More Help for the Defense?

Posted: March 14th, 2014 | Author: | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 189 Comments »

The Eagles have had a busy week so far, adding 5 new players and re-signing Donnie Jones. There is still more work to be done. I know some of you would still like impact additions, but I’m just not sure those players are available, if they ever were. The players that are available are more of the “solid” variety than the star variety. That’s not bad news, though. The right “solid” player can still offer impact.

Think back to last year. Was Danny Woodhead coveted? He had a huge year for the Chargers. Even King Dunlap played well for them. The Eagles got a steal in Connor Barwin, who I think was disappointed in how little interest he drew. Mike Mitchell turned out to be a great signing for the Panthers. I don’t think anyone made a fuss over Karlos Dansby going back to Arizona. He had a monster year for them.

Peter King had Paul Kruger as his #2 overall free agent. He had 4.5 sacks for the Browns. He was kind of their Connor Barwin, but not as good in coverage. WR Mike Wallace was #5 on the list. The Dolphins signed him to a bad deal and now can’t wait to get rid of him. Arguably the fastest man in the NFL averaged just 12.7 yards per catch. Greg Jennings was ranked 9th. He was 68-804-4 for the Vikings, hardly the impact they hoped for. Remember how Steven Jackson was going go be the missing piece for the Falcons? And so on.

Let’s look at the Eagles depth chart on defense right now.

DE Fletcher Cox …….. Vinny Curry
NT Bennie Logan …….. * damion square
DE Cedric Thornton ….. * joe kruger
RLB Trent Cole ……….. Brandon Graham
ILB Mychal Kendricks … Najee Goode
ILB DeMeco Ryans ……. Jake Knott / Jason Phillips
LLB Connor Barwin …… * Bryan Braman / Travis Long
SS * Earl Wolff ………….. Keelan Johnson
FS Malcolm Jenkins ….. Chris Maragos
CB Cary Williams ……. Roc Carmichael
CB Bradley Fletcher …. Nolan Carroll
NB Brandon Boykin

I put an asterisk beside the spots where the Eagles feel weakest. I think they need a veteran DL, whether a NT or DE. They don’t want to look for both spots in the draft. I don’t trust Square or Kruger as a top backup right now. Those guys might have great summers, but I think they need competition.

OLB needs help, whether in the form of a starter on the right side or a top backup for either side.

S is the one spot where the Eagles could still add a starter. I think Wolff could handle the job, but I’d like to add someone there to really challenge him. In my ideal world, the Eagles would add a veteran and still look for a Safety in the draft.

Let’s look at some of the Safeties left on the market and who could be of interest. First, what are the Eagles looking for? They added Malcolm Jenkins who is more of a cover Safety so I’m guessing they would like to add a bigger guy who can be more of a run-stuffer. We know the Eagles like players from successful teams. Who might fit?

* Nate Allen – I know many of you hate the thought of this. He’s not the physical S that I’m guessing they prefer, but he does know the system and the coaches know him. There is something to be said for continuity. As the old saying goes, sometimes the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t. Allen made big strides from 2012 to 2013. If the Eagles bring him back it will be because they feel he can improve even more. If they pass, they may feel he’s never going to develop the way they originally wanted.

* Chris Clemons – There were rumors yesterday that the Eagles had signed the veteran from the Dolphins. Those turned out to be bogus rumors. I watched tape and Clemons would be a slight upgrade on Allen, but not much more. He’s just a so-so player. In 48 career starts, he has 1.5 sacks, 4 INTs and 2 FFs. Heck, Nate Allen has better stats. Certainly not a player I’d be excited by, but he is a functional starter.

* James Ihedigbo – Very interesting guy. He’s played for the Jets, Pats and Ravens. First came on my radar when watching a preseason game between the Eagles and Jets. He played very well. It was against 2nd and 3rd stringers,  but he was still impressive. Never started for the Jets. Did for the Pats in 2011 and the Ravens last year. Posted very good numbers. Had 11 pass deflections, 3 INTs and 2 FFs. Put on the tape and you see a physical Safety. Has good size at 6-1, 214. Downhill player who loves to attack the ball. Good blitzer. I saw him knock over the RT for the Steelers on a play. Good run defender who is at home playing in the box. Has limited cover skills. Is too upright in his backpedal and has to really play back off guys in deep coverage. The only downside is that he’s 30. Sign him to a short, cheap deal and could make some sense as a band-aid player to use while young guys develop.

* Major Wright – I haven’t had a chance to watch tape on him. Wright lists at 5-11, 204 and I don’t know if the Eagles want a guy with that build or if they prefer someone bigger. The big question with Wright is why the Bears are so un-interested in a productive young player who wouldn’t cost that much to keep. He turns 26 this summer and has started the past 3 years for them. Their hesitance in keeping him makes me nervous since Safety isn’t a strong spot for them.

Out of these players, Ihedigbo makes the most sense. The problem is his age, although that may not be a big deal if they see him as someone to start for a year or two and help Earl Wolff develop. Reports yesterday said the Lions were very close to signing Ihedigbo so he might not be on the market, although there hasn’t been much talk since those reports came out.

Things have been silent in regard to Nate Allen. I go back and forth on whether I’d rather keep him or sign Clemons. Allen offers continuity. Clemons is more physical.

There are no guarantees the Eagles will add a Safety, but it still feels like too weak of a position. I think adding one here and in the draft is the smart way to go. Don’t put all your eggs in one basket.

* * * * *

I’ll cover the DL targets in the next day or two. Many of you want to know about interest in Vince Wilfork. I have very mixed feelings there. If he was willing to sign a 1-year deal, maybe. My guess is that he’ll go somewhere he’s got a connection and hope to finish out his career in that spot. I don’t see the Eagles wanting him for multiple years.


189 Comments on “More Help for the Defense?”

  1. 1 nicolajNN said at 8:41 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Oh boy Tommy, you should hide and find shelter somewhere, you’ve made a grave mistake, all hell will break loose…

    You didn’t list Acho anywhere! How could you forget future hall of fame linebacker Emmanuel Acho

  2. 2 Dominik said at 10:24 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I can life with Acho, but Matthews? I don’t even want to know you anymore, Thomas!

  3. 3 Chiptomylou said at 8:41 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I’d probably be OK with resigning Nate Allen to a one year deal…see if he gives it his all in camp with some healthy competition from Jenkins and Wolff. Not to mention the inevitable safety they will draft. Think he’d resign for 2-3 mill? Not sure what his price range would be.

  4. 4 doudigdoug said at 10:38 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I like the idea of re-signing Allen to a multi-year team friendly deal without much guaranteed. This would give us the flexibility to cut him after a year or, if he has a good year and continues to improve, to keep him at a reasonable price based on his current worth. I haven’t seen much buzz on Allen, so he may not have much leverage at this point.

  5. 5 Dominik said at 10:43 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    One interesting point would be: can Ihedigbo or Clemons play good ST? We know Jenkins can, Wolff can, so we could life with a #2/#3 guy who can’t, but I don’t think you want a DB back-up on your roster that can’t contribute on ST. Also: the Safety we draft would have to be able to play ST.

    Carroll, for instance, is (apparently) a good ST player. Kelly and Roseman value that and I understand that.

