More on the QB “Competition”
Posted: August 8th, 2013 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 116 Comments »Yesterday I wrote my reaction to Jay Glazer’s comments that Vick was going to definitely be the QB and Rotoworld’s follow-up that there had never really been a QB competition.
Jimmy Bama decided to write a full post on the subject.
As Jimmy points out, Jay Glazer is the most trustworthy NFL insider on the planet. He has great connections to GMs, coaches and players. I completely agree with this. Glazer doesn’t guess. His reports are based on direct info from credible sources.
But…Glazer’s tweet yesterday didn’t say that he’d heard from sources that Vick will be the QB. It was a combination of what he saw in one day of practice and info he likely picked up from players on the team that he’s tight with. Jimmy picked up on this point and expanded on it.
Glazer’s tweet was not a report. It was an opinion, which is probably partly based on what he saw yesterday, but perhaps more importantly to some, on conversations he has had with players on the team. Glazer has excellent relationships with players across the league, and is as dialed in as any reporter covering sports, as Rotoworld notes. But here’s the problem with taking the players’ word for it – Many of them idolize Vick.
Jimmy then dug up examples of just how much players do idolize Vick, both Eagles and non-Eagles.
Almost every national writer has picked Vick to be the QB. And these are smart, unbiased guys like Glazer and Don Banks. They have no agenda.
Heck, Jason LaCanfora, who isn’t so smart and unbiased, wrote a piece yesterday and talked about the fact that Vick wasn’t all that far removed from 2010, when he was an MVP candidate. Mark Sanchez had just led the Jets deep into the playoffs at that point. Where is he today? Are the Jets fools for drafting Geno Smith or have the last 2 years drastically changed the way they view Sanchez? What happened in 2010 is irrelevant to today in terms of assessing a player’s performance.
The national guys see Vick make at least one great highlight throw a day when they visit. I think that conjures up the memories of the great plays he’s made in the past and they have almost a Pavlovian response. “No competition. Vick must get job.”
Chip Kelly is trying to make all of his players earn their job and their playing time. It has worked well so far. DeSean Jackson is playing lights out. Other receivers are stepping up. Young guys like Boykin and Mychal Kendricks are playing well. Both Foles and Vick have had pretty good camps. They seem to be pushing each other. This is a legitimate competition.
Starting on Friday night, we’ll get a better feel for who is going to win. Last summer Vick was awful in his limited preseason play, while Foles came alive and played terrific football. The competition has both players hungry to prove they should get the job. Will that bring out the best in them or will the pressure lead to mistakes? The players don’t know. The coaches don’t now. The national media doesn’t know. Only I do and you guys haven’t bought enough sunglasses recently for me to share the answer.
I don’t care who wins the job. I just need good QB play in 2013. Score me some points. Don’t turn the ball over. And win me more than 4 friggin’ games please.
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Derek from Iggles Blog wrote a good piece on Brandon Boykin as a starter. I covered that over at Eagles Blog.
There is also a funny piece that you should check out.
Earlier in the piece, I mentioned Jason LaCanfora. He wrote 2 pieces yesterday on the Eagles. Both were awkward, to say the least. I’m not going to link to them. Why feed him the traffic?
The only nugget I did find interesting was that he talked about how much the Eagles like Clifton Geathers and that it wouldn’t surprise him if the Eagles extended Geathers’ deal. My guess is that Jason didn’t get this scoop from Howie Roseman so that must be stuff he heard from the agent side of things.
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Someone asked the other day about why it is perceived to be a bad thing if the Eagles go with small WRs DeSean Jackson and Damaris Johnson as the starters. I’ll cover this in a post.
There was also a discussion on the long snapper position and who the backups are. I think Brent Celek is the primary backup. Darren Howard used to be a backup as well.
LS is a crucial position so you must keep one as a specialist, but you need positional players who can do it if the LS does get hurt.
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SITE STUFF
Someone yesterday complained about an ad coming over the middle of the computer screen. My ads are carefully placed at the top of the site and on the sides. I have never authorized any of the intrusive ads that pop up when you first come to the site. If that is happening, let me know and I’ll look into it. I haven’t had any issues with ads.
A couple of you have asked about an app for mobile users. I will look into this. I know that is a growing segment of the readers and I need to get on that.
Let me know if you have other ideas/concerns. We do what we can to keep the site as user-friendly as possible.
Thanks,
Tommy
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To the people on the other thread. Thanks for the discussion and it is not because I dont want to have a good discussion, but the problem is that I have explained my point of view as good as my crappy English allows me too and it also clear that we have quite different point of views of this whole thing.
your english is good.. where are you from?
