Wentzless?
Posted: January 31st, 2016 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 381 Comments »The Eagles, along with plenty of other NFL teams, took a long, close look at Carson Wentz during Senior Bowl week. I feel confident in saying that just about everyone came away impressed. It’s good that a potential prospect had a strong showing, but it also could cause a problem.
What if Wentz doesn’t make it to pick 13?
Jimmy Bama took a look at the first 13 picks to see which teams might have interest in a QB. At least one QB feels like a lock to go early. It is very possible two could be off the board.
I haven’t had a chance to fully study the top 3 QBs…Jared Goff, Carson Wentz and Paxton Lynch. After the week in Mobile, I have a good feel for Wentz. He is a legit 1st round pick and could be the first QB off the board. I have watched some tape on Goff and Lynch. Both are impressive.
It feels like Goff and Wentz are the top QBs right now. If they’re gone, would Paxton Lynch be worth pick 13?
I need to do more research, but I lean toward “yes” right now. He has good size. He is an above-average athlete. Lynch has a very strong arm and a quick release. Rather than focusing on his best game, let’s look at Lynch’s performance against Temple, an outstanding defense.
You see some issues there, but you also get a feel for how Lynch handles playing in a tough game where things aren’t going smoothly. His blockers and receivers didn’t help him out very much, but Lynch kept trying to make plays. He didn’t make any big mistakes (no INTs) and that is critical when playing a tough D.
For comparison’s sake, let’s take a look at Christian Hackenberg vs that same Temple D.
It isn’t hard to see why Lynch is considered the better prospect. Hack has all kinds of problems in that game.
If the Eagles re-sign Sam Bradford, they’ll have a lot of interesting options at pick 13. If they don’t and need a talented QB prospect to develop, it seems like they’ll have at least one good option still on the board.
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They will all be gone by 13. But i would be open to drafting paxton, or any of the top 3 QBs.
Other than that its LaQuon Treadwell for me. Thats over any OL or DL. CB or S.
If the QBs aren’t there then go BPA or trade back and take the top OG,OT
I am not entirely sure about that, most of the top 12 have QB’s.
Titans – Mariota
Browns – NEED QB
Chargers – Rivers
Cowgirls – Romo
Jags – Bortles
Ravens – Flacco
49ers – Kaepernick???
Dolphins – Tannerhill?
Buccaneers – Winston
Giants – Eli
Bears – Cutler?
Saints – Brees.
Only team 100% taking a QB is the Browns. question marks about Dolphins, Bears and 49ers, and a couple of others might look to get a young QB to develop behind their aging vet.
Think there is an chance that 1 falls to 13, and i think there is a very good chance one falls to 9 where i imagine the Buccs would love to trade down 4 spots for an extra 3rd.
Isn’t Brees in his last year? Romo is broken and wont last too much longer. Rivers was talking about retiring last year.
Saints took Grayson in 3rd last year. It’s not a lock they pass on QB but they’ve got huge needs and these are risky QB prospects. Romo is gonna be there for 2 more years. Though it ‘s possible they could go QB they’re passing up someone to help them make a run with Romo.
I forgot about Garret Grayson
That & Eli is what, 35 now? I’m sure NY wouldn’t hate having someone like having a quality guy waiting in the wings. Nobody knows for sure but I don’t feel hopeful about any of the top 3 QB’s lasting until pick 13. Hopefully I’m wrong about that if in fact we do want/need to snag one.
Cowpukes are probably going to pick a QB to develop. But how high will they pick him is the question.
49ers will draft a QB, cowboys could very well draft a QB, and the browns will draft a QB. I havent thought about the bears, but that can def happen too.
im not saying there isnt a chance, but IMO all will be gine and we def cant sit back and expect one to fall to 13th. we have no 2nd round pick that will make trading hard.
I don’t think Niners are a lock to draft a QB. Kaep and Kelly are a match. Gabbert is somebody Kelly could like. They could take Connor Cook in 2nd. Prescott…they may like Oregon’s QB . Since I said it they will take one.
They could go after Bradford for all we know.
Cowboys may very well not take a QB. These aren’t very good top 5 QB prospects.
But either way it wouldn’t surprise me.
How is kaep a match with Kelly consider the qbs Kelly has liked in the NFL?
i dont think kaep is a match for kelly. kelly wants a smart accurate passer who can be a team leader.
Tannehill just signed an extension that is hard to get out of until 2018. they wont take a QB. Think the main reason they went so hard for Gase is to fix Tannehill.
Dolphins can easily get out of tannehills contract after this year. They mostly just guaranteed him the money he was going to get with the 5th year option. He will get 3 mil guaranteed for 2017 if they keep him this year but still big cap savings if cut. They do have a decision to make after this year though since more gets guaranteed next year.
Looking at this draft, it’s amazing how Aaron Rodgers dropped to 24.
He moves pretty gracefully for a guy that big. I only watched the first 2 minutes. Does he ever start to throw it past the line of scrimmage, or does he always check down to his RB?
most of the offense is short to intermediate. But when he does go long, he looks good. IMO
The pass rush was pretty good by Temple on top of that we can’t see how well the receivers were covered downfield.
A few times he reminded me of Randall Cunningham, like a poor man’s Randall Cunningham.
Did he just apologize for tackling ?
You want irony?
The Rams, selecting at No. 15, can use the Eagles’ 2nd Rd pick to jump ahead of them to pick No. 7 — currently, the 49ers — for any QB on the board at that point.
Friendship over!
Historically and mathematically (via the infamous “trade matrix” used in these situation, it would take a lot more than a 2nd rounder to jump from 15 to 7. It would take this years and next year’s #1, plus the #2, at very least.
mark2741 . . .
you’d think that.
in 2013, though, the Dolphins jumped from 12th to 3rd with a 2nd Rd pick
2013 was a very bad year for top tier talent.
Also, has any of those trades really worked out for any of the teams trading up?
Two 1st-rd picks (plus a couple others) . . . that’s the kind of deal Atlanta did to get Julio Jones.
But that was from 26th up to 6th.
Yup… Especially since when a team knows you are trying to move up for a QB, they try to squeez some extra compensation out of you
Hey! Maybe we can work a deal with the 49ers! Ummmm, nevermind.
Maybe we could tag Bradford then trade his rights to the 49ers to move up 😉
Why would sf do that deal? They need top talent and a qb, not more picks.
Also, the rams is the type of franchise least likely to be good at eventuating qbs,
kelly’s revenge
have you looked at sf roster lately? they need all the picks
Niners are loaded with Picks already…. Would you really be that surprised if Chip said he doesn’t want KAp, DOESNT need to draft a QB, and wants to proceed with Blaine Gabbert? Lol as crazy as it sounds, I wouldmy put it past chip
i actually think Gabbert is more likely to start than Kaepernick
If it’s moving up for a QB 2017 1st round pick is in play. Which with a rookie QB and head coach is a pretty enticing trade chip. Without a QB the Rams would still be near .500 with boring ass Fisher, Gurley and a stout D.
Howie can make a very competive offer if he wants to get up.
Logical team is probably Baltimore. Ozzie and Harbaugh have job security, they are picking this high due to injury crisis not a lack of talent. If Tunsil’s gone and they don’t love Stanley, they could be open to moving back and still getting a top tier CB or a Jason Spriggs.
howie/ozzie negotiation would be one for the ages
Man, it’s gonna feel rough when we realize that we gave up a 2nd, a 4th, and 10 million in cap space for a 1 year rental of Sam Bradford.
*ducks and runs*
*lights Molotov cocktail*
biggest mistake Chip made was not demanding that Bradford agree to a (team friendly) contract extension as part of the trade.
not slavery – can’t force a guy to take a contract. from what i understand they made reasonable offer and condon shut it down.
I’m pretty sure they can make it terms of the deal. No contract no trade.
Yup, especially when we had leverage of Sam not wanting to get traded to the Browns… Chip also mad huge mistakes refusing to respect Value, and opportunity costs of his actions
Sunk cost.
T-Law:
In the Temple game, Lynch injured his ankle late in the 1st Q (or seemed to).
Wasn’t the same after that . . . not to take anything away from a great Owls’ win.
GE: regarding your landlord issue, I think it’s best that there are no pictures and the landlord has already moved into your place. This is likely a tenant friendly procedure. Your story is that the landlord didn’t show to your handover, so you didn’t get a chance to walk thru the place, then she claimed things like dirty oven, scrapes on walls, etc., then you asked for pictures and she has none. She can’t produce them now either.
I think you have quite good facts. I’d call 311 and ask how best to pursue. Let us know how it goes. In a tenant friendly forum, I don’t know how landlord can win without taking pictures.
Lions are just a snakebit franchise. Still no Super Bowl appearances, only 1 NFC Championship appearance, and no playoff wins since ’91.
Their franchise RB retired early at age 30 after 10 seasons.
Their franchise WR is going to retire early at age 30 after 9 seasons.
Detroit just isn’t what it used to be. The city or the team.
We MUST fix the OL. It will not matter who the QB is if they are not protected, cannot run the offense and we cannot run the ball again. We need to draft heavy on the OL and do everything we can to develop them into very good players. Both OG are mediocre to bad, our depth stinks, Peters is declining and we have questions at C. The OL has been neglected for far too long and is the foundation of a good offense. There are zero excuses for not upgrading the OL majorly this off-season/draft. Get it Done.
Chill man. Howie will take care of it.
Appreciate the humor, made me chuckle and put a smile back on my face. Thanks
spot on man
I got the Foles vibe watching Lynch, which is fine. Foles was fine. Anything with Lynch to give us a sense that he has a good chance to be better than Foles? Seemed pretty slow, with accuracy issues, but able to spread it around without being intercepted (in this one Temple game).
If you are going to use pick 13 on a QB then you want one better then Foles. If that is all you have left to pick from at QB then the team would be better off making a non QB selection.
I wouldn’t call a Foles level QB fine especially at pick 13.
Foles ’13 was more than fine; Foles ’14 fine-ish; Foles ’15 not so much.
Foles 2013 was an apparition much like Derek Anderson in 2007 I beleive.
2014 Foles is not someone I would use my 13 pick on.
If you feel as though Wentz is going to materialize into Foles 2014 at some point then the Birds organization would be insane to make him the 13th pick overall.
Well we are talking about Lynch, but Foles with agility, movement ability and a bigger arm is a pretty interesting player long term. Foles problem is that he cannot deal with pressure up the middle due to his lack of agility. Once teams worked this out they just attacked the interior of the OL, which unfortunately for Foles has been poor in both 2014 with the Eagles and 2015 with the Rams.