  6. 6 Tumtum said at 12:58 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I *think* Ihedigbo is a Quintin Mikel type with the STs.

  7. 7 Dominik said at 1:12 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    If that’s the case: sign him, Howie!

  8. 8 eagleyankfan said at 8:42 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Allen made strides — blah blah blah. Continuity — blah blah blah. Then you go on to say Clemons would be a slight up grade over Allen … but end with “Certainly not a player I’d be excited by, but he is a functional starter.” If you say Clemons is an upgrade over Allen and you wouldn’t be excited to bring him here — why in the world would you want Allen back? This doesn’t make any sense. Why isn’t this clear to anyone? IF Chip thought there was any value — any whatsoever — why didn’t they sign him already even if it was for a bag of peanuts? Second point — Allen went from one system to the next and “made strides” — I’m not saying I want him — but wouldn’t you assume that Clemons would “make strides” as well in a new system?

  9. 9 Cafone said at 9:50 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Because you need backups too. Why isn’t that obvious? Right now if either Wolff or Jenkins get hurt we would be starting… Bryan Braman?

    One more FA safety, hopefully a draft pick, and then we would have 4 safeties + Braman who is really just a ST specialist.

  10. 10 Dominik said at 10:26 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I think you mean Maragos. You have to love Braman already, but he’s not a safety. Like Chung. 😀

  11. 11 eagleyankfan said at 10:49 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    The point is — Chip wanted Cooper. Signed. Chip wanted Mac — signed. Chip did not want Avant — not signed. Chip signed the players he wanted to retain. IF(huge if) Allen showed any promise, wouldn’t Chip signed him by now? Eagles could sign Allen for 40 bucks a week and Allen would take it. Back up or water boy — Allen isn’t worth 40 bucks.

  12. 12 Ig_l said at 11:55 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    The longer a free agent is on the street the cheaper he becomes. If you go look at a used car and offer something on the spot you’re going to pay more than if you walk away and let the seller call YOU.

    Players aren’t just worth signing or not worth signing. They are worth signing at a certain price. Allen has value at a below-average-starter price. The longer he goes unsigned, the cheaper he will be.

  13. 13 Baloophi said at 12:32 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    At least a used car can hit something.

  14. 14 bill said at 12:38 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    My friend’s 1980 Renault begged to differ.
    The amount of time I spent working on that piece of dung just to get it out of the driveway on a regular basis. To this day, Renault is a euphemism in common speech for us: “Look out for that dog Renault lying in the grass!”

  15. 15 Tumtum said at 12:57 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Car analogies are getting a bunch of run around here these days.

    I still hate mine.

  16. 16 A Roy said at 3:41 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    That would be true, but the demand for cars may just exceed the cars available. IN which case, it becomes a seller’s market again.

  17. 17 Tumtum said at 12:56 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    That is a little harsh don’t you think. There are minimum wage laws to adhere to, you know?

  18. 18 Jerry Pomroy said at 11:22 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    No offense but Braman is the OLB/STer they signed. Maragos is the FS/ST Ace.

  19. 19 Cafone said at 11:56 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    thanks 😉 noted.

  20. 20 Tumtum said at 9:53 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Neither guy is exciting but they would fill a hole. IMO try for something else. Doesn’t seem to be any race to get either of them signed.

  21. 21 Ben Hert said at 12:21 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    “Neither guy is exciting but they would fill a hole.”

    That’s what she said? Sorry, I had to.

  22. 22 Dominik said at 12:28 PM on March 14th, 2014:

  23. 23 Ben Hert said at 12:06 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    You can blah blah blah continuity and improvement all you want, but they’re important factors that matter. If you have a guy who showed glimpses of being a good safety, and is showing improvement in a new scheme, why get rid of him when you can get him for cheap? Along the same lines, it was pretty obvious that the guys on our defense became much better as they grew comfortable in the scheme. Why would you bring in a marginal upgrade that would take time to adjust to the system when you have a guy with potential sitting on your roster already (technically FA, but resigning for cheap same thing)? Its one thing when you’re talking first tier players, but these guys aren’t that.

  24. 24 Jerry Pomroy said at 12:17 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    But they also had Allen lined up deeper to give him time to react, keep the play in front of him & that is what basically helped to improve his tackling angles. Maybe they don’t want to have to keep scheming to cover up deficiencies and would rather have someone that is just a little bit better at the little things. Not dismissing a return of Allen, but Davis did respond to the improved safety play stating that they were playing them to keep the plays in front of them and that had helped them out.

  25. 25 Ben Hert said at 12:21 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I kinda thought that’s just how we played in the secondary. Our corners did the same thing, so I figured it was more to limit RAC than to cover a deficiency.

  26. 26 Jerry Pomroy said at 12:37 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Yes & no. Our CBs are solid tacklers, so you could gamble a bit more with them in coverage & play press man. Which they did more of as the season wore on. The safeties however, is a bit different story. They played off a bit more to not only give them an edge from getting beat over top, but also to enable them to react & line up their targets under more control without whiffing. So different reasons to come to same result. I’m not against Allen coming back. I just think it’s a possibility they want someone a bit more rounded to play opposite Jenkins, because as he’ll have a ton of responsibility, puts more responsibility on the other safety to be able to function independently.

  27. 27 Ben Hert said at 1:44 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I think that’s a fair point. After essentially replacing Colt and Coleman, it looks like Chip isn’t afraid to get rid of guys who are here for an upgrade. Especially one who isn’t a ST rockstar.

  28. 28 Anders said at 8:49 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    To be honest, the only “veteran” DL I would want is Terrance Cody. I know he isnt great, but he has all the talent and size you want, he just needs to get in better shape.
    I guy who hasnt been talked about much for us in the draft is Ra’shade Hageman, but he just screams Chip Kelly type player.

  29. 29 pjcostello said at 9:25 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    One of the major mock drafts have him going to the Eagles at 22, but I don’t know… should a ‘project’ player be your first round pick? Should that pick be a bona-fide starter?

  30. 30 Ben Hert said at 10:51 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I think once you get past the 15-18 range (purely subjective, of course) its acceptable to go with projects, assuming tremendous upside.

  31. 31 Anders said at 1:53 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    There is no bona-fide starter at 22 unless you get super lucky.

  32. 32 Anthony Hart said at 9:39 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    He’d be wasted in our 2 gap system. He’s got great burst, needs to be somewhere that lets him attack.

  33. 33 Anders said at 1:53 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    We do not only 2 gap. Cox did plenty of 1 gapping last year.

    Hageman also have great power to 2 gap. I think you are underselling if one only think he is a pure 1 gap player like Donald

  34. 34 Anthony Hart said at 1:37 AM on March 15th, 2014:

    I don’t think he’s a pure 1 gap like Donald, but he’s not worth the resources of a first round pick to play NT in a 2 gap system. Plus the team thinks highly of Bennie. He’s our NT and that’s probably fine. He played well outside of the Saints game that people trash him for because Chip Wagon posted like 4 screenshots. Bennie’s a great player to have as a starter, I look forward to his progress in year 2.

