OL Update
Posted: June 6th, 2015 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 79 Comments »We have talked a lot about the OL this spring. The status of Evan Mathis keeps us confused. We’re curious to see what happens at RG. And we have no idea what to think of the backups.
Adam Caplan offered his thoughts on Mathis on a recent interview on 97.5. Jimmy Bama has the details.
“The Eagles, as far as they are concerned, this player, Evan Mathis, has three years left on his contract, so they don’t need to do anything. They’re not going to do anything do his contract from what I understand. I certainly understand both sides here. From the Eagles standpoint, you have a player, although still very solid in Evan Mathis, he turns 34 in November. Had he been maybe 28, 29, even 30, you may consider what he’s looking for. But it’s hard to find a scenario when you’re the Eagles to give someone more money at that age…
I think from Evan’s standpoint, I clearly understand what he’s looking at. He’s not looking for a lot more money, not very much at all. A slight pay increase is my understanding, and incentives in his contract if he makes the Pro Bowl, which I think is fair to me. If he would hit them, obviously he would be rewarded, but of course the team would be because if he makes the Pro Bowl everyone’s happy.
But, the fact of the matter is, nothing that I know of is on the horizon here, and I’ve been asked repeatedly about his future, and I would say I would be pessimistic, clearly, for him to be on the (Eagles) this fall.”
That isn’t encouraging, but it goes along with the vibe I’ve gotten this spring, that Mathis is done as an Eagle.
I would still love for things to work out. Mathis is a good player and a fun personality to have as part of the team. No more reports on possible trade destinations at this point. The Eagles have a mandatory mini-camp coming up. It will be interesting to see if Mathis shows, and what the Eagles do with him if he does report. Will he run with the starters or would they line him up with the backups? If Mathis is on the team, he will start. No one questions that. But the team could want Allen Barbre and Matt Tobin to continue getting reps with the starters in hopes of building up some chemistry. We’ll see.
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Now for some upbeat OL news, this also from Caplan.
#Eagles UDFA G/T Brett Boyko could seriously push for roster spot. Eagles gave him $20 K fully guaranteed ($10K SB, $10K fully gtd base).
— Adam Caplan (@caplannfl) June 5, 2015
Boyko had a draftable grade from many teams, but suffered an elbow injury late last season, which was a caused him to drop out of draft.
— Adam Caplan (@caplannfl) June 5, 2015
The Eagles like Boyko. He played LG and LT at UNLV. At 6-6, 305, he has the kind of frame they like. He was a QB in high school. Sounds like a Chip Kelly kind of OL. The downside…doesn’t have the footwork to be a LT in the NFL. Also lacks ideal arm, hand size.
Right now Boyko is the LT on the #3 OL. His best spot in the NFL is likely OG. I’m sure the Eagles will get him some work there this summer. There is nothing wrong with playing him at LT for now to see how he handles the spot.
Don’t get too excited about Boyko. There are some reasons to be optimistic about his chances to push for a roster spot, but he needs time to develop.
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Another OL nugget from Caplan.
On Chris Chester, Eagles offered a 2-year deal, but he has a better chance of starting with #Falcons (LG or even C if Hawley isn't ready).
— Adam Caplan (@caplannfl) June 5, 2015
We’ll see if the Eagles show interest in any other veteran OL that shake loose this summer. Everything is quiet for now.
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If American Pharaoh wins… does this banner win…
Is the woman on the right our new Blog master after he pulls a Bruce Jenner?
Who;s Bruce Jenner?
If I’m reading it correctly, left to right, its our blog master after he eats a bag of funyons O.o
Does the math work both ways? Will the woman become Tommy if she doesn’t eat Funyons?
You need to photoshop a PBR into mrs. Lawlor’s hand.
I tried to keep it simple taking what I thought were the top three. The Triple Crown in a sense. Chocolate pudding was upset at me as well.
I did this one quickly the other night… from a photo posted.
I tried to keep it simple. Could easily be a collage and not a banner.
Very true, but simple is effective and more chip like…
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Can we pay Mathis in those bills? Just hand him a huge stack?
I’d pay him with a shady stack… 25 dimes.
Shouldn’t that be a 20cent bonus for making AllPro?
We could do monopoly money.
Finally, someone’s done the work of replacing the outdated banner on the top of the site.
What can Mathis actually do, just not show up? How can he make the Eagles release him or trade him? And if they do release him, can he actually make more than he’s paid now?
Well he will probably struggle to make more $$, but he should be able to get more guaranteed money, specifically 2016. Think Mathis’s issue is that if he has a down year this year he will be cut by eagles and struggle to get more than a 1 year show me deal from anyone else due to age.