Lynch has much better agility to role out and scramble sot that should be less of a concern. In the end being a successful NFL QB is about having your weaknesses identified and then overcoming them. Foles failed that test but that does not mean another QB like him would fail.
Meant Lynch. Brain fart.
I in no way think he’s slow, he has more then enough mobility to get our on rums almost like Alex smith type speed. Need to wok on mechanics before but to me he is much better of a prospect with higher upside then Foles
Lynch is much more mobile and better arm than Foles.
Foles biggest problem is throwing of his back foot all the time, something none of the top 3 QBs really do
Better athlete, better arm and better accuracy. Most of those passes were in prime RAC location for the receiver.
Interesting review of Hackenberg- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUh7Tia8pWM
More like interesting one game review. Hackenberg hasn’t been good for a long time.
lol Tyrod Taylor threw 3 ints in the Pro Bowl
That’s like getting shut out in the NBA All-Star Game?
I’m not sold on Lynch or Goff. I think Lynch has the arm, but his passes often look uncatchable. Goff I haven’t seen enough tape on to know either way. I’m hopping Tommy does a breakdown on him at some point.
If anything he doesn’t throw into tight windows a lot but the one thing Lynch has is touch .Wentz is the hardest thrower out out of the three. At the end of the year he wasn’t playing as well for various reasons, maybe you’re seeing him at his worst but I think he throws very catchable balls when he’s on.
https://youtu.be/Jdm3TayuSUo
One of the knocks on Wentz is that he currently lacks the touch to throw over the middle in the NFL. The seam pass where you throw between the LBs and safeties is currently a pass Wentz has big problems with has he throws with almost no arc.
He lacks the touch… That’s just the beginning. He lacks the feet, he telegraphs the throws, he can’t drive the ball on a short throw when he’s under pressure. I want no part of this guy.
But no QB can drive the ball under pressure, the pressure prevents it. Goff, Cook both throw off their back foot under pressure. You do that, you escape, you throw it away or you get sacked.
Jared, Paxton, Carson. I hate names.
The Law firm of Goff, Wentz and Lynch smh…
Do you have young children? That’s where you encounter the real dumb names, their classmates.
I bet theee is a whole generation of silly pregnant 16year old Girls naming their Daughters “Catness”” after Jennifer Lawrence in the Hunger Games smh…
They’re right behind all the Bellas from a few years ago. Although it seems most people have enough sense not to name their girls Renesmee.
Señor Wentzless
S’alright
For some reason, I wouldnt be sad if all 3 QBs went before us and we instead pick an OL or DL (or Ramsay if he falls) and then take a flier on Brissett or Prescott later in the draft.
flier on a QB late; sure.
Prescott or Brissett; no thanks.
Because Hackenberg is better?
He has a higher ceiling than either Prescott or Brissett as a passer, but Hack can’t see an NFL football field until 2017 due to some major problems as well. But at least that problem is running too much in addition to issues throwing. But Hack certainly isn’t ideal to plan around at the QB position either.
Right now Prescott has better accuracy, better throwing motion and just about better in every aspect except been tall and white.
Not if you take Hack in O’Brien’s 2013 system into account.
And Prescott is likely to be drafted ahead of Hack anyway, but in either case I can’t abide by drafting a QB who has pass:run ratios of 3:1, 2:1, and 2:1 over the last 3 years. How can I ever trust that guy to play the NFL game the right way?
I suppose you do not want to draft Carson Wentz then, because he has the following ratios over the last two years: 3:1 and 3:1.
He’s clearly a much better passer than the two guys we’re discussing and isn’t evaluated as a runner by anybody doing evaluations of draft picks.
http://walterfootball.com/draft2016QB.php
Walterfootball to win an argument…
Im not saying Wentz isnt a better passer, just pointing out how flawed your argument is when all you base your discussion about his his rushing attempts (remember sacks are counted as runs).
For god sake, you are trying to argue us taking Hackenberg over Prescott when Hackenberg should go undrafted atm.
Hackenberg undrafted? Hardly.
If you don’t like Walter, I’ll keep an eye out for some other writers on the draft as the process continues.
Ultimately when Prescott’s best comp is Tebow (the root of all evil in terms of style at the “QB” position), I can’t take him seriously as a pro prospect. If you’d like to continue supporting that ruinous brand of football, that’s your prerogative, but I’m not going to allow cheerleading of our team down that path in an unchecked manner.
I find the Tebow comparison super lazy as Prescott’s throwing motion is so much cleaner and better.
Im sorry if you have some form of PTSD about Cunningham and McNabb, but I would have zero problems with a guy like Cam Newton has our QB.
– We’ll see if Prescott, a Dan Mullen guy like Tebow, can make a transition to making NFL reads and throws w/o having to resort to running the ball.
– Don’t mix Cunningham and McNabb. McNabb remains the best QB in the franchise who reached his level of passing excellence by banishing any brain-dead running from his game. He remains (for on the field accomplishments) Cunningham, the ultimate weapon, was a false prophet that should permanently slam shut the argument to ever allow a QB to keep running all the time without teaching him how to keep his eyes downfield and read a D properly. He had the chance to be the “ultimate weapon”, claim “I’m back scrambling”, and/or asking people to “let me be me” to quite a rather large pile of fools gold. Watching him play the game the right way in Minnesota should server as a template for good quarterbacking instead of the slop he was permitted to put on the field while here. I don’t EVER want to see our QB position degraded by that type of play.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000625150/article/top-five-2016-nfl-draft-prospects-by-position
And how about Bucky Brooks if you don’t like Walter?
Agreed about the later round QB. Its about opportunity cost. This years QB class does not have outstanding talent. So naturally, less talented prospects are elevated to the first round. Its just the wrong year to pick a QB in the mid-first. There just doesnt seem to be that big of a gap between the Lynches, the Prescotts, the Brissets and the Hackenbergs of this years draft that their expected draft positions are expected to be. The point being that even though a guy like Lynch might grade out better in the draft process than, say, Prescot, the uncertainty/projection/gamble with the both of them is so big, that the guy with the worse grade could still end up becoming the better pro. Maybe the chance is better with Lynch, but not so much better that it justifies the distance between their respective draft position. At least this is the way I am thinking right now.
Love to add OL or DB talent in rounds one and 3…
年前再来转转！
I am no scout, but I am not excited about Lynch at 13. There are some things to like for sure – you can see he moves well for such a big dude and has a pretty good arm. But what does he really do well? In the tapes above it seems almost every throw is a first read, (bubble) screen or some such quick pass around the LOS. I understand that doesnt mean, that he can’t learn to read defenses, call adjustments and go through progressions in the pros. But you have to wonder about the level of projection. And wether his coaches are trying to shield him from those types of situations with the way they draw the offense up. Does he have the mental element to his game?
Agreed. He’ a trade down target and clearly a step below Wentz who is a step below Goff.
And that is why he is not the consensus no.1 pick. There are things that due to scheme and his current level of development that he has not shown he can do at a high level. However he has not shown he cannot do them either. Think he has an NFL body and athletic skills, seems a leader from reports and executed what his coach asked him to do. Rest is something he is going to have to develop – which is the fine line between being a franchise QB and a bust.
“Are his coaches trying to shield him with the way they draw up the offense?”
No.
Justin Fuente is a power spread guy. From an offensive philosophy standpoint he’s probably closest to Art Briles. Obviously Memphis uses some heavier personnel packages because they just don’t have the talent up front or the athletes that Baylor does.
I haven’t really fine tooth combed Lynch’s tape so I can’t say for sure where he is from a mental standpoint.
But Fuente was Dalton’s OC at TCU. Carr played an Air Raid derivative. Mariotta obviously was spread. Cam played in Mahlzahns offense which is far from traditional.
And guys not playing in a traditional offense isn’t as much of a concern as Bruce Arians would have you believe. Teams play increasingly out of the gun. 11 personnel is base in the modern NFL.
All three of the offensive gameplanners on the staff (Doug, Reich, DeFillipo) all come from systems with plenty of spread elements. Doug’s background with using Smiths mobility will help bring some extra elements while a QB develops.
Great stuff, thanks. Lots of knowledge here, keep it coming. I am not allergic to the spread or the gun at all BTW. But for those concepts to work in the NFL, they still require a QB who can think and do it fast enough to go through progressions, wouldn’t you say?
Casual observation… On Lynch he’s foles-like… slow/ long arm release on anything beyond throws at line of scrimmage. Definately a trade down option, but Out of curiosity has A. Rodgers release ever been compared to a previous qb. Or Is he in a league of his own?
I am not the right person to answer this. But as am amateur I always thought that Vicks release looked like one of the best there ever was. He just seemed to be able to twist and flick faster than anyone I remember, and he threw some pretty deepballs too, no ducks. Always wondered why people didnt bring him up, when they were discussing wether Rodgers or Flacco or Cutler had the strongest arm..
Because Vick’s marvelous arm tended to be used to mostly just hold the ball while he did his amazing running or just throw it 10 yards down to Algae Crumpler?
Probably. We gave that man a 100 mio. dollar contract, by the way.
He sort of looked 100 mil. for awhile there. good times!
I believed for a year, I dont mind admitting. Funny actually, I always liked watching Vick throw the ball. I know he wasnt a very good throwing QB, but his mechanics were smoother than anyones.
Ryan Tannahill at best…. I’ll pass…
what about lineman, Ive not kept up too much on those guys,
At 13?
Tunsil and Stanley will be gone.
Whitehair is going to be very good very early. But he’s a 24 year old guard. Would be very bad value with top tier guys still on the board.
Decker and Conklin are RT’s. I don’t particularly love either.
Spriggs is probably in play. He’s far more inconsistent than you would like but has a pretty big ceiling.
Amen on Decker and Conklin being less than choice for where they’ll be drafted.
And I saw first hand good Spriggs / bad Spriggs during the senior bowl.
I’d say he’s somewhere between a Lane and Jake Fisher.
I think he’s got a ceiling that is a little bit below Lane and he’s got a floor a little bit below Fisher (but higher ceiling) because he’s less polished.
is there a view on next year’s QBs?
I wonder about a trade down for a 2nd this year and an extra first next year?
This is assuming the QB left at 13 isn’t viewed as a can’t miss and the premier OTs are off the board.
I’m cool with that plan, but most of the guys on this site are really into the draft and don’t want to think about bailing out of round 1 this year with a fairly nice pick (potentially) at 13.
Highly doubt that the Eagles will find Wentz on the board at 13…. If we sign Bradford, it increases our chances of landing Wentz. Without Bradford, probably a good chance a team leaps ahead of us at the last minutes and steals Him… It’s what teams do when they know who you want. see Miami trading ahead of chip because they wanted Dion Jordan so bad..
