Being 4-7 Sucks
Posted: November 28th, 2011 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 101 Comments »Last year the Packers played a late season game against the Patriots. Aaron Rodgers had been hurt the previous week and QB Matt Flynn got his first career start. NE won the game 31-27, but Flynn played well, going 24-37-251. He had 3 TDs and an INT. I think all of us who watched that game came away very impressed by the Packers. They were on the road against an 11-2 team. The Packers didn’t have their star QB. They were a longshot, to say the least. The Packers came together as a team and played a great game. They limited the Pats to just 249 yards. The Packers only committed 2 penalties. When faced with a huge challenge, the Packers responded in a big way.
The Eagles did come up with a big win last week with the backup QB running the show. I give the coaches and players credit for that. They deserve it. The win over the Giants was a very impressive showing. That doesn’t mean that the team can then rest on their laurels, which is what feels like happened.
I worried a bit when the Eagles got up 10-0. Getting out to a lead on Dallas or Washington is one thing. Those teams might go a bit into panic mode. Not the Pats. Tom Brady just gets pissed off and that’s not a good thing for his opponents. The Eagles needed the focus that they had last week. They needed the focus that the Packers had last year vs New England. Good enough isn’t good enough. You must play with an edge and do that for 60 minutes. We didn’t even do it for 15.
Complacency has been an issue for the Eagles all year. I think the team is way too quick to go into cruise control. I’m not talking about a lack of effort. Watch the tape and you’ll see that hustle isn’t the issue. I’m talking about losing the mental edge that you need in football. The Eagles get a lead and then just relax a bit.
That wasn’t an issue in the past. I wish it was a matter of blaming one or two players. I think DeSean Jackson is the best example of what’s wrong, but he’s hardly the only reason we’re 4-7. Team chemistry is the issue. For some reason, these guys don’t bring out the best in each other.
Players are at fault. Coaches are at fault.
There was a toughness and togetherness on the team from 2000-04. Maybe the fact we were a crappy team from 1997-99 was the key. The players who experienced that knew the pain of losing and they did whatever it took to win. The Eagles haven’t had a losing season since 2005. There are only a handful of players left from that debacle. By my count, only 19 of the 53 players on the roster know what a losing season is like in the NFL.
I’ve seen this in college football. Players assume that putting on the jersey comes with certain guarantees. I think that led to struggles at both Florida State and Miami. Talented players came in to those schools, but the players didn’t have the ultra-competitive drive that made the schools so great during their peak years. Putting on the jersey guarantees nothing.
Same is true in the NFL. Nnamdi Asomugha played on crappy teams in Oakland. He’s a great player and great guy, but doesn’t know how to win. Joselio Hanson knows what it is like to play in an NFC title game. Nnamdi doesn’t even know what 9 wins is like. Putting on the green jersey guaranteed nothing for Nnamdi, as he’s finding out right now.
Andy Reid and the coaches have not been able to get all the players to fit together as hoped. The shortened offseason didn’t help (especially because Reid is so methodical), but beyond that something just isn’t right.
Carlos Boozer was a big time basketball recruit coming out of high school. Duke coach Mike Krzyzewski won the recruiting battle and brought him to Duke. Boozer was solid, but somewhat of an underachiever after his first year and a half. Coach K sat him down for a talk. He knew Boozer was focused on an NBA career. Krzyzewski gave Boozer important, yet subtle advice. He told Boozer to “unpack his bags”. Boozer took the advice and really focused on his time at Duke and being part of the team from that point on. Duke won the National Title that season, in large part due to the play of Boozer in the NCAA tourney.
I wonder how many Eagles need to “unpack their bags” right now. Vince is here to learn for a year. DeSean is focused on his contract. Maclin had his health scare. Shady keeps firing/re-hiring his agent, which tells you his contract is on his mind. Patt had his health scare. Asante isn’t happy. DRC isn’t happy in the slot. Ronnie Brown isn’t happy. Jamaal Jackson is less than thrilled with sitting on the bench. Steve Smith is here for the money. And so on. The point isn’t that the players are actively doing something wrong. You just wonder if they ever completely checked in as part of the 2011 Eagles.
Personality is important in football. The coaches obviously mis-read this part of the situation. I’m not talking about the players getting along. I think the guys like each other fine. This team needed players who had a spark and could bring others together. In retrospect cutting Anthony Hargrove for Phillip Hunt doesn’t look so good. Hargrove was loved from the minute he got here til the minute he left. Great fit in the locker room. He’s got no upside, but this might be a case where the Eagles erred on the side of looking to the future and not enough on today. Would the presence of Hargrove really have made a difference? I have no definitive answer, but it sure couldn’t have hurt.
A year or two back the public relations theme for the season was “one”. One city, one team, one dream…or something to that effect. This year the actual theme for the season is 53 + +. That is 53 players + the coaches + the front office guys. This collection of individuals needs to figure out how to all get back together as one group.
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I’m working on the Game Review. It isn’t awesome.
Pats had a great gameplan and Brady executed it really well. Bunch sets made it tough to press their receivers. Their no-huddle was also really tough on us.
Haven’t watched all that much of our offense. Mistakes and some bad luck killed us in the 1st half. After that things just got out of hand quickly.
* * * * *
I think we’re slated to draft 9th right now. I cannot truly comprehend the fact that only 6 teams in the NFL have a worse record than us. Does not compute, but it is reality.
