think that graham and cole could easily be outside backers in a 3-4. we could draft a nose tackle, even though qb would probably be our first pick, provided big red is gone. coaches generally want to draft their own guy. cox could be a de. maybe thorton as well? not sure. cullen jenkins could also probably be ok as a 3-4 de. we’d need a few inside linebackers. kendricks might be ok there. not sure about ryans. casey matthews might also be ok inside in the 3-4. we probably have some players to do it but next year would definitely be a transition year

  32. 32 Ark87 said at 12:08 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Cullen was the packer’s DE when they won the superbowl, so that should be natural. Thornton might be very good there as well, he’s a pretty “sleek” guy.

  33. 33 Mac said at 1:48 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    But can Thornton bend the way a DE has to? I remember reading here that Tommy thought Fletch can do it…

  34. 34 Ark87 said at 2:13 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    I’m not sure. I’ve seen people say that Fletch could play DE even in a 4-3. In a 3-4 where the DE is plugging up/rushing the B gap typically, I don’t know that they need to bend as well as an edge rusher. I’m no expert though, as I’ve confessed before, I’m especially a novice when it comes to the 3-4. What I do know is that Ced will do anything to get on the field. I could see him begging coaches to try him at NT. Good kid.

  35. 35 Mac said at 2:48 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    I agree, I see him as the kind of blue collar NFLer that most fans enjoy. Its been nice seeing him develop and also notch his first sack.

  36. 36 Anders said at 12:40 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Ryans wasnt underwhelming, he just wasnt healthy.

  37. 37 eagles2zc said at 1:36 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Seattle’s D is a 4-3/3-4 hybrid and they are doing pretty well. Part of it’s success is due to showing the QB different looks before the snap. Chris Clemons plays a joker in that system and I think some of our DE can fit into that role as well.

  38. 38 austinfan said at 3:39 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Cox and Thornton can play in any system, Cox weighed in at the combine at 298 lbs 3 months after his 21st birthday, he should fill out some more, Thornton is 6-3 and about 310 lbs, Curry was 6’3 268 lbs at the combine, he could go down to 260 lbs for 3-4 OLB or 275 lbs for DE, Graham is similar. So they have a core of young DL that can fit different systems.

  39. 39 bdbd20 said at 9:19 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    I’d really like to see the team make a play for Carolina’s Steve Smith. I always thought that having a guy with his toughness and leadership would be a great asset. Not sure what his value is worth in a trade.

  40. 40 ACViking said at 9:20 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Re: Alternating Cowboys


    Slight edit. Landry alternated Staubach and Morton in 1971 — with the scheme’s apogee coming in a game 7 loss to the Bears, when they alternated every play, that left the ‘Boys at 4-3.

    After that loss, Landry went with Staubach, and Dallas won its last 7 consecutive regular season games and 3 playoff games — by an average of 17 points — to become SB champs.

  41. 41 Mac said at 9:23 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Sometimes I miss Morton…

  42. 42 ACViking said at 9:28 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Any word as to what happened?

    I don’t remember a “spurned lovers” note from him.

  43. 43 A_T_G said at 10:09 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    I am pretty sure Morton was a persona created by Joe Banner to try to turn the hearts and minds of the fanbase against Andy as a grass roots prong of his efforts in their power struggle.

    Once the battle was lost, Morton faded away.

  44. 44 TommyLawlor said at 9:50 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    We all miss Morton. Don’t know what happened to him. He’s all good in my book.

  45. 45 Steven DiLeo said at 9:52 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Morton was right this whole time and we were too ignorant to listen to his wisdom.

  46. 46 Arby1 said at 9:39 AM on November 1st, 2012:

    Hmmm. Suddenly I need to know his thoughts on the Mayan calendar!

  47. 47 Insler said at 7:50 AM on November 1st, 2012:

    Morton said after the last Superbowl that he was tired of NFL and the way the playoff/Superbowl reflect the actual best teams of the league. He also said that he would “review” the Eagles draft and then would “retire” from posting. You can check it out in his comments after the last Superbowl.

  48. 48 Insler said at 7:59 AM on November 1st, 2012:

    Morton said after the last Superbowl that he was tired of NFL and the
    way the playoff/Superbowl reflect the actual best teams of the league.
    He also said that he would “review” the Eagles draft and then would
    “retire” from posting. You can check it out in his comments after the
    last Superbowl.

  49. 49 Mac said at 10:35 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Of the current 32 NFL HCs where does Andy Reid rank?

  50. 50 Jeppe Elmelund van Ee said at 12:30 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    10-15th I think…

  51. 51 Mac said at 3:09 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    That’s what makes it so hard for me to think about replacing Reid. Then again if he is close to 15 perhaps that makes him “mediocre” at this point and in need of being replaced.