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Add Lane Johnson to the name of playërs that are being vocal about strongly wanting Sam back
But shouldnt Bradford leaving give a team in front or behind us a QB, so one less team to take Wentz?
Also if teams wanna trade up in front just to avoid us taking a guy, be my guest, it backfires in most cases anyway.
I doubt there is only one team behind us desperate for a QB. Sam can’t solve 3 teams QB problems
There is really only the Rams close behind us and I really doubt Fischer will dare trade up for a QB.
You are assuming that the only teams that want a QB are dumb like we are drafting out of desperation. I see 3 or 4 teams with starting QBs that I wouldn’t be surprised to see Target one of these young Qbs
Teams rarely ever do that. They simply cant afford it because they are most likely fired next year if the team do not perform well
Which ones?
My feeling is that no matter how well he showed in the Senior Bowl, Wentz will not be a top 10 pick.
When is the last time a 1-AA QB went top 10?
Thats why.
Its a big jump for any player to go from that level to the NFL as we all know. But this isnt just any player playing any position. This is your QB! Taken that early, he is expected to not just jump to the NFL, but be the leader of the team and the face of the franchise!
That, more than any other position is a HUUUGE risk.
I think it takes a crazy front office to do it. That may just be Cleveland. But if they pass, I dont think he goes in the top 10.
When is the last time a 1-AA QB went top 10?
________________
In the last 35 years, only three non-Div I QB were 1st Rd picks:
* 2008 – Joe Flacco, 18th overall to the Ravens
* 1993 – Steve McNair, 3rd overall to the Oilers
* 1983 – Ken O’Brien, 24th overall to the Jets
And in that same 35 years, just three non-Div I QB were 2nd Rd picks:
* 2014 – Jimmy Garafalo, New England
* 2006 – Tavaris Jackson, Minnesota
* 1981 – Neil Lomax, Cardinals (2x All Pro – second team)
________________
What’s striking is that all three of the 1st Rd picks had some degree of success, with Flacco and McNair reaching the SB.
Awesome stat! Good work!
Ah yes, Lomax. Where great-grandmother bought her carpet.
So if you’re drafting a Qb are you pulling the trigger on a non D-1 Qb at 13? Seems like answer should be no.
Right. Cleveland may be crazy enough to take the risk so I cant say I rule it out completely. But I really think there is a super strong chance he is there after the top 10. Quite possibly on the board for us at 13.
Good work AC!
I knew that the only top 10 QB from that sort of school was McNair. Thats going back quite a while.
Even the most recent elite small shool QB prospect (Flacco) went 18th. Not top 10.
I mentioned this in the eagles blog and someone else did the research there too.
So, I thank you for also helping make my point here. I think its very very unlikely Wentz is gone in the top 10. Which leaves a strong chance he is on the board for us.
Though, I can see a crazy team like the Browns taking the risk at 2, it really is an unheard of thing to see a QB from that small of a program being taken so early.
Its just such a huge jump for any player, let alone a guy that you are basically handing the keys to the city to, and asking him to be the face of your franchise.
I bet that no matter how much teams like him, theyll have a difficult time pulling the trigger with such a premium pick.
Be a rough time in philly if he’s the pick, starts and sucks.
Im not crazy enough to think I’m qualified to judge every coaching staff… But from what I hear, Tomasula was BASHED because he put together a terrible coaching staff, got fired, and now some claim that Chip Kellys coaching staff is even worse than Tomasula’s was lol…… I can say that I feel bad for Laqaun Treadwell if that raw talent gets stuck working with Bicknell
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Lol @ drunk tank Donovan comparing himself to Cam newton… Lol you wish McNabb! At least Cam doesn’t refuse to run because he can’t stand the stigma of Black QBs.,
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When you get a DUI, you should have your drunken Twitter access revoked for one yeàr.
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Cam is the opposite of Mcnabb, he isn’t afraid to be himself, doesn’t care what others says, stays true to himself, and uses all the tools he was given to try and win games.
Omg if I hear another word about Buddy Heild aka Jodie Meeks Jr. im going to scream! People still confuse good college players with quality pro prospects.
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If you think Buddy is a top 5 pick, you need your head examined
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Ben Simmons is weak too, hopefully the Lakers draft him
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INGRAM or bust!!!!
It’s a weak draft after the top 2. You can find a lot of stuff wrong with everyone after Ingram and Simmons. Simmons is very athletic and he’s a great point forward prospect. Lots of guys can’t shoot as freshmen. Towns and Wiggins had lots of bad games.
Buddy Heild is not a top 8 prospect in ANY DRAFT CLASS, no matter how weak it is)
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I can name 5-7 wings that are better pro prospects than Buddy..
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Buddy Heild is the quintessential great college player who isn’t a special pro prospect
Not ideal but if teams are expected to go after Bradford and overpay, can we at least count on a 3rd or 4th round compensatory pick? Going to assume we won’t be bringing in any high dollar free agents with the signing of our own guys.
Assuming we don’t sign any FAs. Not exactly sure how Comp picks work but I know FA signings can cancel them out
Value of contracts is taken into consideration. If Sam signs a huge contract and we lose Thurmond to a decent-sized contract, if we pick up some mid-level free agents and a higher priced one similar to Thurmond, Sam will yield us at least a 4th, possibly a third.
http://www.phillyvoice.com/how-many-compensatory-picks-should-eagles-expect-receive/
Typical Kempski article, ask a question in the title…How many compensatory picks should the Eagles expect to receive?…Don’t put the answer in the article. Maybe he wrote the article so somebody would figure it out so he would have the answer for a future article. Journalizm!
Not sure how Philly Voice works, but traditionally the author of magazine/newspaper article doesn’t write the headline.
Not sure how digital media works, but the first paragraph was written as a response to the headline. Although he answers none, that is definitely not true.
Wait, so you think we’ll “definitely” be getting comp picks this year? For who?
The ones awarded this year will be from last year’s FA period. It’s pretty clear we signed way more Free Agents (and a couple to big dollar amounts) than we lost.
That is definitely true. Comp picks this year are based on the 2015 free agent season (and 2015 season), and we signed way more than we lost, so all lost players are canceled out. We will get no comp picks in 2016, which is what Kempski was answering.
Obviously, comp picks based on this year’s free agent market won’t be known until halfway through the 2016 season, and will be awarded in 2017.
Jesus, did you even read it?
The first word in the article answers the question. The rest of the article explains why.
TL;DR “Long story short, the Eagles acquired far more players in free
agency who qualified for comp picks than they lost, and thus will not be
awarded any of the 32 freebies handed out by the league.”
No. We’ll still sign a handful of mid to low tier FA. We have too many holes. They’ll cancel or dilute Bradford.
Teams that get comp picks are ones with fairly stable rosters that build almost exclusively through the draft.
Really depends how many we sign and when.
Thad Lewis
Cedric Thonton
At least 1 of Thurmond/Carrol
At least 1 of Ajirotutu/Biggers/Goode
All leave and would be resigned elsewhere on non minimum deals. Molk may leave as well but he is not getting much cash.
If we are careful in free agency and shop at the bottom of the market you can sign 1-2 guy and not offset Bradford’s contract. Then you just have to wait till mid May to start signing the 5-6 more vets you want to get in to compete for roster spots in camp.
I am not sure they do it, they may decide they can and want to spend in FA to retool somewhat and it is all moot but it is certainly possible.
Pick 97 in 2017 is not worth sitting out FA.
To what end? we are not contending in 2016 if we dump Bradford.
There is no quality WR to acquire in FA as it is a horribly thin and poor group (the biggest FA need i would spash cash for)
We can sign a OG for the kind of money Thornton is going to get in FA. Not sure you want to spend more cash than that on the OL as stop gap measures if you are keeping Peters.
What else do you want to sign? TE/RB has plenty of depth on Roster.
Defensively who do want to sign? DB? I want to bring back Thurmond so we would not be adding a starter in FA and i liked Sheppard in camp and Watkins at times late in the season. We have Safety depth.
LB is a need if we cut Meco and do not resign Goode but i think there is a chance we keep one or both.
DL is a question mark, They may want to spend more on DT but this is such a deep group i am unsure if you go there.
Our special teams unit hardly needs fluffing out hugely.
team has more holes than we think if fans really want to believe they can contend. I guess contending in the NFC east maybe a different story than actually contending with the top NFC teams and the league. I mean starting secondary isnt that special minus Jenkins. Starting Rowe, Max and Jacorey in the slot, 2 of those guys are unknowns. We havent seen that much from Rowe. Throw in Thurmond and who knows in a new scheme and if hes gone even more questions there. Linebacker in a 4-3 also changes a lot. Thats just the defense and like you said WR, they arent getting a number 1 guy so maybe a filler there at best. Gotta roll with the young guys and fill in the line. Im really hoping they move on from Bradford for this reason, so they truly rebuild and dont think they are close to contending.
I don’t doubt the team does. But I would rather see the young players with potential play and evaluate them. We can sign free agents in 2017, 2018. Players like Rowe have showed potential but it is currently uncertain if he is going to be a starting level CB. Would rather wait a year before committing $$ to the position. Same with LB’s. and i would agree about the DL if this draft was not so stupidly deep at the position.
Again we are not contending in 2016, so develop young players and build continuity and then add 2-3 guys in 2017 or 2018 to complete the roster.
“Again we are not contending in 2016” this is how we think, but i’m not sure it’s how Lurie thinks.
When we sign Jeff Allen and Mitchell Schwartz that alone will cancel out Bradford. Keep tryin to tell everyone #it’llbealright.
That makes sense. Just keep thinking about the franchise and trade discussion and while it would be nice to get something back it limits us with cap? Is general consensus that we just let him go?
Additionally the top available comp pick is pick 97. And it would be in the 2017 draft. It’s got about as much draft value as the return we got for Boykin and Barkley. Also 2017 will be diluted due to high number of underclassmen in 2016.
Comp picks may be the most overhyped part of the NFL.
Now that AC has cleared up my misconceptions about Tom Condon contracts, I am reserved to the fact the Sam will not be resigning here, barring some unforeseen free agent market for Sam. That being said, it seems pretty plausible that Chase Daniel will be signed to play the role of a young Doug Pederson while the Eagles roll the dice and draft one or more QBs this year to play the role of a young Donovan McNabb.
One thing that has me relatively confident is Howie seems to know when players will be taken in the draft and is not shy about moving around to accumulate picks.
I thought Chase wasnt a FA this coming season?
Yup, free agent for 2016 season…http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs/chase-daniel/
oh cool, thanks
I just realized with the dearth of quality kickers in the NFL, Caleb Sturgis or Cody Parkey will most-likely yield us a late-round draft pick in 2017.
hopefully Parksburg is healthy and ready to roll.. sturgis looks like gramaticas to much..