Not sure what he can really do except show the team he is unhappy and hope they offer him a little make up present like a $0.25mil or $0.5mil probowl bonus.
He has to turn up to mandatory activities or the it costs him $30k a day… which adds up fast. Worse case he does not turn up even when season starts and then he does not get his salary either.
His ideal situation is a guard for a top contending team gets injured (lets say Broncos because they are all in), and they trade a 5th to the Eagles and he gets contract guaranteed.
I’d rather have Mathis than a 5th. Let alone a lower pick. I just don’t know why the articles and quotes suggest he won’t be an Eagle. Why trade him for low pick. And he can’t afford to just sit out. So what makes writers think he won’t be here?
Yea but Mathis never tore his acl so theres that knock on him
Wouldn’t just be a 5th, they’d also free up his salary for cap space. At this point the team would probably be happy to free up that 12 mill (about 8 more than cutting him) and start developing other players.
interseting b/c they paid Meco who is over the hill and hurt (though they cut his salary etc.). He could look at the Meco example, but he’s not Meco obviously
The team can’t give him extra money at this point, or it would look like they were rewarding his sitting out and going public with his dissatisfaction.
if even wants to get paid, he will have to play.
I’d give Mathis incentives for being named All-Pro. That means something. Getting elected to the Pro Bowl, especially OL, means nothing. The casual fans don’t know how the offensive linemen are performing from year to year so they vote based on name recognition, which Mathis has at this point.
You know what I would give mathis? A chance to compete for a starting Guard spot playing for a contender his last two years in the league, collecting 11mil n the process…. That’s ALL we should give Mathis, not a penny more
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If he isn’t ok, he is more then welcome to sit out all year, waste what time he has left and collect a ton of money in penalties..
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Give mathis NOTHING.
I don’t think Mathis would go for it, but what about this:
His current base salary is $5.5M. He wants incentives in his contract. Okay, well then you have to give something back. He has to agree to a new base salary of $4.5M. If he makes the Pro Bowl, he gets $1.25M. So, slightly more than he would have made. $5.75M total. He then gets another $750K if he is named 1st or 2nd team All-Pro. That would give him $6.5M, which is fair for one of the top 4 guards in the league. If he excels, he gets paid more. If he isn’t quite up to previous form or misses significant time due to injury(likely meaning he wouldn’t make Pro Bowl, although not necessarily considering how stupid fans can be sometimes) then he makes less.
If the Eagles trade/cut Mathis, one guy I’d look into acquiring is Zane Beadles of the Jaguars. His best fit is in a zone scheme but with new OL coach Doug Marronne they’re transitioning to more of a power scheme. They drafted A.J. Cann in the 3rd round and he’s likely Beadles replacement, if not this year then next. The Jaguars structured Beadles contract in a pay-as-you-go format so they an easily trade him without a huge cap hit.
3-way trades are unrealistic but a deal that lands Beadles with the Eagles, Mathis with Buffalo(they were reportedly one of the teams interested in him) and one of Buffalo’s offensive linemen that Marronne already knows(Chris Williams or Kraig Urbik) plus a draft pick(from BUF) to Jaguars would make sense for all 3 teams.
Interesting.
Are you can just trade a 5th or 6th for Zane, and not go thru a crazy NBÁ 3’team trade scenario…
I don’t see the Ravens considering trading Yanda.
You call it crazy, and while unusual, it’s not unprecedented. We did a 3-team deal when we traded Sheldon Brown.
Yea…Ravens are also contenders this year. It’s not like they are rebuilding and looking to acquire draft picks.
Even if the Ravens keep both guards this year, I think this is Yandas last year in Baltimore. once they extend Osmele, Yanda won’t get a new deal. WOULDNT mind picking him up next offseason and having him finish out the last 2-3 years of playing at a high level in Eagle green, since he is still almost 4 years younger then Mathis..
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Sigń a guy like Yanda next offseason, and draft another OL in the top 100, and our OL should be set for another 3 years…
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I don’t believe anyone is jumping thru the hoops required to sign Mathis in a simple trade with us, let alone someone wanting Mathis bad enough to see a rare 3 team trade…
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I don’t believe anyone is going to trade for Mathis and give him a new deal when he is contracted to make 11 mil and when that 2yr deal expires he will be 36yrs old..not to mention he isn’t Big enough to appeal to every OL..
I would be shocked if they even considered moving yanda the way he is regarded around here.