I can’t speak for Anders, but if that’s his real prename, I guess he’s from Scandinavia.
And I guess he’s a little bit overcritical about his english skills. I don’t find them “crappy” at all. On a side note, I never met a person out of Scandinavia with crappy english skills. In Germany, where I come from, that’s a whoooole other story. 😀
In the Netherlands, some of the best English speakers I’ve ever met. I had a very hard time getting around in Bayern and just about every other non English speaking country!!!!!
and where do you guys watch the games at? Last October I couldnt find a single bar that played American football!
Re: and where do you guys watch the games at?
You’ll find ways over the time. But it isn’t easy, of course. You can forget about bars, that’s not even a consideration for me. They’ll show the Superbowl. But I must wait one more year until I can finally see the Eagles at a bar here. 😉
@michaelwintercho:disqus
I assume you know that the Netherlands aren’t in Scandinavia. 😀 (I only ask because you replied to my post and not to Joes in which he was talking about the Netherlands).
@Mjoedgaard:disqus
Let me tell you how jealous I am. 😀 A good friend of mine studied in Great Britain and there were about 20 female students out of Scandinavia (mostly out of Denmark and Norway) in his course. I visited him a few times and I just couldn’t believe the ratio between super attractive, attractive and less attractive women in that group. 🙂
Okay, for some reason I thought the Netherlands were part of Scandinavia (as in right next to Denmark) I just did a little research and see that they’re not even related. Embarassing–sorry!
I could make a joke about the geography knowledge of Americans, but I refuse to do so because there’s no point in it if you correct your mistake. 😉
You would be realllly surprised how about the typical American’s geography…or maybe you wouldn’t 🙂
The only related about Netherlands and Scandinavia is the language are all based on the same.
Amsterdamn is literally the best place in the world…Not just for the Obvious reasons…it’s a beautiful city, people are so nice, they have the best KIKBOXERS in the world and best training…I’m obsessed with Holland…My family in Italy thinks I’m a maniac..I just hop in my car, by myself on a random Friday and just drive 13hours to Amsterdamn like I’m driving from Philly to AC….
Agreed. One of the most beautiful cities Ive ever been to. Super friendly people and great English speakers. Not a huge fan of the dutch women tho, Eastern Europe are much better!
I had a guitar teacher from the Netherlands who could barely speak English at all. We actually had to use Spanish to communicate. (although to be fair, I was studying flamenco, a Spanish music genre). Another student, who was from Sweden, remarked a couple times how surprisingly bad his English was.
Im from Denmark and thanks.
how did you become a birds fan?
Saw the Eagles play in 2002 on tv and loved McNabb and Dawkins
Gotcha…where you a fan of football first, or was seeing the birds what got you into football?
Fan of football first. Had been seen it from 1999 to 2002 with no favorite team
Alexander Gustafson or Jon Jones? Lol
You guys speak just as well as any other American. Seriously.
GEagle is an American, as far as I know. So it would be kind of embarrassing if he wouldn’t speak as well as any other American. 😉
And Re: Scandinavian women
I forgot to mention on the previous post the only currency T-Law is accepting: in Scandinavia, approximately 2 out of 10 women are *Megan Fox* kind of good looking. So there’s that. Most of you may realise now why I’m jealous of Anders. 😀
I have dual citizenship. Born here, but my parents taught me Italian first, figured I would be forced to learn English when I went to kindergarten….I lived in Philly til I graduated College, since then, I been living back n fourth between here and Italy….love Italy, but I hate being 6 hours ahead of USA time(really sucks for sports)…so I always appreciate foreign Eagles fans, because I understand the grind they go thru to watch all the games…I know what it’s like to have to go to a British pub at 2am, on a Sunday night, watch a birds game that ends at 6am and then go straight to work Monday morning lol…
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My favorite is when I’m in Rome, I always run into someone with Eagles clothing on, and I always make sure we bust into “fly Eagles Fly chants” with Random Strangers in the middle of center city Rome sorrounded by tons of tourist from all over the world looking at the crazy Eagles fans
Which is why I was replying to Anders and not GEagle!!
I always thought Eastern Europe had the hottest chicks, though I haven’t been to any Scan. places yet
Oh, misunderstanding from my side. I thought you meant Anders and GEgle with “you guys”.
Eastern Europe chicks are oftentimes a little bit too slutty dressed for my taste. But that’s a matter of taste. 😉
To come back to topic: I hope T-Law hasn’t posted anything new since this post because he’s googling for pics with Scandinavian women. Then I would have made a difference here and could proudly retire. 😀
It’s always ok to agree to disagree. Thanks for keeping it respectful even when speaking to the big bad wolf GEAGLE lol..