Do we stillhave Sturgis under contract past this last season? If so, we should definitely be able to get something for him. If not a pick, a swap for some role player that can help us
we do
Niiiiiiice!!!!!
Not to belabor the obvious, but the first decision the Eagles have to make is whether or not to sign Bradford, and if they do, to what kind of contract. If they tag and trade to one of the teams that pick before them, they could get one of top 2 or 3 QBs in the draft. They might even get their 2nd round pick back. Some of you guys know a lot more about this than I do. I am just floating an idea and would like to hear your views on it.
if i’m HOU, I’m doing everything I can to get Sammy. Thats where the value will be in a tag and trade. HOU has no chance of getting a top three QB In the draft with their position so I would easily send that to the Eagles.
Hoyer stunk in playoffs and generally stunk during the year too (I thought) but his numbers are way better than Sammy Bs during the year, plus he’s got history with the coach.
Sammy B might be gone, b/c Tom Condon, but not understanding what other reasons there be for wanting him to get paid crazy other than completion %. As ACV has said, he throws a pretty spiral. But if i’m howie i’m arguing that his numbers are all system related (see 2013 Foles, 2014 Sanchez) and i’d tag him or have him test the market.
I personally think we’re in a much better position with bradford, but i’d be happy to take Josh McCown (Better numbers than sam) from cleveland or chase daniels and roll.
that’s awesome. Howie to argue that the coach he got fired was the reason for success of the QB.
classic
chutzpah 🙂
isnt the problem with a tag and trade, you have to know that Houston will make that deal and you cant talk to them prior (wink wink). Seems like a tough deal to pull even still, otherwise youre stuck with a huge number for a season rental again.
plus gotta assume someone is willing to do a long term deal w/ sammy, and he proved last year that he can be really picky on deals, might scare people away.
wouldnt be the worst thing to have bradford under center next year and that is what the worst case scenario in a tag and trade. He may even play better after establishin some rapport with ertz and the wrs and then you give him a long term deal.
ya cant argue with that, this SB thing is just hanging in the balance. Will be interesting to see what the team does
Indeed… Very curious to see how it plays out..
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But I’m really interested to see How much the Jets are willing to pay for Continuty with Journyman Fitzpatrik,
,,,
Wish we fired Chip a year earlier. hOwie could have traded circus Peanuts for Brandon Marshall, allowing us to spend the Agholar position on another need like Byron Jones or an OLineman
I like Ags, but man if I could have had Jones and Rowe in one draft… BAM!
I think Ags has a very bright future in this league, but when we had a stud like Maclin, it was stupid to let him walk and create another hole in our Roster..
maclin, ROWE, and Byron Jones, is Infinitely better than Ags, Rowe and Demarco Murray (who I don’t Think would have been an eagle had we not lost MACLIN and devin McCourty turned down our offer)
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I really like Ags future, but it’s hard to see losing MACLIN and having to spend a first round pick on a WR as a smart move. Even if we kept MACLIN, wee still had so many needs that could have really used a first round talent..
Lets play alternate reality game.
*Weird music playing**
We keep Maclin. He is the reliable spark that catches the ball early season. Team hits its stride on offense, moving the ball well, in turn keeping time of possession at a reasonable level. Defense *STAYS* elite (it was, you know it was). Team crushes Carolina in the NFCCG and pounds Manning in his final game.
KC is stuck with only having a tight end as a reliable receiving threat. Never recovers from early season struggles, missing the one key piece they needed to be a good team.
Andy Reid retires at the end of the season (sorry I can’t have Andy fired again in my alternate reality). KC staff is wiped out. Ownership knows that their defense is the key becoming a great team. Hires the head of the best defense in the league to run the team Bill Friggin Davis.
Doug Pederson and Alex Smith decide they have had enough of this NFL life and move to San Diego to open a smoothy franchise.
Eagles hire Tommy Lawlor and D3FB to replace Billy D in a joint effort.
***fade to black***
chemistry would certainly help
If Sam stays healthy. He will most likely improve more and more with each year that passes On the same team, especially a team with Talent around him and good coaching
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When the season ended. Even a bradford hater would have to admit that he was still improving. Which is why I laugh when people think they have seen the best of him already.
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We thought we saw the best of Carson Palmer too after all those years in Cincy, and then Carson gets traded to a healthier situaton, gets CONTINUTY under a solid coach, put Talent around Him, and Carson went on to have an MVP candidate season
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If he stays healthy and goes to a solid team, I expect to see an Alex smith, Carson Palmer type of rebirth… Hopefully it happens while he is an eagle.
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I think there are somewhere around 15 QBs that can take a team to the Super Bowl, if you put enough Talent and coaching around them
i wonder if O’ Brien still has a desire to work with Hackenberg. I know Hack was garbage the last 2 seasons under Franklin, but if you watch him operate with BOB his freshman year it’s like watching a totally different QB (also helped that Allen Robinson won a bunch of jumpballs too)
I don’t think Hack will be taken within the first 3 rounds either, so it will be interesting to see who they have as a starter going into the pre-season. I think they may end up cutting Arian Foster, he will be 30 at the start of next season and will free up over 6 million
I could see a,situatipn like when everyone assumed Marone would draft his college QB Nassib. But ended up passing on him for another QB EJ Manuel.
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Im thinking that come draft night, either the Rams or the Texans will end up picking before the Eagles… Unless we extend Sam, then no one wil care about trading ahead Of us…
Marone didn’t pass on anyone.
Doug Whaley called the shots in Buffalo — and chose Manuel (and the next year over-paid for Watkins).
Second, the entire NFL — not just Buffalo — viewed Nassib as nothing better than a 4th Rd pick at best.
And Marone opted out of his contract. How about that?
TT:
You raised the caution flag before this past season that the Eagles could go 8-8 or 7-9.
In my book, you have more credibility when it comes to assessing potential outcomes for the Eagles than anyone I know.
AC you flatter me. I have to say… its the blind squirrel scenario. I just love the team and guess.
Wouldn’t be surprised if Peyton Manning ends up in Houston.
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I have a hard time believing a QB who makes the SB will quit. Guys like peyton seem like they will play until no one wants them, and he isn’t at that level yet
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Maybe if he wins he will really retire, but I can’t help feeling like he ends up playing another year or two with a different franchise
Manning to Houston?
Is that a joke? He can’t get the ball downfield.
He looks like a 40 year-old version of John Unitas when he landed on the Charger’s bench behind a rookie in 1973.
No chance.
I think he wins the Superbowl and rides off. At least that is what I am saying I predict.. I have no clue. Everyone is drooling over Carolina this year, like Seahawks last year, and Broncos the year before. That trend alone tells me the Broncos win. Even if they don’t I like going against the rest of the world (I grew up a 20 minute drive from the White House and I’m an Eagles fan… I have issues).
I think that TODAY, Peyton Thinks this is his last “rodeo”, but two months from now, I think he changes his mind… I get the Favre impression that he won’t go gently into retirement until each Franchise tells him that it’s time to go…a guy like that, who just took a team to the Super Bowl. IMo won’t be ready to walk away, obviously im sheer ly speculating since I have no clue what goes thru that mans mind…
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I can see Him two months from now thinking that why should he give up his love if he is still capable of competing with the right team around him… I don’t think he will sign with a team like the Browns because he wants to play so bad, but if a playoff team like the Texans that he thinks he can win games with is willing to let him prolong his career, I have a hard time believing he turns that down….
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But I’m certainly not a mind reader so maybe he is truly content with walking away now…
So you think a well run team will give up many assets and a lot of cap space to bring in a QB most people rate significantly below Alex Smith? I don’t get the logic in that.
I’d like to know how many times this type of deal has happened in the past. If I had to guess… not many times, and probably even fewer times with a QB. I like the idea of getting compensation, but I’m not holding my breath.
Cassel tagged in NE, traded to KC.
Sam’s stats this year are similar, although inferior, to Cassel’s in 2008 (and QB stats in general have risen).
Good recall. At least it is possible, though I would think Bradford won’t be as desirable as Cassel was after his dreamy season in NE. One can hope.
Not just that, but the landscape changes every year that goes by… I doubt we will be seeing many of those Cassell situations going fprward. And that has nothing to do with how Sam is evaluated… I just don’t think we will see those types of trades moving forward
This notion that we will get value trading Sam is a pipe dream.
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It’s bad enough Teams have to give him big money, no one is investing BIG MONEY, AND giving up valuable draft picks… Remember Desean Jackson situatuon? Teams want to either pay good money, or invest draft picks, Not BOTH!
Matt Cassel. QBs change the rules — much different than a situational WR, especially one that they were pretty sure would get released (as opposed to the tag). Giving up a draft pick may lower the amount they are willing to pay the QB, but that would not be the Eagles’ concern in that case.
Cassell trade happens years ago.. Landscape has changed since then… Just like 3 years from now the NFL landscape will be different than it is today..
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Obviously I wouuld rather get something for sam rather than lose him for Nothing, but It would really surprise me if we were able to get something for Sam on the franchise Tag… If we lose Bradford, then hopefully im wrong…
“Landscape has changed since then [2008]. . .”
_______________
That’s very pithy. But what does it mean?
How has the NFL’s QB-centric landscape changed?
Joel Corry is the flat out best cap / contract guy out there. I feel like I get smarter every time I read his stuff.
“NJ Advance Media’s Eliot Shorr-Parks believes the Eagles could move on from Darren Sproles this offseason.
Sproles will count $4.5 million against the cap in the final year of his deal, which is a lot to pay a third-down back and special teamer. With several stars to re-sign or extend, Philadelphia could use the $3.5 million in cap savings from releasing or trading the 32-year-old back. Ultimately, Sproles’ future could come down to whetheror not new coach Doug Pederson values niche weapons as much as his mentor Andy Reid seems to in Kansas City.”
i love sproles, but wouldn’t be upset cutting him if it helps retain some guys
Of if it helps us get a guy or two in FA who makes sense. I love Sproles, but it’s all about the future.
Rather retain our own players then overpay on the open market for playërs from other teams..
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Im ok with signing a free agent or two, but only if he is a player our new coaches know well and have Experiemce coaching him in the past, basically an offensive free agent from KC or the Chargers. Or a defensive free agent who Schwartz knows from his time with the bills and Titans..
