More Bradford Talk
Posted: April 9th, 2015 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 299 Comments »Elliot Shorr-Parks came up with a new angle on the whole question of whether Sam Bradford is here to stay.
None of the #Eagles pro shops, which are owned and operated by the team, r selling Bradford jerseys. Hmm. http://t.co/Fs976Yfo0F
— Eliot Shorr-Parks (@EliotShorrParks) April 8, 2015
If the Eagles aren’t selling his jersey at their own stores, isn’t that a hint? Maybe.
I don’t think this means anything definitively, other than the merchandising people are waiting until after the draft because they don’t want to get burned.
When Chip Kelly says the Eagles didn’t trade for Sam Bradford with the intention of trading him away, I believe him. Totally. That deal was being talked about in early February. I don’t think Kelly is delusional enough to start planning at that point to deal for Bradford “knowing” he can then turn around and deal Bradford to get Mariota.
If Mariota falls and the right situation plays out, maybe Bradford does get dealt in a move-up for MM. Maybe. But there are way too many moving parts for anyone to say that is going to happen with any sense of likelihood.
Tampa is taking a long look at Mariota. It is still possible he goes #1 overall. Mike Mayock just put Mariota at the top of his QB rankings. That’s based on more research and analysis. And his rankings are also a reflection of what he hears from league sources. Maybe people are starting to wake up to the idea that Jameis Winston should scare the hell out of them.
The Titans are checking MM out. The Chargers are showing interest and there are rumors of them dealing Philip Rivers. Word out of Cleveland is that they’ve all but given up on Johnny Manziel. They could move up for MM. If he falls to them, would they really deal Marcus to the Eagles for Bradford and picks? Why not just keep the high character rookie QB? It isn’t like that team is built to win right away.
I would love for the Eagles to get Mariota. I still struggle to picture Bradford and Kelly standing on a podium holding the Lombardi. I don’t think Mariota is leading anyone to a title in 2015, but it would be exciting to see Kelly get a young, dynamic talent at QB that he could mold the way he wants. Michael Vick had talent, but was a veteran with a lifetime of bad habits already built in. Mariota needs plenty of work, but he’s already been taught a lot of the key principles of KellyBall due to his time in Oregon.
But I think MM to Philly remains a huge long shot.
I hope I’m wrong.
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Many of you found my comments about WAS yesterday to be ironic. I mentioned that they often put their DBs in bad situations and that led to bad results. Your point…didn’t the Eagles do the same thing?
No. Not at all.
The Eagles DBs did some dumb things, but the basic coverage ideas weren’t an issue.
Nate Allen got burned in Arizona because he was careless and bit on a fake. He was focused on preventing a 1st down when the game situation dictated that he should have focused on preventing a TD. He didn’t and the Eagles lost.
Allen was to blame for some of Bradley Fletcher’s late season struggles. Allen was the deep Safety in the middle of the field. He should have cheated to Fletcher’s side, but instead sat right in the middle until the ball was in the air. That led to big plays by DeSean and Dez. Allen pulled his head out of his butt in the 2nd half of the WAS game and finally rotated to Fletcher’s side before the pass was thrown. Allen was able to pick off a deep throw. Funny how that works, huh?
The Eagles had bad DBs last year. I don’t think the coverage concepts were unsound.
The flip side of that is that the coaches didn’t do a good job of getting creative to try and come up with some solution to the situation. They stayed fairly basic. Some coaches can come up with complex coverages that do help protect vulnerable DBs.
You can argue that Fletcher should have been benched (as many of you did), but that’s still not a scheme issue.
Jim Haslett ran the WAS defense for 5 years. They averaged finishing 22nd in yards allowed and 24th in points allowed during that stretch. It amazed me that the man kept his job. The Skins never showed serious improvement.
Some of you will still disagree with me and that’s fine. I just wanted you to understand the thinking behind my comments. I’m not delusional about Bill Davis as a coach who is going to turn water into wine. I guess I just think he’s more fundamentally sound than Haslett.
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Tom, the Arizona game was reviewed by Greg Cosell where he contends that the first Ftiz TD was partially scheme, partially Nate, and the game-winner was more Cary than Nate, and a great prediction by Arians based on how Davis adjusted scheme after the Fitz TD.
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/greg-cosell-s-film-review–how-coaching-set-up-arizona-s-two-long-touchdowns-230249074.html
I don’t dispute your larger point that WASH D has been inefficient – given the talent they have had. And not a Nate apologist, but I did think that DB abuse was 1) Nate 2) scheme – fewer options after Ryans went down, and 3) DB’s
I think we should see Bradford as a “packaged play” which we know CK loves. As you say, if Mariota falls far enough that he becomes affordable, Chip sends Bradford to CLE for part of the draft pick bundle he uses for MM. If not, he keeps Bradford. Typical CK packaged play.
BTW, if they do keep Bradford, let’s start calling him SB for Super Bowl not just Sam Bradford.
Does this mean CK has already brought SB to Phila?
Hells yeah
Brilliant analogy.
I’m already waiting for the Parade…
@ T-Law
If you’re right and the person who holds the most blame is Nate Allen (and not Fletcher or CWill, even though they didn’t help, obviously), let’s hope they find his replacement in the draft. Depending on a 4th rounder from last year and a 5th rounder in 2013 with injury concerns, both with very little experience, sure doesn’t seem like the best idea to stop X plays based on bad Safety play.
Which leads me to the point: do you think the obvious interest in Rove and Byron Jones is for the Safety position? It’s not like we have a great 2nd CB next to Maxwell, but we have solid NFL players there. Thurmond, Boykin, Carroll, they played in this league and while they sure as hell weren’t All Pros, they weren’t the AJ Biggers kind of CBs, either. I think you can play with one of them outside and one of them in the slot, if a camp battle evaluates their game a little bit.
At Safety, I’m just not seeing it on the roster yet. And while we can’t say “Boy, the CB position is settled for the next three years”, it’s not a glaring weakness. Safety is, though.
A big, sound tackler projected to play Corner for most teams could be a Safety for us. Question is how they play centerfield. They will have the man covering skills required.
I agree. I asked that same question about Jones and Rowe a few days ago. There is alot of talk about Watkins maybe at S, but I really think he will be our slot CB when Boykin leaves.
I hope the best for this kid. He has the talent to be the guy, but hasn’t shown it.
if he stays healthy, I wouldnt bet against him surprising us…assuming he has been taking mental reps and knows the playbook inside out by now…
Earl Wolf will not make the team for the 2015 season once Draft picks and rookie free agents are signed to the roster.
Yeah, I hope for the best. He seems like a decent guy and looks like he has the tools. But, it is also time to make plans that do not involve him. His chances are on the down slope.
Trusting in Chip, and trusting in what Chip says is a completely different thing. The former is fine, the latter is folly. Spitting out truths at press conferences has no real benefit to Kelly. Whether it’s his plans for the future, or his feelings about a star player he released or traded, or what really is the most important ability, honesty provides no benefits and a number of messy consequences. This is definitely one of those situations where we really won’t know what’s going on until it happens. I don’t think the merchandise department for the Eagles has any inside information, I think they just realize they’re completely in the dark as the rest of us.
very well said….. at the same time I do think he gives us SOME Truth, which is harmless since every time he tells the truth, the media doesnt believe him any way and goes with some other narrative… He really should just troll the entire world and start being Brutally honest (except for bashing former players).. If he became Brutally honest and started answering all the crazy questions truthfully, like telling the media exactly who he will draft, it would be the greatest smoke screen of all time, cuz no one would believe him…
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reporter: so chip any truth to wanting to trade up for mariota?
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chip: ” Absolutely, Gonna do whatever it takes to trade up and get that kid. I dont care how much the titans make us pay, we have to go get him”…. people would start laughing and think he was being sarcastic…
Very true
JK is always good for a laugh.
Dont worry Folks, Mykal Kendricks is SAFE…. The “GREAT” NJ.com and Elliot Shorr Park got THE REAL “scoop” for us… you know Mr. Parker, BEST reporter out there, Broke the Desean GANGBANGER story… Mykal Kendricks is SAFE!!! lol:
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“NJ.com suggests the Eagles could use DE Fletcher Cox as trade bait in a Marcus Mariota deal.
If the Eagles are going to move up from No. 20 to the top-five, they’ll likely have to surrender both picks and talented players. Cox, establishing himself as one of the game’s best interior linemen, certainly fits the bill. He’s also entering the final year of his contract and is playing the 3-4 end spot when his natural position is a 4-3 tackle.”-roto
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LOL!!!!!!!
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then again, tomorrow he may report that we will trade Kendricks AND Coach for the golden boy!!!
He probably overheard the Titans’ proposal.
which was?
I think the writers at that rag read your posts and writes about your posts a week later and say “source”…lol
But would Bradford, Kendricks, Cox and the 20th pick get the deal done ??? Or more picks would be involed ?
that’s too much
All those players are on the last year of their contracts, so it’s not the greatest thing for the other team, having to re-sign them all to huge contracts next year.
Would you be comfortable giving him a 5 year/ $45 million extension?
Yes
yup
My understanding is they are saying the reason they are not selling Bradford Jerseys yet is Donnie Jones wears #8.
huh? didnt they give Sam #7? i remember saying someone should tell Fragile Sam not to wear the same number as the most fragile Eagle of all time, Mike Vick….