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respectful debates where two people disagree is when we learn the most..
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if we all just agree with each other everyday, I’m sure this would have gotten old a long time ago
No need to apologize. You made your point of view clear in a good, respectful discussion. That is what readers come here for. And as for your English, I never would have guessed you aren’t a native speaker.
Posted my last question to you over there before I saw this. Feel free to ignore it. And as the others have said, your English is better than many native English speakers.
Heh, well, you knew my opinion about this. I never pressed this (“I don’t have to be very mean”) because it was inevitable.
As if being smug and condescending is any more endearing than being mean.
I’d guess it’s still 50-50. If Kelly had decided Vick was going to start, he would’ve been named #1 on the depth chart.
My problem with the whole thing is that a certain set of the Philly fanbase is being condescended to with a farce of a “competition”.
If Kelly knew all along that Vick was his guy, then it was foolish to take 50% of 1st team reps away from him these past 11 days.
The fact that reps have been evenly split indicates the comp has been 100% real.
Only other possible reason to split would be to motivate Vick, but the fact that a starter still has not been named makes that unlikely.
This has been a legit comp regardless off who ultimately wins and what the MSM wants to believe.
In a normal training camp I’d totally agree. But, in Chips hyperspeed training camp practices the reps issue isn’t nearly as big of a deal. When you watch the action at training camp you’ll be shocked at how fast they move and how many reps they get. Vick gets about as many reps as a normal starter in less time at these practices.
The other issue is with what constitutes first team reps. At the practice I was at, Vick started with the first team. He ran a rep with DeSean and Cooper at WR, Celek at TE and McCoy at running back. As he continued, they ran a play once every 11 or so seconds (yes I timed it). Truly break neck speed. And since they were running so many reps the personnel groupings kept changing. So you’d see Vick with Brown in the back field and Desean, Salas and Ertz, then Foles with McCoy, Celek, Avant, then Vick with McCoy, Casey Sheppard and Damaris, then Foles with Polk, DeSean, Harbor and Celek. By the end, you can’t tell who’s with the first or second team, or if there’s even a first or second team. It’s just maximum reps with always changing personnel groupings.
Vick will start the year as the #1, but he’ll be on a short leash and they know he’s injury prone, so it makes sense to have Foles up to speed too.
Good stuff.
I think the national guys want/expect Vick to win because as you say in their minds, there are still strong traces of the guy who was a #1 overall pick and MVP candidate in 2010. For Eagles fans, who have closely observed the deterioration in his level of play over the past two years, those traces have been more thoroughly washed away.
From what I’ve read/seen, Vick and Foles have been pretty even in TC. If that’s the case, I think it would be a mistake to go with the older, more injury prone player, since he’s clearly not a long term solution and there is at least a sliver of a chance that Foles could be. I don’t expect it matter much either way however because even if Vick does win the job he’s going to get hurt by week 5.
Yeah that’s what I said in the other thread, the national media and the NFL love a guy like Vick. He’s exciting and they still think he’s a highlight reel which is awesome for the NFL. Remember in Vick’s early days how bad of a passer he was but he was still the NFL’s top paid player? The endorsement deals?
Let’s see what happens when pre season starts… Foles was way more poised than Vick last year in the pocket.
there is always a very real possibility that Vick doesn’t make it out of the preseason alive. I doubt it will be like last year where he gets hurt on the first play, sits out the preseason and still gets his starting job in week 1….Vick is going to have to play, and win the job during the preseason if he is going to start, and Vick making it through 4 games without getting injured is never a lock…Heck, he got hurt for the season in what was it, the first preseason game, in one of his years down in Atlanta? last year he didn’t survive 3 plays…
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can’t believe we will be watching Foles and Vick in action tomorrow night…Let the real battle begin!
Wasn’t it weird how the pre-season the past 2 years pretty much was just a small sampling of the entire season? Vick holds onto the ball too long, bad throw..does it again — injured… bad defense on all phases, bad ST, etc….
cant wait for friday!
Lol good point. Vick has been named the starter tomorrow, you still anxious for Friday? Lol JK
Yeah Chip said not to take any stock in who gets the first series, sso i wont 🙂
Lol @ you not caring who wins the QB job. You have been so blatantly pro Foles and and anti-Vick all summer in a passive aggressive style Donovan McNabb would be proud of.
Sigh….smh
I like to read his articles and come daily to read but he has maintained a clear bias.