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I haven’t said much on the Marty M. / Jim Washburn story. Don’t have any special insight. I’m sure Jim was frustrated because the Pats were getting a lot of snaps and he knew his DL would wear down very quickly if things continued at that rate. He needed the offense to string together a long drive and give his guys some rest. That didn’t happen.
Didn’t I point out all of the failures of this front office and coaching staff during the 2nd preseason game against the Steelers?
If you can’t evaluate talent in the draft, you will be perennial losers in the NFL. It’s really that simple: you either draft well or you lose. Free agency is a meaningless diversion.
For years, the team rode the crest of the Ray Rhodes draft picks to winning seasons. Now, the poor drafting of defensive players from 2004 and on has come to a head. The defense is depleted of talent, and what little talent does exist on this squad happens to be older free agent mercenaries (Samuel, Jenkins, Asomugha) or a fluke draft pick (Cole).
Until they remove the decision makers responsible for the horrific talent evaluation in the drafting process, this team will never dig itself out of the hole of the perennial dogs of the NFL. They need to begin immediately, in the 2012 draft, by maximizing the effectiveness of their first three picks (a high first round pick and two high second round picks). This team cannot entrust Howie “The Accountant” Roseman and/or Andy “I Can’t Spot Defensive Talent If It Was Lodged In My Ham Sandwich” Reid to this important task. For this team to ever be relevant again, the person selecting players with the 2012 draft choices must be a capable evaluator of defensive talent.
Question. In 2008 our defense was Top 3 in almost every key category. 9 of 11 starters were home grown. Only Juqua, Asante were outsiders. Only Dawk was from the pre-Reid era.
Care to explain why that was a fluke.
I disagree with Morton but I think 2008 probably was a fluke caused by superior defensive coaching.
Other than Dawk, Asante and Cole, where is the talent in that lineup? That defense was composed entirely of guys who are now either backups or start for terrible teams.
Well lets start from the back. Asante, Sheldon Brown and the non sucking Lito Sheppard along with Dawk and Mikell
Stewart Bradley in his best form, if i remember it was also the season we saw the best play from Akeem & Gocong.
Cole, Juqua Parker, Patterson, Bunk, Darren Howard.
I think thats a pretty strong lineup
I give you Asanta, Dawk and Cole – for sure on them.
But the others? That was three years ago and not a single one of those guys is a starter on a good football team. These guys are all roster chum, credit to JJ for turning them into a good defense, but that ain’t talent.
i think you are missing the point of having solid, but unspectacular role players on your team.
not everyone can be a probowler, but having a group of overachieving role-players is a great thing to have.
Shows you what a real defensive coordinator can do though. Not trying to be a smart ass just making a point.
Coaching of Jim Johnson was the main thing, but that defense was the “last hurrah” of the old vets, augmented by free agent pickups.
CBs: Asante was a free agent mercenary and is still with the team. Sheldon Brown was one of the last decent defensive draft picks (prior to 2005) but was shipped out of town for peanuts and is no longer with the team.
S: Dawkins was a Ray Rhodes guy and is no longer with the team. Mikell was a fluke UDFA signing that worked out but is no longer with the team.
LB: Stewart Bradley, drafted in 2007, played well for a year but turned out to be an injury-prone player and is no longer with the team. Akeem Jordan and Chris Gocong played for maybe a year or two. Gocong is no longer with the team.
DE: Cole is an above-average player drafted in 2005. Chris Clemons and Juqua Parker were free agent mercenaries. Clemons is no longer with the team and Parker is a decent rotational player.
DL: Bunkley was drafted in 2006 and is no longer with the team. Patterson was drafted in 2005 and is a solid but unspectacular player.
Do you see a pattern? Since that 2008 season, Mikell, Brown, Dawkins, Bradley and Bunkley have either left in free agency or have been traded for peanuts. Cole and Patterson are still with the team, but solid but unspectacular players.
The core of that 2008 defense was comprised of older players drafted from 2005 or earlier. The only younger contrbutors were Gocong and Bradley, who, along with the older core, are no longer with the team.
*The key issue is this*:
They have failed to replace these contributors with players of even remotely similar caliber. That’s the key problem. They should have been drafting replacements from 2006-2010 in the draft to represent the core of the defense in 2010 and beyond,, but they have failed to evaluate defensive talent properly, so when Dawkins, Bradley, Bunkley, Brown, and Mikell moved on, they could only replace them with scrubs. The defense is now nothing but scrubs and free agent mercenaries mixed together into a caustic brew.
Jim Johnson was great, but their defensive drafting in the Ray Rhodes era propelled that team to greatness from 1999-2004. A few solid drafts from 2000-2005 enabled them to stay competitive up until 2010. Absolutely abysmal defensive talent evaluation from 2005 *on* has caused the current collapse that will stretch well into the future unless better talent evaluators are brought in.
I think Cole is a little more than above-average. And is every free agent a mercenary? Or should they stay with the team that drafted them for less money?
so when tommy pointed out an example of why you are wrong, you decide to change the topic by proudly exclaiming “here is the point i am actually trying to make that has nothing to do with what i originally said.”
/mort
He is just a mort, Tommy. Let it go.
If we are going back to what you said during the Steelers game, you also said:
“Screw this team completely. I’m done with the bum Eagles…”
I guess at least some of your predictions proved to be wrong.
I think once again it has been proven you cant win through free agency. You win on building through the draft. The last few years the eagles have drafted #s but it has not produced an impact player. Injuries have played a part in that but you cant consistently draft players in rounds 1-3 and not have them make an impact on sunday.