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Every Once in a while you land a quality FA like Runyon that pans out for a long time, but more times than not, free agent shopping has done more bad than good…
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If we are going to overpay, over pay our own players or free agents that our coaches know well… Not interested in having to guess on Charechter, footbal.IQ, work ethic, team player vs a diva..
saw this and ignored it bc ESP was source.
except hes one of the few guys who makes things happen out there. Id hate to just call that a third down/STeamer. Hes totally worth paying since his production imo earns it. If Doug likes screens like AR likes screens, hes def staying. I would understand it though if they go entire rebuild mode which probably means if SB isnt in their equation. Then I get it but at that point is he even tradeable to another team for a pick?
Sproles is also a great locker room veteran which comes in handy during a coaching change, not to mention, It’s never a bad idea to expose new rookies and young players to Sproles legendary work ethic and practice habbits.
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Id rather lower his cap number with an extension instead of cutting him, but I’ll support whatever they decide when it comes to the RBs… In the next two years we need to add some youth to that backfield
feel like it says more about the team that they’re trying to hold on to a 45 yo running back.
Do you remember Brian Mitchell’s time with the Eagles? Even old Specialist RBs have value.
Not saying he doesn’t have value probably produces more than he earns, but at some point gotta say enough is enough, let replacements get that experience. I guess it’s that “we aren’t one player away argument” that people use with SB.
Sproles’ YPC and YPR were the lowest since 2009 and 2007, respectively, by 10.5% and 17%.
Also, the Eagles paid him $3.5 million more than any other punt returner.
He’ll be 33 on opening day.
He’s not worth the $4.5 million he’s slated to make.
He’s worth $9 million if it keeps Barner out of games and/or off of the roster.
But I agree what they get from Sproles isn’t befitting that salary.
B Mitch is one of my all time favorite Eagles and should be in the Hall of Fame. He’s the greatest special teams player in the history of the NFL and is 2nd to only Jerry Rice in all time yards.
Roseman doesn’t roll salary into signing bonuses to save cap space.
Jerry Jones does that. And he’s a jack ass.
sad that sproles gets cut over murray
Unless two Independant sources are saying the same thing, An ESP report is irrelevant..
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Id prefer keeping Sproles and getting Rid of mathews or Murray, but all 3 need to be gone by this time next year, so I really don’t care which we get rid of first.
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Seems to me like Sproles has plenty left in his “Tank” so I wouldn’t be surprised if they extend him looking to get the cap # down…
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Think sproles can be a bigtime weapon in Our passing game, more than he ever was under chip
be interesting to see. When their primary back is in his usage stats are crazy.
I’m alright with that. Was nice knowing ya Darren.
I can vibe on that logic as long as I’m presented with better return man talent than Huff and Barner.
https://twitter.com/howardeskin/status/694228777363066880
not surprised but ouch.
I’d be shocked if Fletcher wasn’t asking for at least that.
Joe Banner not making it easier with the “don’t look at old deals”.
JJ Watt got $100mill……. but then after that the next highest 3-4 DE is Cam Jordan @ $55mill total…. so it sounds like its going to be JJ Watt, Fletch and then everyone else.
…and Suh
GERALD McCoy!.. Mohammed Wilkerson probably will get Cox type money
^^^see picture above
do you wait for the Mo Wilkerson numbers to come out before finalizing?
…we gotta WOW fletch with guaranteed money to get lower total contract IMO
yeah def a dance.
No.. Because I’m not sure Mo deal gets done before free agency and if he hits the open market, we won’t want THAT deal to set the market for Cox
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If we give Cox 100mil. And Jets give Mo 100mil, I would assume the terms of the contract Roseman hands out, will be better than the terms of the contracts Mo gets, even tho the numbers will be similar…
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Think hOwie will do better just dealing with Cox, instead of letting Mo’s deal set the market…
Except we’re going to look at Cox as a 4-3 DT so that doesn’t make any sense.
yeah almost wish would have done the deal last year – way different metrics. Gotta get deal done before this season.
Howie won’t pay Cox Suh money that’s for sure. I’m expecting Cox to get something similar to Gerald McCoy’s contract.
Defensive lineman. ranked by total contract.
HOW IN THE HELL DID SUH GET 52.4% GUARANTEED?!!?!?!?! Who he think he is Revis?
see below….. he is asking for Suh type money.
Has he earned that?
Not yet but the Eagles would be paying him for what they think he can do under a 4-3 scheme with Schwartz.
Fletcher Cox could ask for the moon from the Eagles and probably get it.
You think after Reggie left all those years ago we are going to let another potential All-Time-Franchise player walk? Eagles fans old enough to remember Reggie would not be happy if Cox were allowed to walk due to money (I was 6 when Reggie left town, so contracts didn’t make sense then haha).
hope you’re right
We have to take care of Fletcher and Vinny before we even start talking with Sam.
totally agree. just hoping it plays out like we want
The last thing we need to worry about is losing Cox
I was in HS when Reggie left. It was traumatic. Like I hope Norman Braman and Tom Gamble wind up burning in hell together for eternity level of traumatic.
Braman has been VERY busy funding Rubio’s campaign. Been the single biggest contributor to Rubio’s main super PAC:
“His main super PAC, Conservative Solutions, has raised $16.6 million,
making it the third largest cash cow behind those of Jeb Bush and Ted
Cruz. It holds $5 million from Braman Motorcars, $3 million from the
Oracle Corporation, and $2.5 million from Benjamin Leon, Jr., of Besilu
Stables. (Those horses are evidently betting on Rubio.)”
http://www.tomdispatch.com/post/176097/tomgram%3A_nomi_prins%2C_the_big_money_and_what_it_means_in_election_2016/#more
Braman is his most important single backer and is rumored to be willing to spend up $25M to get Rubio into the White House.
And what I find more offensive than most of Rubio’s policies is that Braman made so much of that money to fuel his car empire by refusing to reinvest his earnings from the Eagles in the Eagles.
The only fun element of the discussion is that Braman is throwing his money into the toilet.
Braman was a pretty wealthy guy before he bought the Eagles and he didn’t benefit from a new stadium opening like Lurie did which received decent public dollars.
If anything, Braman has been very vocal and vociferously pursued legal actions against Miami-Dade County for the massive shenanigans they pulled in funding the Marlins’ new stadium.
He is one guy though that if you bring his name up with some of the older Eagles’ beat writers you don’t get a very pleasant reaction or fond memories of his time here.
Knew he was from Philly but didn’t realize he was born in West Chester & grew up in the city too.
I’m sure I’d have a ton of trouble finding the article(s) from the early 90s, but local writers were reporting Braman (for the early 90s) was walking away from the Eagles every year with some very hefty profit margins……………while letting Keith Jackson, Reggie White, Keith Byars, Clyde Simmons, Seth Joyner, Eric Allen, and William Thomas all walk away.
F him.
That is what I remember too and he was knocked for being a very cheap owner here who treated players and people who worked for the team pretty shabbily.
BS77:
True Braman didn’t get a new stadium.
But he did benefit enormously by the renegotiated stadium lease Tose worked with then-mayor Wilson Goode in 1984.
During the ’84 season, Tose’s gambling debts led to his threats to move the Birds to AZ. (Most folks know that.)
Sadly, within a year, Tose’s financial situation cratered so quickly that Braman was able to buy the Birds in 1985.
Braman paid $65 MM in 1985.
He sold to Lurie in 1994 for $185 MM.
Braman cleaned up all the way around.
And he was always very clear that, to him, the Eagles were nothing but a investment.
My Uncle Toot, who was a degenerate gambler too, and he actually knew Tose fairly well from his time down in Atlantic City.
Remember him discussing Tose once or twice and saying how generous he was when he won with tipping.
Wasn’t Braman a water boy for the Eagles too when they used to train out at West Chester?
I don’t think your wrong in classifying Braman’s perspective in largely viewing the Eagles as an asset he was looking to trade up on. He has done that his entire career.
Higher on the Forbes #500 list than I thought.
Shame Pat Crocce wasn’t about 15 years older.
i thought you guys were talking about Bryan Braman and i was trying to figure out why an ST guy had that kind of spending money
Hilarious Cox and his agent just sent a text message with a picture of the moon literally.
Howie’s trying to find Gru’s phone number on Banner’s old rolodex.
I would think that what the Eagles decide to do with Jason Peters will give us a hint on what they plan on doing about Sam.
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If we are going to let Sam get away, then there is really no point in continuing to pay JP all that money. I think Sam and JP should be a package deal, we either get rid of both, or keep Both.
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Think its best to decide if we want to rebuild, taking a few steps backwards to eventually move forward, or if we think that retaining our own players and drafting well the next two years will allow us to contend? If we are going to start over drafting a young QB who may not even pan out for us, then there is no reason to pay Peters all this money going forward.
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Extending our own young Talent: Lane, Ertz, Cox doesn’t mean we aren’t rebuilding. Even if we plan on rebuilding, you still want to retain those young players… The Peters and Bradfod decisipns will really tell us how this new regime views the current state of our team.
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I expect to see a handful of players who will be better because of the scheme changes, and I expect a handful of young players to be better just by further developing as young players… At some positions, the coaching change should also lead to some growth. I have no idea what type of coach Greg Lewis is, but I have to imagine that he will be better for our young players than Bob Bicknell was, THATS for sure..
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Two quality drafts in a row should be enough to get this team back to being able to compete with the top teams, but not if the QB play ISNT up to par.
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If we see The Eagles axe Jason Peters, then there is no reason to even continue the bradford debates.
See the Eagles are prioritizing the young core for now n the future… Eagles either believe Sam is the franchise QB or not.. Peters either gets cut, traded or resigns/restructured like Celek.. Think he stays n has a better season with out the stress of the Ferrari tempo.. Sam signs then i dont see them going QB at 13.. Sam doesnt resign i say go QB at 13.. A QB will be drafted no matter what with only Sanchez on the roster
That would be nice (Peters having a bounceback season) just don’t think it’s very likely at all. It’s like 2010 when everyone was saying Ryan Howard likely had many years before he started to decline. At the age and size Peters is at, the overwhelming probability is that he gets worse (ability and durability wise), not better, getting forward, no matter what system it is.
I think JP can have a better season, huddling and slowing the tempo down… I assume playing at chips crazy tempo is More of a young mans game for OL..
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less Practice reps each week because we slow the tempo down, and a coach who is looking to Run 60 plays a game instead of 90, could be good for a veteran like JP…
And if JP eventually spenda the end of his career at Guard, then I def think can get two good years out of him…. But if they are going to go with a young QB, Id rather rip the Peters band aid Off now… No reason to pay that much to block for a young QB who is a few years from being worth a damn, and that’s if the QB we draft even pans out which is far froma guarentee..
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Conversly, if Bradford is our QB next year, I would be annoyed if we cut JP
When I complained to Kempski on Twitter that his FA target list sucked because it didn’t include Mitchell Schwartz, he claimed he’s hearing that the Eagles are going to keep Peters.
Grrrr
My thoughts exactly. I was all kinds of hyped up for operation salary cut & position swap…………..but to no avail.
That’s fine, Id rather keep Peters and Bradford, why? Because I care more about giving us the best chance to win, then I care about Cap space. No matter what your cap looks like, you can always clear cap space, adjust contracts, convert Salary to signing Bonus and all types of Cap gymnastics that Roseman has up his sleeves… Id rather keep our veteran LT and QB..
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However, at some point in the not so distant future, we will have to replace JP. If we are going to draft GAbbert Junior, Baby Ponder, or Lockert the 2nd, now is the time to rip the Peters band aid off and look to transition to the next era of Eagle OL
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But if we keep Sam, than I would hate to lose JP..
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Really makes no sense to me to keep one of them… Keep both, or axe both
If you’re going to blow up the QB spot and lose Peters………….then I really need Mitchell Schwartz.
If we can’t pass the ball we really really need to be able to run it.
edit to add: I like Peters, but my 2016 prediction goes something like this: plays 6 games goes to Pro Bowl anyway.
And I’m not sure how Barbre Doll, Turnstile Tobin, and/or Can’t block anybody over 275 Kelce are helping that.
gardner is our only Guard that I would even want to see compete for a starting position…. Barbre could probably be worth a backüp role (HASNT he also played Tackle for us in the past?)
…
But to me, it doesn’t make much sense To keep Gardner, Tobin. And Barbie doll… At the most, keep two of them, and axe the 3rd (doubt any have trade value)
Wasn’t he out Gardening when we needed him this year?
You might be confusing him with Samwise Gamgee… or maybe not.
I wish our Gardner was this reliable!
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/f9/ca/f3/f9caf37fe178bb79638b138d29e12169.jpg
If Surgery = Gardening, then yes…
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Think he was easily beter than Turnstile Tobin,… Barbie Doll missed 2014
I’m just not into projecting guys who have no track record and get hurt into starting roles.
Neither the hell am I… I said, Gardner is the only one of the three I even WANT COMPETING for a starting Spot..
If we’re starting Daniels or Sanchez, why even bother? Just Hinkie it and hope some college QB actually makes it worth drafting him #1 overall next year.
Basically…. Getting out Of the sanchez contract, so we can sigń Chase Daniels sounds Ridiculuos to me… Lateral moves are a waste of time. Unless we are significantly UPGRADING, no reason to be cutting playërs who are under contract … Especially if we are talking about a Baby sitter like Doug Pedrson with mcNabb…
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mark Sanchez sucks! But if we are talking about a guy playing the Doug Pederson role for the young QB we draft, Sanchez does not need to be replaced. Maybe if Sanchez was a free agent, it makes some sense to add Daniels instead, but Sanchezis a veteran who knows our players and is under contract, he is fine to be some rookies temporary babysitter…silly to make a lateral move for a backüp QB, unless replacing Sanchez with Daniels saves a significant chump of cap space
I agree except for Sanchez seems like hes mailed it in at this point. Not that their play would make too much difference but maybe a younger guy like Daniels coming from KC can be a better filler.
If Sanchez knew he would get to start the season like Doug Pederson did when we drafted Donovan, I would assume he would no longer mail it in, and try to take advantage of an opportunity to try and get his value up, since it’s not a given that he will get many other opportunities to play going forward, unless he makes something out of an opportunity to start the first half of the season
Because even with Daniels or Sanchez the division is winnable next season with a strong oline and good/great defense, which we can have.
I believe in free agent’s when you can get them in their prime and for a reasonable deal. My assumption on Schwartz is that he is prime, and that the market for him won’t be outrageous. If I have Schwartz and an OG from free agency (Jeff Allen etc) then I am feeling really good about not having to draft for need this year.
I have flexibility to take a QB if I like one, or try to get a dominant player at any other position for the team… or even trade back or out of round 1 this year to really Hinkie things.
Flexibility in this draft starts by building our oline of the near future this offseason.
Maybe the Patriot league is winnable with Daniels or Sanchez at QB, but no NFL division will be. The only question to be asked at that point is 2 or 5 wins?
No problem with drafting OL early and often this year. But if the plan for QB next year is Daniels or Sanchez, might as well get realistic about what the results will be now.
If they clear up that much cap space, and piss away the best QB I have seen in Eagle green during the better part of this decade, then THEY BETTER spend some money and get me someone BIGTIME like Eric Berry, or whoever the big name free agents are this year… Piss away our QB and LT, and I want at least two Big time defensive additions, but if we pay for free agents, I want guys who our coaches know well having coached them before. I want to know that we are getting a selfless team player, I want to know that we are getting someone who works his ass off instead of living in the trainers room, plays thru injury, solid football IQ, I want to know that our coaches have plenty of experience with that player and are comfortable betting on him giving us our money’s worth in the schemes we plan on running…. Basically the exact opposite of Chip signing Demarco
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But generally, if we are going to over pay, Id rather overpay to keep our own players, and Hope to NEVER again see a situation where we overpay for a free agent from another team, who no one in our staff has experience working with behind the scenes
How much trade value do you think Peters has though now with his current contract numbers and numerous health issues especially the lower back problems?
Id consider us extremely lucky to get a 5th round Pick for him…but his age, salary and going in an out of the lineup all year probably makes it more like a 6th rd pick
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Realistically, best case scenario is probably some conditional contract where the percentage of snaps he plays for his next team determines if they would give us a 7th, 6th, 5th if we are extremely lucky and JP has a healthy monster season…
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I think teams are ok paying for a veteran like him, but I’m not sure many teams will line up to give up a decent pick AND pay his contract
Might be easier to get value for JP, if we were to draft a young Tackle, and we find out that he can play right away, and come August if a contender racks up a few injuries to key Lineman, might be easier To then get value for a rental type, like a 34yr old expensive JP..
Kind of what I figure too given the considerable $ and health-related issues. Basically a 5th-6th round (maybe a conditional 4th but it would probably have to have a crazy amount of offensive snaps; maybe +95%)
No.
Thumbs up
You’re creating a false equivalence.
Peters is under contract.
Bradford is not.
Furthermore, why would release Peters only to create another hole on the offensive line?
At QB, the Eagles already have an opening — and need to sign someone, or draft someone, even if Sanchez stays.
Indeed, and realistically any free agent who could even competently hold down RT is going to cost more than the cap saving of cutting Peters in 2016. Think he stays for a range of reasons, not just his play, but because the Eagles do not want to ‘repeat’ the mistakes of 2015 of cutting big lockeroom guys and replacing them with mercenaries.
Schwartz wouldn’t be a mercenary. He is a high character high quality RT who allows Lane to shift over to LT and perhaps create the bookends we need for the next 5 years or more.
Or, we can hang onto an aging star player. I like Peters and wish he had a chance to win a ring here in philly, but it’s time for him to move on. It will be harder than it was with Tra, but it’s the same thing.
Yup!
It is about perception not reality. All big money free agents walk into a locker room considered as a merc. which is especially hard when the team has just cut a Hall of Famer to make space for you.
I don’t want a free agent RT…. If you lose Bradford, axe that Peters contract, move Lane to the Left side now, and draft a RT to block for a rookie QB years away if that from being any good
might as well get something out of the $$ you’re paying Lane. He’s ready to move to the left.
I do question the thinking behind linking both Peters and Bradford together this year. I don’t see the connection if they keep or move on from Peters that relates to Bradford. If they move on from Peters would indicate that the think Lane is ready for the LT position and even then I still don’t think that will play any factors in the QB position. No one player on this team will determine the FO’s decision on Bradford imo.
Spot on, TD.
That sort of tied move is the kind of thing you’d hear on sports talk radio . . . like when someone says, “The Phillies should trade Ruiz, Galvis, and Dom Brown for Trout because the Angels needed a SS last season.”
Ok…
If you think I am wrong in what I said please chime in, I am very curious to hear your opinion on it. Where is it that you are getting that their is a correlation between Bradford and Peters being linked together to see which one or both will be here next year?
EXTENDING OUR COX IS A MUST
Jimmy Johnson is nodding in agreement to this statement.
I don’t even concern myself with that..,. Honestly, I swear I would bet my Car on Cox still being here two years from now, if anyone is batshit crazy enough to take that bet,.. Let me know..
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I think the extension is a forgone conclusion. Only real question is How Much will it cost, and when wilL it get done?
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As Long As Norman Braman doesn’t re purchase the Eagles in the near future, there is no reason to worry about the Cox extension.
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DT has become a premier positipn teams build around. maybe if you have a guy like Leonard Williams and Sheldon Richardson, you can consider not paying Wilkerson, but you aren’t letting Cox walk when all you have is Logan and Hart behind him… Heck we are going to let a quality young starter in Thornton Walk because we will retain Cox… I really wouldn’t worry about
If you don’t pay a guy like cox sends a terrible message to anyone else on the team. For better or worse most talented dude we’ve had on defense in a minute.
yeah it’s like “hey better not get TOO good, now” and next thing you know we really are the browns
Picking a QB out of this class is a bad idea at 13. Wentz/Lynch are Losman/Boller type plays, and Goff is not likely to succeed in the NFL as a regular starter.
I think, for the most part, the Wentz boomlet is a headfake. Most of these coaches remember 2011 all too well.
The major issue with Wentz is that he was just a lot more talented than his competition, meaning that you get the sort of scouting headfakes that you get with players that are dramatically older and more mature than their competition. However, his tape, at least of 2015, does not show him as a particularly dynamic driver of the offense. He generally makes the plays that are there, but he doesn’t actually *make* plays. If his WRs do work, Wentz gets the ball to them. However, whenever his WRs have been challenged by a defensive secondary up to the task, Wentz does not compensate and elevate the offense as needed. If you draft Wentz and start him in 2016, you are mostly likely going to end up with some flavor of EJ Manuel. His tape certainly isn’t really as good as Blake Bortles work at UCF. And Bortles definitely was never a serious high first round prospect.
Neither Wentz or Lynch are as outstandingly physically talented that anyone should ignore technical capabilities. They get all of this consideration mainly because they’re white guys with suitably large frame and a genuine NFL caliber arm. They don’t typically act stupid on the field, nor do they screw up routine plays. This doesn’t mean that they don’t have value, but honestly? These are low first early second round plays that you really want to sit for a good long while. Much better bet on a team with a starting caliber QB.
Echos my fear of the downside of taking one of these guys. I’m going to do a lot more reading as this process rolls on.
I find it laughable that so many people think you can just go into any draft and pluck a franchise QB whenever you need one.. Talk about convenient
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People seem to overlook the fact that there are plenty of drafts that don’t produce any franchise QBs.
