PHI 27 , GB 13

Posted: November 10th, 2013 | Author: | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 216 Comments »

Big win.

It wasn’t pretty. The final score is lopsided, but the game felt pretty even for most of the way. Going to Lambeau and winning is never easy. The Packers got down to their 3rd string QB, but it almost felt like that was an advantage. Scott Tolzien was a player the defense knew nothing about and he played pretty well.

There were all kinds of crazy plays. I’ll go over them in a later post, but this was both teams doing crazy things. And the officials were all over the map. They missed calls for both teams.

Nick Foles played good enough. His numbers were impressive (12-18-228 with 3 TDs and a rating of 149.3), but you have to look inside the numbers. There was some luck on the long TD pass to DeSean. I didn’t think Foles was as crisp this week, but he did what I wanted…he moved the ball and helped the Eagles to score points.

Shady McCoy had a terrific game. He ran for 155 yards. So elusive…

Riley Cooper had another big game…3-102-3.

Allen Barbre replaced Jason Peters at LT and seemed to do a solid job.

The run D limited Green Bay to 99 yards on 30 carries. That includes a 19-yd scramble by Tolzien.

DeMeco Ryans was terrific. He had an INT and a ton of tackles. Very physical.

Brandon Boykin had a Red Zone INT and made other plays.

Can you believe the offense ran out the final 9:32 of the game. How is that for a ball control drive?

The Eagles are now back to 5-5. If the Saints win tonight, the Eagles will be tied for 1st place.

_


  • bdbd20

    That last drive was AWESOME. I think we can all remember the Dallas game a few years ago where we did the same thing. Our O-line played really well today (even after the Peters injury).

    • Crus57

      I’ve been pleasantly surprised by how well Barbe has played when he’s been called on. Usually our backup OL can be spotted as they’re the ones on their knees while a DL crushes our QB.

      • ACViking

        Was the sack-fumble on Barbe? A RB? Mathis?

        Wondering.

        • Anders

          The first guy was Kelce

          • ACViking

            Hmm.

            I wonder what the inside word around the NFL is on Kelce, in terms of what works best against him.

          • Anders

            I think this is first sack on him all year and his only bad game was the first Giants game. Else he has been deadly. He won a lot of matchups against Poe.

        • Crus57

          Two of GB’s DL came basically untouched up the middle, from memory. So much so that I thought it was a screen pass gone wrong.

          • ztom6

            it was an overload blitz. The inside man was a DB iirc

    • Always Hopeful

      I basically only saw from the Jordy Nelson non-TD (which looked a TD) to the end of the game. I LOVED the last drive. From the early 3rd down pick up by Casey to both Shady and Bryce’s running, to Nick’s run to the O-line just opening holes when the Pack KNEW we were going to run it. LOVED it!

      • Iskar36

        A lot was said about the Jordy Nelson non-TD, but in reality, I think it was definitely the right call by the refs on that one. Nelson made a spectacular attempt to catch it as he was going down, but you could clearly see the ball roll on the ground at the end. At the absolute very least, there was no way you could say there was indisputable evidence that it was a catch.

        • Always Hopeful

          If it was called a TD on the field and upheld by replay and the Birds challenged I wouldn’t have felt bad about the call. Like you said, no indisputable evidence.

          • Iskar36

            Exactly. To me, it looked incomplete either way, but regardless it would have been a very difficult call for the ref and however it was called on the field is the way it should have stayed.

  • TheRogerPodacter

    what was the red zone performance? NFL.com has them at 0 for 4, but i dont remember getting that many RZ opportunities…

    • bdbd20

      I believe the last drive ended in the RZ. Then there was the 3 FG’s. I’m not sure if we got in the RZ in each drive.

    • Ben Hert

      Redzone? We don’t need no stinkin’ redzone.

  • Baloophi

    Nick Foles also picked up some nice, and timely hidden yardage with a few scrambles. Nothing flashy like you’d expect from Tolzien, but still…

    • xeynon

      They even ran the read option with him a couple times with a bit of success. He’s not going to break off 30 yards the way Kaepernick or Wilson can but maybe he can at least keep the defense honest.

  • Corry

    It’s always great to get a win, but man, the defense has to do a better job of getting off the field. The Pack didn’t score a lot, but is it too much to ask to get a couple more 3 and outs?

    Also…Go Saints!

  • ACViking

    Inside Foles’s numbers:

    Yes, the 1st TD could have been an INT and, at a minimum, should not have been a completion for a TD.

    The pass to Avant (through the hands of Tramon Williams) happens all over the league every week. Williams was racing to the ball and didn’t get there.

    The long TD to Cooper led him parallel to the GL . . . if Foles throws it farther, it’s an INT or incompletion. Was the underthrow intentional? I have no idea — except a longer pass probably doesn’t work and may be an INT; and the shorter thrown was 7.

    So besides the first TD, what completion by Foles was fortuitous?

    No one on GB fell down . . . like Chung on the GB TE’s TD (Bostic).

    No blown coverages leading to big passing yardage, right?

    GB played pretty solid pass defense.

    Just putting this out there.

    So

    • Corry

      “The long TD to Cooper led him parallel to the GL . . . if Foles throws it farther, it’s an INT or incompletion. Was the underthrow intentional? I have no idea — except a longer pass probably doesn’t work and may be an INT; and the shorter thrown was 7.”

      In Foles’ press conference, he did say the underthrow was intentional.