If you think Tom is bias, then who do yu think isn’t bias? Lol
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of course, if you say anything negative about Vick to one of his fans they all get butthurt and claim Bias, so I guess this shouldn’t be to my surprise. can’t express your oppinion these days with out being “Bias” or a “hater”……Not exactly sure why you spend your time reading articles from someone you deem bias, but that’s a different story…Typical when I sense Bias in a writer, I avoid reading his work like the plague…but hey to each his own, whatever floats your boat…Mike Vick, can’t do no wrong, I get it! Lol
That’s BS. Please cite some examples of Tommy being passive aggressive about Vick.
Yes, he has stated – with non-biased reasons – that it would be ideal for Foles to win the battle, Vicks age and salary being two very good, non-biased ones.
Vick has struggled the past two years. Again, this isn’t a biased opinion, it’s fact.
Tommy has been neither passive aggressive nor biased. And his statement that he doesn’t ultimately cares who wins is legit; we have the kind of offensive pieces where we just need a QB to be good in order to score points. If either Vick or Foles can do that, it’d be great. Ideally it would be Foles who wins so the Eagles can have him for the next 5-6 years.
Better just to down-arrow than to respond IMO.
Don’t feed the troll, people.
Tom, you truly are the “people’s champ”…Much respect and appreciation(we really can’t say it enough)
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props to you for your refusal to give LaConIdiot any traffic!!
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Vemiel who like Glazier was just giving his guesstimate(I think ATleast) also thought that Vick would be our starter.
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One nugget I got from Tom, that always sticks out in my mind is “players are usually a terrible source of information”….Unless our coaches or Howie are telling Glazier that Vick is going to be the QB, then who could he have possibly spoken to that would know who our QB is?….The funny part is that I really don’t think that Chip even knows right now…and since Glazier has always been a responsible journalist who needs two confirmations before he breaks news…I take it as just giving his guess, the way everyone else does
The only thing T-law has ever done to make me mad is not deliver those Oakley Sunglasses I ordered 2 years ago….I’m still waiting Tommy. I have followed this man since the EMB days and I’ve seen no bias…Shenanigans I say
Hey GEagle, where you from man? I grew up in Germany, in Karlsruhe from 1982 to 1993!
Philly and Rome….First 23yrs I spent the year in Philly and summers in Italy…Then I moved to Rome for like 5 years, and now I’m back in Philly for like the past 3 years(a lot of back n fourth traveling)…
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You grew up in Germany, and then moved to Philly or are you still in Europe?
Yeah I grew up in Germany but moved to PA in ’96 to go to High School in Malvern!
Did you like Karlsruhe? Did you see some other places Germany?
Yeah I loved it in Germany, the German people are some of the nicest, kindest, most caring people you could ever hope to meet! Karlsruhe is right on the edge of the Black Forest which is truly beautiful! We visited a few different spots around Germany but one of our favourite places to go was Strasbourg, it’s just across the border in France!
“the German people are some of the nicest, kindest, most caring people you could ever hope to meet”
As a German (from Stuttgart btw, you may know the rivalry between Swabians and Badener :D), I never ever heard that kind of attributes referring to the German people. Hard working, serious, maybe thoughtful (altough that is obviously more of a pre 20th century and after 1945 point of view, if at all), but nice, kind and caring? Nice to hear that, though.
I always try to be as hospitable as possible when I meet foreigners, because I think a few people acting like good human beings can make a huge difference in the view of the whole country for that person. It’s my own experience, at least, when I’m a foreigner.
Haha, yes I know it well, I watched a couple of VFB v KSC games at the Wildparkstadion whilst I was there! I had the pleasure to watch Oli Kahn before he made it big and moved to Bayern! I got watch Icke Haessler turn out in a KSC shirt to which was cool, that guy had some serious talent! Coming from Stuttgart have you tried to convince the American’s that mustard does not belong on a Pretzel???
To make a bad situation worse, I’m studying at an University in Bavaria. I was shocked on how it is apparently common in PA to eat a Pretzel with mustard.
I’m basically a native to the places that invented the Pretzel and I can only say: this isn’t the way the inventors intended it to be eaten!! 😀
Yeah if I’m not much mistaken the Pretzel was invented in Stuttgart wasn’t it? You guys have got a lot of claims to fame; Porsche, Jurgen Klinsmann, some of the best things to ever come out of Germany came from Stuttgart!
Und von einen Badener ist das nicht einfach zu sagen!
Lol, just read that one. 😀
And all the american readers here are probably thinking: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjV-4CtiIV0
Lol, never seen that before! I did always think her German pronunciation sounded spot on on Scrubs! No I know why!