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I haven’t forgotten the GAbbert, Lockert, Ponder draft, and I haven’t forgotten the EJ manuel, Geno Smith,Matt Barkley and Nassib drafts, and I damn sure don’t feel comfortable assuming this QB class will be significantly better… Id consider a team lucky if they got one Ryan Tannahill level QB out of this draft class, IF THAT…
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Punt on a QB, and hope we can get our hands on someone much better in 2017 or 2018, and even that is far from a lock…. Considering this reality, makes much more sense to have Sam starting for us the next few years while we are hunting for our FUTURE Franchise QB… Drafting QBs out of desperatipn ISNT the healthiest idea as far as Im concerned. Fortunately I really like what I saw out of Sam… I would hate to not like Sam at the same time where I hate this QB draft class, that would depress the heck out of me
Not drafting a QB is i see another reason for Chips downfall.. Sticking with FOles n passing up on Carr n Bridgewater.. 2nd year in n look what they did to their franchise.. New regime you need your QB.. If Sam is that then sign him if their is doubt then dont sign him.. Cant play the waiting game too long coz our core players will have aged past their prime
Drafting a QB just to draft a QB Wasnt solving chips problem either..
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I think when you have a chance to draft a QB you LOVE, you draft him regardless of if you NEED him Immediately or not.. And forcing any pick out of desperation is a mistake
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I think if you take the best players available and not worry about positions, put together two quality drafts in a row, you will end up with a quality team on up your hands… When you force picks and they misfire, THATS exactly how u end up having to go on silly free agent shopping sprees that rarely come close to panning out…
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Missing on draft picks is the worst thing you can do in my eyes.. Id rather hit on draft picks and tie up cap space any day instead of blowing draft picks but having Cap space..
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Instead of worrying about Free agency, or targeting positions out of desperation which can increase odds of making a mistake. I think that if a team hits on picks and puts together a couple drafts in a row, they will put themselves in position to contend.
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IMO there is Nothing worse than misfiring on draft picks. It has a trickle down effect that becomes all types of dysfunctipnal
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And If possible, I believe it’s healthier to replace starters when you have someone on the bench already that you trust to take his place, and that its ALWAYS best if possible to not get rid of a starter and then worry about finding his replacement…
It is not that easy. You could spend 20 years be in a position to draft a QB you love. I loved Andrew Luck? could i draft him? hell no. Loved Mariota, could i draft him hell no?
So unless we loose 14 games in a 1 in 3 year with a transcendant QB prospect you will need to try and work a little harder than that.
Evaluate, find someone with the skills, tools and mentality you think you can shape into an elite QB and draft him. And keep doing it until you succeed. Fear of failure is not an option – it leads no where but mediocrity and then failure.
LOL really dude?
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If you “Find someone with skills, tools, and mentality you think you can shape into an elite QB” why the Fuck wouldn’t you LOVE HIM? What else factors into QBs you LOVE? His cock size? Ability to play the Piano?
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I thought the BS semantics game would be gone with Chip, but apparently not.
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I would call a guy you think you can win with and bet your coaching career on would be considered a guy you Love, but Apparemtly you are using some fuckd up up thesaurus that im not privy too.
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Im talkimg about not spending a 1st round pick on whoever the best QB is that you can get your hands on… Why the hell would I be against someone drafting a QB they think they can win with? I would want to draft THAT player whether we paid Sam or not..
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But thanks…
Because just because he has the tools, does not mean you love him or he is a sure thing. Please for the love of god stop using definitive statements and perspectives on things that are not can can never be definitive.
Things are never Black and White in talent evaluation!
Take the ‘big 3’ QB’s in this years draft. They all have the raw tools to succeed in the NFL, they have the size, arm strength and clean off the field. What they all lack is NFL style experience and highly developed skills. Now those can be learnt and developed, you are not born an NFL QB, you develop into one. It is entirely possible to like Lynch’s skill set and not be in love due to the fact he lacks the experience and polished skills. What i am arguing is you have to take that risk and try to develop those skills, because there is no likehood of us getting a No.1 pick in an Andrew Luck draft any time soon… and i think it is more likely (and a lot fucking cheaper resource wise) to believe that Wentz/Lynch can develop those skills as young QB’s than Bradford in Y6 in the NFL.
Omg …… Im not getting anything of value out of your bullshit semantics crap. Take that shit to San fran with Chip…
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Enjoy your evening player…
ROFL
I need to learn to not bother. Wish we had a mute button.
No, when your period passes, you will get back to using some part of your brain and be smart enough to Understand that it’s not even possibke for anyone to make definitive statements when it comes to this discussion about something that hasn’t happened yet. You owuld have to read Roseman, Bradfird, Lurie and Pedersons mind to make a diffinitive statement, so anyone with half a brain, automatically understands that we are just giving opinipns, and not very informed opinions at that, more like opinions of impressions we get from a far based off a fraction of the Info needed to make a decision, so there is no need to be a bitch and expect someone to spell out that fact every time they want to make an opinipn.
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I know you are smart enough to understand this, so take a deep breath, change your tampon, maybe rub one out, and get back to me… MUah!
That makes no sense at all. Have you actually read what i wrote? To quote you:
“Understand that it’s not even possibke for anyone to make definitive statements when it comes to this discussion about something that hasn’t happened yet.”
Thats exactly what i was saying to quote my previous post:
“Please for the love of god stop using definitive statements and perspectives on things that are not can can never be definitive.
Things are never Black and White in talent evaluation!”
I mean really >_<
Careful.
You have already reach Internet bravado Defcon level 2 – mysogynistic comments and level 3 – the oddly capitolized closing that might denote a kiss.
The next level includes an odd combination of homophobic comments and requests for fellatio from male commenters.
No one wants to see that.
Maybe can’t pick a QB in the first round unless he grades out for you to be something really special because missing in the first round hurts of course. But also to “find” the five franchise QBs that are found per decade you need to be aggressive and cant just wait to have the number 2 pick when a freakin Winston AND a Mariotta are coming out. (Well, OK, so we were lucky with the 2nd pick when McNabb was coming out). Still jealous of Titans and Bucs.
I am simple minded, so maybe if i was GM i would just make it a rule to pick a QB in the 3rd round every year, the best QB prospect left in the 3rd, until one sticks, and a first round or 2nd round QB if only truly special.
Chips case was drafting or getting a QB that made him successful.. Believing in that repetitive accuracy then settling for statue QBs is his own doing.. Foles was not the answer.. Chip had the choice to get someone but too stubborn.. Thinking his new way will still succeed
I like Bradford but there is the doubt in my mind n 6 years the league to show me he might not pan out or get injured again.. He finished strong but its hard to rub out what he has n hasnt done.. Just like Billy D being hired the record n results was there but Chip still got him
Drafting a QB might be a need but why cant it be BPA which just happens to be a need
I hear ya on the misfiring on draft picks.. 2011 shows you what not to do.. Fear should be gone from drafting if the research is done properly on the player
yeah, Tannehill level sounds about right, and I never and still dont like Tannehill. I just cannot accept the bad luck to have the number 4 pick in an awful QB year, or the reality that this year the “big 3” that are seen as first round picks, have Tannehill as their freaking ceiling. Ok, just Bradford, franchise him and move on. Or Cardale Jones in the 3rd. Might rather have Cardale “Good enough to put a team on my back to win the national championship, but not good enough to start” Jones and a first round OT, then any of the big three QBs in the first round.
Worse is having big nick go 27-2 in the year before a bunch of good qbs were taken. That QB class might turn out better than 2012 class.
But they are qbs, hence they will go earlier than they “should.”
Also true, but you have to ask yourself (as a team)……do we want our neck out and jobs on the line for this guy.
It’s scary.
Im sure teams ask themselves that all the time. The draft is a crapshoot for the most part.
But I need loaded dice for our turn throwing them.
Unfortunately we do not suck enough to have loaded dice this time round. will need to take a risk, because there is no ‘safe’ option. Giving Bradford $20mil a year is not ‘safe’, signing chase daniels is not ‘safe. Drafting a 3rd round QB is not ‘safe’.
We do not have ‘safe’ options because we are not sat at No.1 in the draft with Luck in our draft class. Every move has risks, i would rather try for greatness than settle for mediocrity.
I don’t think so. Think about it. What is Hue likely to think? Do I want to work my QB magic on a retread + plus some uber-raw player drafted in the later round (or wait for next year)? Or do I want to try and make someone like Wentz great? I know Haslam would want him to make someone like Wentz or Lynch good now.
The flip side is that there is a surfeit of good looking defensive talent this year. I mean, is Jalen Ramsey a horrible pick at number 2? *Really*? When it comes down to something like that, I think Hue is going to want a reasonably sure talent/refinement pick on D than someone like Wentz. And that probably will go for all the teams to the number of truly good picks lasting… We might actually get to pick someone with real talent pretty far down, like with Fletcher Cox.
Q: What is Hue likely to think?
A: I really hope that Jimmy doesn’t actually bring in RG3 based on being obsessed with that guy from 4 years ago.
Retread with the best chance of working out, assuming you can get him at all is Geno Smith.
Sounds like Whaley was going to sit on Geno for another year.
interesting that bryce petty hasn’t been good enough to take that backup roll. Some people were high on him – maybe could be had for a 7th?
Backwards comment on my part. Got Geno backwards with EJ.
You had me going and appreciating your posts and then you drop Geno Smith as a player to acquire?
Geno’s problem is that he has horrible brainfarts way too often.
When you’re not going NO GENO DON’T!!!!, he’s a pretty high quality young QB. If a coaching staff can actually get him to be a consistent decisionmaker, yeah hard job, you’ll actually get a reasonably good qb.
Every year there usually, probably always, a defensive tackle worth taking in the first round. And an offensive tackle, and a wide receiver worth it.
But not every year has a QB worth taking in the first round. But still hard every year not to have at least one or two QBs taking in first round by QB desperate teams. Just a matter of luck and patience if when your team is QB desperate there is one or two first round QBs worth taking and still there when your team picks. Or a matter of patience for your QB desperate team to have sitting there in the first round the “best QB prospect” of the year who actually any other year is a 3rd round value, to not take the best remaining QB.
I am too impulsive and I can squint hard enough and rely on hope too much, to have patience if i was a GM for a QB desperate team, to not take a QB in the first round even if not worth it. I should go work for the Browns.
problem is ESPN hypes all these guys every year for ratings – who cares how good he is – so it’s hard to really evaluate and project who will have success. Johny Cash was considered a No. 1 pick by some. People though Geno was a 1st rounder.
Shah8:
Your comment raises the important question of how teams deal with the competing factors of “relative value” and “absolute value” when setting a draft board.