  35. 35 Anders said at 11:35 AM on March 15th, 2014:

    I want him to play both nt and de

  36. 36 Tumtum said at 9:50 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Fat and lazy. Don’t seem like Chip Kelly traits to me. For Cody that is.

  37. 37 Anders said at 1:55 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Maybe Azzinaro can light a fire under his ass? Been fat can be helped if he comes to a team who focus a lot on nutrition and lazy might be helped if he wasnt overweight (I wouldnt call Cody lazy, but more inconsistency coming from too much weight)

  38. 38 A Roy said at 3:38 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son.

  39. 39 Jerry Pomroy said at 11:17 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I’m not sure that’s a route I’d go with either. We already have 3 good young starters on our line (Hagemann), as well as 3 guys that can come in and be pass rushers in sub packages in Cole, Graham & Curry (Cody). The only way I see Hagemann is if they want him at NT, and use Logan as a rotational guy that can play all three spots. But they’ve also gone on record saying they like Benny at NT & want him to add more weight. It’s possible, but I personally don’t think it’s the right move when you have a definitive need for a pass rushing ROLB smacking you in the face.

  40. 40 Anders said at 1:52 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    The only 2 sure things we have right now is Cox and Thornton.

    Square is a camp body, Kruger is un known, Curry is only a nickle rusher, Logan is a question mark. Not sure what Cole and Graham have anything to do with wanting depth at NT.

    I know there is a need for an OLB, but there is a great chance OLB would be a huge reach at 22.

  41. 41 D3FB said at 2:47 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I like Hageman, but I just don’t see where he fits into our scheme. He’s got a great explosion and power, but doesn’t play with pad level. He turns 24 in August. With his height and inability to stay low I don’t think he projects at nose. He has a much lower floor than either of our starting ends, and probably equal ceiling to Cox, and would only be a slight improvement over Thorton. I just can’t see using pick 22 on a guy that would only be a marginal improvement over our current starters if he completely pans out. I think his best use is a 5 tech in a one gap scheme ala JJ Watt.

  42. 42 Anders said at 3:06 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I clearly see Hageman’s ceiling as higher than you. 24 is the edge for what I think first rounders can be, but I of course prefer them much younger.

  43. 43 D3FB said at 3:26 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I think he’s got a very high ceiling but he’s also got a pretty low basement. He’s actually older than Cox. Given the fact that he’s a bit on the older side and he is still so raw, I think the best fit for him is in a one gap scheme.

  44. 44 Mike Roman said at 8:59 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I liked the Carroll signing a lot. We didn’t upgrade the CB position as I had hoped, but he does add depth and competition for Fletcher and Williams. I feel a lot more comfortable with him coming off the bench over Carmichael.

    Assuming Dix and Pryor are long gone by #22, I’d like some veteran competition for Wolff and that’s why I’d be okay bringing back Allen. Hopefully Wolff would win that job and develop, but if not Allen is functional.

    At this point we’re going to have to add outside linebacker depth in the draft. I’d still be interested in somebody like Rob Jackson but I don’t know what the Eagles think of him.

  45. 45 Tumtum said at 9:46 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    If we assume Wolfe will eventually be able to start (or a yet undrafted rookie), and another guy signed this off season would just be 1-2 year filler, why not James Ihedigbo over Allen? He will be better in the short term. I have a feeling he is probably asking for a bunch of money though.

    Hate to just always agree with Tommy… but I think hes got me hook line and sinker on this one.

  46. 46 Mike Roman said at 9:57 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I don’t like Ihedigbo because I can’t pronounce his names. I do better with one and two syllable words.

    I’m only half kidding.

  47. 47 Dominik said at 10:29 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Eagles should have signed Michael Hoomanawanui. Just to do you a favour.

  48. 48 A Roy said at 11:00 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Is Manu Tuiasosopo too old?

  49. 49 Tumtum said at 11:28 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    There are like 50 Tuiasosopos. Lets find one.

  50. 50 Jerry Pomroy said at 11:01 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Hoo Man I Wanna…

  51. 51 Mike Roman said at 11:06 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I wonder if Donald Igwebuike can still kick?

  52. 52 Corry said at 9:03 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    What’s the word on O’Brien Schofield? I know the Giants failed his physical, but for whatever reason, those things seem to be a bit more subjective than you would think. What made him fail the physical? Anyone know?

  53. 53 eagleyankfan said at 9:17 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    a la Saffold? It does make you wonder about these physicals…

  54. 54 D3FB said at 2:41 PM on March 14th, 2014:

  55. 55 eagleyankfan said at 2:57 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Good stuff!!! TY.

  56. 56 Dominik said at 10:31 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Damn it, I loved that signing for that kind of money – for the Giants.

    Have to admit that I don’t know him, but there wasn’t a writer I read that liked this move.

  57. 57 D3FB said at 2:41 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Here’s a great article that explains the whole physical process:

  58. 58 Rage114 said at 9:12 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I don’t think the long term answer is available in FA for the other safety spot. Therefore, I would vote to resign Allen (let him and Wolff battle for the spot) and then use a high draft pick to be the long term solution. And if the draft pick beats out those other players, even better. Does Allen play ST?

  59. 59 Corry said at 9:23 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I recall Allen being out there a few times, but I don’t have anything to backup that up other than memory, so sketchy at best.

    I also don’t think the Eagles think the long term answer is in FA either with the way they’re playing it at any position. Almost all of their signings the past two years have been midlevel guys with very team friendly deals.

  60. 60 pjcostello said at 9:24 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Jason Phillips is an OLB, not an ILB.

  61. 61 Patrick said at 9:31 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    No, he is an ILB in a 34 defense.

  62. 62 Tumtum said at 9:41 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    James Ihedigbo very interesting. For some reason going into this I didn’t even think of him as an option. He played pretty darn well for the Ravens last season. He isn’t a top of the line guy and will certainly make some mistakes in coverage. iirc he had some issues with penalties. Some of which seemed bogus. Listened to his player’s show a number of times and he seems like DeMeco type, perhaps not as vocal. Sounds like a guy who expects a lot from himself, and others.

  63. 63 ICDogg said at 11:43 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I hear he’s signing with the Lions

  64. 64 Tumtum said at 12:50 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Probably better than Delmas too… Damn Lions.

  65. 65 austinfan said at 9:44 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Stockpile lots of fast, athletic guys with work ethics, coach ’em hard and hope you unearth a couple gems. Outside of one or two high priced FAs, that’s the best way to go in the offseason, from street free agents, third tier FAs and the draft. Which is what the Eagles are doing.

    For every player who comes into the league like Venus on the half shell, with ocean foam and spotlights glaring, there are a half dozen who take 2-3 years to develop and “surprise” the media pundits and fans but not the coaches. A lot of times a player is simply stuck, Maragos could be a great FS but on Seattle he’s never going to get a chance barring major injury. Sometimes a player is raw coming out of college and needs a few years to learn how to play the game.

    The reality is that 2nd tier free agents won’t sign with you to be backups for backup money, and you can’t pay a starter’s salary with a FA premium for your 3rd safety or CB or backup OLB. Which means that good teams end up signing one or two starters and the rest 3rd tier FAs, because there just aren’t that many FAs who are under 30 years old and much better than the starters you have on the roster (it doesn’t make sense to overpay for a marginal improvement when you’re happy with the guy you already have).