I know, I know. But for some strange reasons other regions in Germany don’t see it that way. 😀
And don’t forget Mercedes-Benz! Maybe the most important company in Germany next to Volkswagen.
I almost don’t want Vick to win the job, just so all the blowhards who’ve dismissed the QB competition all along won’t feel proven right.
That’s the part that kills me. I’ve routed for Foles/Barkley all along, as an Eagles fan I would very much like for one of them to *win* the job and grow into our next franchise QB so the team can prosper for the next 10 or so years. That would just be convenient as an Eagles fan.
Over the months of the off season and really watching this lockeroom and where Mike stands in it, Vick simply has not been out-performed in a significant enough way to merit him being a back-up in the locker room’s eyes. At least not yet. As I resign myself to this and attempt to embrace this, it KILLS me to imagine those national media idiots gloating over it because it was so obvious to them, uuuuuhhhhg.
Again, not a Foles fan, but i really hope for the sake of the team he can go out there this pre season and prove he can be a franchise QB. And as you said, rubbing the national media’s noses in it would be oh so glorious.
Hate to say it, but I hope Vick gets hurt tomorrow and just puts an end to this! I been breathing this damn QB battle everyday since Chip was hired..I’m tired of it. easier if Vick just does what he does and gets hurt tomorrow….I hate to wish harm on anyone, but my mental health comes first lol
I find it interesting/amazing how polarizing this whole QB battle is for the fanbase. You don’t hear arguments about Cole vs Graham as the starting OLB even though you could say that Graham deserves the starting job more than Trent based on last year and age. But I guess that’s why the QB is usually the highest paid guy on the team.
For me, I’m not really thrilled about either option. Vick has never shown an ability to be good consistently over a 16 game season – hell, he’s never really shown an ability to make it through a 16 game season. Foles didn’t really do a lot last year when he got the chance to play during the regular season. He wasn’t awful, he just wasn’t anything special.
So for me, I just hope that somebody really wins the job (as opposed to being less bad than the other guy) and then translates that into success when the games count. If we get that, I’ll be happy no matter which way this goes.
Vick is a polarizing figure. He has a lot of fans, even inside the locker room. I really don’t think it’s the Mike Vick camp vs the Nick Foles camp.
It more like the camp of, that’s freaking Mike Vick, of course you should play him if he’s healthy. Versus Mike Vick doesn’t do great things for us in the short or long term so why not play Nick Foles until we know he isn’t the guy and then put Matt Barkley in, and if He’s not the guy, we should have a nice draft pick for 2014 to find a guy.
Interesting you bring up Cole and Graham, the infuriating part is that Graham and Cole aren’t even in a battle. They have graham backing up Barwin, you have got to be kidding me.If Cole went down, would they really replace him with Hunt? God I hope not…The pre season should be a good opportunity to evaluate their pass rushing. I’m so tired about the only details coming out are their clumsy pass coverage. Of course it looks ridiculous, dropping the pass rush OLB into coverage is the equivalent of sending a lineman to catch a touchdown pass. You label him an eligible receiver to get people thinking about him, but you don’t go to that well too many times.
Vick is only a polarizing figure because practically all the blame for the failure of the last two years is laid at his doorstep. Too many people call his 2011 season bad when his performance was similar to 2010.
His QBR was to top ten both years. Football Outsiders had him rated as their twelfth rated QB in ’10, in ’11 he was their eleventh best QB. Pro Football Focus had him in their top 10. But Philly fans swear his ’11 season was just AWFUL. It wasn’t. Blame a defense that blew leads to start the season and ST units that were horrible.
That’s fair. The other part of that equation was the (at least perceived) drop off from his 2010 performance when he seemingly put the team on his back and marched us to the play offs. When fans observe any drop off in a player over 30…hell 28 these days, they assume a trend. Hence people jump off that band wagon like it’s on fire. Right or wrong, fair or not, that history isn’t written yet.
From what I’ve seen most people who consider there to be a drop off are only looking at INTs.
Vick was lucky to have only six picks in ’10 and unlucky to have fourteen in ’11. A lot of dropped passes and tipped balls ended up with the other team.
If Kelly is an outside the box thinker–why not a two-headed quarterback. If Foles wins the job, still use Vick with a package of plays.
Think how hard it is to prepare for both a RH pocket qb, and also a LH mobile qb in the same week. At least it will force opposition to use up a lot of practice time on both scenarios.
The answer has been in front of us all along: Chip intends to create a QB smoothie out of Vick and Foles. Barkley and Dixon will go into the backup smoothie.