Yes and no. You can use FA. You need a good infrastructure in place. Our infrastructure let us down. Maclin and DeSean with key drops. Vick playing down a notch. Avant’s fumble vs BUF.
On defense, the infrastructure got rebuilt and that has been a major issue.
I’m sorry Tommy, but Free Agency is absolutely a fool’s errand.
Name me a single Super Bowl winning team of the past 10 years which was not built almost exclusively through the draft.
The 2009 Saints are the closest you’ll get to a Super Bowl winner with a high number of free agents on the roster, but almost every other Super Bowl winner of recent times has been, I’d say, comprised of a core of players consisting of about 95% home-grown, drafted talent.
I don’t really agree. I think building through the FA, allow you to push a good team over the top, but never make a bad team win. The draft makes bad teams get better due to NFL rules of worst team/highest pick.
I do however think that you find your franchise player, that gonna win that super bowl through the draft, with Drew Brees/Saints being the exception(but was he really a franchise player when San Diego let him go.
Think about every good team. They drafted their Franchise, whether it was Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers or Ray Lewis, Brian Urlacher, Adrian Peterson, etc. I agree with Mort on this one, where is that player on the Eagles. Vick? DeSean? The closest were have is LeSean, but does Andy see him as the Franchise player? if so, why don’t he feed him the F###### rock!
i think you did not understand what he is trying to say….
i read both of your posts and its like you are both saying the same thing, but you insist on disagreeing.
/mort
I agree that you can use FA. I think it is more important to add 1 piece 2 at the most to just top off the entire ordeal. I think that is what has let the Eagles down a bit. You have mentioned before that the Defense in 2008 was at its best with mostly home grown talent. I think the eagles have not grown well enough from within the past 3 or 4 years due either to injury or a player just not panning out.
This is one of the most anti-Reid pieces you’ve ever written. What makes it sting is how objective is.
“So this is how the world ends”
Tommy, IF Andy is gone after the season, not saying I want him gone since I actually really don’t know right now, there good and bad things either way. But if he’s gone what do you think would happen to the various coaches? without knowing I think some of them are quite expensive and we would still owe them the money if they are fired, correct? It’s an odd question but I’ve been wondering about that.
And did Belichick go easy on us, maybe because of his friendship with Reid? It’s not often you see him putting Brady on the bench and play the back-up, they usually keep firing.
Real complicated subject. I’ll just touch on it rather than address in depth.
At end of season, Lurie has to decide who stays and who goes. I assume Banner is completely safe due to their friendship.
Roseman?
Reid?
Coordinators?
Asst coaches?
If Lurie opts for change, he has to decide whether to hire a football guru to run the whole show. If so, does that guy keep Reid or get his own coach. Does Howie stay and Reid go? Does everyone go?
Assistants only stay if they fit the systems used by new coaches. I would love to see Mudd and Washburn stick around, but there are no guarantees…if changes are made.
I would think that Bobby April have a “good” chance to stay
I barely even want to think about Roseman. He should be gone. His drafting has been terrible, he hit on a couple late rd guys who are serviceable. Watkins has been solid and improving. Allen has been marginal and done nothing but make fans lower their expectations for him.
If the coaches failed in getting this team to fit together, Roseman is the one that gave them the wrong puzzle pieces.
Tommy, I mentioned yesterday in my comment about AR and his future that the shortened offseason is not an excuse for why our team is playing poorly. You sort of touched on it in this post, but I was curious if you could expand on that a little. Personally, while I think it affected the team, I don’t know that it has had as big an effect as some would like to believe, at least in terms relative to other teams. Juan is the most obvious person it would affect considering his inexperience, and I could see the argument that we have seen signs of improvement at times over the year, but at this point in the season, I don’t think our defense would have been drastically improved by a few extra mini camps. Our rookies are another spot it would have affected, but that is the same for all teams (and frankly, we have had decent production out of Rolle, Kelce, and Watkins). Chemistry could also be affected, but again, how much more chemistry would we be seeing at this point if we had a few extra mini camps. Sure, it may have helped a little bit early on, but I doubt at this point in the season we would be seeing a huge difference in terms of team chemistry. Anyway, just curious to hear your thoughts.
Andy is very, very, very methodical. He believes in doing things a certain way. Taking away the months of April, May, and June absolutely had an effect on us.
This isn’t an excuse for 4-7. The record is reality. Understanding why we’re that way is important.
Freddie Mitchell was our 1st Rder in 2001. Andy eased him into the offense and Freddie had 10-15 catches that year as a role player. The next year Andy wanted to use more 3-WR sets. He wanted Freddie to be the slot guy. Freddie spent the camps learning the slot. He got to Lehigh and it became obvious there that Freddie wasn’t ready for the job. Andy then signed Antonio Freeman, who had a very good year for us and was hugely important in the development of Donovan McNabb.
Andy is patient. He likes to teach and test. He wants to give his young players a chance to show what they can do. A normal offseason gives him enough time to teach and evaluate. That wasn’t possible this year.
As for chemistry, having a spring and summer to work guys in would have been much better. The more time Andy has with his players, the better the locker room is going to be. Chemistry isn’t just liking each other. It is learning how to work together…to be a unit rather than individuals.
Patience is both a fault and virtue for Big Red. That patience is part of the reason Andy is so methodical. He’s not going to make snap judgments. Back in 2006 Donovan got hurt. Jeff Garcia took over vs TEN and wasn’t real good. He was a bit better vs Indy, but we still got our butt kicked. Jeff then played well and we won 5 games in a row. He led us to a playoff win and almost another. Would all coaches have stuck with Jeff or would some have gone to AJ Feeley? Reid made the right call and did it at his pace.