    Now if I were an Oakland fan, I’d be upset at a FO that let a young OT leave, and is signing 30+ year old washed up players when they need a major rebuild and should have focused on youth. As an Eagle fan I’m happy, they’re building young, athletic depth, upgrading STs, and filling every hole going into the draft so they can go BPA.

    Howie isn’t done, I’m sure he wants to move Graham once the remaining edge rushers are gone and teams get desperate, he wants to add more athletic depth players, maybe some competition at K. No major moves, because there’s no one out there worth it. Rather, at this point you’re looking to improve competition for the back of the roster.

  66. 66 Tumtum said at 9:49 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    As an Eagles fan it is nice to see the birds execute their strategy. The Redskins appear to be attempting to get it right and do the same thing. The problem with them is that they are completely ignoring their biggest needs in the secondary and guys just keep falling of the list. They are going to get to the draft and make need picks with what few picks they do have. #Teamcan’tgetright

  67. 67 Jerry Pomroy said at 10:50 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Skins problem was that they put all their eggs into one basket w/ RG3. Then had nothing left to utilize to build around him (no picks, no cap space) & he ends up getting injured in the process. Kinda like having a house in need of repair on a limited budget. So you take out a line of credit on the house and buy a fancy car instead of fixing the house. The car runs & looks great, but breaks down a year later. The car gets repaired but still isn’t quite the same. All the while, your house is still messed up, your car isn’t what it was when you bought it, plus your deeper in debt looking for some relief.

    Shoulda fixed the house slowly on your limited budget, before taking out a loan and then buying the fancy car.

  68. 68 kevinlied said at 11:05 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Very insightful. As superficially counter-intuitive as it might seem, I think the Sproles trade fits this plan because it allows them to cover RB2 and slot WR or WR4 with one guy, thus affording another roster spot for a developing athlete. Of course they gave up a chance to select such an athlete, so maybe not. Anyway, I’m on board with the offseason so far, and I love how you’ve explained it.

  69. 69 livingonapear said at 12:30 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    The only real impact moves the Eagles could have made never went to market. Orakpo and Worilds would have made our team much, but since they never hit FA, there wasn’t much we could do about it. Ware might have been a possibility, but I’m glad the Eagles didn’t try to match what Denver’s throwing around. Signing Jarius Byrd instead of Malcolm Jenkins would not have put more heat on the QB, which is the real reason we couldn’t get off the field on 3rd down.

    I think that, similar to drafting a player number 1, people get causation and correlation mixed up. They think that the effort and capital that you spend on a player, that making a statement signing, automatically makes the player worthy of that effort and capital.

    People insisting that Geno SMith be drafted in the first round, because that’s how you get a franchise qb, fall into this same category.

  70. 70 Baloophi said at 12:37 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    The converse(?) is also widespread: “Nick Foles can’t be a franchise QB because he was taken in the third round.”

  71. 71 shah8 said at 1:25 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Again, Foles was picked in the third round because he wasn’t perceived to have the requisite physical tools. Everyone who does, and who has some refinement, are usually picked within the first fifty picks.

  72. 72 Baloophi said at 2:28 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    This is exactly the kind of “logic” we’re talking about.

    I’m talking about people retroactively saying “Nick Foles can’t be a franchise QB because he was a third round pick.” You know, the kind of people who seem to disregard actual performance and statistics and look to things like combine performance and where someone was selected in the draft to make assessments about a player.

  73. 73 shah8 said at 3:58 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    You’re going at it from the wrong direction. I was speaking of the original evaluation that led people to believe he was a third round pick. Insofar as my opinion goes, from the afterthefacts evaluation, I don’t believe he has played *above* what made him a third round pick. Which is why I’m very leery of simply assuming he will be a franchise QB.

  74. 74 Baloophi said at 4:18 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Nope – I’m not going at it from the wrong direction.

    livingonapear made the observation that some people confuse correlation and causation and cited the example of people believing that drafting Geno Smith as a high pick would make him “worthy” of being a franchise QB.

    THEN, I made a comment about how some people also believe the converse (which is a term in logic meaning that the reverse implication is true – in this case, that drafting a player with a later pick precludes that player from being a franchise QB).

    NEXT, you responded saying that Foles was drafted in the 3rd round because he didn’t have the “requisite physical tools” or “refinement” to be drafted in the first fifty picks, which is an opinion that doesn’t relate to anyone’s statement.

    THEN, I replied to clarify that I was talking about people who – despite all objective evidence proving otherwise – cling to things like draft position and combine measurable (i.e. “requisite physical tools”) to continue to make the argument that because someone was drafted in the 3rd round they can’t possibly be a franchise QB… which was my original point.

    THEN, you responded to say that your evaluation “afterthefacts” (which I assume don’t include things like TD’s, passer rating, poise, record, etc.) that Foles hasn’t played *above* what made him a 3rd round pick (requisite physical tools?). As such, you’re leery of assuming he’ll be a franchise QB, which despite not really following what we’re talking about here, seems suspiciously similar to someone refusing to believe that a player not drafted high can ever overcome not being drafted high.

    THIS… was time well spent.

  75. 75 shah8 said at 4:42 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    THAT… was silly.

    Geno Smith was indeed a first round caliber pick, and unlike Foles, he actually has plays on tape that demonstrates why he was considered a first round pick. He has had a bad first year, and had some hard knocks. Livingonaspear more or less just projected his sentiments onto others, and it is his own cause and correlation that is mixed up. After all, Geno Smith didn’t get picked number one, now did he? He wasn’t scheduled to go ahead of Sanchez until the shoulder got hurt, now, did he? And yes, the quarterbacks usually worth picking in the top 50 picks are usually franchise caliber prospect or very high end raw prospects. That’s because, as I’ve corrected before–EVERY prospect that scouts reasonably can believe is starting QB capable, are usually picked then. After that, it’s backups and lotto picks.

    That’s why, Baloophi, later picks are usually not thought of as with high potential. Check out how Mike Glennon is being brusquely dumped as a starting QB, for example. It usually takes something like Joe Webb’s 2011 to even crack open that chance even a little. Remember, Webb has had one of the greatest games as a rushing QB ever, by DYAR, and he did it in less than a half, and his passing was certainly effective enough. Foles is playing because people pretty much hate Vick. If things were otherwise, Josh McCown would have kept the starting job over Cutler. Didn’t happen, not just because McCown is old, but because he simply isn’t talented enough.

    Foles doesn’t have the tools, and he’s not a particularly good passer, in the sense that he can make the full palette of passes at a professional level. He’s also dangerously immobile, for his own health and for the success of his team. 5.12 40s are more or less disqualifying times, same as with Mallet 5.17s. You’d be slower than a good NT, so you really just can’t be that slow and be a starting NFL QB. Good pocket movement can only make this less dangerous, in the absence of outstanding OL performance. All that means that you are at a strong risk of a meltdown at QB for whatever reason.