They probably keep him for this last season, but I doubt he will get a new contract, since Osmele will cost them a pretty penny.. WOULDNT mind targeting Yanda if he reaches the open market after this next season
I wonder if Mathis is mad that Barwin got a pay raise, but he didn’t. From all accounts, there was no reason for Barwin to get one, but Chip did it just to pat the guy on the back. I’d have to say if you’re giving Barwin a raise to reward good play, Mathis is just as deserving. I can’t say I disagree with Mathis if that is his issue.
B has a much better attitude and does more visible community stuff.
Agreed, but as good of a guy Barwin is, he isn’t being paid to be a good guy. He’s being paid to be a good OLB (which he is).
Mathis is an exceptional guard even at his age. If the issue is a relatively small amount of money, I’d say give it to him since the precedent was already established. No way would I be comfortable having Allen Barbre and Matt Tobin be our starting guards, especially with a fragile Bradford depending on them. I look at paying Mathis as insurance for keeping Bradford healthy.
“Agreed, but as good of a guy Barwin is, he isn’t being paid to be a good guy. He’s being paid to be a good OLB (which he is).” — this is not what the last two years of the CK error has taught me.
CK feels differently about it than I do. I’m just saying what I would do, not what I think CK will do.
What I would do too.
Yes, time will tell if this is the Chip Kelly era or the Chip Kelly “error.”
sometimes i surprise myself.
I love it when mistakes work out.
I think a big part of Barwins gift was to make sure he had a slightly higher salary than Graham. They had just signed Graham to a deal that paid him half a million more dollars than Barwin this year after Barwin just had a huge season. Then shortly after that they announce that they gave him an extra $750k. Seems to me they wanted to avoid jealousy in the locker room by making sure Barwin was the highest paid OLB, even if only slightly.
nice analyssis
Barwin isn’t 34 and didn’t miss any games last year. He also hasn’t been publicly asking for more money. He wasn’t paid just for his performance in the field, he was paid because he is a Chip kind of guy through and through.
Also he was our most productive LB last year so to be fair they wanted his pay higher then BGs.
Mathis wanted a new contract last year and toyed with the possibility of sitting out but he didn’t. This has nothing to do with Barwins contract considering it started before that.
Barwin outperformed his contract, by a lot. Mathis performance is right in line with what he’s getting paid. This also started well before Barwin got his raise.
Not to mention off the field, where the team and sport couldn’t ask for a better ambassador than 98.
If Chip wasn’t such a racist Mathis would have his contract by now.
Give Mathis an all pro incentive and tell him to shut up and do his job the rest of the season.
I’m not going to be excited if we’re dealing with two sub-standard starting guards come that opening night in Atlanta.
That very well might prove true…. But I wouldn’t assume “Unknown” is always going to equal “substandard”,.
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I bet there was a time in seattle when Byron Maxwell was an “unknown 6th round pick considered substandard” by SEAHAWK fans
I hear you but I saw Tobin underwhelm last year while Barbre was laying down on the job.
I liked a lot of what I saw from Tobin while he was playing on the left side. I think he got much worse when we moved him to the right side…. You could end up proving right, but im sure we didn’t see the best Tobin is ever going to be, I assume he would improve with another summer under his belt, will that imprpvement be good enough? Maybe, maybe not…
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But Barbre on the other hand, hasn’t played bad at all for us, the problem is we haven’t seen much of him at all….. But no one can watch tape of Barbres snaps as an eagle and say he was playing at a substandard level… He was solid in what few snaps he was given
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While a player may be an unknown to us, th coaches got to see them everyday, they got to chart their growth rate over the cours of a few seasons.. I assume the coaches have to be higher then we think on some of our unknown lineman for us to not address the position with any urgency this offseason….. I have to interpret that as coaches seeing more potential in some backups then us fans and media think……. But who really knows, remains to be seen
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And you could well be right, but I’m not trying to sit through another season of crap blocking and rushed throws by our QB. No matter what top 5 guys they roll out there for the season, it needs to look more like 2013 and less like 2012 or 2014.
Holding my breathe hoping for a Marshall Yanda trade… Maybe some of our young aol catch Harbaughs eye at the joint practices
Tobin also had that ankle injury.