Other times Reid is slow to bench a guy that we all want out of the lineup. Beyond that, Reid is methodical at how he makes adjustments with the team. It was only after the Ravens debacle in 2008 that Reid re-shaped the offense. That got us hot down the stretch and we nearly made it to the SB.
Taking any time away from Andy is bad. Just look at his post-bye record. Give the man time to prepare and he’s generally going to figure things out and get the team in order.
So the big question is, how patient is Jeff Lurie?
that was a good year. signing a guy like freeman was a great pickup. not a high tier FA for sure, but an excellent role player and exactly what the team needed at the time.
I see your point that a few more minicamps are hard see as the difference in losing to the Pats. They had better discipline, better execution and a better plan.
On the other hand, had those minicamps made even a slight difference earlier in the year, this loss could have easily knocked us down to 7-4 instead of 4-7. The severity of this loss is magnified by loses that I believe we would win now against Atlanta, Buffalo, and Chicago.
RE: “Unpack your bags”
What does it say about the front office that so many players with bags still packed *not* just were brought in.
But that the Eagles *needed* to bring them in.
Sure, the Eagles have some nice front line talent.
But not enough. Not nearly enough. There aren’t enough “Eagles guys” on this team.
I think back to Vermeil and Buddy and early Reid/Modrak: Those teams were built from the inside out. They were guys who bled green. That’s not nearly true of this team.
Not enough players who do thing “The Eagles Way.”
________________
Why can’t / don’t the Eagles go back to their 1960 uniforms . . . or even 1970 version.
The “hip” midnight green was nice. Let’s bring in some tradition now.
‘Cause next year, this team is gonna be all about “The Eagles Way”.
I know its an aesthetic thing that would have no effect on the team’s play on the field, but I agree regarding the Kelly Greens. You’ve seen teams like Buffalo and San Diego go back to (slightly modified) versions of their ‘classic’ looks, and it is much more fitting these days than the gaudy ‘hipster’ re-designs that teams like the Eagles, Seahawks and Broncos went for in the mid-90s.
Midnight Green ushered in a new era for the franchise. A new logo, a new owner, eventually a new coach, and eventually a new stadium… all of that stuff has, evidently, run its course. Lets bring back the classics.
Am I alone in much prefer the midnight green? I think the Kelly Green looks far worse, but is just favored because of the nostalgia.
Our nostalgia sucks. We’re a pathetic franchise with nothing to be proud of (other than a fluke championship) in a long time. The last time the Eagles were relevant (prior to Reid) China wasn’t Communist, the Cold War had barely begun and humans had never been to space.
I don’t want uniforms that remind everyone of our half century of being crap. Screw tradition, let’s stick with the look that relates to a worthwhile team.
I like both kelly green and midnight green- but I prefer the kelly by a large margin.
We wore kelly green in 1948, 1949, and 1960. That’s not crap- that’s winning. Which championship was a fluke? Certainly not 1960 where Vince Freaking Lombardi lost his only playoff game. Certainly not 48 and 49 where the Eagles are the only team to win back to back championships by shut outs.
I think going back to kelly green can inspire- turning a new leaf back to greatness. Sure, it may be just a small thing, but why the hell not?
1960 was the fluke. And that’s not meant as a slam on that team, but that it stands out, like the 85 Bears or the 02 Bucs, as a great moment in an otherwise unmemorable time.
Yeah, the 48 and 49 teams were great. You know what wasn’t great? The 50s. Or the entire stretch from 1962-1977. Or, really, the 80s and 90s.
From the 1960 Championship game to the hiring of Andy Reid the Eagles won FIVE playoff games.
Now, I know there’s more playoff games, but Andy Reid won as many playoff games in five seasons as this team won in four DECADES. There’s no greatness to turn back towards, only nostalgia for something that never existed.
one of the best posts i’ve seen by you. agree on the chemistry. too many hired guns that aren’t Eagles–guys who have other agendas that come before the team being as successful as it can be. to add insult to injury these guys getting paid BEFORE DJack didnt help (more on that later). now am i excusing him? HELL NO. he’s committed the ultimate sin, allowed contract issues to effect his play…it’s created a situation where many philly fans won’t ever back him wholeheartedly again. and who can blame them? i totally understood the DRC (need/compensation for Kolb) jenkins (another need position) and Nnamdi signings (hell, he recruited us..FA that basically fell into our lap) but Steve smith, vince and ronnie brown? WTH man? those guys aren’t and won’t EVER BE BIRDS. PERIOD. also a lack of real team leaders and guys that live and die with losses like Dawk & Trott did. from a continuity aspect we should have held onto Stew/Q for atleast another year. On the front office issue? i’d like to see Joe Banner relegated to a consultant and his role dramatically reduced.
He’s also committed an ultimate sin. losing his objectivity. there’s no one who can convince me that damn Banner didn’t let his lack of a relationship with Rosenhaus affect his DJack negotiations (the T.O debacle..duh!!!) its not like he hasn’t seen how a contract situation with a star player can affect a team. for the inability to learn from mistakes and lack of foresight to sign a player (who’s played well from day 1) because of his own personal issues, this guy has totally lost my confidence. you lock up Vick, Celek and Reggie brown after solid years but make Djack wait? DUMB. Banner and Djack (not letting him off the hook) created TO saga #2 (minus the pushups) and Banner should friggin know better…eagles fans deserve more.