      • ACViking

        Great. Thanks.

      • Iskar36

        Yep. He said he put it where he wanted it, although it may have been “slightly” underthrown. I definitely agree with ACViking, it may not have been a spectacular throw, but it certainly wasn’t a “lucky” misfire.

        • Pennguino

          Right he mentioned that if he throws that straight the safety will have a chance to turn and pick it. So he threw it a little shorter than he wanted too but off to the side away from the defenders. He mentioned how the winds up higher were gusting. I love the cerebral approach he has on the game.

          • ztom6

            perfect example of a “throw the receiver open” throw, no?

          • Pennguino

            A beautiful mind…though he was a little off early on. Looked like they had the right defense called to combat Foles. He fought through it and Chip came out with a better game plan in the second half.

      • shah8

        I thought about it some, can’t replay it, but that’s a really funky way to think about throwing a deep ball. I don’t think I can recall anyone ever throwing 40+ yards five yards to the side, so a double-covered receiver can get it.

    • ICDogg

      The one thing that I really like about Foles is that he knows how to take advantage of a defensive mistake. And makes some plays that are “gifts”, in a way, but not every QB sees these things and takes advantage of them.

  • ACViking

    Re: Foles’ Inside the Numbers.

    In the RZ, the offense was disappointing.

    I not so sure the playcalling was that great either.

    • Anders

      I thought the play calling was bad. Didnt like all those roll out passes

      • ACViking

        Hate the rollout / 1-receiver pattern.

        • Anders

          ghost of AR

    • Corry

      Yeah I wasn’t a fan of the play calling. They always seemed to have those longer goal to go situations though. The ball always seemed to be on the 8-9 yard line.

    • bdbd20

      I didn’t really have an issue with it. I was fine being conservative seeing we were playing an inexperienced QB and FG’s would probably be enough.

      • ACViking

        I wouldn’t disagree if the Eagles were coached by Lovie Smith — a fairly conservative coach.

        But Kelly? He’s a “Jug-u-lar Vein” guy.

        • bdbd20

          We can agree to disagree. I felt that a turnover in that situation would give GB some momentum. There will be times to take chances.

          • ACViking

            Even at 7-0?

            But fair enough. Point taken.

    • Ian Patrick

      you sir are misled. if we hit 2 FGs that henery shanks we win 33-13. hard to put special teams ineptitude on Foles. you can say oh well he should have gotten this or that amount of yards. yea well if your mom and your werent your mom and dad, maybe youd be half a foot taller. shoulda woulda coulda is the talk of an arm chair quarterback. results are the speak of winning ones, or at least game ones.

      • Andy124

        Redzone efficiency is generally measured by touchdown%, with settling FGs considered a loss for the offense.

  • ACViking

    Re: Missed Challenge

    Anything from anyone on that non-decision?

    • ICDogg

      could have cost them the game, but didn’t.

    • Jerry Goldstein

      I thought it was idiotic and seemed to be Shurmur’s fault according to Kelly’s PC.

    • Corry

      Chip said he didn’t get anything from the coaching staff to challenge it, so he didn’t. Maybe Shurmur was in the little coaches room?

    • ICDogg

      actually, there were 2 missed challenges… don’t know which one you’re referring to

      • Jerry Goldstein

        I’m guessing the one where Boykin’s(theirs) hand was OOB but it was still ruled a catch.

      • Iskar36

        Was the second missed challenge on the 3rd and 5 play where they marked him down after the fumble yardage? If it was, I wonder if that was actually the right decision not to challenge the play. It seemed that the player had gained the yardage for the first down before stretching out and then fumbling (I didn’t get a chance to see it again, so I could be wrong). He did gain a few additional yards that he shouldn’t have, but according to the rules, you can only win a challenge of ball placement if it results in the difference between a first down or not. So, while the ball was misplaced, it seemed to me (again, based on the one glimpse I saw), that he still got the first down, therefore we would have lost the challenge.

        • ICDogg

          I thought he was short

          • Buge Halls

            He had made the first yardage before he was down, so it would have been a wasted challenge. The out of bounds play is right on Shurmur’s shoulders and would have been overturned if challenged. That needs to be fixed – it’s been a problem all season!

      • ACViking

        The long catch by the sideline.

  • Jerry Goldstein

    What can I say? Foles Era! So excited about this team suddenly.

    Also, we’ve already topped our 2012 win total. Well done Chip Kelly!

    • Joseph Dubyk

      You and me both. I’m finally excited about the Eagles again. When we saw a porous defense and the same old Vick at the helm, whats there to be excited about that?

  • Corry

    Any word in the Twitter-verse regarding Kendricks, Wolff, and Peters? Kendricks certainly looked like his was the worst, but you’re always concerned about knee injuries regardless of how severe it looked.

  • GermanEagle

    i love you

    • ACViking

      This Bud’s for you.

  • ICDogg

    Nick Foles’ QB rating on the season is now 132.5.

  • BlindChow

    We now have more wins this year than last year. Take THAT, Andy Reid!

  • Iskar36

    In terms of Nick Foles, I still have no idea whether or not he can be a franchise QB, but on a day that he played “poorly,” he threw 3 TDs, 0 INTs, had a high QB rating and only had one turnover (which I still think was a very close call either way). As Tommy mentioned, the numbers don’t tell the full story by any means, but I love the fact that Foles fought through some struggles and ended up overall having a successful day.