Even worse then an ankle, he spent his first NFL game experience playing next to like 4’or 5’different teammates. He played next to Lane,Peters,Kelde and Molk…mwhich basically means he spent his first game,experience having to play with two different groups of T/C
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not only should Tobin improve as he gains game experience, but he should really improv when he builds chemistry with the Tackle and center lined up next to him… not only does Tobin need NFL game experien, but we won’t see the best he has to offer until he builds chemistry with the lineman he plays next to, especially when our blocking scheme requires a lot of combo blocks, knowing when to pass a defender off to another lineman, these things can only be built thru experience playing next to the same guys…,all summer Tobin practiced and played with the 2nd string, I assume he will be much better with a summer or building chemistry with Lane, KELCE, Peters on the first team
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There is no way we saw the best Tobin has to offer when he was so inexperienced and had no chemistry playing with the guys lined up on either side of him..nit was too dysfunctional of a situation to think we really saw,what,Tobin is capable of….
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And whill we hAvent seen much of BARBRE, the few times he was called upon to step up, he delivered just fine…. No one can point to any Eagle film that shows BARBRE being some hack who the coaches are foolish to count on…. Barbre answered the bell every time we asked him to step up, it’s just hasn’t been a big enough sample size to give fans faith in him, but really THATS just assuming the worst…
I think Barbre will be serviceable, but playing next to Peter’s or Johnson will make him a Herremans level player at best.
I agree 100% that having some sort of chemistry with the lineman next to him will greatly help him.
If we were to lose Mathis it would definitely hurt. However the more I think about it I am high on Tobin and I think our STARTING line will be effective without him.
I do think that if there is an injury we could be in some real trouble. With the loss of Herremens and Mathis our line is EXTREMELY thin.
Any news on Manhart? Many thought he was draftable, too, and had the right attitude to develop into an NFL player.
Has to be an upgrade over the “No Heart” 2014 Philadelphia Eagles who gave away a division title via chokes to Dallas and Washington while committing unfocused turnovers and penalties left and right.
Wasnt Byko,was our UDFA with the Draftable grade who went UNDRAFTED due to a senior season injury?
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Ideally we need 1 or 2, or our #3rd string OL to take the spot of two of our #2nd team Lineman, Ideally we see two UDFAs take Molk and Vanderveldes roster spots
Manhart definitely has some potential, but it’s OTAs lineman are in shorts and T-shirts and aren’t allowed to hit anything but a dummy. Things are just mental right now. Can’t tell much and won’t hear much about our rookie UDFA linemen until hitting starts.
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Wanting incentives for making the ProBowl is bullshit when at this stage he will win that glorified popularity contest on his name alone,..
As far as I’m concerned this Mathis nonsense is no big deal. mathis has no leverage, so what does it matter? He can bitch and stomp his feet for a few more weeks but soon he will be forced to report.
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mathis has been available for over a year, yet two Older Guards were traded for while Mathis still remains on the sideline… The Patriots were able to trade their starting Guard last August, and a few months ago the Saints were able to trade away Grubbs, yet the Guard who has been on the trade block the longest(Mathis) still can’t generate interest….
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This is pretty cut and dry as far as I’m concerned, Mathis can play for us, or he can retire, we hold his rights TIL he turns 36 and at that point no one will want him… So cut the crap, Do NOT NEGOTIATE with Terrorist, and make it clear to Mahis that he can either play for us, or waste his last few years on the sideline.. Problem solved!!!
Game of chicken that Mathis can’t win is exactly how I see this situation as well. He’s not going to give away over $30K every day when mandatory practice starts and he’s not going to sit out and not collect $5.5mil this year or $6.5mil next year. So I’m less concerned that he won’t play for us than most people. His best chance at seeing the most money is to play for us and play well.
I’d like to see the Eagles try and trade Mathis straight up for the stud guard of the Ravens, Marshall Yanda
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The Ravens have their own contract problems with their two starting Guards. both Guards have expiring contracts and want more money. problem is Yanda is 30yrs old, while Kellichi Osmele is younger and will require a hefty investment..
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I’m thinking the Ravens will end up paying a big extension to Osmele, and waiving Marshall Yanda after the season when he turns 31… They waived Holati Ngata, I think Yanda is next….
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Osmele is a 330lb power guard Bohemoth… Yanda is a more athletic 305lb Guard which fits what we do…
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Even if we can’t trade away Evan Mathis, I would still like to see us take a run at trading for Yanda, or sigń him next offseason to a 3 yr deal
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hopefully at our joint practices with the Ravens, some of our young Backüp Lineman catch John Harbaughs eye
A Mathis/Yanda swap makes no economic sense for the Ravens. It doesn’t make much football sense either.
I wonder what Chip Kelly was thinking when we went after the top Free Agent Guard, Orlando Franklin? We’re we trying to sign him as Herremans replacement? Or where we trying to sign Franklin in order to tell Mathis to Piss Off?