Maybe they gave him #7 for now and he wants #8. I don’t know just throwing out what I heard, seems just as plausible of explanation to me ….
maybe, your guess is as good as mine…
if he wanted 8, he would have had it already…
Or maybe they plan on getting rid of Cooper so that Bradford can get back his old college number.
Didn’t the coaches teach the CB not to turn their heads around and play the ball? We got burned on that multiple times due to them not making a play or getting penalties…I’d say that is putting the CB in a bad position.
And sure the players made mistakes, absolutely, but did we see the coaches fix those mistakes? No, the same mistakes kept happening which to me says either the players are not listening to the coaching or the coaches are not addressing those issues hard enough…either one is not a ringing endorsement of the coaches.
I’m glad you mentioned this Gary. Many coaches teach DBs not to turn their head too soon because they lose a step and/or miss a cut by the WR. As I understand it, it’s all about timing and athleticism as to when to turn the head, if at all.
Hopefully, we can get clarification from someone who knows more about DB coverage technique.
Thanks OD…I understand why that approach is taught, but many PI penalties are called when the CB is not turned to the ball and/or playing the ball…so, if the coaches are going to use this approach, they better make sure the players know how to do it right and execute it well on the field…if the player cannot do it right, then he needs to be replaced or taught a different way that will be successful. Eagles CB got called for a good number of penalties last year and that hurts the team…perhaps that approach needs to be scrapped or adjusted so it will be a more positive outcome more frequently for the CB…or the GM needs to have better CB depth so the starters can be replaced quicker if they cannot perform up to par…
Deion wouldn’t be a good example. He was so fast that he could do whatever he wanted.
I think you are right. And I think things got oversimplified, just like the big people-little people thing.
I’d imagine the teachings were more about losing speed when you look back and not doing it too soon and not doing it at all in specific, desperate situations. I also think that the speed of our CBs led to many more of those desperate situations than should have occurred.
my coach was old school (real old school – revolutionary era) : “wait til you see the whites of their eyes” (big eyes were key to turn or chop, depending on your position)
are you saying it’s the coaches or the players at fault?
both are gone
Both I’d say…the players for not executing on the field/fixing their mistakes and the coaches for either teaching the wrong technique or not getting the player’s mistakes fixed or not replacing said player if they continue to not execute…
Well 2 of them are gone now.
Good Business is based off of SUPPLY and DEMAND..
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Doubt there is much DEMAND right now, if any for Sam considering that is still rehabbing a bum Knee, on a 1yr contract, and the media keeps insisting, insisting and insisting that “Chip ISNT done yet”,and “Sam will be included in a Mariota trade”.. after all the media speculation, how can anyone in their right mind buy a Sam Bradford Jersey?
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If there is NO demand, why would anyone want to stock up on Supply, even the Eagles store? the Store is still being run as a business, not some charity service to fans. What manager is going to order a bunch of anything that he cant sell?
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would you even stand a chance at selling more then five Bradford Jerseys before the draft?
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unless the team store is some non profit, fan serivice, then can we really blame the store for waiting til at least after the draft to order those jerseys..
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and EVEN after the draft, its still probably going to be hard to sell his Jersey unless he signs an extension… Maybe some girl thinks sam’s cute and buys her kid a Sam Bradford jersey, but what Man will even buy his son a Sam Bradford Jersey when No One believes he will even be here thanks to the media speculation? im not even sure he will have many kid sale Bradford Jerseys until he signs an extension.
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I view this as Common sense “good business”
I do. I think there’s always a demand for a new toy. There’s always a percentage of every group that has to be first person to ‘own’ it. Whether or not that percentage is large or small, there’s still a percentage.
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From a retailer point of view, it doesn’t make any sense especially considering you lost any possible sales on all the Eagles that left.
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I don’t think people who would buy his jersey would wait until the draft. They would buy it now.
there is some demand, but likely not enough to justify mass producing the jersey (which has an initial cost that is off set the more you make/sell). The Merchandisers likely did their homework on this one. The nuts that want to be the first to own a green Bradford Jersey are also the ones who will pay extra to just make a personalized Jersey
true — but what’s their homework? CK might break all trends and historically move up to number 2 or that Bradford might change his jersey number?
I mean market research. They want to see if there is enough demand to justify the costs of producing something (this often involves polls, focus groups, etc). If Sam is here mid season winning a bunch of games, those things will sell like crazy. For now besides some fans not being sure he is really the guy in Chip’s mind, I think a lot of the fans aren’t sure he’s the guy in their own minds yet. The believers will pay the extra to make a custom Jersey, the rest will wait. The merchandisers more likely mirror the fan’s feelings on Bradford than Chip’s is what I’m going with.
I mostly agree :). Mid season though, I don’t know. I mean, there might just be a valid reason, but as it stands now, Bradford is the starting QB. Just that alone is enough to say he’ll sell enough jerseys. Whether it’s now or later, you’re ordering. (I’m not disagreeing with you, just talking out loud)
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Let’s take the Rams as an example. There’s just as much rumors with the Rams about how Foles might not be their guy. But you can buy his jersey. I don’t know if you can buy them in neighboring states(like NJ is to PA) here. You can buy Bradfords jersey on-line. You’d think that would be enough for them to put in their orders.
At the very least, I think everyone agrees that whatever the reason for not selling the Jersey’s, it’s unlikely someone on the inside is telling them “Bradford won’t be here very long so don’t bother.”
If running a successful store was your livelyhood, you would be comfortable mass ordering Bradford Jerseys, that the national and local media is making it hard for you to sell?..Doubt it…
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too little to gain, too much risk..,How many Bradford Jersey sales do you think a store is missing out on by not having Jerseys from the time we signed him, til after the draft ends? cant be much…
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I think he is our QB, but even if I think he is our QB, I would never order a product that im not sure I can sell. Why would I, when I can wait 3 weeks, and my investment will be safer? How many Sam Bradford Jersey Sales am I going to miss out on waiting til after the draft to sell his jersey?
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and even if we get to week 1 and he is our starting QB, Im still probably ordering a Fraction of the amount of Jerseys I would NORMALLY order because I assume the majority of the fanbase wont be comfortable purchasing his jersey until he signs an extension..
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and what are you really missing out on by not carrying Sam jersey’s right now? If most fans want to buy an Eagles jersey, I would assume there is at least a couple players who’s jerseys they like… and there are plenty of NEW EAGLE players just added…. So if you go to a store wanting to buy an Eagles jersey, specifically Bradfords and you get to the store and they dont have it.. what percentage of the customers would go home without buying a jersey because they didnt have Bradford? and what percentage would see that they didnt have a bradford jersey, and end up just chosing a different NEW player like Byron Max or Marco Ryan?
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Too much risk of getting stuck with them until at least the draft passes, and not enough reward for taking that risk…
well, it says the stores are ‘owned and operated by the team’ — so I’m not buying it’s their lively hood..
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It’s not ‘Jersey Depot’ either where the stores are buying 10,000 jersey’s. What’s the most any store would buy? 40? 100? I still don’t see the risk for any store. Even a mom and pop shop, you’re buying popular Eagles jerseys — at bulk rates too —
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the stores not supplying his jersey — is not risk vs. reward…
watch Mariota fall to Jeff Fisher and the Rams end up with Foles and Mariota and stick it to eagle fans lol….
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even if Mariota were to fall, you still have to move ahead of the charges and Cheifs, Browns and Cheifs if you want him.
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Roto says there is a rumor about The Dolphins trading up from #14 to try and get Kevin White…. #14 to like #4 or #5 is similar to moving up for Dion Jordan from #12, which cost them what, a 2nd round pick? Your first and 2nd round pick for Kevin White might not be a horrible idea… That would give them White and Jarvis Landry, not a bad tandem
that qb premium is a killer
Manziel ran away from Oregon when he heard Mariota was coming, Im going to die laughing If Johnny gets out of rehab, and a week later he finds out Mariota is coming to cleveland to screw him out of the limelight AGAIN!!
Lets not twist reality to fit a narrative right?
it was a joke, no need to act like a bitch…. and if you are going to talk like me, put it in quotes
I don’t think he makes it that far, because Chicago I think would jump at that opportunity to take him.
I hope that it’s #4, I’d hate to see the Skins get some extra picks to fill holes.
wouldnt mind seeing the jets or titans take him..
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I would LOVE to be able to trade up for Dante Fowler, so much rather get him, then MM
I agree with your take on Sam Bradford. You just don’t trade a future 2nd and Nick Foles (who is worth at least a 2nd in a trade) unless you plan on having him be your starting QB. Trading for him just so that you can flip him in a few months seems like something that you can’t bank on.
I’m sick of the Mariota speculation and every single article or story that ties Mariota to the Eagles gets me a little aggravated. I’ve moved on and am looking forward to see what Bradford can do.
id say nick was almost worthless in that trade, the picks plus cap savings should have been enough for a guy that hadn’t played in 2 years and wasn’t that good when he played.
How was Nick worthless in that trade? The Browns were willing to give up a 1st round pick for Bradford. For the Rams, Nick Foles + a future 2nd was worth more to them than a 1st round pick.