    If this is the Foles we see the rest of the season, to me, if the BPA in the draft happens to be a QB, I fully support going after that player, but I would be more than happy to stick with Foles if the BPA is a non-QB.

  • Iskar36

    Wow. Again, numbers absolutely do not tell the full story, but great stat from Reuban Frank:

    Reuben Frank
    ‏@RoobCSN

    Nick Foles is first player in NFL history to have a passer rating of 149 or higher in consecutive games [minimum 15 attempts. #EaglesTalk

    • ICDogg

      crazy

    • ACViking

      Re: Passing Records

      There should be a big line in the record book separating QBs who played before the 5-yard chuck rule and after.

      Then another line between the QBs who played before hitting WRs became illegal.
      __________

      I like Foles. But the records need context.

      • Iskar36

        When did those rules change again (not a sarcastic question, actually curious)? The 5 yard chuck rule was something around 10 years ago. The hitting WRs is 3 years old I think, right?

        I fully agree with you that those rule changes changed the game a ton, but not every QB is getting those numbers even today, so you can’t simply throw out those accomplishments. If the rule changes were all it took to make those passing records happen, we would have seen more QBs accomplish that record.

        • ACViking

          The 5-yard chuck rule (or, “The Mel Blount Rule”) took effect in 1980.

          At the time, i.e., 1983-88 period, when Dan Marino was tearing up the NFL, lots of former players pointed to the abolishing of true bump-and-run defense.

          The “kill the WR rule” started, with urgency, last season.

          • Iskar36

            I would then also add a line when the NFL started having refs call PI with a lot more regularity which happened around 10 years ago. That changed passing offenses dramatically (and I would argue, way more dramatically than the can’t hit a defenseless WR rule did).

            Either way though, those rules changed awhile ago, so plenty of QBs had an opportunity to achieve what Foles has in the last two games. Still, Foles was the first to do it. Because of that, I don’t think you can simply dismiss that accomplishment.

      • Anders

        Looking at passing records. Im still amassed by the LA Rams with Norm Van Brocklin. Those Rams was crazy good.

        Good job by the Eagles to pick him up and win a Championship.

        • ACViking

          Has to be, given the rules, the greatest individual performance ever by a QB.

          And even after someone break’s the Dutchman’s record, it’ll still be the greatest record for a single game.

          Just like John Unitas’ 47-straight games with a TD pass was (and to me remains) the greatest streak in the NFL.

          He played in 12- and 14-game seasons. WRs were mugged all over the field. And he faced some truly great defenses (GB, Chicago, NYG of the early ’60s) 5 times per season.

          • Anders

            The 50 LA Rams has the scoring record per game with almost 39 points per game.

            The Broncos looking to break that record that year

          • ACViking

            A –

            Great find.

    • Anders

      #careerbackup #Offensebottom5 #vanillaoffense #Kellyisafruad #Chipsoffensehasbeenfiguredout

      • Buge Halls

        #douchebag #cowgirlsfans #STFU

        • CrackSammich

          Not a fan of sarcasm I see.

    • ACViking

      Ruben Frank should talk about records the way he talks about SB champions.

      It’s like the NFL didn’t exist before 1966.

      Passing records only should be measured after 1980, because that’s when DBs couldn’t bump receivers beyond 5 yards.

      HOWEVER . . . great numbers by Foles to be sure.

      • Iskar36

        I agree with you in general about Reuben Frank. I love the amount of knowledge he has about historical statistics, but like you said, he does not contextualize any of his stats what-so-ever. I don’t know if he actually views it this way or not, but the way his writing reads to me, for him, stats DO in fact tell the whole story, which I disagree with. Either way though, they are very interested numbers usually from Reuben Frank.

  • BlindChow

    LeSean McCoy had 6.2 YPC. Looks like those Foles runs are paying off!

    • ACViking

      How ’bout “Foles the Passing Threat”?

      • BlindChow

        No no, the reason McCoy’s average went down was because Foles wasn’t mobile enough, remember?

  • ACViking

    Re: Conservative Chip?

    Before the 9:30-minute drive in Q4, Kelly’s play-calling was:

    22 called passes: 17 pass attempts + 3 sacks + 2 scambles

    20 called runs

    That’s 52.5-47.5 pass-to-run ratio.

    _______________

    Add in the last drive, the numbers skew dramatically to run-heavy play calling:

    15 runs — including 3 kneel-downs — versus 1 pass.

    • Corry

      I don’t think that’s conservative play calling. I think that’s just Chip Kelly’s offense. If you watched him at Oregon, his offense was based on the run game out of the spread.

      • ACViking

        You’re right, for sure.

        But relative the rest of the NFL, Kelly’s playcalling through 3 Qs was, by today’s standards, on the conservative side.

        Crazy.

        And by Big Red’s standards, Kelly’s downright old-fashion.

        • Corry

          Oh definitely. You have to credit Kelly with knowing that one of his best players is Shady McCoy and actually uses him.

          Reid, for as brilliant an offense coach as he was, never seemed to make good use of his RBs in the traditional sense. Westbrook probably spent just as much time in the slot as he did lined up deep behind the QB. If Big Red was still our coach, I think McCoy would have had the same fate.

          I wonder if we didn’t have such a dynamic player at RB, if Kelly wouldn’t be more pass happy…

          • P_P_K

            The main reason I was glad to see Reid leave was because I wanted to see what Shady is capable of.