I don’t think the Eagles hate Rosenhaus as much as people think. Generally, Drew gets deals done for his clients. I think TO was as much to blame as Drew back in 2005. Sounds like DeSean is big part of the problem now, wanting elite WR money.
I don’t think the Eagles have a feud with Rosenhaus, but I can’t imagine they (or most teams) like the guy, and I am not saying that as an insult to Drew. I think there is a reason so many high profile athletes go with Drew. He works hard for his players and does his best to negotiate for the best deal he can possibly get for his players. From the teams standpoint, I am sure that gets frustrating because they obviously want to get a team friendly deal which can often contrast with Drew’s goal. My guess, and it is purely a guess, is that the Eagles are not against their players signing with Drew or are against with talking with Drew, but feel they have to negotiate aggressively with him because they know that is exactly how Drew will negotiate for his players.
Tried to match up the colors with midnight green the Eagles currently wear. I had been using the kelly green. I also tried to match the gradient in the header logo. If they’re too blue let Tommy or I know.
I agree with what you wrote here. I wonder, however, how much of a service Drew provided DeSean by guiding him to continue his negotiations through the season in an attempt to get more money.
On the one hand, if he eventually gets 10 million here or elsewhere, Drew did his job.
On the other hand, one significant injury REALLY lowers his value anywhere and the press he has been getting this season make 10 million, or even the 8 the Eagles reportedly offered, seem almost impossible.
Although he doesn’t seem like one for hard self-reflection, I wonder if a few years down the road DeSean will be wishing he had signed before the season and concentrated on football. I can see him settling for a deal relatively similar this summer on a team that sees very little prime time games and growing into a problem as his ego conflicts with playing for a loser. Then again, maybe that is happening right now.
I thought of this about a month ago but I really think Nnamdi is the equivalent of Takeo Spikes. Meaning, he’s the harbinger of losing.
TKO never won anything with Buffalo and Cincy. He came here and the team went from a playoff team to 8-8. Then he was castoff. Notice the trend on San Fran and San Diego?
Nnamdi is on a perennial loser and comes here. Guess what happens? A playoff team goes in the tank.
Was it just me or did our Dline get mugged? Can’t remember which Brady TD it was but NE LT had his arm completely around Trent’s neck. Also I love when the opposing team’s Oline blatantly holds..there is no replay and the commentators say nothing. BTW if the Jim / Marty thing is true..that’s awesome!
The officials were letting a lot of holding go on. Haven’t studied much of our offense so I’m not sure if that was true for us as well as against us.
True I’ve noticed the Refs taking it extra easy on the holding calls for both teams. It’s the blatant ones that kill us. Saw them against Chicago and when opposing offenses can hold like that it nullifies our pass rush.
It isn’t just a problem with the pass rush, but also prevents them from having to double team Cole or Babin, leaving another receiver out there.
IgglesBlitz Readers,
I did some minor changes to the look and feel of the site. I know how much Tommy values his readers’ opinions so please don’t hesitate to let me know if you like or dislike the changes I made to the navbar, sidebar links, etc. Gives you something else to analyze other than the lifeless Eagles. Thanks!
I’ve definitely noticed some of the changes and they look great. The one thing I am not 100% sure about is whether some of the colors have changed. I’m on a different computer at the moment than my normal one, so it very easily could be that, but the colors seem a bit bluer to me.
Thank you. I thought it was just me.
I agree, it looks great, by the way.
one thing that bugs me with this commenting system is that i usually read through all of the comments on here and see if someone said something that i wanted to say. if i dont find anything, i’m at the bottom of the page. now if i want to post a new comment, i have to scroll all the way back up to the beginning of comments. depending on what tommy wrote, that might be in the middle of the page.
stupid complaint, i know. it would just be nice to have a button to add a reply to the main article at the END of the comments as well as at the start.
also, the minor tweaks to the site are a plus. definitely putting a more professional shine on things.
Tommy,
I know you’ve been asked before and this team will need time to make coaching changes but c’mon man who won’t be here next year?. Personally I want Reid, Jim and Mudd to stay. Castillo the jury is still out. Marty, it’s hard to pinpoint if play calling or players are more to play for the struggles, this year especially, but I believe his gig is up. He just seems predictable. He has his moments but not enough and hardly clutch. Johnie Lynn is another guy I question. We picked him up from the 49ers and look how much better that teams secondary is playing this year. They also cut Nate and pick up Carlos..and Carlos is having a phenomenal year.
BTW before Mangini started working for ESPN, the media gave me the impression that he’s a cancer. But know after listening to him he seams like a good dude that has some really good insight. His former players say he is a coverage guru..maybe a candidate??
I heard Mangini was hated in most of his NFL stops, especially in Cleveland, and tries to load the players with too much info rather than letting them play.
I might be in the minority on this one, but I think the “likability” of a coach is a overrated quality. I’m not trying to pull for Mangini or anything like that, and I also am not saying that “likability” doesn’t affect HOW a coach works, but I am not sure it really correlates positively or negatively with being a successful coach. There was an article out a few weeks ago about which coaches the players disliked the most (or something along those lines) and Belichick was very high up on the list (as were a handful of other decent coaches and awful coaches). To me, in a situation like the one we are currently in, having a likable coach is favorable because at least players are willing to play for the coach and that may limit some of the locker room explosions, but outside of a situation where the coach is on the hot seat, a more aggressive coach could sometimes lead to the players getting more fired up or play with a little more anger.