    I don’t really regard the numbers if they aren’t supported by the play on tape. Foles got a ridiculous number of opportunistic TDs, and he did well in the goal to go passing situation. On the other hand, Foles cannot carry the load passing if the running game isn’t going (and the defense isn’t making mistakes). This shows up an awful lot of the time. If that were not true, we would have won the Saints game, might even have built large leads that might or might not be wittled by the end of the game.

    And really, I’ve seen this before with the Vikings 2012-2013. One good year where most everything went right, the schedule was pretty easy, etc, etc. Only to have another bad season because no matter how much better Ponder gets, he’s just not starting caliber.

  76. 76 A Roy said at 4:56 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Reminds me of a Far Side cartoon I saw years ago.

    What the human says: Way to Rex, now we’re going to go outside and have some fun, Rex.

    What the dog hears: blah blah Rex blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah Rex.

  77. 77 shah8 said at 4:57 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Well, when you ain’t got anything, insults are a useful way to feel productive, I guess.

  78. 78 A Roy said at 4:59 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Same ole same ole. You make suppositions and in your mind they’re facts. You should’ve realized Baloophi ate your lunch and quit while the quitting was good.

  79. 79 shah8 said at 5:03 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    But wait, you attempted to dismiss my position using my own words when I grant that these are my feelings and analysis. Now they’re are “facts”. You do realize that you could contest the substance of what I say, right?

    but of course, blahblahblahblah is all you really hear, and you just want the dog to shut the hell up, eh?

  80. 80 Andy124 said at 6:40 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Why do you all continue to feed it?

  81. 81 A Roy said at 8:12 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Combination of things. I had nothing better to do. It’s fun watching knee jerk responses. It keeps him from pestering other people. And it makes GEAGLE seem positively gallant by comparison. Sorry if you were bothered.

  82. 82 Baloophi said at 5:03 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I’m no longer sure who you’re arguing with or what points you’re trying to make since they don’t relate to this discussion. You’ve pulled me through the looking glass. What is up? Where am I? Why is The Police playing on a loop on my iTunes?

    I apologize if I’ve sucked you into an argument about Nick Foles – that’s not what I was intending to talk about. I know that’s your thing and I really wasn’t intending to launch another tired debate.

    What I was talking about is how people continue to point toward draft position to make claims about a player’s ability at the exclusion of empirical evidence of actual performance in the actual NFL.

    A real world equivalent might be hiring someone who doesn’t have a stellar resume only to watch them perform really well, make your company a lot of money, and be a dependable employee. BUT, when the quarterly review comes around you go back to that resume and say “but he doesn’t know Excel and didn’t go to Harvard…”

  83. 83 shah8 said at 5:07 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Well, when you project, you might get confused when people correct you.

    My original point isn’t really controversial at all. Sure some fans might do as you say. However, more fans hold up crud like Colt McCoy and protest about how he doesn’t get enough chances because people only think he’s a third round pick. And not grant that he’s a third round pick for a reason.

    WRT Foles–I want him playing at full NFL starting caliber QB. I don’t accept him for now because the tape isn’t actually there.

  84. 84 Baloophi said at 5:20 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    “Well, when you project, you might get confused when people correct you.”

    Apology accepted, Captain Needa.

  85. 85 shah8 said at 5:29 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    /me shakes head…

    again, who’s the dude bringing in facts and logic. Vader. Who’s the one sputtering? Needa.

    What do you think is going on in this thread? Why do you think I bother being so explicit? The chances are very, very, good that I will turn out to be right, and I usually do ultimately win these things. It’s cheap, but talent does tell the tale.

    Pretending that technique can overcome a lack of talent is merely a fool’s game. Sooner or later, you run up against talent who work just as hard as you, and get creamed.

  86. 86 Jernst said at 5:51 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I see what you’re saying. Tom Brady ran a 5.28 40 yard dash and that has certainly proven to disqualify him from being a good QB.

  87. 87 shah8 said at 5:54 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Difference is that Tom Brady is much faster than that speed, and he’s far more agile than Foles. Brady had a notoriously awful combine, which was a big part of the drop.

  88. 88 shah8 said at 5:57 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Well, he was faster than that speed when he got into shape as a young QB.

  89. 89 Neil said at 6:13 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Maybe. But now Brady’s a statue compared to Foles. I see him duck to the ground at least as much as he attempts to roll out.

  90. 90 shah8 said at 6:16 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Which is why it is reasonable to always bet against Tom Brady whenever he faces a defense with a bonafide interior pass rush in the playoffs (since ’08).

  91. 91 shah8 said at 6:18 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Only loss would have been that Ravens game where they got a little lucky too.

  92. 92 Neil said at 6:18 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    No QB does well against an interior pass rush.

  93. 93 shah8 said at 6:19 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    True, but Tom Brady is absolutely horrible. I remember the ’09 Ravens playoff game where he was just helpless.

  94. 94 Neil said at 6:26 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Yes, and despite all of that Tom Brady is a fantastic QB. No QB can succeed when their line isn’t executing.

  95. 95 Jernst said at 8:32 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Tom Brady…certainly no Joe Webb, that’s for sure

  96. 96 Jernst said at 5:47 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Baloophi…the person you were talking about in your original assertion is, in fact, Shah8…you described him perfectly.

  97. 97 Jernst said at 5:44 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Dude just had one of the best years ever statistically for a QB, but he hasn’t played above what made him a third round pick? What is your malfunction, shah? Is there a reason you turn every comment section into a dissertation on how Foles can’t succeed, because he’s not an athletic playmaker with a strong arm, despite all evidence and logic to the contrary? Do you not get tired of typing the same things every day?

  98. 98 shah8 said at 5:48 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Well, I do describe my issues. He certainly has done well for a while. Just do not believe it’s very sustainable.

  99. 99 Jernst said at 6:05 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Believe me, we all understand your position and your issues with Foles. I just don’t understand why its necessary to turn every comment section into a repetitive dissertation where you repeat the same concerns over and over.

  100. 100 shah8 said at 6:10 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Foles was used as an example that people get confused with cause and correlation. I said that’s not true, and it spiraled from there.

    And no, I don’t talk about Foles every thread. It’d be boring. This is the Philadelphia Eagles, and there are other things we could talk about.

    Like how crazy people are about Bryce Brown. I mean, Chip Kelly is dumping Brown for Polk? Really? That dude who has had the total attempts fewer than the number of games in a season? That Polk? Sure he had more TDs than Brown, but virtually all of his scores were relatively meaningless. That’s still not a good reason to let Polk be the backup RB to Shady. Not to mention the durability downside.

  101. 101 A Roy said at 3:37 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Just like Tom Brady was….oh, wait…

  102. 102 shah8 said at 3:55 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Tom Brady always could make the throws, and he was always accurate. Lastly, that era was a bit different than it is now wrt to draft evaluation.

  103. 103 A Roy said at 3:57 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    “The Experts” will continue to make mistakes. I’m not saying they made one here, but it’s starting to look that way.

  104. 104 shah8 said at 4:19 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I’ve talked about this before:

    QB draft mistakes (people picked after pick 50) for people who have succeeded happen because either

    1) They didn’t get enough exposure because they played at a small school and played against inferior competition. Warner, Romo.