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cardinals also look like they might have a quality OL they can spare, especially if all their young OL win starting spots…
Trying to upgrade from Herremans.
That would have been a bad ass line,,,
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If we can fix things with Mathis, after this season I would like to see us sigń Yanda, and go into the 2016 season with:
Lane, Yanda, Kelce, Mathis, Paters
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That’s a great veteran line to go into a season with, while we draft and start developing young OL on the bench to take over for some of the old men like Peters and Mathis in 2017, and replace Yanda with another young player going into the 2018 season…… That’s how we transition from a great veteran line, to a young Top OL while remaining contenders without having down years of poor OL play counting on too many rookies….
I’d guess first and foremost it would have been for Herremans with the hope Mathis showed up. That would have been quite a dominant line. And then, wed also have a contingency in place if Mathis didn’t show up.
If Mathis doesnt play for us this year, Peters-Barbre-Kelce-Tobin-Johnson won’t be terrible. We’ve gone deep into the playoffs with lines worse off than that. But, one injury could really set things off into a death spiral if one of our backups does’t emerge as a starting quality player. We could potentially have a black hole at one of the guard spots or be in a real world of hurt if Kelce or either of the two tackles goes down.
I don’t believe some late 7th round pick is enough to have us hold onto Mathis this long, if we plan on cutting him if we can’t trade him… If the Eagles were going to cut Mathis I expect it would have already happened. there just isn’t enough potential value to be holding onto a player we don’t plan on putting on our roster this year…
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I do NOT believe cutting Mathis is a possible outcome. At least not at this point. it makes sense to hold onto a guy like Desean and try to get a 3rd, 4th or 5th round pick in return…but the petty 7th round pick 34yr old Mathis would fetch us in a trade ISNT worth all this Mathis Drama…. I simply do NOT believe we are holding on to player in June who we are willing to cut, in hopes of an extra 6th or 7th round pick in return.. I don’t believe that at Alll not with Chips little patiemce for bullshit… if we plan on Mathis not beng on next years team, he would have been waived already… My impression for chip letting it get to this point and telling the public that he hasn’t had a single trade offer for Mathis in two years, is that chip is bunkering down to take the stance that Mathis can either play for us, or he won’t play for anyone…
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Seems to me we have no intention of cutting Mathis, and are simply waiting this out knowing Mathis is forced To report soon… And once he understands we won’t trade him, he isn’t going to want to waste what little career he has left on the bench, so I assume Mathis will put in the work to continue performing for us
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At this point, I would be really.surprised to not see Mathis in our lineup this year… I wouldn’t cave and give Mathis an extra penny now, but once he tucks his tail and comes back, gets in eagle shape and earns his starting spots I would then give him a bonus when he no longer expects it, but I damn sure wouldn’t cave to his demands and let him strong arm an extension out of us now..
This whole thing is just so annoying. A 34 year old guard who up until a few years ago was a journeyman playing silly stupid games bitching about his contract. I mean, a stud diva WR, you expect that. But not somebody like this. Ain’t got time for that.
Even worse when he can just shut up, play and collect 11mil the next two years…. And like I said, if he shuts up and comes back, we can then even throw him some bonus incentives…. But we Damn sure SHOULDNT reward him for this behavior and pay him to come back an honor his contract… F THAT! Keep up the game of chicken TIL he is forced to tuck his tail and comes back, and if he does right by us, then we can throw him a bonus when he doesn’t expect it….but we have to be fools to let him strong arm an extension out of us….F THAT! Chip kelly needs to make it known EARLY in his GM tenure that we do NOT NEGOTIATE with Terrorists…
What’s the behavior that you’re referring to? At this point, Mathis hasn’t done anything except skip voluntary activities. He didn’t miss anything mandatory last year and hasn’t missed anything mandatory to this point either.
Nothing, he has been the model Eagle, out there busting his ass with his team mates every day….. This may be the most delusional money grab attempt by an eagle that I can remember.
If he didn’t understand before, after he has been available for trade for two offseasons, it may be a hint to recalibrate your perceived value, instead of eating up some poor advice from his agent…
What doesn’t make sense to me is that in same interview he says that he hears the Eagles plan to make no changes to the contract of the player who is locked up for 3 more years, and then he says he is pessimistic that Mathis will play for the Eagles in the fall.
The only logical conclusion would be that Evan will refuse to play, which I can’t fathom. Doesn’t make sense.
Of course I could be mincing words and cutting him may not be considered changing the contract.
“He’s not looking for a lot more money, not very much at all. A slight pay increase”
Undoubtedly for Rosenhaus.