I think the likability factor points directly to both AR’s strength and his weakness. On one hand, he trusts his players and players respond to that by trying to prove him right (Garcia). On the other, he is slow to make an adjustment because he trusts his players, resulting in sticking with a guy we all want benched for too long. I think him trusting in his guys is one of the reasons players like him, but it has it’s strengths and weaknesses (as would having a coach who players dislike).
“Hey man, on running plays, can you make sure you don’t run yourself out of the play?” – LB’s
“They pay me to get sacks.” -Babin
“Hey man, can you be a little more conservative in clutch situations instead of jumping in front of every pump fake?” -Safties
“They pay me to get interceptions” – A. Samuel
I’m not necessarily singling these guys out, but that seems to be the general attitude.
Really need a new OC, DC and DB coach…any idea who is out there?
Part of the problem is who is out there that is an upgrade. There really isnt a point in getting a new OC as long as AR is here because he is going to have a throw first mentality regardless of who has the title of OC. I think part of the problem was there really was not a true name out there as a DC this past year and I am not sure who is out there this year.
When it is all said and done, whenever the AR/MM era ends, I would love to find out how much each person controlled the game plan and the play calling. I think the general consensus right now is that AR designs the game plan while MM does the play calling based on that game plan, but I have to imagine they both have significant input both in the game plan and the play calling. My question really is are they really that like-minded coaches, or has MM been groomed to think like AR, or does MM have ideas that are different than ARs but get overruled due to AR being HC (or something similar, although I imagine AR ultimately has final input).
MM is a big part of the problem. The change in philosophy when MM replaced Childress is one reason this team struggles. They keep trying to go big play, 2004, then TO gets hurt and they go back to the ball control WCO and make the SB, 2006, 5-4 with the big play offense then McNabb gets hurt and they have to go ball control WCO with Garcia, 2008 McNabb struggling, then they go back to ball control and go 6-1 and into the NFCCG. See a pattern?
The 2002 team, with Thrash, Pinkston, Freeman, Chad Lewis and Thomason as the skill players, a Liz Franc duce averaging 3.8 ypc, McNabb injured and Feeley/Detmer starting six games, merely averaged 25.9 points per game. What are the 2011 Eagles averaging?
From Twitter:
RoobCSN Reuben Frank
“Trevor Laws on Sea.: “Watching film, it’s an easily winnable game. If we play our game, we should blow these guys out. That’s the way I feel”
Really? Providing bulletin board material at 4-7, only a few weeks removed from loosing to Arizona? Flat out dumb comment.
Wow
um… let the sucking for RGIII begin?
Well, when you’ve played as well as Trevor Laws has in his NFL career, it’s difficult not to be arrogant.
This is exactly why we’re not going to the playoffs. The players think they’re all great. They’re not.
I’m fine with letting Laws walk in the off-season.
exactly. even after being proven week after week that they are NOT a good team, they still feel that they are. they feel that they are entitled to a win. why? because they are usually pretty ok? because they picked up some big name FAs? how does that mean you deserve to win?
to win, you have to want it more than the other guys. its part of the mental toughness that this team seems to lack entirely.
instead, it seems like our players just think “we might have lost today, but we’re still a better team.” own up to it. take some responsibility, both as an individual player and as part of a team.
There’s no reason the Eagles can’t shift to a 3-4 defense — and get some better LBs in the process.
The usual objection is “wrong personnel” up front.
I don’t think that’s true anymore. (It’d be less true if we still had Bunkley.)
The Houston Texas — under former Eagles D.C. [in name only] Wade Phillips — are, I think, the top-ranked defense in the NFL.
The Texas NT is Shaun Cody, listed at 301 lbs.
The RDE is Antonio Smith, listed at 280.
And the LDE is rookie JJ Watt, listed at 288.
Among Dixon, Patterson, Landri, Jenkins, Laws, and practice squader Thornton, the Eagles can fill out the front three.
At LB — assuming no changes (and there will be) — there’s Rolle-ee (Pollee), Chaney, Mathews, Fokou, Jordon, and Clayton.
Noticeably missing is Brandon Graham and Trent Cole. Those guys — especially Graham (because that’s where he was projected in the first place) — can be OLBs. Although, like the defense Phillips is running in Houston, they could be used as a 4th attacking lineman.
Wide 9 would be gone. And Babin too.
Not advocating. Just exploring consequences.
Getting back to one of the original posts, one of the philosophies under the new GM that really bothers me is the concept of trading down for value. I never understood, and still don’t understand, why it is better to trade down to amass more picks when you’re a team that is (in theory) a championship contender. You don’t need to fill out a roster with extra picks. If you believe your talent is ready to compete at a high level, if anything you should be trading up to get that one or two key players rather than trading down to end up with 10 or 11 picks hoping that a few will turn out to be good.
I can’t believe the Eagles are currently scheduled to pick 9th. That’s a painful reality, but it scares me that they’ll trade down to later in the 1st round, then trade again to get out of the 1st, then trade some of the extra picks they get trading down to get a few extra picks next year, etc.
I’d rather see them target the player or players that they feel will get them over the hump, and do anything to get them. And among those choices should be a stud kick returner–even if they have to “reach” to get him.
Trading down generally says one thing to me – you don’t trust your ability to evaluate talent. That’s why you say screw the high pick, we probably won’t find the right guy there, let’s just get a bunch of scrubs and see what sticks.
Either that, or you’re hyper confident that you can spot the talent among the 6th rounders and want to take as many of them as possible. No. I think the first theory’s right.