    2) They had an injury issue. Schaub

    3) Their careers got derailed for some reason. Brady (+bad combine)

    Russell really never should have been drafted that low, and had he been drafted 2007 or before, he almost certainly would have been a second rounder.

    Foles doesn’t fit in any of these categories. Foles was picked where he was because he’s not a particularly strong (sorta strong enough) arm, and he’s very immobile. Pretty much for the reason Mallet was chosen where he was. Foles has had the luxury of being well coached since a kid, and being given every chance to succeed at every level, like many wealthy children. However, in the pros, being technically good in some areas isn’t everything. Sooner or later, you’ll have to make plays, and you’ll have to make them while being prevented from doing what you do best. Usually, people who are as undertalented as Foles will have problems winning games, like Keenum or Jimmy Clausen. This is so because they have limited ability to take yards from functional defenses (think how Wilson took those first downs early in the Super Bowl). Some have succeeded for a short time because they were on a stacked offense with a good to excellent defense. The party, though, usually ends. The OL has injuries, DCs figure out schemes and tendencies, FA departures, and said QB start having to truly carry the load. Then they get hurt or fired.

  105. 105 A Roy said at 4:46 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Funny how there’s always an exception to every rule, except the Foles rule. The problem with the combine, Senior Days, and all other measurements is that some things are not measureable. How many fast, strong armed QBs flamed out because they were unable to 1) read defenses and 2) process information at the speed necessary mid play. Foles has shown that he MAY be exceptional in these areas. You kept whining that they only gave him easy reads. And yet, he passed the test so far. He learned from his mistakes. E.g. Dallas 1 vs Dallas 2. Let’s wait and see what we have this year before continuing to dismiss him.

  106. 106 shah8 said at 4:51 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    If Tony Romo doesn’t get hurt being a hero the week before, we probably would lose the Dallas game, in superficial analysis.

    Anyways, scouts scout via game tape. It didn’t escape anyone’s notice that when Matt Scott started in place of Foles after injury, that Scott did quite well. Nor did it escape anyone’s notice just how low in moxie Foles was in college. You can blame it on a terrible OL, and that would be true, but Foles being slow and not someone who particularly rises to any occasion is also true. The combine and Senior Bowls merely verifies the tape. And no pro scout does it in a different direction, except for the small school guys that never played against good competition.

  107. 107 A Roy said at 4:54 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Superficial certainly seems like the right word.

  108. 108 shah8 said at 4:56 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Anything can happen. Just remember, though. Kyle Orton was really only able to make *one* play all game. If Romo was in, the game would be called differently, and Foles probably would have executed a different game plan. However, Romo would have *made plays*. On a good day? Lots of them.

  109. 109 A Roy said at 5:02 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Sure he would have. I’ve never seen him have an average day. Only days where he’s better than Foles will ever be. Never seen Romo chuck and duck once. Oh wait. I thought it was Vicente Romo we were talking about. Tony Romo? hahahahahahaha And where was he drafted?

  110. 110 Neil said at 5:08 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    If Scott’s play didn’t escape anyone’s notice, why do you think Matt Scott went undrafted, but Foles went in the 3rd?

    The remark about Foles not rising to the occasion seems true enough. He seems like he’s always the same steady guy. If you ask me, that’s a positive. I’d prefer that to Romo maybe making some plays or maybe throwing the game away.

  111. 111 shah8 said at 5:23 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Matt Scott’s career got derailed, just like Tom Brady, and Matt Scott probably needed the starts in college (with Bob Stoops) to be a refined passer, which he isn’t. Not that he would have had much chance at that in Rodriguez’ system had Rich been there all these years. Was certainly the more highly touted prospect at the time.

    Steady Eddy? No post-season victories. A quick perusal shows maybe one or two big game wins in college. I really would prefer that the QB be able to win in the postseason or rise to the occasion for the big game.

  112. 112 Neil said at 5:28 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    It’s a little premature to criticise Foles for no postseason victories, no? And he may be steady, but he led us back against the Saints.

    I never got the impression the coaches had some vendetta against Scott like they did Brady. Seemed like Foles was just the better player at the time. Someone like Roethlissberger, I imagine, didn’t play many important games at Miami in Ohio, right? That guy’s career didn’t turn out too bad.

  113. 113 shah8 said at 5:35 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Nah, he mostly just got the backing to be the starter. That really does happen in college far more than you’d think. College QB is even more political than NFL. Rich family or booster schmoozing, and if you ain’t too bad, then you’ll start. It works out most of the time. Guys like Perriloux flames out even after choosing a place with an open spot. Other guys perform. Sometimes it’s pretty suboptimal. Christian Ponder also had first dibs on all the jobs, and he was certainly good enough to keep it at the college level, but he was never better than many prospects or EJ Manuel.

  114. 114 Neil said at 5:36 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    That’s awfully, but conveniently, cynical.

  115. 115 shah8 said at 5:40 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    That Drew Henson story was absolutely atrocious. Anyone who follows Georgia football gets the same full batch of infighting over who gets to be the next QB, unless it’s Stafford. Georgia Tech fans still remember the horrible Donnie Davis controversy…It’s rough out there!

  116. 116 Jernst said at 5:39 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I just don’t see anymore arm strength or running ability out of Joe Montana, Tom Brady, Drew Brees or Kurt Warner. So, why can’t Foles be a good QB but all those guys can?

  117. 117 shah8 said at 5:42 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    /me rolls eyes…

    All those people were far more talented than Foles, and from the start, could make all the throws, with accuracy. With very limited concession wrt Montana and deep balls, and maybe Brees. I’m old enough to have watched all of them.

  118. 118 laeagle said at 6:47 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I now realize that this entire discussion was one long, protracted, evil plan to bring the phrase “deep balls” into use on Tommy’s site.

  119. 119 BreakinAnklez said at 5:39 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Dude, we get you don’t like Nick Foles…let it go…

  120. 120 Jerry Pomroy said at 12:57 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I think the argument could be made in Byrd’s case as he’s a TO machine. But not at that price I’ll add. The reason I personally wanted him was that Orakpo didn’t hit the market, and I was not sold on Worild’s. So I fully anticipated getting a pass rushing OLB in the draft, which means there will be a developmental stage before they reach full potential. Having Byrd’s ballhawking skills would help alleviate pressure on the young guy to need to deliver impact right away with consistency.

  121. 121 Jernst said at 5:35 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Byrds INT totals over the last 4 years: 1, 3, 5, 4. Thats an average of 3.25 INTs a year. Good numbers, but I think people vastly over-rate his ability to generate TOs.

  122. 122 ezgreene said at 9:54 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    It’ll be harder to trade brown than I think, I believe. RBs just have no value. I think graham goes, maybe Matthews if he returns anything.

    Asked this last night, but too late:

    Soliciting informed opinions on Demarcus Lawrence, maybe as a 2nd round target if he lasts?

  123. 123 Arby1 said at 10:24 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Lawrence is somebody I’ve been wondering about too. Been focusing on Attaochu (sp) and Christian Jones at 54.

  124. 124 D3FB said at 6:04 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    See above.

  125. 125 Mitchell said at 7:03 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Does Jeffcoat have an explosive first step? If so doesn’t he have all te tools available to be a good pass rusher? I understand he lacks moves but those can e taught right?