I vote for the Mathis solution, our qb will be mike vick standing on Nick foles shoulders. Unstoppable
If we are going to stack them, I’d rather have Vicks legs.
BUT, Foles legs know how to slide. It’s a moot point because the Vickmera’s primary mode of locomotion is cartwheels with occasional bouts of flight.
I am sure Barkley is behind this 100%. His chances of seeing the field increase exponentially under this model.
One important nugget I gleamed from the article is Tommy knows the winner of the QB competition and won’t share cause we’re to cheap to buy sunglasses. Don’t think he would have put that there if the well wasn’t running dry.!!!!!
Regarding mobile users: If you want to go in that direction, I would suggest using a theme for your site that incorporates responsive design, rather than developing a separate mobile app. Mobile apps are expensive and require constant updates, due to different devices with different screen sizes flooding the market.
Responsive themes will automatically adjust the layout to whatever size screen a device uses to access a site. Birds 24/7 and BGN do this (try resizing your browser to tablet size, then all the way down to smartphone size on these sites, and you will see what I mean). WordPress has a bunch of free responsive themes in their library. I’m not sure what blogging platform you are using, but it would be worth checking to see if they offer this.
One thing I hate about Birds 24/7 on my iPad is you can’t make the text bigger by zooming in on the screen (unlike this site). If Iggles Blitz changing it’s format resulted in similar (loss of) functionality, I would be disappointed.
Agreed. I always feel like it is so important to keep the ads in view that being able to read the text is secondary.
Vick has been named the starter tomorrow, because Chip said it was his day in the rotation, and they will schedule next weeks practices so it’s Foles turn to start in 2nd preseason game…Expects both to get 12-20 reps and Barkley play the rest of the game..
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Starting CBs are Boykin and Fletcher(Cary not playing)
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Starting Safeties are Chung and Allen
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Starting OTs are Lane and Barbre with Peters not playing tomorrow
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Dennis Kelly had surgery on herniated Disc and will miss the rest of the preseason
Interesting and boring at the same time 🙂
If Chip gives Barkley a few first team receivers, look out.
This is the first time since before high school Barkley has not started. He is mad as hell and is not going to take this sh*t anymore. Time for him to grab the attention of fans and coaches. He has the 2nd and 3rd quarter to show what he’s got.
Thank god this game is on NFL network!
Well Barkley better get ready to cry me a river, build a bridge and get over it!!! Lol
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we are only dressing 7WR tomorrow, and we can’t afford any more injuries…The starters are needed to evaluate Foles and Vick…Barkley gonna have to make due with Momah,Salas,Miller….Because I don’t think Sheppard and Damaris are playing, so Avant, Riley and Desean might have to go into the 2nd quarter if Foles doesn’t get enough snaps in the first…..Chip can’t risk them much more then that….Best Barkley can hope for is to see some time with Ertz. Hopefully Barkley can make a dollar out of fifteen cents…28 hours and counting til we find out
Your logic is unimpeachable GEagle.
But Chip will throw Barkley a bone or two. Maybe Avant or Riley for a few plays. Chip takes chances when there is a QB competition. Get on your knees and pray they don’t get hurt.
@oregonducker….welcome…..your postings are quality….might I ask sir, have you always been an eagles fan or did you follow the Chippah? Just curious…..glad to have you aboard
I came gripping Chippah’s coattails. I have a lot to learn about being an informed Eagle’s fan – probably patience and alcohol tolerance are my top challenges.
Tommy’s site is the best IMHO.
Darren Howard ahh yes I do recall that.
Hey Tommy, I always read your site on my phone and its actually not too bad on mobile. I always welcome better ways to get Iggles Blitz but don’t feel like you have to get an app or mobile site!
yeah, it’s so not a problem that I wouldn’t even bother downloading the app…it comes up fine on a phone
Agreed.
Same here.
I’m gonna give this disclaimer before I say what I’m about to say: I have no horse in this race, I want the best QB to win and I think the best possible scenario would be for Foles (the younger of the two) to establish himself as a legitimate starting QB for this team going forward. I also only attended one training camp practice and I have ultimate respect for the other beat writers and bloggers who cover the team every day and have differing opinions on the matter than I do.
That being said: I left training camp that day with the same feeling as Glazer. The QB competition is a farce. Chip has played it masterfully. He even has Vick worried that he might not be the opening day starter, which I think is the ultimate goal of the QB competition to make both players fear for their starting spot and try and bring the best out of them.