Tommy – regarding the Marty M. / Jim Washburn story, it’s really not a big deal. Andy was apparently floating the idea that, just for the sake of symmetry, he’d replace Marty Mornhinweg with Washburn. That’s when things got a little heated.
I’m laughing and crying!
I’m thinking about Shady. In addition to fans, sportswriters, and probably even opposing coaches, even his D-line coach is wondering why he doesn’t get more touches. He only has one year left on his orginal contract. I wonder if at some point he starts to think the team he is playing for doesn’t know how to use him and starts to consider his options. I would.
I was kind of hoping Casey Matthews would pick up some more pointers during Thanksgiving dinner that would help make him and our defense better. I guess we’ll have to wait until Christmas.
Maybe Vick and company can have Christmas dinner with the Manning’s. Then we’d be unstoppable.
Well played
I’m jealous I didn’t think of that.
I like Cullen Jenkins, and Derek Landri.
Trent Cole still rocks when he isn’t getting absolutely mugged by an OT and on the field all day.
Brian Rolle is inspiring, but can’t really change the game.
Something is amiss with the corners this year… (obviously)
I think the Safety’s are o.k. hopefully as they get healthier/mature they round into a good group.
BUT… where is the fire? I think that if we keep Jenkins for another year he could round out into a fiery leader on the defense. He puts on some mean hits. He seems like a wound up kinda guy, and I think he is elite enough that the guys could respect him and follow his lead.
I don’t think the the corners are that big of a problem. Before this past week, WRs just weren’t doing much against the Eagles defense. Aside from Larry Fitzgerald, the top WRs against the Eagles were #3 guys like Robinson and Cruz.
Guys like Roddy White, Julio Jones, Hakeem Nicks, Steve Johnson, Santana Moss, Dez Bryant, and Miles Austin didn’t break 50 yards. Most didn’t break 30 yds.
I do, however, see the safeties as a problem. Whoever has played has been bad, with rare exception. They blow coverages, miss tackles, and really don’t make that many plays. How much of that is their fault I can’t say, but I’m far more confident in the CBs than I am the safeties (let’s not even think about the LBs).
its sad to say, but we really only need the guys playing the middle of the field to be somewhat competent and we haven’t really had that all season.
maybe those guys are just too young and were thrown into the fire too early.
Only thing amiss with our corners is the DC!!! I’d pull asante off the field and have Nmandi and DRC play press on the outside and Hanson in the slot. Asante would be the backup….
Very interesting column, Tommy: So now everything is the players fault, especially Nnamdi, and AR gets a free pass because he didn’t have a summer to work with these guys (and Jim Harbaugh did in SF??) and absolutely no mention of Juan “Totally Over His Head” Castillo (because, obviously, the Giants showed that he was actually a genius in hiding.).
Sorry, but your credibility is going downhill faster than the Eagles record.
“Coaches are at fault.”
“Andy Reid and the coaches have not been able to get all the players to fit together as hoped.”
“The coaches obviously mis-read this part of the situation.”
Re-read that and you’ll see the coaches mentioned a few times.
Didn’t specifically cover Juan because that wasn’t the point of the post. Clearly he’s part of the problem, but the issues I was addressing were more about intangibles than Xs and Os. Juan is great with intangibles. The other stuff is where he comes up short.
“Juan is great with intangibles.”
Maybe I’m going too philosophically here, but how would you even know?
I hear things from various places. Players like Juan. Notice they aren’t running to the media to complain about him. Other coaches, FO people like Juan. He’s a good guy and good football coach.
Unfortunately, that doesn’t make you qualified to be a good DC. Big difference in coach and coordinator, at least at the NFL level.
When you say Juan is great with intangibles, what are you referring to?
Oops, I see you basically answered that.
Maybe a little slack for Tommy should be in order. He gives mostly unbiased reports and only paints Reid as a good coach, not quite Vince Lombardi. Also, much like Dave Spadaro who writes for PE(as does Tommy), there is a little bit of green Kool Aid drinking required to write on that site. Also, perhaps Tommy has done some type of scouting for the Eagles before and chooses to keep that relationship on good terms. In any case, this is his website and we are all guests, free to leave whenever we like.
If you’ve stayed positive about the Eagles’ chances over the last 10 years you’ve been right more than you’ve been wrong.
Should have signed Tulloch.
I give Tommy a lot of credit. As you said, he is mostly unbiased and gives a very fair analysis of the Eagles. I don’t think his writing for PE has really ever changed the way he talks about the Eagles and he is definitely not anything like Spadaro, who for the most part is a PR guy for the Eagles. I will say, I do want to see Tommy’s thoughts on AR sooner rather than later. He has touched on the issue a few times, but he has yet to discuss it in depth on here and usually adds “we need to wait to see what happens the rest of the season.” While I don’t disagree that the rest of the season needs to be played out, I don’t think anything that happens the rest of the season will forgive a 4 and 7 record. I know he has mentioned he has a post planned, I am just hoping to see it soon.
well the jags fired del-rio once they got their 8th loss. maybe thats what we are waiting for?
I won’t pretend to be a coach, but with our speed on offense… would it hurt to convert to some type of spread offense next year? I know Reid is a WC guy, but wouldn’t a spread type of offense favor our greatest asset on offense… speed? Any thoughts Tommy.. you would know a lot more about this than me, of course.
We already run kind of a spread offense. Lots of 3 WR sets. Lots of shotgun. Little FB use. Empty sets.
So who are the top WRs in the draft this year? Any Calvin Johnson/Andre Johnson/Larry Fitz-type guys this year?
Justin Blackmon (Okla St) and Michael Floyd (N Dame) are the best WRs. Both are big and talented. Blackmon could be Top 5 pick. Floyd in the 10-15 range.
I’m all for going up to get one. Especially since it won’t be that far of a jump for us. We need a big physical playmaker. I don’t see any scenario where Desean is back. His stock is plummeting, but his opinion of himself isn’t.
I think we’d all like to see a good LB taken, but if we lose Jackson, we need another playmaker to free up McCoy and Maclin.
No alshon Jeffery?
How about Mcnutt out of Iowa in the 3rd round?
Is it time to talk the draft yet? Who are the top, stud defensive players? Talking top 15 good. We need some fire really really bad,
I take a little (very little) solace in the fact that the late drive against the Giants was the stomach punch that probably ended their season. Of course, that’s kind of ruined by the fact that it hands the division to the Cowboys.
All BS aside, the main reasons everyone in Pjilly see’s this team as soft.
Juan has no blitz.
MM has no dive.
Tommy you need to change the name of your site to iggles no-blitz!
Agreed. Its about as outdated as “McnabborKolb” at this point.
Lets stop with the Kool Aid…this team and the coaching staff sucks…Diddy hit the nail on the head with this article – “DIDINGER: EAGLES, YOUNG ARE NOT ‘OK'” – if you have not read it – please do so on csnphilly – “The coaches have been unable to keep the team focused. They played well against Dallas then played pitifully in losses to Chicago and Arizona. They played well against the New York Giants and melted down against the Patriots. The game plan was mystifying and the play-calling was hapless. Sometimes you get the feeling the Eagles coaches are working with crayons while everyone else is painting with oils.” – perfectly said – Andy always overthinks and wants to think hes the smartest guy around – it was plain even for a child to see – the Pats were gonna go no huddle – and the Eagles had no answer…Howie Roseman is a BUM – cant evaluate for crap – if he and AR are responsible to next years draft – we are doomed…anyone watch the Saints/Giants game last night – what do you now think of JPP? however much you may deride Morton for his comments – he says it like it is!!
Morton was higher on Brandon Graham than he was on JPP when they were being drafted. I guess you could argue that the front office should know better than Morton, but lets not pretend like he’s doing anything more than pointing out the obvious and then beating it to death with a club.
via Les Bowen
“EXTRA POINT
The last time the Eagles had a losing season – and 2011 isn’t officially a losing season yet, but I have faith it will get there – was 2005. Hmm. What happened in 2005? Kinda hazy on that. Seem to remember something about a driveway, and situps, and a wide receiver who kept making himself a distraction, on purpose, because he was unhappy.
More to the point, I remember how pleased the front office was with itself that it hadn’t indulged said wide receiver’s whims, until the season was a smoking ruin.
And I remember talking to Andy Reid months later about that mess, asking what he took from it. Reid said he should have acted on Terrell Owens much sooner, before Owens undermined Donovan McNabb’s authority and tore apart the locker room.
Apparently, the lesson didn’t stick. DeSean Jackson isn’t tearing apart the 2011 locker room – he is nowhere near the malevolent presence T.O. was – but the outlines of the problem are similar. The Eagles went to camp with a prominent weapon, a team catalyst, a diva, very unhappy about his salary. Once they determined that what he wanted was unacceptable, they just assumed they could force him to be a happy camper, and there would be no residual damage. After all, just like T.O., he was under contract.
Hasn’t worked that way. I think the Juan Castillo decision might have been the one that doomed the Eagles’ season, but letting Jackson drift listlessly along wasn’t a genius move, either. Look at the last 3 weeks: DeSean misses a Saturday meeting, sending a terrible message to his teammates on the eve of a crucial game against Arizona, the Eagles come out flat and lose at home to the Cardinals, with everybody buzzing over Reid’s decision to sit Jackson. Huge distraction. Then Jackson recommits himself, plays with fire and purpose, the Eagles upset the Giants. Then, sometime Sunday, after a couple of Vince Young misses, Jackson’s enthusiasm flags again, he starts short-arming balls, and down go the Eagles.
Has Jackson’s play made it abundantly clear he isn’t worth what he is seeking? Yes. Has management winning that hissing match done anything to help the Eagles? No.
I wish I felt management grasped that second point as well as I know it has grasped the first.”
true words.
Very interesting stuff. I kind of agree, at one point does it become detrimental to a team to just keep a player because “He’s under contract”? I’m not sure Jackson has contributed anything unreplaceable on the field this season, he’s been targeted a lot and not been real productive, he hasn’t done anything for the locker room. Maybe for guys like him its better to cut bait early rather than hoping that they’ll actually be a professional about it. Clearly Desean is far from the only problem we’ve had this year, but it definitely hasn’t helped.
This is kind of tangental to the Eagles stance on contract extensions, which I hate. I love the idea of signing a guy early to give him financial security and in exchange get what might be a favorable deal for us, but the problem is the players just aren’t holding up their end of things. They sign the deal and inevitably a few years later they aren’t happy with it. I realize that they should hold up their end of the bargain but the fact is that multiple guys we’ve done deals like that with haven’t stuck with the program. Regardless of how good of an idea it is, or that it should work, it just doesn’t work because of human nature. Players get greedy and feel they deserve more. I think the FO needs to understand that even though its great in theory, its just not working in practice. Inevitably it becomes a situation where the player we thought we were getting a great deal on in order to sign more great players becomes such a pain in the ass that he’s not playing anywhere near where we need him to be anyhow.
In summary, great in theory, not so great when actually implemented.