  52. 52 Steven DiLeo said at 4:27 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    He has missed the playoffs 3 times in the past 7 years and has only won 3 playoff games in that span. His winning % in those 7 years is 55% which averages up to 9 wins a season for the past 7 seasons.

    He hasn’t been anything special since his superbowl run. The Giants were ready to can Coflin last year despite winning a Super Bowl in 07′. Reid has less room for argument.

  53. 53 Mac said at 9:47 AM on November 1st, 2012:

    All good points. It’s not SB or bust for me… I do want to see the team be competitive and make the playoffs lets say 70-75% of the time. I’m definitely along lines of believe you have to get in to have a shot at winning, but the actual outcome of the playoffs is a bit of a crap shoot between matchups, injuries, coaching, a little luck, and obviously player performance individually and as a team. I feel like Reid gets us invited to the dance frequently (though not as often as I’d like as you pointed out he’s been at 57% over the last 7 years). Some sentimental part of me just feels like the Eagles “should have” won a SB during his time here.

  54. 54 Ark87 said at 10:42 AM on October 31st, 2012:

    Sources say we are sticking with Vick this week. http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast. I like Graz, has a pretty good handle on things. Pretty good article outside the apparent news.

  55. 55 Mac said at 12:06 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Andy believes this team is better than mediocre… well this game has mediocrity on the line, win and get to 4-4 lose and we’ll be at 3-5. Under what circumstances can the team lose on Monday and Vick remains the starter?

    This should be a pressure packed game for Vick. He has to find a way to win.

  56. 56 DanJ3645 said at 12:21 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Vick gets shaken up on a play. Foles gets concussion from a double A gap blitz on the next??

    Or we lose a shoot out where the D from last weekend turns up………

  57. 57 Mac said at 1:49 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Hmm, not enjoying either of those nightmare scenarios.

  58. 58 austinfan said at 12:07 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Foles was a projection pick, not just a spread, but he showed at the Senior Bowl he wasn’t ready to be a NFL QB. In preseason he showed off his field vision, his accuracy, his arm strength on the short throws, and a mechanical flaw on the long throws. Frankly, I don’t think he’s capable of making a throw over 30 yards on a consistent basis, but since those throws are about 2-3% of all throws for NFL QBs (and many in desperation situations), that’s a minor flaw.

    He’s actually far more suited to what AR used to do, and what he was planning to do with Kolb, than Vick. Foles in many ways is a bigger, stronger and less mobile version of Kolb with a slightly better arm. He got a lot of practice throwing under pressure at Arizona, one advantage of playing with inferior talent (and it is an advantage, college QBs on top teams may see a defense that matches up physically twice a year at best).

    Foles could succeed, but MM would have to throw away about 1/3 of his playbook, all the sprint roll outs, deep routes, etc. On the other hand, simplifying the playbook and focusing on executing the bread and butter plays may be exactly what this offense needs. AR/MM are like a boxer who want to show off how fast and clever he is, and looks shocked when he gets punched in the nose. While deception is part of the game, football is still about imposing your physical will on the other team.

  59. 59 shah8 said at 1:26 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    The main reason Foles is a third round prospect is because he is a statue. Sam Bradford was a first round pick because he *can* run, and more importantly, he can throw on the run.

    I hate hearing that Foles isn’t capable of consistently making throws over 30 yards. That probably means he can’t throw outs with good zip to well covered receivers or anything like that. The Christian Ponder Experience has given me a very pure loathing of QBs like that. If you round it all up, you’re basically telling me that we’re not going to see a QB much better than Mike Kafka. Taller, somewhat better arm–but still backup material, through and through. I hope you’re wrong about the arm.

  60. 60 GermanEagle said at 2:13 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    I am afraid that in terms of arm strength, we won’t see any QB after Vick any time soon. Unless we will roll the dice on Geno Smith…

  61. 61 austinfan said at 3:34 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Foles can throw the outs and most of the NFL throws, he just has problems throwing the deep ball, he’s got good zip on those 20 yard throws, so he can throw it into a tight window, I’m not sure it’s arm strength or mechanics on the long ball.

    I’d say his arm might be a notch below Eli and Brady, but it’s much better than Kafka. Schaub is a good comparison.

    The mobility is limited, but he has a good feel for pressure, and a big body which will allow him to shrug off pass rushers as he fills out, much like Eli does.

  62. 62 Arby1 said at 3:58 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    “he has a good feel for pressure,” this, combined with Dilfer’s comment: ” “Foles has as good of pocket instincts & climb as any SPREAD QB I have studied the past 10 years.” plus what I saw in preseason make me think of Big Ben. Also, it seemed like AR and MM were constantly complimenting him for taking hits and getting back up, that he was a tough guy, also like Ben R. Anybody else see this comparison?