        • Corry

          Although, it does seem like a lot of teams are realizing you still need to run the ball. Packers spent a high pick on Lacy even with the best QB in the league (and a fourth on Franklin as well). The Colts shipped a first rounder over to the Browns for Richardson. So I think we’re starting to see the league go back towards the running game.

    • Anders

      Kelly takes what the defense gives him. We was able to run and the Packers did okay job on our WRs outside of 3 plays.

      • ACViking

        The Packers definitely were NOT playing single-safety high all game (like everyone else since Game 2 or so).

        I don’t remember one time where Foles dropped back, looked off the safety, and threw the other way.

        Regardless, the offense put up points and killed the clock at the end.

        The defense still needs more talent, though — something that’s not been talked about the past few weeks against lesser teams.

        • Anders

          A lot of us have talked about it.

          We really need that impact OLB and could use another CB (upgrade Williams and depth for the few games Fletcher is going to miss).

          I think safety is settled now with Allen and Wolff, but we could use some more depth (I do not want to see Colt Anderson on defense ever unless its a total blowout)

          • ACViking

            A –

            I should have phrased my comment better.

            While not a topic recently, many commenters — like you — ID’d the defense as needing more help early in the season.

            While the D is playing better, it’s not winning any SBs without more talent.
            ____________

            By the way, do you recall seeing Graham out there today?

          • Corry

            He was out there a couple times that I recall. He made a couple stops in the run game.

          • Anders

            I have talked about the need for impact OLB the last 6 weeks.

            I really think it is biggest need for us as it would help the secondary more than a rookie or FA CB could do

          • ACViking

            A –

            Yes, you did. Lost in the hubbub of the QB discussion, I think.

            You and GEagle have been laying out the OLB prospects and arguments.

            Given how the Eagles are doing, and they seem headed for at least 7-9, WHO DO YOU THINK IS OUT THERE in the late teens of Rd 1?

          • Anders

            Khalil Mack, Trent Murphy or Kyle Von Roy.

            I think Trent Murphy would be the pick because of his size and Kelly has just seen him destroy his Ducks two years in a row (I know he didnt coach em this year, but I bet he still watches them).

            Another LB from Stanford I would love is Shane Skov. Guy has perfect size for ILB in a 2 gap 3-4 (something Stanford also plays)

        • ICDogg

          I know we like our D-line, but if there’s the next Vince Wilfork out there, I’m all over that pick.

          • ACViking

            A massive, dominant NT who could push the pocket, too?

            That would be great. Thornton and Cox would become better the moment that draft pick is announced.

        • Iskar36

          While I love seeing us win, I would love to get a more accurate gauge on our defense with us going up against a good offense (with a healthy QB playing). Over the last several weeks, we have held teams point totals down a ton, but have managed to give up tons of yards. To me, coupled with the fact that most of the offenses we have played in that span have been poor (or have been missing their Pro Bowl starting QB), that’s a sign of a defense benefiting from poor competition. I THINK our defense has improved a ton since earlier in the season, but a true test against a quality offense would be nice.

          • ACViking

            I-36:

            We’re reading from the same novel.

          • BlindChow

            Having our own defensive starters on the field would also help in that analysis. Who knows what difference Fletcher (and later, Kendricks) would have made?

          • ACViking

            Seriously, without Aaron Rodgers today, we know very little more about the defense.

          • P_P_K

            We know they are lucky they didn’t face Rodgers.

  • Ben Hert

    Back in January, who would have thought we’d be seeing these two sentences in a game recap:

    “The strong-armed Foles exposed Green Bay’s secondary in the second half. Cooper was wide open on both of his long scores…”

  • ICDogg

    Most important thing for me to take from this game: this is a game we would have lost last year. That is a turning-of-the-corner in a way.

  • ACViking

    Re: No Love for Foles in the National Media

    PREDICTION:

    Tomorrow, the elites will lump Foles in with Case Keenum . . . because Keenum has 4 TDs and 0 Ints this season (so far).

    And, you know, they’re both not Brady or Manning. Or Luck or Griffin.

  • Ben Hert

    Not talked about enough was Shady and the OL running for ~150 yards against one of the top run D’s in the NFL.

    OL looked pretty good today. I’m intrigued to see what shakes out at the OT position in the off-season.

    • Anders

      If Peters cant stay healthy, I think he is cut, Johnson takes over at LT and Babre, Kelly and Tobin battles for the RT spot

      • holeplug

        Think I’d give Peters one more year. Johnson is still so raw.

  • JJ_Cake

    No team will be underestimating Foles from here on out. Again, unless he’s injured, Foles is solid enough to be our QB. Yet another game where he has outperformed over Andrew Luck (who I started in place of Foles in my fantasy team; Foles made me pay for that :) at least Shady and Djax got me points… yes I’m a fantasy homer).

    I am enjoying Nick’s team leadership, and humility during press conferences.

  • planetx1971

    I find any arguments against Foles not being the starter now ridiculous to the point of being OFFENSIVE. If Luck, RGIII, Wilson OR Tannehill had thrown 16td’s with no picks at ANY point, they’d already be building 50ft. golden statutes outside canton & they’d be being worshipped as God’s (even more than they already are) Vick will make a GREAT back up to finish his tour of duty hear. Bottom line, Vick is a KNOWN quantity. We HAVE to see Foles the rest of the way to determine our future plans. I DONT give a SH*T if there was a lucky bounce on a TD! ALL HAIL FOLES!!