Well Bortles went No.3, and is looking a damn good NFL QB and a great pick. Goff/Wentz/Lynch are not Luck/Mariota/Winston grade prospects. So what? If they were that good they would not be draftable by the Eagles.
Yes 2011 QB draft class struggled. But the 2014 class is looking great outside of a headcase addict.
I would rather draft a QB who has all the tools to be great and to project them to develop their pro games than a QB who lacks the physical tools to ever be great.
As for value it is whatever the fuck the market makes them to be. Bortles was a top 5 pick because that is what the market said his value was worth. QB’s with clean off the field, good size and good arms with athletic ability go at a premium. Thats the NFL. For every 2-3 Ponders there is 1 Big Ben or Flacco or Aaron Rogers. And it is SO MUCH easier to build a contending team with an Elite QB than any other way.
I’d say Bortles is only okay.
As an evaluator of talent, we really need to stop overvaluing counting stats by QBs that lose a lot.
The reality is, Bortles would have never been able to move the ball against Seattle’s D the way Bridgewater did, and he would have almost certainly replicated Andrew Luck’s performance against the Patriots in the playoffs had he been in charge of the Vikings’ O vs Seahawks. Bridgewater has worse stats, but he is *much* better than Bortles.
Also, there seems to be a good deal of evidence that Bortles is a product of his receivers in the sense that Stafford was a product of Megatron’s ability, even in good years.
He is in year 2. He is developing, and was a less polished passer than Bridgewater coming into the league. But his upside is significantly higher than Bridgewater and they have done what good teams do to young QB’s on cheap contracts – surround them with talent to help them out. Evaluate QB’s in year 3-4 but so far he is pretty much right on where you would want his development to be.
bortles is much better at throwing a catchable deep ball, especially on the run. I’m not sure that+presumably the size to take the beatings adds up to higher ceilings.
Derek Carr is the best pure passer of all of the 2014 QBs, but Carr has a serious problem with the intellectual aspects of QB’ing. Effectively, if you deny Carr a good presnap read, and you take his preferred option, Carr does a terrible job of doing his post-snap read. Defenses got to understanding this pretty well, and as his OL protection declined due to injury and familiarity, Carr also declined in effectiveness.
I agree with most of your points, except the assumption that players stay where they are when the come into the league. Carr has yet to show he can go through progressions and develop a feel for a game. That can happen however and is a skill you can develop with time. If he does that he can be a franchise QB. If Bortles develops his feel for the game and his short area accuracy he will be a franchise QB. Bridgewater will need to polish his game till it shines but he is such an intelligent QB he may be able to do it.
Man, the league should be full of great QBs if what you say is true!
Bridgewater is easily the most overrated QB in the league.
He’s overrated, but there are a couple that give him a run for his money.
Imagine if we had gotten MM last year …did anyone on the eagles, the press or the fans & commenters even think to try? ? Why the heck didnt Chip try to draft mariotta!! Drives me nuts
Best endorsement I have heard for drafting Lynch/Wentz yet! 🙂
Team is putting all the right pieces around cox to help him take a team friendly deal. DC and position coach both emphasize DL / making those guys the heart of the scheme.
Or it makes him take a risk to play this year put up monster numbers and hit the market in a year where contracts explode with the 1.2-1.3 billion cap space that is projected to be available.
still have a tag year
for sure but it hardly makes things cheaper for the Eagles to resign in 2017, when it will be after most of free agency is done and new record contracts have been set.
If a player wants to be here, and the front office and the team wants him here, odds are a deal gets done Regardless of who the agent is, and what the Agents wants.. agent works for Cox not the other way around. If Cox wants to be here, his agent needs to reach an acceptable deal, or he risks getting fired and Cox looking for a new agent that will get him what he wants… agents failing to deliver what really matters to a player is how agents get fired and replaced which happens all the time
“Super Bowl XXXIX
The Patriots were really good at cheating by this point.”
Did like this Onion recap of the Pats-Eagles SB.
http://www.theonion.com/super-bowl-history/2000s-2010s/#39
VINNY Curry could probably Fire his Agent, tell the Eagles just To give him the same Deal as BG, and the money he saves not paying his agent would probably make it close to the amount VINNY would end up with if he pays an agent to negotiate a Better deal than what BG got..since I don’t think an agent could negotiate something significantly better than what BG got
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Wonder how similar those numbers would be…
Quite different. Vinny has been a more consistent rusher with a more clearly defined role and production. Also the market is quite different. I expect him to get $2mil+ over the Graham contract (which was significantly below market value).
Also it is easier to leave money on the table when you had 1st round pick money for while you were a Rookie. Late 2nd rounders need to get paid to take care of themselves and their families.
You know what’s interesting about these massive Fletcher Cox contract numbers? I’m not even unhappy about them and I don’t think other people are either. If you’re going to go big and lock up a guy to a megadeal, it better be for someone like Fletch. He’s going to be an elite anchor on our line for the next 5-6 years, someone you can build a defense around. I want to see the man get paid.
Beats spending on the “Dream Team” any day of the week.
He will have a man dog sized contract very soon. He might have 12 sacks this year.
With how thrilled he seemed to be about the 4-3 Change, I have a feeling Cox’s 2016 season is going to make Chip Kelly look really incompetant for forcing the two gap onto our DL personnel..
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There is a reason Schwartz referred to it, as “we are going to take the handcuffs off the players”..
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Im expecting a Special season from our Franchise Defender. Typically expensive DTs like Cox who produce, stay healthy, and are coachable, selfless teammates DONT trade teams..
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if it wasn’t for ALbert Haynsworth poor charchecter, doubt the Titans łet him get away.
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if Suh didn’t have such a poor Charechter, I assume the Lions would have payed Him the money to retain him..
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The only other way you typically see someone of Cox’s elite caliber in his prime get away is if you are a team like the Jets and you can lose Wilkerson, and still have Leonard Williams and Sheldon Richardson (although it would be easier if sheldon didn’t get in trouble with the Law).
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im a big Bennie Logan fan, but Letting Cox get away, and having Logan and Hart to fall back on, ISNT quite the same as having Sheldon and Leonard, to put it nicely
F CK!
I wish we drafted more playërs that Develope so well that make us throw 9 figures around like this…
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Rather have those players than a bunch of guys so Cheap because Roseman is the Only GM that values them… Every once in a while you can hit on a cheap Mathis gem, but for the most part, having too many 100 million dollar talents is a problem Id gladly welcome
Easy to be a good GM when you don’t have anyone to pay.
What is this DREAM TEAM thing i read from time to time ?
https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/694319783618174976
jesus it’s a slow news day
Forget about Wentz, Lynch or Bradford! Let’s sign Joe Webb. Job done!!
Never going to happen. The only reason Carolina is so reckless allowing Cam to run the ball and take hits is because they know they won’t miss a beat if he goes down and Webb has to step in.
Yep, that’s right.
I’m sure a 3 yr. 9 million dollar contract could motivate Webb to leave.
Fuck Lurie. The reason that Temple even has cover to do this is because of the huge increase in payments that the Eagles want to renew Temple’s lease:
– $72 Million ($2 million a year for 30 years + $12 million up front) for
the Linc; up from $1 million a year now
– Temple is trotting out an estimate of $100 million to build a new stadium which of course I’m sure will in reality end up being $125-150 million instead
The Temple president is using this as rationale that it is better fiscally and from a prestige standpoint to build their own 35,000 person stadium as a result.
http://mobile.philly.com/beta?wss=/philly/news&id=367283911
Kenney did come out earlier this month with some scathing remarks on the Eagles but has been quiet since his inauguration. Nevermind the fact the Eagles received $256 million in public financing to build the Linc (50% of the overall cost) and that they supposedly even made a slight profit on each game Temple played at the Linc.
http://www.phillymag.com/citified/2015/03/23/public-financing-sports-stadiums/
I was hoping Kenney would really come out swinging out the Eagles and attempt to shame the Eagles into come notably down on their price tag. Oh well.
At least their are plenty of activists and students at Temple who realize this is a really an ill-advised economic decision.
Screw Temple. The Eagles received public financing because they had the leverage to do so because the city didn’t want them leaving. No one except their alumni gives a flip about Temple. They can pay the cost of a lease or better yet build their own stadium and stop screwing up the Eagles’ field.
So ‘two wrongs make a right?’
The Eagles are at the nexus of causing this problem by making to look a notably profit from Temple. So sick and tired of pro sport owners raping the public with the NFL owners being the worst example due to the expense of the stadium and the lack of times they are used.
they can play at franklin field.
It’s not about “right” or “wrong”, it’s about market forces and leverage.
It has nothing to do about ‘market forces.’ It is just terrible public policy which is a relatively recent US phenomenon that really only started in the 1990s.
Terrible public policy because you don’t like it. Get over yourself.
It is actually one of few things that economists on the left/right readily agree upon – it is just really poor public policy especially in regards to pro sports teams and stadiums.
Its really crazy when you think about because what other type of facility could the state spend $200-$400M on and then say ‘oh yeah that is something Mr. X who is worth $500M now owns.’ Its kind of mind boggling.
Really, I’m perfectly fine if a city makes a decision that it isn’t a wise public investment to fund a stadium. I take more of an issue with fans/government leaders when they criticize a team for taking a better offer on the table
and move to another city. They stole “our team”! No, the owner moved his team because it was in his financial interests to do so. If a city chooses to let a team leave, they have no one to blame but their own government leaders.
Matters a lot too because Temple is a very important employer and overall institution to the city with $100M+ not an insignificant amount.
Hell a lot more important than a pro football team even if that is sacrilege on here.
Listen, I don’t recall all the specifics of the Eagles’ stadium deal, but if they have the right to set the asking lease price for Temple instead of the city then it’s because they negotiated that right at the time. Now you can criticize all you want if that was wise for the city to do but the fact that the Eagles were able to negotiate it tells you they had leverage. They decided that was more palatable than risking the Eagles leaving. Now, Temple has the ability to negotiate with the Eagles about an annual lease price and their ability to do so will hinge on what leverage they have. Now they and the city can attempt to put pressure on the Eagles from a public relations standpoint but realistically speaking the general public is going to care more about an NFL team than a local regional college.
Temple has most likely wanted its own stadium instead of leasing and its not going from 1 to 2 mill, that will make Temple bankrupt.
This is the same team that can afford to build their own stadium, but slave bind their football players.
When it comes to money, I have zero pity for NCAA football teams
Jeff McLane
@Jeff_McLane
2m2 minutes ago
Sean McDermott confirmed that the #Eagles had called him early in coaching search. Said it was clear they wanted an offensive-minded guy.