  126. 126 D3FB said at 7:38 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I don’t see much explosion from his first step. He’s got a great pedigree, good size and strength,and from time to time makes a nice play but there’s no consistency. To have his bloodlines and to have played at a major school like Texas, he just isn’t anything special. To me he’s the pass rushing version of DRC, without the otherworldy athleticism.

  127. 127 D3FB said at 6:04 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I think Lawrence is a better fit at DE than 34 OLB. Alot of his pass rushing success comes from feasting on pretty bad MWC right tackles. Has a solid speed rush, can bull rush the tackle back into the QB’S lap when he gets his long arms extended and hands inside the tackles. Only counter move I saw was a stutter to get the tackle to freeze his feet followed by a quick arm over. So he needs to develop more in the way of counter moves. Against the run game he’s best when he’s allowed to fire off into his man and force disruption or penetration. Doesn’t hold up well when engaging and reading, his pads get too high and he gets thrown around. I have questions about his instincts. Some but not much experience rushing out of a 2 point stance. Ran a 4.8 at the combine. Didn’t see him dropping at all.

    Overall I think he’s a decent mid round guy, although I think he profiles better at DE than OLB. He would probably come in behind Barr, Mack, Smith, Van Noy, Attaochu, Ford, Bradford, Murphy
    But would be ahead of: Kennard, Jeffcoat, Shembo, Hubbard, and Starr.

  128. 128 ezgreene said at 7:12 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    MIdround? I hear top 50.

    I, for the record, know nothing and just go on the opinions of others. Yourself included.


  129. 129 D3FB said at 7:24 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    By that I meant just outside the top fifty, I see him as a late round 2, into round 3 or top ten picks of the 4th at the worst. Alot of people are higher on him, some people have him as a fringe first round talent, others see him more in line to where I do. There’s alot of guys like that this year. There are about 15 or so elite prospects, after that you have guys who some people think are first rounders and others think he’s a 3rd or 4th rounder. For certain schemes he may present more value, but for us I wouldn’t touch him til the third.

  130. 130 Christopher Miller said at 9:56 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    If Raji sits out there long enough, would you take a flyer on him with a one year deal to compete with our guys?

  131. 131 Jerry Pomroy said at 10:28 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I may be wrong, but I swore that I thought I saw that he re-signed w/ Packers…

  132. 132 Dominik said at 10:33 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Mike Neal re-signed, do you mean him? Didn’t read anything about Raji, but it is possible, of course.

  133. 133 ICDogg said at 11:30 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    He’s still available.

  134. 134 GermanEagle said at 4:32 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Not anymore. 😉

  135. 135 Jerry Pomroy said at 11:45 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Yes, that’s who it was Neal. The problem with Raji is that he’s a short pass rushing interior lineman with stubby arms that fits more in a 1 gap system. He’s got some knocks against him that I don’t think fit what we look for. They like length, athleticism & long arms at DE. At NT, they might want someone like Raji’s frame but with longer arms. In fact, he’s had those knocks against him ever since he was drafted if I recall correctly.

  136. 136 Rage114 said at 11:36 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    He was offered an $8 mil/year deal but he rejected it.

  137. 137 Mike Roman said at 4:31 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    $8 mil/year?

    Not sure what’s more insane, the fact that he rejected it or that he was actually offered that much!

  138. 138 Mike Roman said at 4:30 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I heard that too but today I saw that he’s unsigned.

  139. 139 Arby1 said at 10:08 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Dammit! It’s 10am and the Eagles haven’t signed anyone yet today! C’mon guys, you snooze you lose. #channelingfakewipcaller

  140. 140 SunShine said at 7:07 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I heard some wise guy questioned Spadaro if Shady is now expendable due to the Sproles trade. Boy the egregious thoughts that go through one’s mind

  141. 141 Dominik said at 10:39 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    “There are no guarantees the Eagles will add a Safety, but it still feels like too weak of a position. I think adding one here and in the draft is the smart way to go.”

    I sure hope that’s the road they go. The way I see it, Maragos is signed for the Anderson role (which could become a little bit more important, since Jenkins should be our NB back-up if Boykin gets hurt – so he could be the #4 Safety if Boykin is injured + #4 Safety if a Safety is injured). You just can’t count Johnson in. He has a rough road ahead of him to make the team.

    That leaves us with Wolff, Jenkins and Maragos at the moment. Two more spots. One more FA, one via draft makes almost too much sense.

  142. 142 ICDogg said at 11:29 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    That they haven’t re-signed Nate Allen yet speaks volumes.

  143. 143 A Roy said at 11:35 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    1) They don’t WANT Allen back. (Most likely.)
    2) He’s asking for too much money. (Possible, but unlikely.)
    3) They may sign him later for backup/competition if they cannot sign anyone better. (Possible.)

  144. 144 ICDogg said at 11:41 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    Even if you figure Allen wanted to test the market he knows by now that it’s not as he would like it to be, and lots of safeties went before him.

  145. 145 Dominik said at 11:48 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I guess it’s a mixture of 2) and 3), although you obviously can’t rule out 1). I kind of have the feeling that he wants too much money right now, Roseman is looking which player he could get instead and hopes that Allen reduces his asking price.

  146. 146 Jerry Pomroy said at 11:57 AM on March 14th, 2014:

    I think it’s more leaning towards, if we can do better we will, if not we know what he is and can deal with it ‘if we have to’ as a last resort. That’s why I think Clemons makes more sense. He’s a slight upgrade that can do a little more. With the addition of Jenkins and being so versatile, you almost have to follow that up with someone similar opposite him. If Jenkins is up playing man on a 4WR set, or on the TE, you need someone that can play deep. If Jenkins is deep, you need someone that isn’t a liability against the run or covering the flat.

    I wouldn’t be surprised if they are talking to both and trying to use the numbers against one another to bring the $$ money down.

  147. 147 Dominik said at 12:22 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    “I wouldn’t be surprised if they are talking to both and trying to use the numbers against one another to bring the $$ money down.”

    Like Howie would do something like that. Didn’t you learned, after the Peters and Maclin signings, that he’s a nice guy? 😉

  148. 148 Jerry Pomroy said at 1:13 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Howie’s conversations with Allen & Clemons agents…

    Clemons Agent: “Howie, we’re looking for $___/yr. You guys obviously still have a hole at one of your Safety spots and Chris is the best left on the market.”
    Howie: “You know, I’m not so sure that Chris is that much better than Nate was for us last yr, and he’s only asking for $____. Oh, I’ve got another call. You think about it and let me know…(click)”

    Howie: “Hello?”
    Allen’s Agent: “Hey Howie. Listen, you guys know that Nate’s play improved significantly last year. So we’re looking for $___/yr.”
    Howie: “You know, I’m not so sure that Nate is any better than Clemons and he’s only asking for $___. So think about it and let me know.”

  149. 149 eagleyankfan said at 2:10 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I think you’re off base….Howie answers .. Agent identifies himself … Howie hangs up. You people really think Allen — who stinks — is holding out for money? Please.

  150. 150 Dominik said at 2:36 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    And the agents are like: damn it, we have no other choice but to go down with our asking price. “Wait, what, Nate Allen is lowering even more?” Should we just pay you to have the right to play for you?