  • Buge Halls

    Isn’t it AWESOME seeing our offense seal a game by running the ball for 9 1/2 minutes? Andy Reid would have had the QB throw the ball three times, then punt and given the game to Green Bay! Running out a game is a thing of beauty! The best way to beat any team is to keep their QB on the sidelines watching.

    • ACViking

      I think you’re being totally unfair.

      Kelly called a pass play on that drive.

      • ACViking

        Buge Halls . . .

        Yes. That last drive was sweet music.

        And, frankly, sometimes I’d like Kelly to pound the rock for 9:30 minutes earlier in the game. Use most a quarter to score.

    • P_P_K

      I wish Chip had the roster that Reid had during those NFC Championship years.

  • Corry
    • ICDogg

      Yeah, you don’t see too much referee hugging

    • Joe Minx

      This is the best thing ever.

  • ICDogg

    The Eagles are indeed the first team in modern era to be at .500 or above after Week 10 without a home win.— gregg rosenthal (@greggrosenthal) November 10, 2013

    • ACViking

      Now that is something to take note of.

      Laurie just should have said something nice about the VET. Now he’s cursed Linc.

  • Joseph Dubyk

    Foles obviously wasn’t as good as last week but he still did a lot of nice things. He still needs to work on some things as well but from a guy who’s only started a handful of games thats to be expected…. Seems like Jason Peters is going to be gone next year with a 10 million dollar tag, health concerns, and he seems to be on the down swing of his career……… The defense still scares me, I doubt we win that game if Rodgers is at the helm.

  • Baloophi

    Peyton with 4 TD’s now at 11:34 in the 3rd.

    Trying to help the media narrative that Foles is a fluke…

    • ACViking

      Peyton is a jerk.

      You think he was kidding on SNL with those kids he QB’d?

      • ACViking

        And if Manning throws for 8, it just shows that NFL pass defenses are a joke anyway.

        • Baloophi

          Indeed… in a weird way, he hurts the accomplishment if he does it again.

      • Baloophi

        He has certainly presented me with a difficult challenge:

        Watch him try to re-tie the record? Or clean and organize the garage.

        Hmm…

        • ACViking

          Where’s that been all day?

          • Baloophi

            If you’re referring to the garage, fortunately it’s still in the same place as it was yesterday… not always a given in Southern California.

          • ACViking

            That’s what I’m talking about.

  • Westpaceagle

    Kickoff Return Game (off topic)
    If I was a coach I would see if it was advantageous to down every kickoff return. It seems like the risk of injury, turnover, or not making it to the 20 outweighs the possibility of a long return, which seem more and more rare these days.
    I would have some super smart stats guy come up with a formula like:
    X = (% turnovers + % injuries) – % returns of 40+ yards
    If X is positive then down it every time. Eventually teams might kick in a way that is advantageous to a return, or get complacent at which point a called return could provide opportunity to make a play.

    • Baloophi

      You might have to factor in things like “strength of field position” to account for 3-and-outs from your own 20… which can be difficult to quantify.

      BUT, I like the outside-the-box thinking. If you took it to an extreme example, you could theoretically gain more practice time for your offense or defense by reducing time spent on “kick return,” though you’d still need to practice “onside return” and “squib return”…

      • Westpaceagle

        Thanks- maybe its just because our return game in recent memory has produced almost nothing, but every kickoff results in a lot of violent collisions. I think some commentators have referenced kickoffs as the most dangerous play in football. Plus as you mentioned time in practice, plus fatigue during the game.
        The worst is when a long retun is called back due to a penalty, then you are 1st and 10 at the 10 yard line anyway.
        Seems like an idea a coach like Chip Kelly would consider.

  • Insomniac

    So what do we draft this year?

    • Anders

      I say OLB in the first.

      • ACViking

        Eagles will be drafting late teens-early 20s.

        What then, assuming Barr is off the board? What impact, pass-rushing OLB makes it that deep?

        Or is there a trade up? How much would you be willing to spend to get Barr or his equal?

        • Anders

          Mack, Murphy and Von Roy.

          I would not trade up for Barr as he is most likely a top 5 pick even tho some does not agree: https://twitter.com/lawlornfl/status/399417981152661504

        • Baloophi

          To help spur some discussion, if we’re in the late teens, we’re probably looking at something like this:

          DEFENSE
          - #2 Safety prospect
          - #2-3 CB
          - #1-2 ILB
          - #3-4 DE/OLB
          - #3-4 DT

          OFFENSE
          - #3-5 OT
          - #1-2 TE
          - #1 OG
          - #3 QB (?)
          - #1-2 RB
          - #2-4 WR

          • ACViking

            I’d not thought about TE.

            But you are dead right.

          • Baloophi

            We’ll be right in the TE sweet spot. I think the QB decision and how the board falls will determine the trade mobility.

            I suspect, however, that we’ll sit tight, or even move back to load up in the 2nd and 3rd. We’ve got some spots to fill… especially in the secondary.

          • ACViking

            No TE from Stanford, though.

            The school is slowly developing a reputation for turning out over-rated “NFL ready” TEs.

          • Baloophi

            Did we even dress a TE today??

          • Baloophi

            Also, we should start a new “draft” thread before this one winds up with micron-wide margins.

            On that note, if you (or anyone) can find a “working” draft order, that would be fun to look at…

          • Anders

            http://www.bucsnation.com/pages/nfl-draft-order-2014

            Havnt been updated for this week yet tho.

          • Baloophi

            Excellent work, Anders!

          • Ben Hert

            Like the Iowa of TE

        • jshort

          You don’t see this team making playoffs?

          • ACViking

            Possible. I’d don’t know.

    • P_P_K

      Tonight I’ll drink whatever draft is on tap.

    • bdbd20

      Assuming Nick plays well the rest of the year, I think we go best player available other than QB, RB, or TE.

      • Ark87

        Punter, here we come!

        • Andy124

          Probably the 3rd round. I think we’ve learned that the 4th round is too late to draft kicker types.

  • Anders

    I think we should give some credit too Goode coming in for Kendricks and playing a good game.

    • P_P_K

      Najee B Goode.

      • Baloophi

        “He never learned to cover or catch so well / but he could come off the bench just like he’s ringin’ a bell.”

        Go! Go!

        • P_P_K

          Maybe some day his name will be in lights…

  • ACViking

    Re: Sean McDermott

    When did he become JJ-II?

    I know T-Law’s written that McD had to go after 2010, for reasons beyond the historically bad RZ defense.

    But the guy’s become the “next hot D-coordinator.”

    Is it Rivera? Or did McD grow up?

    Of course, if he’d done that here . . . we’d be asking why Reid and MM had Foles throw the ball 57 times and call only 7 running plays.

    • Anders

      Panthers have drafted really well and McDermott wasnt that good to start his Panthers career.

      Having a great DL and a star LB really helps on a lot of problems. The Panthers still has problems at CB and S tho.

      • ACViking

        He’s improved, no doubt.

        And your point about talent supports your drum-beating that this Eagles team needs more defensive talent.

        Good call.

        • Anders

          Another guy doing a great job.

          Todd Bowles. He leads the top passing defense in the NFL if im not wrong.

          • ACViking

            Right. Also a great catch.

            Reid’s oversight of his team and staff here in 2011-12 deteriorated so much.

            If he’d have dumped Marty and hired Bob Sutton in 2011 (I voted for that), he might still be here.

            For better or worse.

          • Anders

            tbh, while 11-12 was bad. I love Kelly, so maybe this was for the best?

          • Baloophi

            At least Jim Washburn isn’t looking so great…

          • Anders

            Seriously, how can that DL not have more sacks? 3 top 5 picks

          • Ben Hert

            Patrick Peterson, Honey Badger, Bell, great talent. Be hard not to.

          • Anders

            Look at the Chiefs last year. They had great talent.

            Hell look at the Eagles offense this year compared to last year (I know injuries, but we have had them this year too)

          • Ben Hert

            Fair point on the Chiefs.

    • ztom6

      Star Lotulelei and Luke Keuchly are both really, really good players.

    • Ark87

      I’ve been wondering exactly thank myself, AC. All the national media gives all the credit to Ron Rivera….but all of us Eagles fans know who the DC is….sigh

    • A Roy

      My take was that he was a smart guy who tried to implement too many ideas too quickly. Case in point was he had Trent Cole dropping back in coverage and everybody was griping.

      • ACViking

        I think it was more than that.

        JJ ran the firezone blitz, too, with Cole dropping back.

  • planetx1971

    132.5 QBR, 16td’s & STILL NO PICKS. Yup, really need Vick back out there starting! Those numbers just aren’t confidence inspiring enough for me :|For Marcus Vick either…

  • ACViking

    Colin Kaepernick is NO Nick Foles.

    I don’t care that CK runs a 4.4 forty.

    Maybe in this offense, CK would look like Foles with Vick’s (younger) legs.

    Right now, I’ll take Foles.

    • Anders

      Funny that Foles has out played Wilson, Kaepernick and RG3. Hell I argue he has out played Luck this year, but he is not getting enough credit.

      • ACViking

        Partly the whole Kelly-Vick’s his man thing.

        Lately, it’s the opposition.

        But if the Eagles go 4-2 down the stretch with Foles, he’s earned some love.

      • anon

        OK…we’ve only played one team with a winning record. CK only had one passing target and their o-line was getting straight dominated.

  • ACViking

    Re: Henery

    I’m watching the Panthers/49ers game.

    Carolina, on 3rd and long, ran short routes to get a 5-yard completion to set up a FG.

    The FG was from 53 yards. Graham Gano nailed it.

    • Anders

      look at his 10 and 11 seasons

      http://www.nfl.com/player/grahamgano/71309/careerstats

      He was terrible for the Skins those two seasons.

      • ACViking

        Kickers need seasoning.

        • Anders

          My point was that most kickers like all other plays can have down seasons.

          • ACViking

            What’s your thinking on Henery?

          • Anders

            I think he is fine. He has shown his leg is strong enough (he made a 60 yarder in college and a 53 last year that got called back for off side). Its all mental with him right now. I think he will bounce back.

          • Baloophi

            I think it’s also fair to at least consider wind when both kickers were off. Could be just that they both had off days, but it’d be nice to get an answer from ole’ crazy eyes.

            Doesn’t answer for his other misses, but might explain today…

  • Anders

    Watching this offense, I sometimes wonder how dynamic early career McNabb would have been in this offense?

    • Joseph Dubyk

      Probably no better than what McNabb was. Foles is what he is because he can make quick decisions and be accurate. He can throw guys open and anticipate a WR getting open even when hes covered at the time of the ball’s release…McNabb made a living buying 5 seconds with his legs until someone was open enough . He struggled with accuracy big time especially in the short and intermediate range…Andy definitely got the most out of McNabbb IMO

  • http://twitter.com/ezgreene ezgreene

    Tommy, would love to hear what you know about why Andy made the fateful switch from McDermott to Castillo. Any color and behind-the-scenes stuff, the better….

    • Joseph Dubyk

      Talent…. Once all the ray rhodes era guys were officially gone we did a horrible job of getting talent on the roster. aside from trent cole who else did we draft that was more than JAG on defense/.

    • ACViking

      I recall T-Law writing that McDermott, who’d coached the Eagles’ DBs before becoming DC, had some personality issues with the defensive players. McDermott “changed”. Also, the RZ defense became worse and worse.

      T-Law said a change had to be made. Now why Castillo? Maybe the worst decision a HC has made anywhere in the NFL since they started watching tape of the opponent

  • A Roy

    Thanks for the lowdown, Tommy. I was at the Ravens-Bengals game and am catching up on the Eagles game. Nice to get perspective from you and the gang.

  • Joseph Dubyk

    For a lot of people predicting that scrambling QBs were the QBs of the futre the data just does not suggest that.. The only one that seems to be above average is Russell Wilson… Pryor, Kapernick, RG3, etc all seem to look like flashes in the pan… Vick is never going to start in this league again and I think Newton’s OK, but is winning bc of a good defense. Honestly, I just want a pure pocket passer and Foles is making me more excited each week that I could finally have been waiting for ( I grew up watching Randall,, then McNabb, then Vick)

    • Anders

      I just want a mobile QB who can burn the defense for at least 3-4 yards on a keeper once in a while.

      Remember guys like Rodgers and Luck are much more mobile than people think. Also Wilson is also only really winning because of his defense.

      • Joseph Dubyk

        But Wilson’s line is horrible and he has somewhat overcome that.

        I get the whole thing about scrambling Qbs being excited. But these guys have used their athleticism their whole lives. When it comes to transferring the X and Os into their game more it never seems to work out. Kapernick got close last year but he looks like a 1 year wonder if I ever saw one.

        • Anders

          Cam Newton and RG3′s passing numbers look pretty good. No crazy good, but still good.

        • anon

          Difference between scrambling and mobile and whether that comes at the expense of passing prowess. Read option allows mobile Qbs to do some. But I’d say Big Ben is a scrambling Qb…he’s ok.

  • Anders

    Question for ACViking.

    Can you remember the last good white CB? Not sure I have ever seen a white CB while I have watched the NFL (since 1999)

    • Andy124

      Jason Seehorn(sp?)?

    • shah8

      I remember Seahorn and Lyght, tho’ the latter is a safety, but why do you care?

      • shah8

        And if we ARE including safeties, I suppose you might include Harrison Smith.

        • A_T_G

          And Kurt Coleman!

          • shah8

            The question was in reference to *good* white players. Coleman’s still got the ghost of Nnamdi’s finger dogging his ass.

          • A_T_G

            Ah, I didn’t realize the good requirement was still in play.

        • nicolajNN

          How could you forget Sean Considine!

        • http://www.aceandson.com/blog Richard O’Connor

          And John Lynch

      • Anders

        It was just a thought that all CBs are black. Just wondered.

        Also Eric Weddle is a white safety.

      • Andy124

        To be clear, Anders didn’t just pull this question out of the ether. It relates to a joking conversation going on at another site.

      • shah8

        Miami Dolphins has a white CB, forget his name…

        • Anders

          Brent Grimes? He isnt white

          • shah8

            whups…thought he was…

    • wallacemnw

      Sehorn.

      • Anders

        Thanks.

    • ACViking

      Sehorn? Short-lived fame. Really just a couple seasons.

      Before him?

      HOF CB Roger Wehrli – Cards (’69-’82).

      Pro Bowler Tim Foley – Dolphins (’70-’80).

      Before them? Kent McCloughan – Raiders (’65-’70).

      • ACViking

        One other:

        Pat Fischer – Washington/Cards (’61-’77)

        • Corry

          You forgot Dick LeBeau. ’59-’72 (btw, I know this because he’s a big deal in Steeler country which is where I live).

          • ACViking

            LeBeau . . . nice job.

            Ed Sharockman of the Vickings, too.
            ______________

            But Wehrli was among the best cover guys I’ve ever seen, regardless of era or any other criteria.

  • Baloophi

    Very unofficial, and most likely erroneous working draft order after today’s action (every game but Saints / Turds). But maybe this gives us a sense of where we’re at…

    Feel free to holler out adjustments…

    1. Tampa Bay (0-8)
    2. Jacksonville (1-8)
    3. Minnesota (2-7)
    4. Atlanta (2-7)
    5. Houston (2-7)
    6. Buffalo (3-7)
    7. New York Giants (3-6)
    8. Pittsburgh (3-6)
    9. Oakland (3-6)

    10. St. Louis – from Washington (3-6)
    11. St. Louis (4-6)
    12. Baltimore (4-5)
    13. Cleveland (4-5)
    14. Tennessee (4-5)
    15. San Diego (4-5)
    16. Philadelphia (5-5)
    17. Miami (4-4)
    18. Arizona (5-4)
    19. Chicago (5-4)
    20. New York Jets (5-4)
    21. Dallas (5-4)
    22. Green Bay (5-4)
    23. Cincinnati (6-4)
    24. Detroit (6-3)
    25. San Francisco (6-3)
    26. Cleveland – from Indianapolis (6-3)
    27. Carolina (6-3)
    28. New Orleans (6-2)
    29. New England (7-2)
    30. Denver (8-1)
    31. Seattle (9-1)
    32. Kansas City (9-0)

    • A_T_G

      I think you need to switch the last two teams. There is no God cruel enough to have Reid win the SB this year.

    • mtn_green

      Move Dallas down to 20 they’re gonna lose.

      • Baloophi

        I was going to… but didn’t want to jinx anything…

    • Baloophi

      Also (for fun), here’s a Top 50 prospect list from nfldraftscout…

      1 Teddy Bridgewater QB Louisville 6-3 205
      2 Marcus Mariota QB Oregon 6-4 212
      3 Jadeveon Clowney DE South Carolina 6-5 274
      4 Anthony Barr OLB UCLA 6-4 248
      5 Jake Matthews OT Texas A&M 6-5 305
      6 Sammy Watkins WR Clemson 6-1 205
      7 Johnny Manziel QB Texas A&M 5-11 210
      8 Cyrus Kouandjio OT Alabama 6-5 310
      9 Khalil Mack OLB Buffalo 6-3 248
      10 Taylor Lewan OT Michigan 6-7 315
      11 Mike Evans WR Texas A&M 6-5 225
      12 C.J. Mosley OLB Alabama 6-2 232
      13 Hasean Clinton-Dix FS Alabama 6-1 208
      14 Louis Nix DT Notre Dame 6-2 345
      15 Cameron Erving OT Florida State 6-5 320
      16 Ifo Ekpre-Olomu CB Oregon 5-10 185
      17 Ryan Shazier OLB Ohio State 6-2 230
      18 Vic Beasley DE Clemson 6-2 235
      19 Cyril Richardson OG Baylor 6-5 340
      20 Stephon Tuitt DE Notre Dame 6-6 312
      21 Marqise Lee WR Southern California 6-0 195
      22 Antonio Richardson OT Tennessee 6-6 327
      23 Eric Ebron TE North Carolina 6-4 245
      24 Jason Verrett CB TCU 5-10 176
      25 Jace Amaro TE Texas Tech 6-5 260
      26 Bradley Roby CB Ohio State 5-11 192
      27 Trent Murphy DE Stanford 6-6 261
      28 Zach Mettenberger QB LSU 6-5 235
      29 RaShede Hageman DT Minnesota 6-6 311
      30 Kyle Van Noy OLB Brigham Young 6-3 235
      31 Brett Hundley QB UCLA 6-3 222
      32 Allen Robinson WR Penn State 6-3 210
      33 Cedric Ogbuehi OT Texas A&M 6-5 300
      34 Gabe Jackson OG Mississippi State 6-3 340
      35 Jordan Matthews WR Vanderbilt 6-3 205
      36 Bishop Sankey RB Washington 5-10 203
      37 Derek Carr QB Fresno State 6-3 215
      38 Lache Seastrunk RB Baylor 5-9 210
      39 Zack Martin OG Notre Dame 6-4 308
      40 Austin Seferian-JenkinsTE Washington 6-6 276
      41 Louchiez Purifoy CB Florida 6-0 190
      42 Lamarcus Joyner FS Florida State 5-8 190
      43 Anthony Johnson DT LSU 6-2 295
      44 Melvin Gordon RB Wisconsin 6-1 207
      45 Odell Beckham Jr. WR LSU 5-11 193
      46 Morgan Breslin OLB Southern California 6-1 250
      47 La’el Collins OT LSU 6-5 315
      48 Timmy Jernigan DT Florida State 6-2 298
      49 Chris Smith DE Arkansas 6-2 268
      50 Tajh Boyd QB Clemson 6-1 225

  • Anders
  • OregonDucker

    Tommy quote – “Can you believe the offense ran out the final 9:32 of the game. How is that for a ball control drive?”

    I still cannot believe that stat. The Eagles controlled the ball against the Green Bay Packers Defense for 9.32 minutes. Think hard about that!!! Chip, Foles, and Shady are the REAL DEAL folks. Oh yeah, so is the OL with subs.

  • Baloophi

    Tony Romo is rarely seen without some sort of headgear on his melon. Signs point toward hair plugs…

  • Baloophi

    New thread, comrades…

  • xlGmanlx

    I’ll be the first to admit I had cooper pegged as a bench warmer/scrub, but the stats don’t lie. Again, before he got hurt, I was really looking forward to these D against Rogers, to see what kind of progress they have made. Injuries are part of the game, so I can’t take anything away from beating the team in front of you.
    I wonder where all the Roseman haters are now? Can’t wait until this front office has another year to attack the depth on this roster and another year in the Chip Kelly era. He has made rookie mistakes as a coach, but I don’t expect him to made the same ones past this season.

  • eagleyankfan

    “Nick Foles played good enough. ” — give me a break. “Luck”? You’re right, because other winning QB’s never ever, EVER have luck go their way. Been a long time since we can say (co) leaders in the nfc east. Thank you Foles for your “good enough” game to get a win at the frozen tundra.