First, I think the fact that Vick was brought back on a $7mil salary (or really an additional $3.5mil…however you want to look at it), is a clear indication that the team at least at the time of that decision, expected Vick to start. You simply do not pay someone $7mil when you expect them to fail and be the back-up. Vick, of course, had to justify his starting spot with his play and would be on a short leash, however, he most likely had to be considered the front runner before practices started.
Second, watching them on the field, it was obvious (results not withstanding) who the clear cut starting QB was. It appeared to be Vick and then everyone else a tier below. Foles and Bradley were more even than Vick and Foles. The other 4 QBs were barely distinguishable. Vick clearly had a pro skill set (arm, legs, accuracy, ect) and the other 4 just didn’t compare. They couldn’t make every throw the way that Vick could to threaten every inch of the field and their accuracy and delivery weren’t on the same level either.
Third, the majority of practice was spent on the read option. Chip once again is getting people to buy hook line and sinker the notion that his offense will not use the read option as a main building block of his play book. You simply don’t spend that much practice time on a set of plays that you aren’t committed to running. He obviously WANTS to run the read option looks you saw at Oregon. Obviously if Foles or Barkley wins out, he’ll adjust course, but his desire is clear. Vick was the only QB out there that looked smooth, in control and like he should be running those plays. Foles and Barkley looked awful running them.
Now before everyone jumps on me and tells me how awful Vick has been the last two years, trust me, you don’t need to fill this thread with Vick hate based on the last two years. I saw the same thing you did. Vick was terrible last year. He was a scatterbrained turnover machine and yes he’s injury prone too and 33 years old. I know all of this. But, that does not make Nick Foles any better.
Don’t feed me lines about completion percentages during OTAs and Training camp. If any of you have ever watched 7-7 or Chips version of 11 on 11 with no hitting, you’ll quickly realize how useless the results of those drills are. It’s set up to be really easy for the QBs. Any pro level QB will complete the majority of passes. The stats tell you nothing. The simple eye test of the two shows you everything you need to know. Vick has the requisite skill set to play the position at this level and I’m not sure Foles does. The ball takes an eternity to get to it’s target, it wobbles in the air and I guarantee he’s more in the mold of Feeley or Hoying than a Tom Brady or even a Trent Dilfer. And, if you truly believe that Vick is starting Friday because it just so happens to be his turn in the rotation, there’s no helping you. Chip controls everything down to how much the players sweat and piss, I’m sure he set up the rotation knowing it would be Vick’s turn to start in the rotation.
Chip wants to win now, and as such he wants his most talented asset at QB (Vick) to perform up to his potential (2010) and his way of doing that is by pushing him with this phony QB competition.
All that being said, if Vick reverts back to his 2012 form and looks like a scatterbrained turnover machine, I have no doubt that Chip will drop him like hot cancer and move on, he’s not going to invest much time in a 33 year old QB that’s struggling. He’ll go to Foles if he has to. But, don’t be surprised if Foles struggles this year if and when he gets his chance. I just don’t see the requisite physical skills (read: arm strength) and for someone with poor arm strength his accuracy, timing and anticipation are hit or miss. Sometimes he looks great in those areas and many times he looked lost in the very areas that he needs to EXCEL in to overcome his physical disadvantage to Vick.
If you are concerned with negative reactions, you might consider avoiding statements as strong as “The competition is a farce” when you have admittedly attended one practice and your opinion is in direct contradiction to those who’ve attended every practice and who cover football for a living, as well as the coach’s on the record statements.
I don’t know, I disagree with him but I think he did an adequate job of making it clear that this was his opinion and not trying to sell it as a fact.
Exactly. I don’t necessarily agree with him, but he makes a fair statement based on arguments he believes in.
The problem with this theory is that Vick doesn’t have a resume to back up his physical gifts. His career passer rating barely breaks 80. He is, essentially, a way more mobile Jeff George.
The QB position in the NFL is played between the ears. That’s why Peyton Manning was still exceptional even though he clearly lost a lot of velocity last year after the neck surgery. There have been many other guys who succeeded without huge arms (Montana, Brees, even Chad Pennington).
I’m not saying Foles is in that category – in fact, I think there are several reasons that Tannehill, Weedon and Osweiller were picked ahead of him. But let’s not pretend this is Chip walking in and telling Brady, Peyton, or even Eli, that what they did in the past doesn’t matter and they need to prove themselves to him if they are going to start for his team. He’s just not buying into The Myth.
At least I hope not.