  151. 151 Ark87 said at 12:29 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    The money is a package deal. He probably wants to start somewhere and get paid as such. We won’t guarantee him either. So we aught to not be at the top of his list.

  152. 152 Dominik said at 12:31 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    True that. Can’t blame him for trying. It isn’t like there are enough good Safetys in the NFL.

  153. 153 Right_On1 said at 12:46 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Have to think that another safety is needed, probably someone who could be cut if we get someone in the draft. What’s everyone’s views on Darian Stewart – quite like what I’ve seen of him and I’d guess he’d be pretty cheap.

  154. 154 Sean Stott said at 1:30 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Seems obvious to me, Eagles plan on taking Pryor or Clinton-Dix (preferably Pryor) in the 1st round.

  155. 155 A Roy said at 1:34 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I’m betting they drop back, gain another pick, and take a WR.

  156. 156 Patrick said at 2:07 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Im gonna wait until Louisvilles Pro Day before i can commit to liking Calvin Pryor. I just wasn’t impressed with his combine. The numbers are one thing(lack of top speed and shorter than expected), but he just didn’t look as athletic, quick, loose hipped as I would have liked him to. Better than Joyner, but I still ended up with more question marks that answers. If he doesn’t show me better athleticism I would rather go with Deone Bucannon who seems to be available later, and get somewhat the same player.

  157. 157 Sean Stott said at 2:14 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    He projects to be a strong safety, not free. Fluid hips is something that sounds nice on paper but has no real world impact on being a big hitter strong safety type. Stop listening to Mike Mayock.

  158. 158 GermanEagle said at 2:22 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    If I had to choose between listening to Sean Stott and Mike Mayock, I probably will have to choose the latter.

  159. 159 Sean Stott said at 2:24 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Then you’ll end up doing things like taking DJ Hayden in the first round, and not knowing when to shut up about 40 times and arm length during Thursday Night games.

  160. 160 Mike Roman said at 4:33 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    That’s funny shit, dude. lol

  161. 161 D3FB said at 2:24 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    He may not have loose hips but the kid can’t tackle or take a proper angle to save his life.

  162. 162 Patrick said at 3:09 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    My guess would be that the Eagles aren’t gonna be very interested in what the name of the safety style they want to play. The signing of Malcolm Jenkins points to the fact that they want to interchangeable, versatile safeties who does it all, not 1 safety who plays the box and 1 safety who plays the deep middle.

  163. 163 Insomniac said at 4:33 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    If we wanted a strong safety that could hit and sort of cover then we would have tried to sign Ward. Not to mention Pryor is vastly overrated and over hyped by the media.

  164. 164 GEAGLE said at 5:10 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I could also say it’s obvious they want to draft Buchanon since they liked his pro day yesterday enough to schedule to bring him in for a visit…

  165. 165 eagleyankfan said at 2:09 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    extending Sproles contract now makes sense 🙂

  166. 166 GermanEagle said at 2:20 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    giving up a 5th rounder for Sproles now makes sense 🙂

  167. 167 Crus57 said at 3:28 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I agree with the point you raised in the previous thread about this, it’s unusual for us to extend someone over 30. I guess he hasn’t actually played that much, certainly not primary-RB level amount.

  168. 168 shah8 said at 2:23 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    How much do you want to bet that the extension was rather mandatory from the Sproles party?

  169. 169 eagleyankfan said at 2:26 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I think so. Sproles was vocal about not being traded because he wanted a new contract. Now Sproles should be happy. Happier than a body builder directing traffic.

  170. 170 ICDogg said at 6:05 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Or a camel on Wednesday.

  171. 171 Anders said at 2:28 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Sproles said that the contract wasnt a part of him been traded.

  172. 172 Stevo said at 2:18 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Tommy, a little surprised that you didn’t star Trent Cole, given our need for a pass rushing threat. From what people were saying, it looks like the Eagles would have been really interested in Ware. Would the Eagles be interested in a Jared Allen? Guessing, if the Eagles were, they’re waiting for him to come down some on his numbers, but curious if people think Allen could be a 3-4 outside backer.

  173. 173 Iskar36 said at 2:24 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Everywhere I have read views Jared Allen strictly as a 4-3 DE. I doubt he is an improvement on Cole, and at least Cole has a year of experience now at OLB.

  174. 174 shah8 said at 2:24 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Jared Allen would be a bit too much like how Babin was. A rather selfish sack-seeker that doesn’t offer much for the other tasks of being a DE.

  175. 175 Baloophi said at 2:31 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Did anyone else read “Eagles extend Sproles” and think it was a height thing?

  176. 176 A_T_G said at 2:42 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Wow, nice rack!

  177. 177 Baloophi said at 3:00 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    That’s actually the search term I typed in to find the image. Needless to say it took a little longer to get this post up.

    Wait a second…

  178. 178 eagleyankfan said at 3:08 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    now we know what Chip looks like without his shirt on…

  179. 179 barneygoogle said at 2:42 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Does anybody have a reason for why Chip Kelly is so…silent? He’s saying nothing. Does Howie have him tied up in the basement? Is he afraid that some media type will STILL ask him who’s the starting QB– Vick or Foles? ……and I do think Vick is coming back. (: ).

  180. 180 Anders said at 3:06 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Kelly never talks unless he is forced too due to rules.

  181. 181 GEAGLE said at 5:09 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Why the hell haven’t we signed Alex Carrington yet? He is the only DL we should even consider, unless they also want to take a flier on Cody..
    Ihendigbo looks like he is signing with Detriot,
    Nate wreaks of overvaluing our own players syndrom, and he can use a fresh start s much as this fanbase

  182. 182 BreakinAnklez said at 5:33 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Maybe because the FO doesn’t think he’s as good as you do?

  183. 183 ICDogg said at 6:33 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    I’m a big time Wilfork fan, in fact if we had a younger healthier version of him it would probably be the single best thing we could add to this defense.

  184. 184 SunShine said at 7:02 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Want nothing to do with Major Wright. I know he played next to a horrible safety in Chris Conte and definitely have to consider the tandem as detrimental in being productive. Out of all these choices, probably prefer Chris Clemons. Though I wouldn’t mind heading to camp with Wolff battling it out with a rookie from the upcoming 2014 draft class. Should be significant and meaningful competition with a veteran or rookie

  185. 185 Weapon Y said at 7:42 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Could a trade for a safety be in the works? Who will be a free agent next year and/or is upset with their current team?

  186. 186 D3FB said at 8:15 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    The 2011 draft class comes up for free agency next year. There literally wasn’t a single good safety in the entire class. It’s terrifying how bad that safety class was.

  187. 187 A_T_G said at 8:36 PM on March 14th, 2014:

    Speaking of Joe Webb, he is currently a free agent. Has he received any interest from teams, as a QB or a receiver? I can’t remember seeing anything associated with him.

    I did find this. That is a man who sees the whole field and is able to create.

  188. 188 shah8 said at 8:50 PM on March 14th, 2014:


  189. 189 A Roy said at 10:45 AM on March 15th, 2014:

    You’re quite the fisher.