According to which value chart you use and the assumption that the Browns offered the 19th pick, it puts Foles’ value somewhere in the top 8 picks of the third rd
Mariota, Mariota, Mariota… say it over and over and over and maybe he will show up like Beatle Juice in an eagle jersey
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if Sam Bradford stays healthy, Id take him over MM any day…
Yours is probably the best argument I have read of heard re the Bradford/MM speculation, Donald. In fact, I see the Eagles drafting a developmental QB in the later rounds rather than all this unrealistic alchemy about mortgaging the future to grab MM.
Well reasoned,
The Bengals are expected to re-sign RB Cedric Peerman later Thursday.
Peerman recently visited the Eagles, apparently sparking the Bengals to come up with an offer. He has just 64 carries across five seasons in Cincy, but carries value as a core special teamer.-roto
3 more weeks. I really can’t wait to have all these roster moves mostly settled. I just want to know for sure who our QB is going to be.
gotta wait until tc to answer that question.
why tc? Unless Bradford is traded the day of the draft, you know long before tc.
if we take a qb not mariota i think it’s going to be a competition in camp. it’s unclear if bradford will even be ready by then.
you think any QB taken in the draft, with Bradford on the roster — there will be competition? Not a chance.
Good point about SB, but whether we draft a QB, Mariota or not, Sanchez will be starting if Sam can’t go.
Don’t you love the suspense though ??? Btw, oregonducker directed me to some of your comments, and I must say “great info” on some of your comments, keep it up !
thanks
i just want these weeks to pass so I can stop going out of my way to avoid reading local media coverage.Our media is bad enough, This time of year when everyone is creating smokescreens, the crap our media reports is unbearable to me…. I cant take this time of year it just infuriates me.
I think, the jersey talk is silly. Why would merchants be afraid of ordering stock “just in case” if he’s traded? To save money? I think they’re missing out on money. A new toy spurs new interest. Wait on the jersey and you’re losing the “new toy” motivation.
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Are those merchants losing money on Shady/Foles/Mac etc etc jerseys?
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Maybe there’s a direct order from the Eagles to not ship, but I doubt merchants are nervous about something that’s such a long shot…
Yes they are losing money on Shady, Foles and Mac jerseys. No one will pay anywhere close to full price. And by having inventory sitting on shelves cost money. It’s why turnover is so important in merchandise.
Jim Haslett’s defense always played pretty well against Dallas.
To be fair he had Ryan Kerrigan, Orakpo (who was always injured, Hatcher for a year, and pretty much nothing else. It didn’t help matters for him that the highest drafted defensive player during his stint other than Kerrigan was Trent Murphy.
Safety is a hard position to fill. It’s like that one position where you can sign a probowl player from another team and not know how he’s going to pan out to your scheme. Jarius Byrd, Dashon Goldson, and Patrick Chung come to mind. And drafting for that position seems a little tricky as well. Most of the time a college coach puts a player at safety either because he not good or fast enough in coverage to be a CB or because he’s too small to be a LB. It’s hard to draft a guy in the 1st round and expect to be your starter on opening day.
Can’t forget about London Fletcher. He wasn’t as athletic as he once was, but the dude was a rock in the middle of the field for WAS.
London Fletcher! I can’t believe I forgot about him. I was such a huge for a long time. He doesn’t get mentioned enough with the best LBs that played during his time.
As much as I love the Eagles and think Chip is a decent coach, I have to part ways with your opinion on the subject of the defensive schemes and poor coaching. Coaching is not only about X and Os, it’s alot about knowing your people and putting them into a position where they can succeed. If they can’t succeed, find someone who can. If they can’t CHANGE THE DAMN SCHEME until you find someone who can play it the way you want it. When you single up Fletcher on Dez/Jordy/Desean and play a Cover 1- you better be confident that your people can be effective. To your point where you claim that the defensive scheme was sound, I’ll agree in principal only. In practice, with a slow CB that has shown you that he is a major liability, a Safety that is always a second late making the read or bites on the run at all the wrong times, it is piss poor coaching. Yet we still kept running the same ridiculous schemes and having the same failures with the same players (I think Joe Banner mentioned something about the definition of insanity before).
So while I usually appreciate the staunch and unblinking support of the Kelly regime I read on this blog, I believe that making the statement that the coaching and scheme were sound is an extremely myopic point of view.
So basically you’re saying change the entire defensive scheme because of just 2 players being liabilities? That actually makes no sense whatsoever man. There are 9 other players on the field that are doing there jobs correctly but yea lets change the scheme on them as well right?
Not saying to change the entire defensive scheme for every play or even every team. However, when you are hemmorhaging at the same spots each and every game at a record setting pace, some type of change is in order. So, if you are not going to change out the players or even attempt it, then you have to change the scheme temporarily. It’s logic. Or we can keep marching out the same players with the same scheme and bleed profusely, which is what happened. I think the scheming needs to be flexible or give another guy a chance to play better. Can you honestly say that you are 100% certain that none of the CBs on the bench could have done just as well or possibly better? With Fletcher being so terrible in that scheme, I think those young guys at least deserved shot. Or change the scheme until you can find a player that can perform.
And Sconces and Fletch are both gone now, along with the position coach – if a player can’t outperform a starter in practice, not likely to be inserted in game, especially when fighting for a playoff spot – Eagles did win 20 games past 2 seasons, and last year were able to add a dime package to their D. Flexible scheming sounds logical and viable, and yet is difficult to execute in the best of situations – one of the reasons a shut-down corner is so coveted, they allow you options in your approach.
^This. Just need more talent in the backend.
Yes – hoping that Wolff, Watkins, Jenkins and Kiko, Kendricks, and Meco bring us stability, and that scouting has identified backend talent we can add in the draft.
Yea, I have high hopes for Wolff, but Watkins on the other hand I see as another Boykin(slot corner). Some good competition though at least.
your last assertion is where I cringe and smh. I disagree with both of you about the compartmentalized critiques. Think back to the first Giants game. Corners looked outstanding and safeties were strong and free of major gaffes. Linebackers were in the Giants’ backfield numerous times. Sacks abounded.
The blame for some – not all – of the X plays goes FIRST to an ineffective pass rush (not overall, but on given plays). My second bone to pick is with how much run and intermediate pass play support the whole secondary is required to provide. If you remember 2013, the same CB’s who were punked in 2014, did not give up the big plays over the top, but the D had trouble getting off the field on 3rd and long/short/inches… Some – not all – of the D’s issues were middle-of-the-field pass coverage which is the LB domain. Safeties and CB’s were required to assist on those as well as the run. I’m not offering excuses for anybody, but the point is it is simplistic to indict the last man at the scene of the TD reception. Alonso should immediately offer some relief on run and intermediate pass support. Snagging another edge-rusher in the draft would not hurt either. Of course we want and need a ball hawk in the secondary, and maybe that guy is already on the roster. Last word: any scheme is only as good as the players executing it.
Change the entire scheme? Really? How about give Fletcher some extra help when he’s singled up in press-man against Dez Bryant? It’s really not that drastic.
You know that, I know that; shouldn’t Nate Allen know that?
well said!
Sometimes certain players are so bad (Fletcher) that you can’t even put them into a situation to exceed. Their lack of talent of talent makes it so they can’t even execute a good situation. It’s not that easy to just find a good player BTW.
I think we can agree that Fletcher was terrible. I think we also agree that it is not that easy to find terrible players, as you have stated. However, there is a wide gulf between terrible and good player. We had a terrible cb on one side, an inconsistent/bad cb on the other. Yet we played them like they were Revis and consistently left them on an island. Any way you slice it, that is piss poor coaching and asset management.
Actually I don’t think that was the case. At certain times they may have not had help, but the safety cannot be required to help the CB every time. That makes your D very predictable and very vulnerable in other areas of the field that may be higher percentage plays. Even at a HS level a safety is going to be required to make decisions. The majority of the times Fletcher got burnt bad it was Allens responsibility to assist. He would either be to slow, whiff on a pump fake, or read the play wrong. He failed a very basic safety concepts at times. To be honest the majority of the time He SHOULD have been there to do something but failed. Davis had him in a position that as long as he did what is basic and should have been done then the big play would not have happened. He was that bad that he was given the position to succeed but still didn’t. You could easily see it with just the quick eye test. He put the front 7 in position to exceed greatly. The large majority of them were only in year 2 of the 3-4. So he shows that he can put players in a position to succeed. Jenkins had one of his best years, if not his best. That just goes to show that the lack of talent was severe at SS, and both outside CB spots, especially Fletcher.
“I’m not delusional about Bill Davis as a coach who is going to turn water into wine.”
How about at least hoping for water in to PBR…
I’m pretty sure the makers of PBR already do that.
Their problem was just walking on water.
Agree with you Tommy.
I think that due to Nate’s lack of instincts, our entire secondary appeared much worse than if we had a reliable veteran safety who knew where to be on any given play.
He always seemed out of position.
Nate should have been there in double coverage on almost all of those TD’s, but he wasn’t even in the same zip code.
As bad as Fletcher seemed, I saw him as a much better player than most of our fan base.
I am not saying he played well, just not nearly as bad as some have posted in the past.
Anyway, I am as excited as the rest of us to see what the Eagles do next.
I think Chip wants to win now and Bradford gives him that “blue chip” level QB that he needs to properly execute his offensive scheme IMO.
I feel that Bradford can resurrect his career here in Philly and give the Eagles a QB who can make faster decisions than Foles and will have that repetitive accuracy on the short and intermediate routes that Chip likes to run.
Too bad we aren’t going to have a reliable veteran safety next to Jenkins again this year.
our secondary will be drastically improved, and you will be happy with the 2015 Eagles defense…
Oh I think it will be improved, and I still do think we will have an improvement over Nate at the “SS” position. I just sort of wanted to say that. Part of me is bummed still that we didn’t get McCourty, but then I wonder if we did get him then who if not more then one player would we have not been able to retain or gain in FA? Then part of me thinks it was a good thing because maybe our new young mystery safety plus the FA or FAs we obtained due to not getting him may end up being greater then just signing him.
im just happy that as soon Chip came into full power, he aggressively went after the best safety upgrade imaginable, made a respectable lucrative offer, and only missed out because the kid didnt want to leave the team he just won the SB with… I can respect That, and I respect the strong attempt by chip to finally remedy our safety issue… When he showed that he was willing to throw 10 mil for an elite soluiton at the safety problem, I have to respect if he didnt see a suitable option B on the market. If he was willing to pay McCourty 10mil, im sure he would have went after one of the other cheaper safeties if he thouight they were good enough..
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Cant Improve your safety? then you will need to upgrade the CB on that safeties side, so he wont need the safety as much to be able to shut down his man, putting less on the plate of the safety, making his life easier.. mission accomplished with the signing of Byron Maxwell…. Im not sure what Jaylen Watkins can do, but I like his potential. I would however Bet on Wolff growing into a better safety then Nate if he can manage to stay healthy… We FINALLY properly diagnosed him, so hopefully it was finally treated correctly and he can put his injury problems behind him….
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Once that kid is healthy, knows the defense like the back of his hand to be able to play instinctually without having to think, I believe we will see him fly around and be the safety answer we are looking for…. Im hoping Jaylen Watkins has AS Much safety potential as Wolff, and that they can both be healthy, really compete and bring the best out of each other, pushing each other to new levels for that starting safety spot
Agree with everything you said.
Quick poll: assume the price to trade up and get Mariota is (take it or leave it) Bradford, our 1st round pick, and Cox.
Do you do the deal?
hell to the no
No.
I think Chip would have to think long and hard. I bet he may do it.
Too…many…juvenile…puns…
lol who’s the juvenile…fox smells… nm
No…I don’t think we’d include the first. You’ve opened up a giant hole trading Cox.
Must…show…restraint.
That’s really the question this whole thing boils down to, I think.
Advantages:
* We keep our second this year and our first next year. That’s a lot of ammo to keep while still getting a potential franchise QB
* We keep some of our other assets, including Boykin and Kendricks
* The real key: the difference between an upper echelon DT/DE and “just a guy” is big. The difference between an upper echelon QB and “just a guy” is freaking enormous. As in, that’s what can win you a championship. JJ Watt is one of the absolute best players in the league. Didn’t help the Texans much when it came to making the playoffs. If Chip pulls the trigger on this, I believe that this point here is exactly why. All about resource allocation.
Disadvantages:
* Cox is a known quantity, a true star coming into his prime. MM is still a question mark, despite whatever experience Chip has with him.
* Removing Cox leaves a big hole to fill. That’s what she said.
* While the difference b/w star DE/DT and JAG DE/DT is not as significant as the difference b/w star QB and JAG QB, maybe that math changes when you consider that Cox is pretty much a super star. What happens when the player in question is one of the top 3 at the position in the league?
My call: I’m 50/50 on it. Cox is almost worth the jump by himself. But still, it’s a franchise QB we’re talking about. If I could do it and keep either the first or Bradford, I’d do it. Say, Cox, Bradford, and a 3rd next year.
Chip’s call: he’ll probably toss a couple more 1st rounders in there, just to make us cry.
plus you have to pay cox pretty soon
I raise the question because I have the feeling that is the price it will take to make the deal happen. I anticipate moving Bradford to Cleveland for the 19, using that 19 along with our 20. But those picks along with another pick probably won’t entice TN enough to move the 2nd pick of the draft. They have to sell something to their fans that says “immediate improvement” and that’s why it takes a high caliber player to make it happen. Cox’s value is high because of how good he is and can be, but he does need to be re-signed.
we could send someone else to cleveland to get to the 12 pick, i don’t know if its worth it, will mariota be better than bradfrod?
I think Mariota if he comes to the Eagles, having already played in almost the same system, and for the same coach, will be ready to start immediately and his main adjustment will be to the level of talent of his teammates and his competition. H
That’s the thing, it is not almost the same system. Ask Huff. I think alot of people are saying it, and it’s really untrue.
Mariota is a guy you build your team around; he is (you hope) your quarterback for many years to come. He is for the Eagles close to a known quantity where for other teams he is not. Bradford is a lot more iffy, mostly for health reasons.
Bradford if healthy is a more talented QB. Again If. I really don’t think MM is that good. I don’t think he could really carry an NFL team. I think he would need a very strong supportive cast around him for us to compete with the best of the best. I think he is like a Russel Wilson.
I just don’t see MM as worth it. He really isn’t anything special in a single category. If this were a stronger QB draft class he maybe even wouldn’t be best or even second best. There isn’t a single thing about him that says “Damn, look at that.”
Bradford and the 1st are a given. Cox is the crux. To me, Cox is more valuable than a 1st, since he is a first that was a success.
If Chip wants him, knowing him as well as he does, and all it costs is the pick used to get him, the player he replaces, and one more thing, I say go get him.
Cox is great, and will be great for a number of years, but (1) is his position as valuable as he will be expensive in our system, and (2) he is not a QB and nothing is as important as a QB in this league.
(Great question, by the way. I honestly didn’t know what my answer would be when I started typing.)
That’s what worries me. His 5th year option should be used, but will he sign an extension or a new contract if he does hit FA? He knows he could make much more money playing DT in a 4-3. I think it will become a problem when it’s time to put paper to pen. Now, what if he improves even more and becomes undisputed best 3-4 DE in the league after Watt? Watts contract may really hurt us because he may try to say look what Watt got, I should get somewhere around there.
ICD,
I’ve have been mulling the scenarios over in my head for some time now and have come to these conclusions: 1. Trading Cox comes down to whether or not the Eagles want him to be a part of their plans after next year. Most fans would say, ” OF COURSE!!! COX IS AMAZING!!!” However, he is not fully utilized in our 3-4, IMO. So perhaps they would sell while the price is high so they can get something better in return. The Eagles must also weight the options on how easy it is to find 3-4 DE’s. Is it that difficult? I’m not sure. 2. We all know that the Redskins traded an insane amount of draft picks when going up for RG3 and I don’t think the Eagles or Chipperino is that reckless. To answer your original question: the most I would give up is this years first, Bradford and next years first. If that doesn’t do it, so be it, but anymore ammo and the price for an unproven player is almost silly. 3. To go a bit further, what happens if we don’t get Mariota? Well, we still have a better prospect than Mariota coming out of college in Bradford. From what I have seen Bradford looks quite impressive and has NFL experience. If Chip thinks Sam can stay healthy I think he is overall a better bet and not only do we get to keep our 20 and draft another spectacular player (and I do think at 20 there will be an amazing player available) but we already have a former #1 overall pick who was placed in a crappy situation.
What do you mean he was not fully utilized in our 3-4? Do you mean he can do better in a 4-3? If that’s what you mean, yes I agree with you. However why does it matter if he would be better in a 4-3 because he is still our best player on D. Regarding the sell while the price is high comment I disagree. We will more then likely exercise the 5th year option on him, meaning we won’t lose him and he is improving so his price will be even higher next off season. No it is not hard to find a 3-4 DE, yes it is very hard to find a young one that is that good. I don’t think you can just find better. He may be the best besides Watt. This isn’t a Curry situation in which he doesn’t fit the base D, and can only play on certain types of downs. He fits his position brilliantly.
That’s right he does have a 5th year option I forgot. He would do better from a numbers standpoint in a 4-3. It would be hard to find better but it’s clear he is not Watt so I wonder what kind of drop off we could expect if we got someone different.
I think a rather big drop off all around probably. I would list him behind Watt as best 3-4 end. He is a huge help to our LBs. He is a special talent in that position where there really isn’t much special talent at all at that position. Look for his sack numbers to increase next year. The LBs and Curry said he was running the QB right into them alot of times.
Watt, Wilkerson, Richarson, then Cox in terms of ranking 3-4 DEs. Nonetheless though Cox is the most important piece on this defense. I know Chip says everybody is on the trading block, but he above everyone else should not be considered tradable.
Idk about that list. Those other ends don’t plan in a 2 gap unless I’m wrong. So their stats may look better then Coxs. However I think Cox does other things better. I guess it’s really in the eye of the beholder.
Well Watt is just a beast so we know he’s the best. Richardson was a DROY and improved in his 2nd year and Wilkerson has been a stud since he entered the league. I am not entirely sure the specific defense that the Jets ran under Rex but according to PFF those were the rankings given to 3-4 DEs with Cox at 4th. I would take Cox ahead of Wilkerson but not Richardson he’s just so good. Regardless Cox plays for the Eagles so he my favorite of the bunch.
Yeah, it’s very close between the 2. I do think Cox has more natural ability then him though. Cox was almost seemed cheated from 2 or 3 sacks last year with the LB getting there less then a half of a second before him. I think if you added 2 sacks to his stats the national media would be saying he was the next best behind Watt. Look for his name to really blow up in the national media next year.
I absolutely agree. Cox’s stats would be on par with the best in the league if it wasn’t for our defense asking the down lineman to eat up the blockers and let the LBs do the work. Nonetheless Cox is an absolute stud.
Yup, he makes every level of our D better. Won’t surprise me if he becomes one of the Eagles all time greats.
future hall of famer… he is one of the special ones…
If it weren’t for him being a 3-4 DE I would think that would be possible.
Yup. He makes every level of our D better.
definitely.. his stats could have been really freaky last year if his team mates didnt beat him to the punch as much as they did, usually because of the dirty work he did..
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the best is that he is such a good kid, who really loves the team, and his team mates and takes it very serious to never let them down.
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seriously, we cant find a true GREAT young player who cares LESS about his stats then Fletcher Cox. If you are LUCKY you can find a kid who cares AS Little as Cox does about stats, but you wont find a more selfless kid… He is one of the special ones and its blatant disrespect to see people throw his name around like he is disposable.. If Everyone has a Price, I dont think you can afford Cox as far as im concerned…
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and we are lucky that this post also goes for Cedrick Thornton (who is a great guy and team mate) and Bennie, who wore the prestigious character number at LSU, nuff said…
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Watt is just one of the best players in the entire league. He is the only player you can have A DISCUSSION
100% untradeable as far as im concerned.. The only player I would trade him for is JJ Watt
I just love him because he is actually a home grown talent that is one of the best players in league. We haven’t had many of those in recent years. Hopefully Pope can be that next guy.
right! True That!… people that would trade him for the next favorite college player are out of their friggin minds.,. he is one of the 3 most valuable players on our roster… he does So MUCH for guys like Barwin, BG, Curry, Kendricks, Meco, friggin Kiko will LOVE playing behind Fletcher… He is one of the RARE players that really make his team mates better, and to have that ability at the age of 24 is friggin insanity… how the hell do you even think of losing him, for what? a college prospects? Cox is one of the best players in the NFL under the AGE OF 25,.,,, HE IS THE BEST intrerior DL we had since Jerome Brown and we still have so many year at a ridiculously high level out of him ahead of us, and we probably havent even see HIS BEST yet….This is going to be his 4th year, 3rd in the scheme, probably going to be even better then the scary impressive player we saw dominate last year,,
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free agency, trades, whatever i still dont get how anyone can even entertain the thought of losing him. it completely blows my mind…and like you said, ESPECIALLY since he is home grown.,.. Thats the goal of the roster building, To get studs like him grown in house, we finally hit a grand slam and people throw around trading him for some college kid like its nothing… so disrespectful to a high character, hard working, good kid, who I hear is an absolute MONSTER in practice, I hear he is one of those GREAT players that bring it every day in practice, and thats so important for building a winning program.
,.,
i think talking about trading him, or not paying him is flat out disrespectful, and its disturbing. we should cherish the next 6-7 years we get out of him
To be honest even the talk of trading Cox infuriates me. Like why even discuss it. All these people saying Chip is a genius but yet turn around and throw Cox’s name in any trade talk is absolutely ludicrous, Chip isn’t dumb enough to trade his best defensive player.
AMEN!! Trust me I feel you man, it drives me nuts… whats worse is when Im in Philly during this period, I cant escape the nonsense. Its everywhere. You turn on the radio and one week these maniacs talk about trading away Kendricks… they get bored of that rumor and they move on to trading Cox, and then we want Manziel, like it never ends,… its one dumb report after the other. These people think Chip is retarded, they throw around the most absurd crap and justify it by saying “No one knows what chip will do” LOL, pretty sure he wont go FULL RETARD on us tho,.
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They rip him for Lying, which is my favorite. because he should be fired if he is publically telling the truth and reveal our plans. These jackasses are at the point where they flat out ask him “WHat happens if Mariota falls to like 6 and its not that expensive, will you go trade for him”???? Like are you fucking Psycho that you just asked him to answer that publically? like WTF is wrong with you? and when chip brushes them off and doesnt answer, they get mad and then they rip him and call him a liar,.. like you psycho, we should rip him if he is dumnb enough to reveal our true intentions publically, not the other way around,..
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Two things I really really believe Chip was telling the truth about:
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1) building ILB depth was a major priority. but he is lying about Meco’s timeline. No way he is counting on him to even be able to backup our ILBs in september. WHich is so crazy that people now think Kendricks is getting shipped out, but whatever… lol
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2) I believe him when he talked about how we had too much invested in the offense, and not enough invested in the defense, and I quote “It clearly showed on the field”…. If I believe THAT, how in the world can I possibly believe he will piss away our most valuable defender for an Offensive player? Losing Cox would set us back so damn much, people are just crazy. I have to stop getting mad and just start laugfhing at them… hopefully all the nonsense ends when the draft is over, but I wont hold my breath
Okay, then, why not? (And what’s in that wheelbarrow?) Do you not take Chip at his word when he says that everyone’s available for the right price? What about Cox straight up for Mariota? What about Cox for Mariota PLUS a first next year? Would Chip still not be “dumb enough” to trade his best defensive player?
It really irks me when people get so single-mindedly attached to individual players. I’m an Eagles fan of and before I’m a DeSean Jackson, LeSean McCoy, Nick Foles, Jeremy Maclin or Fletcher Cox fan. Now don’t get me wrong, I love Fletcher Cox. He’s probably my favorite current Eagle. But if Chip thinks trading Cox gets us a franchise QB that can take us to multiple Super Bowls, what kind of an Eagle fan would I be to argue with him? A smart one?
Just to be clear, I don’t think we should trade him at all but I guess if it gets us MM and Chip is sure he can succeed……. I guess.
I understand. I know your not the let’s get MM at all costs guy. I don’t know you but you seem like a very logical person. It’s just that I don’t think MM will become that good of a QB. I think he may be solid to good, but that’s about it. Honestly if Bradford stays healthy I think he can be much better then him. Before Bradford went down in 2013 he was having a Pro Bowl numbers type year.
I have a lot of faith in Chip reviving qbs. I’m kind of excited to see what Sam can do.
Me too. In 2013 (the last year he played in the reg. games) through 7 games he had: 1687 yards, 14tds-4int, 60.7 comp%, 90.9 QB rating. I think that’s pretty impressive considering he was surrounded by a poor cast and had a poor O Coordinator. I’m pretty sure that was also the year his receivers had a historic percentage of dropped passed.
Just tell his knees to stay healthy!
I’m working on a way to put adamantium into his knees.
cant possibly disagree more buddy, but I’ll leave it at that
You know I’m nott for trading up for Mariota in the slightest. It costs too much and Cox is too good but I stand by statement, that from a purely numbers standpoint, Cox would be better in a 4-3. Obviously he fits both schemes very well. Read point 3. I’m just saying what I think it would take.
he would fit STAT world BETTER as a 4-3… he is growing to play a 3-4 as well as anyone can. He is playing the 3-4 too damn well for me to say that he is BETTER in another scheme. It doesnt get MUCH better than what he is doing for us. He could Do AS WELL in a 4-3, but he is playing at too high of a level in our 3-4 to say he would do better….. he would only “do better” in STAT WORLD… Real World, he is an elite player no matter what you want to run, give him a year to get comfortable in whatever scheme you want and he will do it at an elite level..
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but Lucky for you we dont playa 3-4. we play multifront defense, so you get to see your boy play in a 4-3 (which you prefer) plenty of times again… We get the best of both world..
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3-4 2 gap is better for stopping the run, and we try to line up that way when we think other teams are running… yet when we know the other team is passing, we get to go to oufr 4 man lines, and you get to see Cox in the scheme you think he is better at,.
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You cant sit here and accurately say that he is a BETTER Run defender in a 4-3, because he is already ELITE at it in a 3-4, which also happens to be better against the run then a 4-3… You cant tell me that he would be better against the run in a 4-3. He would shoot thru gaps and make plenty of plays and grade out as a top 4-3 run defender, just like he would as a 3-4 run defender.. Only difference is we are getting MORE out of his greatness against the run in a 3-4, because instead of shooting him thru the gap and have him make plays, he is a monster who occupies blockers, gives other players a second to make a play, and then he will just chuck you out of the way and go make a play like he would if he was linning up in a 4-3 against the run…
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and this convo is just scratching the surface. His VERSATILITY EXTENDS to being able to give you snaps lined up as a NT… or just as easily slide over to fill in for trent Cole as our 4-3 DE in 4 man lines… the kid is a rare Monster who can do it ALL at an elite level, just give him a year to get comfortable at what you are asking him….
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so I absolutely agree with you that he could be great in a 4-4. but he is equally as DOMINANT in a 3-4, and FORTUNATELY for us, its not a problem of 3-4 vs, 4-3, because we run plenty of BOTH.
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You keep Fletcher Cox, you will have a Future Hall of Famer;.. he is THAT good…
I wont say he is BETTER in a 3-4…. but I wont say he is BETTER in a 4-3 either…
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but if your definition of BETTER is all stat based, then sure, he probably looks better to the casual fan in a 4-3… anyone with a minimal understanding can see what a monster he looks like in a 3-4.. I cant believe how many tackles for losses he gets out of a 3-4 two gap… now im sure he would have a few more if he was shooting gaps every time, but he is too athletic and talented to risk him getting out of position and having a QB go Matador on him. He is so athletic and talented that he is better off standing up, reading the situation, let kendricks and Kiko get space to fly around, and when he knows where the RB is going, he chucks his Offensive lineman out of the way and makes the stop…
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he may Look more valuable from a stat sheet in a 4-3, but his greatness is probably more valuable in a 3-4. again, fortunately we get the vbest of both worlds in our defense…
It’d be really tough to give up Cox. Cox was worth the 12th overall pick just a few years ago and he’s been very successful and is now a known quantity. So if he was worth the 12th overall pick as an unknown quantity what is he worth now that he’s a known star with an incredibly high ceiling just entering his prime. If we can all agree that Bradford is worth a 1st rounder as well, then we’d essentially be giving up 3 first round picks for MM. That’s a lot of resources. I’d rather give up more picks than Fletcher Cox. Given the choice I’d rather give up next years 1st than Cox.
Depends on how high you have him rated. He is arguably the best QB in a weak QB class that does have many flaws. There is no guarantee he will be good. I wouldn’t, not for Cox.
If Chip thinks MM is the answer, yes, you do it, no doubt !
No. Thanks.
While Cox is scheme versatile, there’s a huge difference in role/value between:
one-gap 4-3 DT, two-gap 4-3 DT, one-gap 3-4 DE, two-gap 3-4 DE
and it’s a pretty easy argument that he’s a more valuable player in two of the three other systems. At this point you have Fletch for the next two years before you probably have to commit elite money to him. Long term, the question becomes (as it always does with roster building) about resource allocation, specifically how valuable is a two-gap end in your system, and how much cash (what percentage of your overall cap) are you willing to allocate to that position. Cox is quite probably the single player on our team I’d be most disappointed to lose, but if you think you can get a decent (not equal, he’s elite) replacement on his production at a fraction of what his long-term cost will be, then it does make some sense to trade him to a team that would value his skills at a higher premium (he would be an absolute monster if he was back in a one-gap 4-3) when his trade cost is at or near its peak. All that being said, I think I would be willing to include Cox in a trade to get Mariota, but not along with our 1st AND Bradford (it’d have to be one or the other).
Cox is a top 20 under 25yr old player in the NFL that will dominate for at least another 6 years…. Cox should be completely untouchable unless we are trading him for JJ Watt. i wouldnt even trade him for Gerald McCoy… he is the most important player on our entire defense… Hell no!
And what exactly would be the point of trading Cox for Watt or McCoy? It’s a question of comparative positional value, not emotional attachment to individual players. If you believe that Mariota is a franchise QB, and obviously we all have different opinions on that, though none so fully formed as Chip’s, then there’s no player on your roster who’s untouchable, and in the post-Bradford trade presser Chip pretty much said exactly that.
The thing I appreciate most about this blog is when the discussion gets beyond our own emotional biases as fans and really works through some more complex strategic ideas. I know I give you a hard time GEAGLE, because your style is far too often that of the WIP callers of my youth (which kind of just pisses me off and degrades what I appreciate about this community), but you do sometimes show potential. I just want to help you reach your restrained (and thoughtful) potential.
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See, there ya go. That was a thoughtful and effective articulation of your full range of nuanced intellectual comprehension…
The Redskins suck so bad they can’t even bluff that they are drafting MM
http://www.nj.com/eagles/index.ssf/2015/04/2015_nfl_draft_marcus_mariotas_planned_visit_to_wa.html
Snyder “McCloughan in my office now. I want you to bluff we are drafting Mariota. Bring him in for a visit so I can meet him”
McCloughan “Get that Mariota kid in here no matter what it takes!”.
Secretary “Yes Mr Mariota, next Tuesday? I will ask.”
McCloughan “Excellent” yells to Snyder “He is scheduled for next Tuesday”
Snyder “No Tuesday is no good for me. I got rich man stuff to do. See if he can do 3 weeks from Thursday.”
I don’t understand why Cleveland would be so quick to give up on Manziel. Haven’t even gotten to mini camps yet and he was just a rookie last year. The only explanation would be it’s Cleveland. But I believe the Pettine Zoo is better than that.
Maybe because Manziel doesn’t belong in the NFL? He belongs on a reality show with Cade McNown, Jamarcus Russel, Akili Smith, Tim Couch, Joey Harrington. With Ryan Leaf as the “MC”
shawn andrews can produce the show
Dude is a coke head, mental disaster and total head case. Sometimes you gotta just cut your losses.
No, he is a spoiled addict that has entitlement issues, and due to his parents money never developed proper life skills.
Yea…that too
I think they are finally understanding that his skills that made him good in college are not good enough for the transition to the NFL. What he was really good at in college does not work well in this league. They see him in practice everyday, and they have realized that the skills he does need he is unable to develop. Add to the fact that he doesn’t seem as though he 100% wants to put in the effort to work on his carreer. Rehab helps get you off drugs, it does not improve your work habit and life skills. What he really needs is to be in a structured halfway house, but that won’t happen because he is Johny Football. Alot of players don’t have anything to fall back on if they fail in the sport. Add that, their love of the game and their competitvness, and they work hard. If Manziel fails in the NFL he still has mommies and daddies money to fall back on.
This time of year is all about guessing at the motives behind the actions that teams take. I think one could easily read the interest that other teams are showing in Mariota as a sign that we are exploring moves to go get him.
If teams hear that we have contacted the Jets, for example, about moving up if Mariota reaches 6, they are going to show interest in Mariota, and then see what interest we show in their pick, or in picks above theirs. After all if they don’t want Mariota, the best case scenario is to see him get picked early enough to push their guy down or to reap a bounty for giving up their spot.
Yes. You also will see rumors of other teams besides the Eagles trying to trade up for Mariota.
Just scanned NFL news, and 2 headlines gave me pause. Le’Veon Bell will miss 3 games for weed, the drug that the NFL should just forget about, and Dolphins trying to move into top 10 in draft. After the mega signing of Suh, they want to make a run for Kevin White. Did Dan Snider buy the Dolphins when I wasn’t looking?
2 games for dui and another one for weed charge, were they all from the same incident?
Yes.
http://fantasynews.cbssports.com/fantasyfootball/update/25141793/report-steelers-rb-leveon-bell-will-be-suspended-three-games
In terms of the jersey being sold/not sold, to me this is a complete nonstory being played up for the sake of conversations/posts. First of all, why in the world would Chip discuss his draft plans with the merchandising side of the organization. Chip could care less whether a jersey is sold or not. Second, and this is probably the most important point, from a business stand point, (and lets be absolutely clear, jersey sales are purely a business decision, and have nothing to do with the actual football decisions) why WOULD they sell the Bradford jersey right now. Production of jerseys costs money. Right now, clearly there is real uncertainty (at least perceived by the fans who would be the consumers that buy jerseys) on whether or not Bradford will be here by training camp. Thus, not only could the window to recoup the costs of making the jerseys be short, but the demand will be relatively low. Finally, IF there was any financial gain to be had, why wouldn’t they simply sell the jersey? Once a costumer pays for the jersey, why would they care if the player leaves if they have already earned a profit. Also, why would the football side of things want to stop the merchandising side of things from making a profit, particularly since the alternative both costs the merchandising side and leaves your current starting QB wit uncertainty tland less confidemce going into the season that may hurt the football side of things.
Bradford may or may not be the starting QB going into training camp, but jersey sales provide absolutely no indications of that. They simply indicate the decision that the costs/risks involved from a business standpoint outweigh the benefits.
if they sell them on the website why not in stores? is you’re argument that an nfl team is concerned about the money it makes to print a couple of jerseys?
No. Printing a bunch if jerseys the don’t sell in the grand scheme of things doesn’t make a huge difference in terms of the profit the NFL makes. That being said, good businesses still will try to make rational decisions based on markets. The market is low for Bradford and the benefit of selling the jersey now as opposed to after the draft when things are more clear is minimal. Therefore, while it doesn’t make a huge difference, the rationale business decisions Is to wait to sell the jersey.
all i’m saying is if there was no mariota play, as ck et. al. have said they would print the jerseys, who else would the get?
But they are printed and available..
the reality is no one wants a Bradford jersey until he makes it out of camp at least and onto the field for a game. and then you kind of have to wait it out still…
so nobody is buying a Kiko’s jersey either?
Why in the world would Foles jersey go 50 % off prior to the announcement of a trade? Things that make you go hmmmm…..
Eagles’ preseason schedule: Week 1: vs. Indianapolis; Week 2 vs. Baltimore; Week 3 at Green Bay; Week 4 at New York Jets
No Patriots this year? Shame.
We’ve got them at NE in the regular season.
long summer
@ GB ??? Wow… and aren’t we playing the Jets during the season ?
Week 4 of preseason is all backups, most of who won’t make the team.
aah, good point !
GB is week three… And week 3 is usually the closest to a real game of them all.
But still as they say a dress rehearsal.
That’s a pretty cold description of the Jets.
Joint training camp practices with the Baltimore Ravens maybe?
I hope, that would be a good team to do it with. Or GB.
doubt we would do it with a contender in our conference like GB..
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Maybe Jets, steelers,even the bills…
Definitely, proximity to eachother and John Harbaugh knows the Nova Care facilities well.
doubt it, Harbaugh was talking shit about chip the other day to the media
care to elaborate?
oh my bad, thought it was common Knowledge..
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he was acting like a klown, talking subliminal trash like a real pussy, but it was understood that he was talking about Chip… he was running his mouth about how “They dont promote all their sports science like some other people”..
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move over Bruce Arians, we have someone else to slap around…. do we play them in the regular season this year? we beat them with our 4 win team..LOL
Only in pre-season this year. It is a bit naive, I think, to assume that Chip is the only guy stressing nutrition, sleep, etc. I’ll bet Chip doesn’t want the mantle of “The Sports Science Guy” because it does have a ring of arrogance. I love that he is plowing that ground, but, as the saying goes, “The first casualties of war are secrets.”
does anyone else think MM is really more of a college level QB?
he doesn’t seem to have a great arm, not as good as Bradford, and when he decides to run, he is going to get crushed by the defenses, putting him on a stretcher. so this takes away part of his game.
Wilson looks a little stockier then him so can handle some hits, even though he slides well.
can eh really throw it well enough for the big leagues?
beats me..
If he can’t throw it, then we’d be in trouble… but with the running aspect it gives the defense another weapon they need to account for, and could bail out the offense every now and then. He could always slide instead of trying to get a couple of extra yards to prevent too many hits. But he has to be able to take hits, as a Qb in the NFL, but I think having that running game and up tempo offense should prevent the defense from zeroing in on him too often.
he took that one hit in the bowl game and was hurt.
but his arm is what i’m worried about, just doesn’t seem big league to me. he just looks like a really really good college level QB.
I think petty is going to be better in the nfl honestly.
but i’m no Mike Mayock!
I’m not either, but I’m guessing if Chip goes for him, he has no doubts about that part of it, and who else would know Mariota better ???
so if he doesn’t go for him then we know….
it’s a big gamble, if you let him pass and sam isnt the one then it’s like what are you going to do now…
petty?
i’m assuming we don’t talk any qb, but we could always trade bradford and take a wr and then take petty or hundley.
I can’t picture chip not getting atleast another young qb. even UDFA style.
hopefully better then that though, petty or hundley backing up
Exactly !
Chip has the offense built for a rookie QB. He will have a great running game to fall back on while he eases in. He has a good enough arm to make every throw in this system. The running ability is a bonus, which will only make the running game even better.
Power ground game from the Eagles this upcoming season. Never thought i’d live to see this time come.
but can he throw the deep ball, which also helps the run game?
He throws a good ball on those vertical concepts that Oregon likes to run, which Chip runs a lot at the pro level.
Wilson is also 5’11 while Mariota is 6’3 so it is easier to look stockier when you’re 4 inches shorter.
true.
doesn’t Wilson have a little more zip on his passes too or no?
You know what that is a tough question to answer because on too many occasions I’ve seen him throw passes with too much air under them. He can put zip on his passes but like I said he throws a lot of rainbow throws.
I take college Bradford over college Mariota, but that is not a slight at Mariota at all
No Patriots on schedule… Maybe because we are opening with them regular season!
Rather play them at the end of the season, in the cold, with both teams in playoff contention and our offense humming…
No. Thanks.
Of course, come away with a 20 point win… as we’re going to be blowing away teams this year.
Pats always start off slow – you want to play them early to have any chance at their place. Also playing the season opener means you done your Thursday night game for the season so we are free from those awful 4 day rest games.
I love everything about playing them first game of the season. We just can’t start out how we started Jacksonville last year.
Same applies to the Jets, Bills, and Steelers…
We’re not playing the Steelers in the regular season.
The Pats do. And most likely in the opener.
We deserve that game. F Pittsburgh.
RIP Stan Hochman. He worked for the Daily News almost all of my life.
He was awesome
http://mmqb.si.com/2015/04/09/nfl-dallas-cowboys-business-discipline/
When your own mayor likens one of your transactions to a “punch in the gut,” there’s probably a few fans who aren’t crazy about it either. I guess the karma should be good for us.
Tony Romo uncuttable and untradeable until 2017. Hope he takes a couple of good shots in that sore back of his so he can’t play that long and the cowboys are still stuck paying.
3 more years to beat up on Romo? YES PLEASE!! need to make the most of these last 3 years of his career, and cherish every hit he takes from an Eagle defender…
3 Years?. I am hoping to see BG and Cox team up to put on huge hit on Romo and end the career after this year. I don’t root to hurt players but anybody wearing that stupid star on the helmet is the exception.
i want to beat his body to a pulp, beat him down, make sure they miss the playoffs, but I want the cowboys to have enough hope, to think he can be their QB again in 2016, and in 2016 I want to beat on his body again, but leave them enough hope to go into 2017 as their QB
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Romo is a Loser, he doesnt have that clutch gene needed to win anything serious… The Longer Cowboys Keep having hope in him, the longer it will be til they find a quality QB that we should fear
Im hoping they trade for Peterson, give him a new deal and Hardy plays 16 games
“…the amount of dead money acceleration would be $46 million if the Cowboys and Romo were to somehow part this year.”
it’s so crazy.
My favorite nugget:
“Romo now carries the highest amount of potential dead money—cap charges that will remain if Romo and the Cowboys part ways—of any player in NFL history.”
https://twitter.com/BOBonTCN/status/586280878545969153
Hopefully last TV appearance pre-suicide.
why would you even say that?
Because he took a torch to this team in 2005. F him. He’s right up there with Norman Braman, Harry Gamble, Danny Watkins, etc. for guys who went out of their way to cause this team harm. F him.
it wasn’t all on him, even so it’s been 10yrs
I’m listening to zero excuses on this. F him.
He played on one leg in the Super Bowl… risked his career to come back so soon…
A truly amazing effort on his part. It still doesn’t excuse blowing up the team the next year.
They didn’t want to pay him… I put some of it on Banner and Co., they should have paid him and had at least a couple more chances at it. And McNabb had his own ego issues, and couldn’t deal with TO’s attitude.
They did pay him. A ton. Going into 2004 in getting him out of San Fran. Year two of a six year deal isn’t a time for a new deal.
Mike you are right. SBParade what kind of stupid statement is that saying they didn’t want to pay him 2 years after signing a contract.
I wouldn’t call that statement stupid. I just think it simply was made through TO’s deluded frame of reference.
Yes I agree I didn’t mean to use “stupid”. My apologies SB. Just angers me and people try to make excuses for T.O.
Agreed.
I thought his agent screwed him over not letting him become a free agent… I forget, it’s been a while… but there was some issue with his contract. Either way, it wasn’t meant to be… although it was fun in his first year. But I don’t blame him at all, that’s the only season the Eagles reached the SB, so whatever headache was worth it, and if would’ve won… he would’ve probably never left here.
The circumstances under which he left San Fran played us off vs. the Ravens in an odd contested trade / free agent bit of nonsense. The Eagles paid him a ton upon acquiring him in either case. Coming at the team for more money less than 12 months into a deal is pure insanity.
TO is to blame…After his great season, amazing recovery and effort and performance in the SB he had Phila. eating out of his hand. He wanted more money. Advertisers and businesses all over Philly and S. Jersey would have paid him far more $$$ than any contact the Eagles would have paid…
Instead he wanted to do sit-ups in the driveway. Sad for all concerned.
thankfully the age of the diva WR has mostly passed.
Yes, but maybe instead of to paraphrase “Go kill yourself”, one should say “Go F yourself”.
I don’t know, I’m with anon here. I hated T.O. at the time for how he blew apart that team, but even before we got him the guy always had a ton of emotional issues, and at the end of the day, as much as we may care about the team, it’s frigging football. There’s really no place for jokes about suicide or wishing actual harm on someone.
I get where you’re coming from, but I view his acts as treasonous.
Yeah, and I get that you dislike the way that he acted, but it’s a totally not cool thing to even joke about. Treasonous to what, a corporation? Oh god no, by all means, don’t betray your capitalistic overlords and their municipal devotees who’d trade in functional school systems for publicly financed gladiator pits. We’re all Eagles fans here, but get some goddamn perspective.
And people say Philly fans are low-class. Can’t imagine where they get an idea like that from.
That comment makes you an ass… uncalled for comment…
You can call the comment uncalled for as a point of disagreement with me, but if you’d like to comment at me personally you can go change your sanitary napkin.
and the winner of the most scum of the earth comment on Igglesblitz 2015 goes to Media Mike
The a Titans are garbage, and Whiz wants a pocket QB. He wants Bradford and the Rivers noise is all about driving up the price for the pick
And when Mariota goes #1?
But I agree about Wis and a pocket QB. I’d be willing to bet they take Fowler for OLB / LeBeau magic at #2.
i would give my pinky or the eagles to trade up for Fowler
I see Fowler as a great fit for the Titans.
i see Fowler as a great fit for anyone who needs a monster to Eat QBs off the edge…
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IMO he will be the best edge rusher to enter the league in the .last 3 drafts…
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He is the best of this class
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Rather take him instead of Barr, Clowney or Mack
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Rather have Fowler over Dion or Ziggy Ansah
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Love his combo of power and speed off the edge, and he plays with a nasty streak.. Think the world of that kid
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Doubt the Titans would draft him, they just paid Orakpo and Derreck Morgan…
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Think there is a better chance Fowler ends up with the Jags…. Fingers crossed he doesnt fall to the skins
Considering Ansah is already 31 or 32, I 100% agree on that front.
Fowler over Mack really? That’s interesting right there brotha as I would take Mack over him. Aw hell I wish the Eagles had either one, I’ll leave that as my opinion lol
I was a big fan of Khalil Mack, still am…. and I would def put im #2 behind Fowler, but I really really think the world of Fowler… 3 years from now, I think he will be in the conversation with guys like Justin Houston and the mighty Robert Quinn…. then again, we are just splitting Hairs, Fowler? Mack? we would be fortunate to have either…
https://instagram.com/p/1RSOlsC_uF/Â
what an Idiot….
..
New Seahawks teammate Michael Bennett still believes Jimmy Graham is “soft.”
We’re sure coach Pete Carroll is thrilled. “Just because he’s on my team, I don’t stop feeling that way,” Bennett, for some reason, said. “Obviously I’m going to be a better teammate to him because he’s on my team. I can’t do the things I was doing to him when we were playing him. … We are a running team, so he is going to have to block and do all those things.” Bennett is correct that Graham hasn’t always played with the edge required of a well-rounded tight end, but his comments are perhaps some of the most idiotic we’ve seen all offseason. Part of Seattle’s success under Carroll has been its all-for-one, one-for-all mentality. Bennett may want to get with the program with regards to his new teammate.-roto
,,,
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I have said Jimmy is Soft since Barwin made him HIs Bitch in the playoffs, but for a superbowl contender to trade for such a quality weapon, instead of welcoming him to the team, existing players are talking shit? Hee Haw, Hee Haw….
I would love to know what the soft loser Graham said to Seattle before Graham was humbled in that playoff game two years. ago. Obviously some dudes are still irked.
If I remember right Mike when they met in the playoffs a few years ago there was smack talk going on during warm ups where Graham said “You know who I am, I’m Jimmy Graham” then Bennett responded with “Who the f*ck is Jimmy Graham”. Then after that Bennett went on to say his brother is the best TE in the league followed by Gronk and Graham. Still not enough to warrant the idiotic comments that come out of Bennett’s mouth. Can’t wait to hear about the camp fights during TC when Graham tries to block Bennett.
yeah that def happened… im sure there was some other running of the mouth done during the game since both were on the field at the same time as a DE and TE..
.
His Brother the TE, is always talking about how he is a better TE then Graham, and Maretellus is probably right. he probably is a better TE then “Yimmy”(Barwins bitch doesnt get his name pronounced right).. But “Yimmy” is the much better pass catching Receiver weapon… You cant even really count Yimmy as a TE, the only reason he is a TE is for contract purposes. We were defending the Saints out of our Nickel package, yet Sean Peyton was still petrified to put Yimmy in, and let him block against us in the run game.,
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He really is just a TE in the Saints offense, but that could change depending on how the seahawks want to use him… Thats a run first, smash mouth offense, I assume they will demand that he grow a pair and figure out a way to get on the field while they use Beastmode..
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I wouldnt be surprised if Pete Carroll goes to bobby wagner, Kam Chancellor and his defenders and tells them to rough Jimmy up in Camp… dont hurt him, but stay in his face, go at him hard, try and toughen him up and get him ready to play in an offense that is based off of a lot of Power football..
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and not for nothing, the offense will work so much better when Jimmy being in the game doesnt tip the offenses hand, telling the defense they probably arent running the ball..
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he is too big to be this soft, and this inadequate as a blocker. I think he can grow to be better, the saints let him get away with it, but I could see Seattle try and tough him up and get him ready for a SB run… of course there is a fine line, they cant overdue it and alienate him…
I think he’s there for red zone purposes, they’ve been fumbling around w/ red zone targets for years so they stepped up and got the best. At one point he was catching 10+ TD passes a year.
He does need to block better.
he is definitely going to help them down there, but to do that, he is going to have to improve as a blocker, You know Seattle is going to do plenty of smash mouth running in the redzone especially after the SB loss. If he wants to play in the redzone he will have to be credible as a blocker if not he wont play half the time, cuz they wont completely abandon lynch when they get down there
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I assume they are going to try and make it a point to grow the blocking part of his game, Im very curious to see what Pete Carroll can get out of him in terms of blocking/toughness growth…..He is going to a team that really competes its ass off against each other in practice, he will be facing a tough defense that plays with a ton of swag in practice every day.. Im thinking SINK or SWIM dynamic may actually be good for him, and help toughen him up and grow that part of his game that he got away with in New Orleans..
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very interested to see what Pete Carroll can do with him in the run game… or if he ends up waiving the white flag and conceding to not play him when they want to run, like the saints often did because of his lack of toughness and physicality… if the Seattle seahawks practice environment against that defense every day cant get it out of him, then no one will…
Not my best work from round 3 on, but oh well.
Round 1 Pick 6 (NYJ): Marcus Mariota, QB, Oregon (A+)
Round 3 Pick 20: Daryl Williams, OT, Oklahoma (A-)
Round 4 Pick 14: Eric Rowe, CB/FS, Utah (A-)
Round 5 Pick 9: Kenny Bell, WR, Nebraska (A)
Round 5 Pick 20: Leterrius Walton, DT, Central Michigan (A+)
Round 6 Pick 20: Ben Beckwith, OG, Mississippi State (C+)
Round 7 Pick 20: Gerald Christian, TE, Louisville (B-)
Or the improved version
Round 1 Pick 6 (NYJ): Marcus Mariota, QB, Oregon (A+)
Round 2 Pick 20: T.J. Clemmings, OT, Pittsburgh (A)
Round 3 Pick 20: Nelson Agholor, WR, Southern California (A+)
Round 4 Pick 14: Eric Rowe, CB/FS, Utah (A-)
Round 5 Pick 9: Jesse James, TE, Penn State (A+)
Round 5 Pick 20: Kenny Bell, WR, Nebraska (A+)
Round 6 Pick 20: Kyle Emanuel, OLB, North Dakota State (C+)
Round 7 Pick 20: Miles Dieffenbach, OG, Penn State (B-)
I enjoy the exercise, but honestly what’s the point if Agholor’s going to be there in the late 3rd or Rowe in the late 4th. Whatever rankings are supplying that result are just idiotic, and can be discounted at face value. You might as well just draft Mariota in the 7th. Speaking of which, why’d you draft Mariota so early? You probably could have gotten him in the 7th.
Just curious, but in this mock how were we able to draft up and get MM and still maintain the same amount of picks?
When it’s your turn to choose a player, the game will give you trade down scenarios.
Sometimes you have like four or five teams looking to move up in any given round.
You can pick which is the best value or choose a player.
Be careful though, it’s highly addictive.
I’ve refused to play it for that reason.
I used 2016 and 2017 #1s to get him. In actuality I would prefer the trade be Bradford (or the pick we get for him) #20, and Kendricks.
Gotcha
Dumb question….I see these mocks you guys do, what does the letter grades stand for?
I believe in the First-pick website, they base your draft on what others have drafted and what the creators have assigned as good value for a prospect. So, if Dupree falls to 20 and you select him, it is rated as great value because he is projected to go higher. It is all incedibly inaccurate but a decent engine to play with mocks.
It’s an algorithm of need, value, and if you overdrafted a position.
Hey GEAGLE, check out this nugget of wisdom from your favorite hack writer ESP:
Eliot Shorr-Parks is the GEAGLE of Eagles beat writers.
At first I just thought this was funny, but it’s actually kind of crazy how dead on this is as an analogy. ESP really does show some insight sometimes (his take on the Bradford/Mariota tap dance), and along with Jimmy Bama he’s proven to be one of the more adept beat-writers at reading between the lines on some of Chip’s quotes and actions. That being said, he loses a lot of credibility by throwing up a (weirdly formatted) post every five minutes or so, far too many of which are little beyond click bait. And his stubbornness and refusal to listen to what anyone else is saying (see: Landon Collins) can quickly grow tiresome.
The fact that GEAGLE is always mocking him (like he’s almost trying TOO hard…) is just icing on the cake. It could really only be more perfect if GEAGLE was actually some sort of obscure anagram for Eliot Shorr-Parks. Incidentally, is GEAGLE some sort of obscure anagram for Eliot Shorr-Parks? (I’m no good at anagrams)
Eerie, isn’t it?
Both could benefit from an editor too.
Shorr-Parks is a joke… terrible attempt there.
He’s been arguing that for a while now.
Regardless of scheme for or being the “best” safety. His play still doesn’t warrant the 20th pick. Terrible value.
LOL elliot talking about scheme fits now? why start now, he never cared about anything important like that before lol… a safety who got picked on in coverage in college, he doesnt believe isnt a scheme fit for us? hee haw hee haw.
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thanks for the laugh Minx…
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