  63. 63 Mac said at 4:18 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Not sure I saw ability to extend plays like Ben Roethlisberger. But Foles was impressive at getting back up and moving to the next play… maybe comparable to Eli’s ability to take a hit and keep going?

  64. 64 Arby1 said at 10:19 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    I’m thinking of the bomb to Demaris and a few other plays that were just scrambles and find a open guy. The pocket presence, ability to take a hit and extend plays if necessary, not to mention his size, make me think of Big Ben.

  65. 65 Mac said at 9:41 AM on November 1st, 2012:

    Yeah, I see the logic in that now.

  66. 66 phillychuck said at 5:32 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    “The main reason Foles is a third round prospect is because he is a statue. Sam Bradford was a first round pick because he *can* run, and more importantly, he can throw on the run.”

    I’m sorry, that’s just plain false. Foles is agile in the pocket, he ran a sub-5.00 second 40, and he throws very well on the run. Look at his Arizona highlights–his O-line was such a sieve he was on the run more than he wasn’t, and he set the PAC-10 record for just about every passing category, including completion percentage. He’s not Vick, but he’s not a statue, either.

  67. 67 shah8 said at 7:35 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    No…the Arizona games I saw, incidentally, features Foles taking sacks–as in he was quite easy to catch. He’s not elusive in the pocket. Moves around, yes, slides inside, yes, but he’s really not Big Ben, at least in college. I was surprised when he moved as well as he did in preseason, but that’s PRESEASON.

  68. 68 Rogersnh4 said at 2:26 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Assuming that this is Vick’s last year, is there any way that Jerry Jones doesn”t sign him? Isn’t it almost inevitable?

  69. 69 Mac said at 2:52 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Golly, I would think that some other team would be in more dire need… or possibly just want ticket sales. My prediction would be that Jerry would sit tight with Romo.

  70. 70 A_T_G said at 4:25 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Besides, Vick seems to have sincerely changed his former criminal ways. I’m not sure he would fit in on the Cowboys any more.

  71. 71 BobSmith77 said at 2:30 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Say Vick is topping out more at 92-93. I have seen him get caught a few times in the open field from behind which never used to happen and get stuck by a LB/S in the open field one-on-one. Hits seem like they really have taken a total on him already this year & playing the flak jacket limits his speed a bit.

  72. 72 BobSmith77 said at 2:38 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Maclin is the toughest guy to figure out on this team. Certainly doesn’t suffer from a lack of opportunity (46 balls thrown his way this year) but he seems to disappear for prolonged stretches, make some critical mistakes (that was the main knock on him at Mizzou), and hasn’t seen to progress like I thought he might this year.

    Seemingly topped out at a guy who will catch 60-70 balls, 800-900 yards, and 5-6 TDs. Not bad numbers but in a pass-friendly offense that looks to throw the ball down the field those aren’t standout numbers either given how many times he is targeted.

  73. 73 Cal Setar said at 2:52 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    I don’t think we can accurately gauge Maclin’s ceiling yet. Mystery illnesses and mediocre QB/O-line play can really put a damper on your ability to put up big numbers.

    I agree though that he’s seemed to wilt in critical situations. Unfortunate coincidence or symptom of something greater?

  74. 74 BobSmith77 said at 2:45 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Here a question I got asked – Williams and Barnett or Jackson and Maclin? I would take the later hands down but I don’t think the gap was as wide people would think it is especially before Barnett blew out his knee in ’93.

    Biggest difference is Jackson’s raw speed and big play capability but Jackson is also kind of a nonfactor in the red zone due to his size and route running. Maclin is a better version of Williams but still more of a possession-type receiver.

  75. 75 Mac said at 2:49 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Off topic, I’d love to see what Maclin could do in the slot if we had a good big body receiver opposite Jackson.

  76. 76 A_T_G said at 4:29 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    I am excited that the game is Monday night this week, I might get power restored by Monday.

  77. 77 ceteris_paribus1776 said at 5:45 PM on October 31st, 2012:

    Jackson has speed, but isn’t a terrifict “football player.” He’s not a guy you build your offense around because he can be taken way. Maclin, as Tommy said, “is above average.” He’s just another guy out there 90%of the time. Basically, these guys are a great and avg #2 WR, respectively.

    You don’t “need” an elite #1, but you damn sure better be able to run the ball or have a QB that lifts the rest of the offense up. We have neither because of Vick and the Oline.

    I think Vicks poor play and terrible Oline must be factored in when talking about talent. That’s why this team isn’t overly talented, and what talent they do have is limited. If they don’t ride Shady or protect Vick, their skill players aren’t elite enough to get the job done.

  78. 78 mhrinda said at 12:41 PM on November 1st, 2012:

    Good addon to my previous post: