Some Stood Up

Posted: December 7th, 2014 | Author: | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 62 Comments »

While today was discouraging, there were 2 Eagles who played well. Fletcher Cox looked like the best DL on the field. He was a big reason why the Eagles kept Marshawn Lynch under control. Lynch was 23-86, but 20 of that came on a draw play early in the game. Cox had 8 solo tackles (more than any Eagle or Seahawk) and was a disruptive force all game long. He was in on 11 total tackles and had a TFL. He could have had a couple of sacks if Russell Wilson wasn’t such a shifty, elusive QB.

Mychal Kendricks was also in on 11 tackles. He had a TFL and FF as well. Beyond numbers, Kendricks made his presence felt for much of the game. He had the power to tackle Lynch on inside runs and the speed to chase Wilson. Kendricks was the only Eagle with the closing speed to get to Wilson in the open field. If not for some throwaways, MK could have had 1 or 2 sacks. Kendricks looked like the best LB on the field today.

Cox and Kendricks played well enough to win. They were ready for the big game. That can’t be said for all their teammates.

The Eagles defense certainly has issues. The secondary just isn’t good enough. But you see the foundation of a good defense with players like Kendricks and Cox. Both are young and you can build around them. Both are strong and physical enough to play the run and deal with physical offenses. Both guys are athletic enough to play in space and handle speedy offenses.

* * * * *

One place the Eagles can get some defensive help is from guys currently on the roster.

* Obviously you start with Marcus Smith. If the Eagles decided to stick with Barwin/Cole/Graham at OLB, Smith could make the move to ILB a permanent one. He’s got the size and athletic ability to be a good ILB. He’s been mostly a non-factor this year (made a play on STs today), but that doesn’t mean he won’t thrive in the future.

* CB is a trouble spot for the Eagles and Jaylen Watkins could offer help there. The Eagles like him there more than at S. I don’t think the Eagles will pencil him in as a starter for 2015, but Watkins will at the very least be competing for a starting job. As weak as the Eagles are at DB, Watkins needs to get on the field somehow, somewhere.

* DE Taylor Hart can beat out Brandon Bair for a backup DE spot. Bair has been solid as a backup, but Hart has more raw talent and upside. You’d love to get him on the field.

* Ed Reynolds was late in joining the Eagles and that put him behind. He’ll have a full offseason to learn the defense and be ready. I don’t think Reynolds is starting material for now, but you at least want him pushing someone for playing time on defense and contributing on STs.

* Or maybe Reynolds get stuck on the PS again because he can’t beat out Chris Prosinski. That would be okay since Prosinski has played well on STs. He hasn’t played on defense yet and might never be a guy who will, but a full offseason will give him more of a chance to earn a role on D.

* Travis Long could be a valuable backup at ILB and OLB in 2015. The coaches were very high on him prior to his injury.

* Najee Goode will return in 2015. He could push for a starting role depending on what happens with DeMeco Ryans. Goode might add more speed to the middle of the defense, which would be a good thing.

* Earl Wolff is a mystery man to all of us. He recently had surgery so any issues with his knee should be gone next year. Wolff has got to stay on the field. There is no question that he has NFL ability. He showed that as a rookie. Wolff took a big step back this year. The Eagles won’t count on Wolff for next year, but I’m sure they’d love to have him show up ready to play.

Obviously the Eagles will bring in outside help, but you always want to start by looking at your own roster. Player development is huge for building a successful, winning organization. These players have potential. Remember that Ced Thornton was a UDFA that took time to develop. Former early picks Brandon Graham and Vinny Curry were disappointing early in their careers, but have now become key parts of the defense.


62 Comments on “Some Stood Up”

  1. 1 EAGLES said at 12:22 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Tough loss, Seahawks players running their mouths. Michael Bennett said Sanchez was trying to impersonate a good qb lol, then of course sherman said we miss Jackson. Not surprised about Sherman, but Bennett? Sanchez was horrible but sometimes players should just stfu.

  2. 2 Media Mike said at 5:13 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    I think a few too many people may have given Seattle players the impression that the Eagles system was more important than the players involved in the game.

  3. 3 MagsMightyMutt said at 12:30 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    The defense played 85 snaps today. They only allowed the DEFENDING SUPER BOWL CHAMPIONS TO SCORE 24 POINTS. The secondary was fine. Why was Wilson sacked or hit so often? Possibly he couldn’t find anybody open down field? Hmm? The officials did not call an even-handed game. The offensive game plan looked awfully average. Again.

  4. 4 Mitchell said at 12:46 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    The secondary, is by no means fine. At least half the positions can be upgraded there. The defense may have played 85 snaps but the secondary has been suspect the whole season.

  5. 5 McNabbulousness said at 7:51 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    the 2ndary play well for their talent level yesterday. that talent level isn’t enough if you want to be a player come jan/feb. outside of boykin/jenkins, you want to upgrade.

  6. 6 anon said at 12:40 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Honestly. I think our expectations were too high. Mine too. CK is a great mind but sanchez vs seattle? really? What i didn’t expect was the reversion to the KC game last year. Seemed like groundhog day. Had some turnovers, offense struggles, but we’re always still in the game defense just cannot get off the field.

    I think people are giving the D a pass b/c they made some plays and passed the eye test. But this is probably the best offensive game seattle has played all year. DB couldn’t cover at ALL (and i realize it’s hard to cover for 5 seconds during scrambles) but damn.

    Sanchez, I thought was ok. Had some bad throws, probably wants the pick back but i don’t blame the offense on him. If you though he was going to beat SEA i think you give him too much credit.

    Everyone beats that team with ball control and defense. That’s just not what we do. Really thought we were better.

  7. 7 Mitchell said at 1:09 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Agreed we are still in a “rebuilding phase,” Somewhere just below the best teams in the league such as the Packers, Hawks, etc.

  8. 8 anon said at 1:14 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    how long does that last? you think chip is on the marvin lewis plan?

  9. 9 Mitchell said at 1:45 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    However long you think bud. What do you think? Blow this bad boy up again and start over? Secondary help and we take s big leap. We have one rookie wr and another that’s trash. How long did it take Carrol to bring Seattle a ring? 4 years?

  10. 10 anon said at 7:07 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    yeah but at some point you’ve got be able to beat someone. even the rams can beat good teams regularly.

    is there something to ball control?

  11. 11 Jarock said at 5:47 PM on December 8th, 2014:

    Really, the rams? When was the last time they even made the playoffs? The rams wins against good teams have more to do with other teams discounting them than great play on their part.

  12. 12 NickS1, Armchair GM said at 6:53 PM on December 8th, 2014:

    I’d say their domination of the NYG was their best offensive game.

  13. 13 JB said at 12:49 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Are we still giving Reynolds the showed up late excuse?

  14. 14 Mitchell said at 12:52 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    We are giving him the 5th round draft pick excuse. I would not expect anything from him this year.

  15. 15 TommyLawlor said at 1:02 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Late round pick who I wasn’t a big fan of to start with. But missing the spring hurt him. That’s legit, not an excuse. Might not pan out at all, but will have legit offseason in 2015 so we can fairly assess him at that point.

  16. 16 eagleyankfan said at 7:57 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Didn’t we give Ertz that excuse last year? We had higher expectations of him this year. But I agree, both missed valuable time to start the season.

  17. 17 Jarock said at 5:48 PM on December 8th, 2014:

    If missing time in the spring is this much of an issue, then drafting players from colleges who graduate late should be avoided unless the player is a transcendent talent.

  18. 18 Mitchell said at 12:51 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    I am totally sold on the front seven, however, I am discouraged with the lack of picks in the top end of the draft for the secondary. Wolffe, Reynolds and Watkins may pan out but they are lower draft picks for a reason. I would like to nab someone higher with some immediate impact.

    We talk about how a lot of our draftees sit because we have a talented roster….. well not in the back end of our defense. There has to be someone out there to put in some time right away.

  19. 19 Media Mike said at 5:14 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Front *6 – Casey Matthews still sucks.

  20. 20 daveH said at 8:07 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    marshawn broke both his ankles on 1 move ..but marshawn was carrying multiple players all game

  21. 21 McNabbulousness said at 7:47 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    short term, yes, sold. long term need to find a t. cole replacement (might be m. smith but there’s a lot of talk about moving him inside). and the vinny/b graham situations are wild cards as to if they’re still on the team long term.

    on the d line, couldn’t be happier with thornton, logan, cox unit.

  22. 22 goose said at 1:02 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    We have big corners. Seattle had small WRs…our corners played close to the line of scrimmage, but never jammed the WRs at the line. Seattle’s WRs were able to use their quickness to get open….why didn’t we jame them on the line?! At least put a hand on them…

  23. 23 Jarock said at 5:54 PM on December 8th, 2014:

    One of the downsides to bigger corners that the current trend is ignoring is that they struggle with smaller quick receivers. Yes, they can jam them at the line, but if they miss, they are toast. The NFL tends to run in cycles. Currently almost all of the best WRs are big physical guys and everyone wants big CBs to combat that. As the pendulum shifts, I expect more smaller quicker guys to become bigger factors. In about a decade or so, expect smaller speedsters to be rage while everyone is looking for the quickest corners to compensate.

  24. 24 Mitchell said at 1:06 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    My thoughts on the game:
    – Prosinski was pretty damn good on special teams tonight. He had like what, 3 tackles on kicks?

    -Cox and Kendricks and absolutely people you build around. IMO you need an excellent-elite player in every layer of defense. I think we have 2 players in 2 different levels. Now for the secondary…..

    -Curry: all he does is disrupt the backfield and get sacks. It is VERY possible he gets double digit sacks this year which is CRAZY for a rotational player.

    -The Sanchize: I had hopes for him as a retooled qb in Chip’s offense. However, he is simply too emotional for tough games and I don’t think he has the mental steel to deal with adversity.

    -The run game: Polk sure does look good in his limited touches and sometimes I feel like more of a powerback could hit some of those holes, shake off arm tackles and get yards more consistently. McCoy is fantastic in space but would a powerback be better as the staple and a shiftyback be better for rotation?

    -The draft: I know its early but I would love to see a WR,CB,and C/G be take in the first 3 rounds.

  25. 25 47_Ronin said at 2:30 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    It is early for the draft, but never for talent evaluation. Given where the Eagles are at in the NFCE you have think that certain areas need to be addressed with a vet FA who would have a higher probability of coming in and contributing rather than a complete unknown rookie. I think CB (unfortunately) will be a FA acquisition, and throw in FA WR to take Cooper’s spot.

  26. 26 Mitchell said at 2:35 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Huff will take Poopers spot. Sammie Coates is my man as well.

  27. 27 McNabbulousness said at 7:42 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    haha poopers. i see what you did there.

  28. 28 Anders said at 8:11 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    I really hope we can get Coates. Guy needs a year or 2 to fully develop his skills

  29. 29 D3FB said at 2:42 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    I doubt we go FA with WR. It would be a poor allocation of resources. Maclin is likely back on a big deal. Cooper is a sunk cost, we gain nothing by cutting him. The depth of the WR position in the draft is just as good as last year. There will be a somebody available in the 4th or 5th round that will be able to contribute meaningful reps by the bye week next year. No need to pony up good money for a #2 when you can draft somebody making peanuts and have a WR core of Maclin, Matthews, Huff, Rookie. That 4,5,6 million is better used bringing in a guy like KJ Wright or Rahim Moore.

  30. 30 Media Mike said at 5:16 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Is Maclin back? He’s not resigned yet, fired his agent, and likely to be the top WR on the market. If the money on him gets above what the Eagles want to pay; he’s not back.

  31. 31 McNabbulousness said at 7:43 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    also think the eagles realize they need him to anchor the WR corps. so the price they’re willing to pay will prob. be a little higher than usual.

  32. 32 daveH said at 8:18 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    mac can run & catch effortlessly ..but he isn’t a game changer like larry fitz, megatron or kenny britt (har har)

  33. 33 D3FB said at 3:57 PM on December 8th, 2014:

    I would bet on it. Dez and Demarius are both going to be FA. Julius Thomas will be an FA. Randall Cobb as well. It should be a fairly saturated market. I also think the front office likes him enough to match any offer he gets elsewhere (unless somebody is gonna pay him like 14 mil a year) I think they would match anywhere up around 10-12 million annually. The only team I think he could possibly go to where he would take less to play there would be KC, but they are going to have to open the checkbook for Justin Houston so I don’t know if they would have the cap room to bring in Maclin on top of that.

  34. 34 Media Mike said at 5:16 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    CB, CB, S, ILB, OLB, RG, WR, 3rd T

  35. 35 McNabbulousness said at 7:40 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    not in any particular order; OL, 2ndary help (cb/s), OLB.

    don’t think we need a receiver in the first 3 rounds unless there’s a no brainer available. move j matthews up to the no. 2 slot and put cooper back in the slot. coop doesn’t have the talent to be a no. 2 but i think he can thrive in the slot. give huff a chance to compete/develop (as well as stop fumbling the fucking ball).

  36. 36 daveH said at 8:19 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    yes and no tears if he gets crushed crashing the middle

  37. 37 Mitchell said at 9:14 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Pooper is trash. Draft Coates.

  38. 38 daveH said at 8:10 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    each point dead on ! nice call(s) ..
    I love seeing HUff in punt catcher’s face every single time! a tad of maturity and he will also be improved and more valuable.

  39. 39 Sean Stott said at 1:44 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    The Eagles’ 3rd and Long package is simply embarrassing.

  40. 40 McNabbulousness said at 7:34 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    yes yes yes!!! we can not play coverage with the talent we have on the field. need to send pressure in those situations.

  41. 41 xeynon said at 2:07 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Cox and Kendricks are emerging as star defensive talents. Barwin is an excellent jack-of-all-trades who can dominate as a pass rusher against subpar OTs – put him opposite a truly dominant OLB and he’s lethal in that role. Thornton, Logan, and Jenkins are solid starters. Curry, Graham, and Boykin are useful role players. This defense has young-to-in-its-prime talent and just needs a truly disruptive pass rusher and a couple of cover guys to be top-tier.

    Unfortunately, the holes on the roster we have to fill (those three on defense, maybe QB on offense) are some of the harder spots at which to find elite talent. I really hope Foles comes back and plays at a high level because it would make our job a lot easier if we don’t need to find a QB.

  42. 42 Jyolteon said at 3:03 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    I dislike Seattle as much as any 49er fan because I live in the city and have to put up with their obnoxious fans on a daily basis. The game completely ruined my weekend. I haven’t taken a loss so poorly in a very long time.

    Yes, Seattle is a better team than Philadelphia and they deserved the W. I don’t like to bring up referees, but my god is it infuriating watching the “legion of boom” get away with illegal contact on almost every play. There were multiple times the DB got to the WR before the ball did and the ref simply looked the other way. I don’t even want to talk about the Fletcher PI. Is intentional grounding even a penalty anymore?

    Now that I’m done whining…

    The Seahawks dominated us today on 3rd downs. Defense had plenty of opportunities to get off the field early in the game but they couldn’t do it.

    Fletcher Cox and the front seven handled Marshawn as well as anybody this year. Serious question: Is there a better 3-4 lineman in the league than Cox right now?

    I would have liked to have seen more Chris Polk to try to tire out Seattle’s front seven. Sanchez played OK, but we’re not beating elite teams with OK quarterback play.

    Bad things seem to happen when the ball is thrown to Cooper.

  43. 43 BobSmith77 said at 3:13 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    no but the Eagles really needed their draft picks to contribute this year if they were going to take the next step up especially after being pretty passive in FA compared to the year before.

    Matthews has certainly had is his moments but otherwise the other guys haven’t even been getting on the field with the exception of Allen.