Agree completely with both statements above. I admit this is just my opinion based on watching one live practice and each of Foles’ home snaps in person as I have season tickets. I certainly respect the bloggers and beat writers for their opinions but mine is just different based on what I saw. I used the statement “is a farce” because it was a line others had used and I agree w it to an extent. Obviously if this was Brees or Brady chip wouldn’t even attempt a QB competition. Also if Vick plays poorly or Foles plays exceptionally, I’d fully expect Chip to pick the better player. So, in that sense it is sort of a competition. The thing that I don’t agree with after seeing the players live over the past year is that the competition is as even as people make it out to be. I certainly acknowledge the possibility that I’m completely off base here but I’d bet anyone anything that, barring injury, Vick will without a doubt begin the season as your starter.
I wouldn’t get too hung up on how Foles played last year. All of the people who see him as viable say he looks better this year from the standpoint of accuracy and velocity. Even if improved, he’s obviously not Michael Vick physically in any way. That’s not the only thing that matters though. It’s more important when it comes to the competition to see who runs the offense better. Who makes the right audibles and reads and protections, who is capable of throwing to a spot rather than an open receiver, who displays mastery of the conceptual framework that Chip has taught. These parts of being a QB have always been Vick’s weakness, his success was built on the effect his speed had on what the defense is doing. If his athleticism continues to decline as it has been (getting caught from behind by Kroy Biermann), his arm isn’t going to matter because Vick has never been able to beat anyone with impeccable and tight execution.
The mental aspects are the ones you can’t judge fully by watching practice without being the coach teaching the system, so it’s not surprising the conclusion you came to. I think a lot of the time, what people are saying when they say Foles had a better day, is that the plays Foles ran “looked” better or had better outcomes. They’re trying to approximate just how good Foles has been mentally by counting plays he botched, basically. This is imperfect to say the least compared to how Chip can judge what happened, but it’s where the people who think there’s a legitimate chance for both quarterbacks tend to be coming from.
Agree with everything you said. QB is the most cerebral position in football. No doubt about that. But, there has to be a requisite physical skill set to bring those thoughts to life. I could be the smartest football mind to ever live, but I can barely throw a football 30 yards and I’m only 5 foot 9. Suddenly, my football intelligence means nothing.
I’m not saying Foles is nearly that physically handicapped, but he does lack the type of skills that will ever make him elite. His arm strength is below average, the ball takes a while to get to its target. It wobbles in the air, rarely a tight spiral. He simply cannot challenge the entire field. On top of that, I haven’t seen superior accuracy or ball placement from him to make up for his lack of arm strength (like a Chad Pennington).
That being said, he is smart, and shows tremendous poise in the pocket. However, I think it’s obvious to even Foles supporters that if Vick played his best game possible and Foles played his best game possible that Vick’s game would be FAR superior to Foles’. Therefore, my feeling is that Chip’s plan A is to have Vick play at his best. Foles being a back up option if Vick struggles.
Yeah, that’s reasonable. The only reason I’m a Foles supporter is because I want to see Vick at his best before I believe he’ll do it. That and like Tommy I want to see the young guy. If Vick’s better, put him in.
Remember, there’s no “I” in Jason La Canfora.
But there is an “Anal Jar Sac.”
Oaf on canal jars
That’s his rally cry.
Also, if the bullies in Jason’s 7th grade class didn’t come up with “Jason La Canfour-eyes” then they deserve to give themselves swirlies.
Baloophi, “the gold standard”
So classic.
Anal Ja’s Car? I don’t recommend it.
http://images.theage.com.au/2009/08/27/700879/jarule420-420×0.jpg
“…it wouldn’t surprise him if the Eagles extended Geathers’ deal.”
Tommy, please. Let’s try to keep this site PG…
In my exhausting search for something to bitch and complain about, I can’t find anything to bitch and complain about. Congrats on the being the first part of my life to offer such luxury.
Have you seen the warning label on football helmets these days?
http://media.phillydailynews.com/images/Screen+Shot+2013-08-08+at+11.17.30+AM.png
I displayed four out of six of the symptoms of a concussion just readying that damn thing.
I just got a kick out of football helmets being sold with a label that says “Do not engage in the sport of football”,
liability
Hey Tommy, I have never had any issues with the site and as a smart phone user am super psyched about the idea of an app for your site! As an Eagles fan from across the pond I always appreciate the ‘non-mainstream’ Eagles Info, keep up the good work!
preseason games are boring. Sam Bradford is hapless.
McManus was on the radio tonight for his daily hour segment….some caller called up all pissed off and hype about Chip Kellys decisions today, talking about how much Chip sucks, and he is Disgusted at Chip bringing “His sick, and twisted Oregon offense”…McManus didn’t know what to say…I laughed the entire car ride home….our fans, are such maniacs lol..
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Well done ! Drinking water might have been more useful, but hey …