    A semi-decent OG would have done wonders for this OL this year with the injuries including today when Cashner struggled badly all day.

  44. 44 D3FB said at 4:01 PM on December 8th, 2014:

    name your semi decent OG

  45. 45 BobSmith77 said at 3:25 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Game quote winner:

    Jarrett Bell account‏@JarrettBell

    Got this from Michael Bennett: “Tell the Philadelphia police to put an ABP out. Sanchez is trying to impersonate a good quarterback.”

  46. 46 NinjaP said at 3:31 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    I’ve seen enough of Mark Sanchez. When is Nick back?

  47. 47 Media Mike said at 5:19 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    If Sanchez is bad against Dallas; Foles will be back for the Washington game.

    If Sanchez plays well against Dallas; Foles will be back the week after the Eagles lose next. But that might be in 2015.

    There will be a lot of lies coming from the coaches about the health of Foles. He’ll be as healthy as they need him to be.

  48. 48 BobSmith77 said at 3:35 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Some of the favorite Sanchez’ memes:×250/55914649.jpg

  49. 49 BobSmith77 said at 3:41 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Funny but I thought Cooper was kept in part due to being a good teammate/team player:

    “Was it a miscommunication?” Cooper said. “No. (Sanchez) knew the the route. I knew the route. I ran the route. He threw the ball.”

    The statement by Cooper appears to throw plenty of blame at his quarterback, who struggled against the Seahawks, completing 10 of 20 passes for just 96 yards passing. Sanchez agreed it was a bad throw.

    “I missed the landmark to Coop,” Sanchez said. “I just missed it. I was kind of flushing forward and I didn’t get everything that I wanted on the ball. It was just a bad throw.”

    The play in question might have been Sanchez’s worst throw of the day, but it also appeared as if Cooper could have done more to break up the pass.

    “I can’t let it get intercepted, I guess,” Cooper said.”

    The INT was on Sanchez but Cooper’s comment at the end if puzzling. Couple that with his foolish comments about Maclin last week and you kind of wonder where his head is mentally and he for some misguided reason is pissed about his production despite getting as many target this year already as he had last year.

  50. 50 Bob Brewer said at 5:18 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Today left me more hopeless than ever that this program is going to work. This team does not have an adequate QB and I don’t where that adequate QB is going to come from.

    I do believe if Tony Romo was the Eagles QB they’d be a legitimate Super Bowl contender. Yes, that’s how bad Sanchez and Foles are.

    The NFCE simply has to get better. The Eagles are getting worse draft positions than the team deserves, which hurts in the long run.

    I’m in Ricky Bobby mode with the Philly franchises, if you’re not first, you’re last.

  51. 51 Media Mike said at 5:22 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    I’d ask you to take one more set of games to evaluate Foles. If he’s reflected a bit about the stupid throws and happy feet while he’s been out there is a chance he’s recover some type of improved throwing form. We’ll see.

  52. 52 Anders said at 5:41 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Current version of Romo is not the answer with that bad back.

    I do agree we are better on defense than anticipated, so getting a franchise QB is pretty much what is left.

  53. 53 daveH said at 8:26 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    disagree about romo .. he’d find ways to bug the crap out of us no doubt

  54. 54 P_P_K said at 5:50 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    The Seahawks may well be the best team in the NFL, for the second straight year. Of course they exposed the Eagles weaknesses. That’s what they do. They are the superior team and they beat us up. But, even with all the crazy, lopsided stats, it was only a 10 point game. Imagine Fletcher doesn’t get nailed with that PI call, and Jenkins (I think it was Malcom) holds onto the interception for a Pick-6. With just those two plays, it’s a different game and the Eagles could have stolen a win.

    I’m also going out on a limb and saying Sanchez wasn’t the problem. The Seahawks D was just too good. Peyton looked about the same as Mark in last year’s Super Bowl. The only qb who could play well against this Seattle D is Russel Wilson.

    I was also really pissed when the refs agreed to Carroll’s request to bring out the chains to measure for that Eagles first down. Ridiculous.

  55. 55 Dragon_Eagle said at 6:23 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Tommy, I’m surprised at the focus on defense above after yesterday. Defense played really, really well considering they were on the field for nearly 42 minutes, largely because our offense could not get a drive started,convert a 3rd down (2/11) and had regular 3-and-outs. Defense and STs gave us decent field position, too. Yes, CB is a problem spot for us, but that’s nothing new.

    I thought this game brought more attention to the offense’s deficiencies. Offense yesterday was just putrid. Sure Seattle’s defense had something to do with that, but we need to improve to compete.

    We need a better WR than Cooper opposite Maclin. Coop is not talented enough to make plays against a team like this. More OL depth – time to look for Herremans long-term replacement this off-season. And, hate to say it, but, sigh, QB. I would like to think Foles would have done better, but I’m not so sure. Finally, coaching. I don’t think the coaches were committed to the run early and often enough. Gotta knock the Seahawks back a bit to open up the passing game. Did Polk get a touch?

  56. 56 McNabbulousness said at 7:28 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    yes! i thought the D played great considering the circumstances.

  57. 57 McNabbulousness said at 7:29 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    if the D doesn’t play like they did you have another packers-esque blow out on your hands

  58. 58 McNabbulousness said at 7:27 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    cox is now playing the player we thought he would be. this is awesome. kendricks seems to have taken the next step in his game and looks damn good. very optimistic about the future of the defensive unit.

  59. 59 eagleyankfan said at 7:53 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    Is this a joke? The Eagles defense can get better by hoping some players pan out as back ups? I’m hoping the Eagles brass have higher expectations than this article.

    This wasn’t as brutal as that Packers game. Maybe because Seattle does not have the talent at WR as GB? This was a tough match up. This was the defending champs and I think the Eagles put some teams on notice with some solid play. Eagles seem a bit tentative(or tight) on offense.

    Eagles were 1 dropped INT return for a TD away from making this a close game. I think that played summed up the game in a nutshell.
    It’s just perception — C. Mathews had a few ‘wholly cow, how did you miss that tackle’ plays left on the field. The one miss, where he had a clear shot in the backfield was embarrassing. A safety, who is having a very nice season, was taken to school on a TD play. That was way–way to easy.
    This was a good measure stick. You know how far the Eagles need to go to become elite. I don’t think that’s far off either. Want to measure this team accurately? The next game will tell you everything you need to know….

  60. 60 BobSmith77 said at 8:18 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    I’d bet Seattle wins out down the stretch and GB/Seattle get the byes. Don’t see AZ beating Seattle. Ditto Detroit beating GB.

    Eagles host a 1st round game if they can take care of business Dallas next Sunday and host Detroit/AZ in a winnable game here but a ‘pick your poison’ in the Divisional Round on the road in GB/Seattle.

    It would be nice to see at least one playoff win this year. Haven’t see that since Jan ’08.

  61. 61 GermanEagle said at 8:22 AM on December 8th, 2014:

    GE’s quick hits:

    1. I would not give Maclin top 5 WR money. He’s a good to very good No. 1, however against shutdown corners like Sherman I’d expect a bit more.

    2. Fletcher Cox’ contract extension will become expensive, but rightfully so!

    3. Mark Sanchez is who he always was, and I don’t think we need a bigger example of him in philly. Get well, Nick.

    4. Connor Barwin should not only be voted to the Pro Bowl, but he should also be considered as an All Pro. What a beast.

    5. Kendrick’s contract negotiations will be ‘fun’.

    6. Merry Xmas Nate Allen, but please don’t come back next year. Thanks.

    7. Happy new year Bradley Fletcher, but please don’t come back next season. Thanks.

    8. Shady’ ridiculous way of carrying the football is finally catching up with him this year.

    9. You gotta love Chip Kelly. We saw a new side of him on the sideline and I liked it.

    10. The refs surely weren’t favoring the Eagles last night, but anyobody who thinks they were the why the Eagles lost shall watch the game again. The Seahawks dominated. Simple as that.

  62. 62 daveH said at 9:20 AM on December 8th, 2014: