Concluding the Mathis Affair
Posted: June 17th, 2015 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 309 Comments »Chip Kelly spoke. Evan Mathis spoke. And confusion remained.
Kelly held a press conference prior to minicamp. The hot topic was the release of Evan Mathis. Kelly was peppered with questions and the key takeaway was that the Eagles released Mathis after his agent, Drew Rosenhaus, had made several requests for the release.
Mathis doesn’t exactly agree. Les Bowen has some details.
Asked about this, Mathis said any release request would have occurred “no time recently” — meaning he might have welcomed being released when free agency was in full swing, when teams had cap room and hadn’t drafted yet, but he wasn’t really looking to be released in June.
“If he was so willing to oblige my release, why didn’t he sign or draft any OL?” Mathis asked, via text.
And
On Mathis, who has been unhappy with his contract the past two offseasons, Kelly was asked why the Eagles didn’t just demand that Mathis honor the contract he signed in 2012, which would have paid him $5.5 million this season and $6 million next season. “It wasn’t addressed to us that that was going to happen,” Kelly said. Asked if he thought Mathis would have reported for training camp, Kelly said, ‘I don’t know.”
“He could have asked,” Mathis texted, when those comments were relayed to him. Mathis later said he would have reported and honored his contract.
“They obviously wanted a new contract, we weren’t going to give them a new contract, they asked for release,” Kelly said.
Rosenhaus said he will no longer comment on anything involving Mathis and the Eagles.
Mathis sure sounds like he was ready to report and play, even under the existing contract.
This boils down to a couple of things. The most obvious point is that Eagles don’t want the distraction of having Mathis around. The point that is harder to comprehend is that the Eagles don’t seem to think of Mathis as being all that good of a player anymore.
Tim McManus got some good quotes from Jason Kelce about the first point.
“Last year there was some under-the-radar talks about it, stuff that was going on in the media, but nothing really concrete and he never really let it take place in front of the team or anything like that so it wasn’t a distraction,” said Kelce. “At this point obviously he would have missed all of OTAs. It was a much bigger deal throughout the season at this point.”
“The most important thing that we’re trying to establish here — that I think is established — is a culture,” added Kelce. “It’s a workplace where everybody is in this together, everybody is in this with one another. People look at this like it’s voluntary and that’s fine, but the fact of the matter is that he was one out of 90 guys that wasn’t here so that’s clearly not a part of the team. Nobody has anything personal against Evan — I still consider him one of my best friends I’ve ever had throughout my life, actually — but this is just the nature of the business, the nature of what we’re trying to build here.”
“We can talk of woulda, couldas if he would have came back and so forth, but the fact of the matter is I think the coaches and the offensive line, I think that everybody feels that we have the players to be successful up front, and they didn’t want the distraction,” said Kelce. “That’s what I’m assuming.”
Chip Kelly really does have his players thinking the way he wants. This team is focused on continually getting better. Even if Mathis didn’t work to make this a distraction, it would have been from time to time. Kelly clearly doesn’t want to deal with something like that if he can avoid it.
As to Mathis and his level of play…the vibe you get from Kelly and Jason Peters and some others is that they think Allen Barbre can step in and play as well or almost as well as Mathis. Kelly hasn’t said anything publicly to rip on Mathis, but he’s hinted at it.
Kelly has talked several times about how the Eagles had no offers for Mathis. Did Kelly say that for the heck of it or was he hinting that other teams didn’t see Mathis as someone worth trading for? Even PFF, who worships Mathis, shows him on the decline.
Evan Mathis has been the HIGHEST-GRADED guard in 3 of the last 4 seasons according to PFF. And now he's available. pic.twitter.com/ibeH4NK8jf
— NFL Network (@nflnetwork) June 12, 2015
And this from Doug Farrar of SI.
My assessment of Mathis based on 2014 tape — Loses in some power situations, susceptible to rip moves, struggles to hit 2nd-level targets.
— Doug Farrar (@SI_DougFarrar) June 13, 2015
I think you need to be really careful about overrating/overpaying a 33-year old guard with some tech fixes. Really good player, but…
— Doug Farrar (@SI_DougFarrar) June 13, 2015
Seems like the Eagles agree that Mathis has those issues, but they would disagree that he is still a “really good player”.
I find it hard to believe that if the Eagles truly thought he was one of the best OGs in football that they would just cut him. Mathis at $5.5M would be a good deal for a top OG.
This isn’t my attempt to rip a former Eagle. I’m a fan of Mathis and hope he has a great year for his new team. I’m just trying to make sense of the Eagles actions. The comments from Kelly and the players don’t paint the most flattering picture. No one has said Mathis is a bad player or anything close to that. Clearly he is still a good player. But it seems like those around the team don’t see him as one of the best OGs in the league anymore.
Are the Eagles delusional for thinking Barbre can play at the same level? That’s a fair question. I haven’t seen enough of him to have a strong opinion of how good Barbre can be at LG. The team (players and coaches) seems to be completely confident in him.
I loved watching Mathis play in the last 4 years. I prefer athletic OGs so he was my type of blocker. That said, the team did go 5-2 without him starting last year. I know there are a lot of factors in that record, but the point is that he wasn’t irreplaceable. LT, RT and C remain the key positions on the OL.
I am going to miss having Mathis as part of the Eagles. Time will tell if Chip Kelly and his teammates end up feeling the same way.
_
Mathis overplayed his hand, and then on the next hand, over played it even more. lmfao
http://i.imgur.com/YAqktPe.gif
Lmfao
Wasn’t Mathis playing most of 2014 coming off a pretty bad injury though? Or am I overestimating how that might have affected his play.
It may have. I can’t recall a single instance in which that was mentioned by anyone at all. He never really looked hobbled when on the field though. Usually if an injury is an issue somebody mentions it. Just didn’t seem the case.
With how he made comments this off season about certain things you would have thought he may have said his injury affected him in some way. Esspecially considering how everybody was debating if he is falling off or not.
He tore his MCL.
You can actually play on a torn MCL, it’s a pain tolerance thing.
Rehab is 4-8 weeks depending on the swelling, and stability of the other tendons and ligaments. 100% full recovery for the average person is 3 months.
He has world class physicians and trainers. He’s not you’re average joe who goes to a physical therapist for 45 minutes after work a couple times a week.
He missed 2 months. I’m sure it affected him to a degree, but it’s not like he was playing through a torn muscle or something of that ilk.
“You can actually play on a torn MCL, it’s a pain tolerance thing … He missed 2 months.”
So what your saying is Mathis was laying down on the job for 2 months? 🙂
Haha, I mean you could do it if you tore it in the playoffs.
You’re insane to not let it heal during the regular season.
Hmm, well hopefully it’s true that his play was declining, I’d hate to see him go to another team and light it up this year.
Here’s a bold statement… If Mathis were versatile enough to play the RG position, then Herremans would have been the Eagles pro bowl guard (aka playing next to Peters and Kelce is nice).
Lol you just beat me to it. Was pretty much saying the same thing. I was slower to hit the post button.
I think saying Herremans would have been the pro bowl G is a little extreme though. He did play next to LJ who played at a Pro Bowl level at times, and was also next to Kelce of course. Herremans never had the same athleticism Mathis has.
That’s a little too bold. Herremans isn’t really blocking anybody that well anymore.
Haven’t seen this mentioned really but is it possible Chip thinks that a decent amount of his success was due to playing next to Peter’s and Kelce? Maybe he thinks that even if Barbre is a slight downgrade talent wise the 2 guys playing next to him are enough to make up for it.
I’m not saying this is it, but it may be a small part of it. After all Mathis was VERY average untill he played next to the two of them. I’m not saying Peter’s and Kelce made him, I’m just saying it may be possible that they were a bigger help then we just assumed and Chip feels that way as well.
yeah wonder if when they went back and reviewed the tape that’s what they saw, tra thomas basically said as much, that barbre actually fits better with the blocking scheme than mathis
Yeah, I found that article very interesting. I wonder if Barbres style meshes more. Does anyone have an answer to.that?
Not enough tape to definetively say either way. He’s only played like 75 snaps for us.
And there in lies one of my major complaints; we don’t have a good base of evidence on Barbre to trust the move.
Article on BGN talks about how Mathis style was not conducive to the scheme and the way the other OL blocked. Peters talks about how the way Mathis set would cause a gap between him and JP that stunting DL could exploit…
I think the most telling quote from all this is when Mathis texted, “He could have asked.” I’m sorry, but if your head coach has to ask you if you will show up for mandatory training camp, then you are not 100% committed to the team. Just like Kelce said, “…he was one out of 90 guys that wasn’t here so that’s clearly not a part of the team.” Bye bye Evan.
I think it’s even deeper than this. People keep pointing out that these were voluntary workouts, but we all know how CK feels about practice/training. If someone doesn’t show up, that’s bad. If someone doesn’t show up because of a dispute with the team, they are actively and intentionally hurting the team, whether it’s voluntary or not. Kelly can’t have a player who is willing to do that, whether they’re all-pro or not.
isnt he or someone on record saying o-line ota drills are pointless without pads?
As with almost everything regarding CK, I don’t think this topic can escape the context of $$$. I think from Jeff Lurie to this newest class of draft picks, the prospect of a solid, better-than-average OL asking for 16M at his age might turn a lot of heads. Even if Mathis remained mum, and just sat out OTA’s, details of this kind of story have the interest of every team member, I would think, and those details would be followed with great interest. DeSean was overpaid and sent packing, Shady was monopolizing too much revenue and traded, JMAC was desired by the team, by Kelly, but for a certain price. If Mathis was getting any of this, he must’ve thought he was exceptional. A legend in his own mind, it appears.
Much as I think money is far too often overlooked, in this case it was just one component. Age and money put him on the bubble. If he wanted that money, he needed to show up and prove he was worth it. He literally let someone take his place. You have to make them take it from you.
Chip’s culture thing is sure looking like…
http://www.thedirtisred.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/blacksheep.jpg
Is this another racist joke?
In the English language, black sheep is an idiom used to describe an odd or disreputable member of a group, especially within a family. The term stems from the genetic effect in sheep whereby a recessive gene occasionally manifests in the birth of a sheep with black rather than white coloring; these sheep stand out in the flock and their wool was traditionally considered less valuable.
The term has typically been given negative implications, implying waywardness.[1] It derived from the atypical and unwanted presence of other black individuals in flocks of white sheep.
In psychology, the black sheep effect refers to the tendency of group members to judge likeable ingroup members more positively and deviant ingroup member more negatively than comparable outgroup members.
It wasn’t until I visited the New Zealand South Island, which purportedly had 7 sheep for every human being, that I found out what happens to black sheep.
Cut.
You might want to look up the term – sarcasm as I’m pretty sure that’s what xmbk was going for
Thx. I looked up your username on dictionary.com and found it’s definition too.
Slang.- a stupid, mean, or contemptible person.
Hah – you’re funny for a three year old. It’s a shame you’re too stupid to understand a basic concept such as sarcasm
It’s Johnson, Kelce, Barbre and Peters.
Gotta weed out those diva sheep!
As an interesting parallel of how a team sees a player one way vs. outsiders seeing him another; Eric Sehorn, I mean Weddle, is basically being frozen out in contract talks with San Diego. The San Diego Chargers, along with myself, aren’t trying to pay that dude top of the safety market money…………..because he’s massively overrated.
The real question isn’t whether or not Barbre can be as good as Mathis, it’s whether Barbre/Tobin? can be as good as Mathis/Barbre. You’re not replacing Mathis with Barbre, you’re replacing Mathis with Tobin or another unproven lineman. I really can’t believe Chip doesn’t understand that, so Chip believes the upgrade from Tobin to Mathis isn’t worth the money and hassle. From the outside I would disagree, but what do I know?
I’m sure he understands it.
Stoutland has said that some players are better playing on one side and some are fine regardless of playing on the right or left side. He said that Barbre is much better playing on the left side and Tobin can play on both sides. So playing Barbre out of position doesn’t help us either. Guard is the least important position on the OL. Continuity is the most important thing to an OL success. Mathis was a nobody before he started playing for us. Chip has the most riding on all these moves and he is the one making them. Just have to wait until they start playing games to find out.
I liked Mathis on the field. Did he benefit from being in between Peters and Kelce – absolutely. I don’t blame him for asking for more money, neither did CK, but he pushed too far. Perhaps he should have negotiated for Pro Bowl incentives on his ORIGINAL contract he signed in 2011, if he thought he’d become that good. As for the comments after the fact, it really doesn’t matter what he says now. He has eluded to wanting to be here, would have reported. It’s too late dude. He had a nice contract and collected some nice coin here. He wanted to play the “I’m not happy game” for the 2nd year. It seems like a situation where one phone call from Mathis to CK could have solved. He thought he was so great that there was no possibility of being released. He gambled and lost. I think he will lose money too. As the oldest starting OL in the game, perhaps Chip is making the right decision at the right time.
I am puzzled why no OL were drafted or brought in prior to this move. Even if CK had an idea he’d release Mathis, it would have been a good leverage move to draft a nasty run blocking guard. I am still hopeful they pick up another competent guard for depth. (Not Wheeler)
I haven’t seen enough of Barbre to have an opinion on what kind of guard he is, but if JP and Stout have his back, then we should watch and learn.
He said he called in may: CK blew him off (he says). Said CK never asked if he was going to show to mandatory workouts, just said contracts were out of his hands.
May was 45 days prior to mandatory camp. I have no reason to believe anything Mathis is saying right now. He’s back peddling. Perhaps the word “release” should have never been said and this is a non issue.
You’re right, given the situation, I would have just showed to camp, but he didn’t even though everyone was writing how he was going to get released. Maybe after that May conversation they knew it was basically over.
It’s not Chip Kelly’s job to personally call every player to make sure they will attend mandatory workouts! Mathis signed a contract.
Obvious point #3: Once you decide your current contract is your best option, stop playing hardball and join your teammates.
Obvious point #4: Don’t sign with Rosenhaus.
Hopefully, all the “malcontents” (as all these players have been portrayed after being highly praised while here) are gone now and no new ones have been or are being created.
Again, we’ll have to see how the season plays out before we’ll know if it worked or not.
I agree Mathis overplayed his hand, but also disagree Kelly’s its my way or the highway approach is always the best course. I hope the OL can be much better this year than last and that players do not start viewing Kelly, like Gore did, as a detriment rather than attraction to playing here.
Gore is quoted saying he made his decision based on wanting to play with a great QB.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000480009/article/frank-gore-i-wanted-to-be-with-a-great-qb
Also has Drew Rosenhaus as an agent.
Of course
A log of he said she said stuff…but …
…..
“Mathis sure sounds like he was ready to report and play, even under the existing contract.” WHAT????? T-Law — if THAT was true — why didn’t he just report during the voluntary camp? (of course he’s going to say that after the fact)
…..
Now that Mathis was released, of course he’s going to play the ‘poor me’ card. I confused by the people falling for it….
Mathis playing rope a dope with that retard Les Blowhard.
He hasn’t gone to OTAs in like 3 years.
If the Eagles had an offer for Mathis, they would have taken it. Why not? It’s the same cap situation as releasing him, plus you get a pick. That tells me no one offered them a pick.
he’s still on the st. clearly no one is trying to pay that salary.
Minnesota didn’t release Peterson even though he said he wouldn’t play for them. No one releases a quality player under contract. Mathis was under contract and would have played, just like last year. All players who want something hold out, at least until they can be fined. Kelly decided he doesn’t like that. So he released arguably the best guard in football and replaced him with a journeyman. That’s two journeymen/undrafted back-ups starting when you count Herreman’s replacement. As an Eagles fan, let’s hope it works.
Peterson’s importance to the vikings >>>>>>>>>>>> Mathis’ importance to the Eagles.
Teams release (high) quality players under contract every off-season. Maybe this was a bad decision. Time will tell. But let’s not act like it was without precedent
Yeah they release them at the start of the off season and give that player generally have a catch to negotiatie with other teams.
Incredibly rare a player gets released at this standpoint of the offseason.
if Peterson was 34 coming off a season where he missed half the games due to injury, they would release him.
Peterson and Mathis isn’t a good comparison
So Kelly calls an impromptu press conference to say several days after taking a fair amount of criticism that he just granted Mathis what he originally requested? BS.
More and more I am convinced that Kelly is completely in over his head as a GM who makes a bunch of decisions based on impulsivity instead of through due diligence. Recipe for disaster generally in a GM. Heard it rumored with a couple of times this offseason including the McCoy trade.
It wasn’t impromptu. It was planned.
Your right.
Impulsive is not a word I would use to describe Kelly.
OMG, a Philly fan rushing to negative conclusions without all the facts. Guess it had to happen sometime.
What do you mean ‘facts? It has been more than a week now since the transaction with both sides reacting publicly now. Mathis nor Rosenhaus have said they weren’t requesting a release now.
Yet Kelly said they were requesting a release. So you believe the player and his agent and not coach you obviously don’t like. Big surprise
Several days after the fact. Why didn’t he originally report that, say they granted Mathis and Rosenhaus their wish, and wished him well.
It wouldn’t have completely quashed this story but it largely would have.
Because, and here’s the kicker…
Chip Kelly doesn’t give a shit about the media. He doesn’t care. At all. Also he doesn’t give a crap what you or I particularly think. That is of zero value to him. So he does his thing and if they are getting too much shit the PR guy drags him up there for a press conference.
Wouldn’t have it any other way. All the people that like to whine about what Chip says to the media had better learn to get over it.
My favorite crowd is the “he doesn’t talk to reporters and that’s somehow disrespectful to the fans”. They’re adorable.
Yeah it’s kind of a non-point. Why should he give a crap about the fans (us)? He respects people individually, but the collective ravenous beast that is the Eagles fandom always wanting to know more about him and how he thinks and makes decisions can take a hike. And that’s fine. He’s a coach not a politician.
If he wins we’ll love him, if he loses we’ll hate him.
A lot of media guys around Philly egg on that mentality too… We deserve this, we deserve that, blah blah blah… Bunch of braying mules IMO.
Maybe Chip thought it was none of our business and was treating Mathis like a professional by keeping private conversations private, until Mathis didn’t.
Maybe Chip figured that Mathis would just deny it and play the victim.
Or, maybe, as D3FB says, Chip just didn’t care enough to explain it to the masses.
I don’t know what rock you’ve been hiding under, but every report I’ve heard since the end of February or so has been that they have been asking to be traded or released.
Mathis has been asking to be traded for the last 2 off-seasons. We didn’t get any reasonable offers. He turned down a $1 million a year raise last off-season. Gets hurt, misses 7 games and then asks if the raise he turned down is still available. Says “Deez” to Chip on Twitter. Holds out of OTAs. Maybe Chip saw how well Barbre was doing in practice and thought the drop off from Mathis to Barbre wasn’t worth putting up with his crap anymore. This doesn’t sound impulsive at all. Looks like Chip thought this through and this was his last option.
There is always angst between players and coaches/teams in the NFL given the nature of the contracts & the way they structured.
Still think what is more likely is that Mathis didn’t show up to voluntary OTAs and Kelly reached a boiling point & decided to release Mathis.
Just ensures that the team is notably weaker at that spot this season where they already didn’t have a ton of depth.
I know there is always angst between players and teams over contracts. But I think this move really only weakens our depth. Tommy wrote something yesterday or the day before about the Eagles going into 2004 with unknowns at both OG spots and they turned out OK. These coached see the players everyday in practice and know way more about them than us. Continuity is the biggest thing when it comes to the OL. I think Chip couldn’t count on Mathis and thats why he is gone. If Cox was doing something like this, I don’t think Chip would cut him. Mathis was a 34 year old OG, complaining that he wasn’t getting paid enough.
Someone on a different thread said “If your girlfriend keeps saying that she is going to break up with you, she can’t be surprised when you dump her”. I think that sums this situation up perfectly. Mathis played chicken with Chip and lost.
Mathis has been playing ‘chicken’ with Mathis for more than a year now.
I completely understand why the Eagles won’t give him a new contract or meet his demands. Doesn’t make any long-term business sense.
Just am perplexed at how this is both good or sound reasoning to just release him now.
If he didn’t show up to training camp and held out for all of the training camp, that is a very different thing but people are acting like this is common.
It isn’t at all even if you go back over the last 30 years. Hell, it wasn’t uncommon veterans would hold out and get fined a bunch of money for missing mandatory OTAs and even training camp practice. Just a lot less common today than it was 20 years ago.
Players usually only holdout of the voluntary workouts anymore. Players don’t really holdout when they are getting fined. I think when Mathis got hurt last year, Chip got a chance to see what the OL looked like without Mathis. And he didn’t see as much of a dropoff from the guy rated the best OG in football the previous 3 seasons to his replacement. So when Mathis started this ish again, he said “eff it”.
There’s more of those facts you[re missing. Are you at the training?Have you been able to see how the line has been doing? Are you staring into your crystal ball seeing how the line will play this year?
This “ensures” nothing about the team except they have almost $15 million more to spend.
Spend it on what exaclty right now? the money thing is the single dumbest thing on why he was released right now.
OL Cap Numbers with Mathis/Herremans:
Jason Peters: $9 mill
Mathis: $6.5 mill
Lane: $5.2 mill
Kelce: $4.4 mill
Herremans: $3 mill (I think)
Total : $28 mill or 32% of offensive spending ($85 million).
What exactly are they going to use that money on this moment? Who is available to sign and worthwhile?
As for next offseason, that’s completely irrelevant because they could have cut him then.
The $ rolls over into the next season
Contract extensions could be one possibility I’d think.
Kelly is showing a great deal of restraint not talking about a former employees total lack of respect for him personally and the whole organization. Brainless parrot writers won’t stop asking the same questions over and over and over and over so he has to say something. whether it is 100% the truth or not is immaterial. Kelly is keeping it non-personal in public, like everybody should do.
I mean yeah because the season has totally played out already….
doesn’t sound like it to me
‘More and more I am convinced that Kelly is completely in over his head as a GM because he makes a bunch of decisions based on impulsivity instead of through due diligence..’
From YOUR VERY OWN POST further down on this page:
“Impulsive is not a word I would use to describe Kelly.”
You totally contradict yourself, bucko.
My guess is Mathis wanted more guaranteed money, his salary for 2015 is fine but he thinks decent chance he gets cut next year (more likely he is not worth this contract) and wants an overall guarantee worth more than his 2015 salary alone. Maybe he gets that, who knows.
is Mathis trying to pretend he didn’t know his agent was trying to play hardball with the Eagles?
Mathis needed a new agent after last season.
Same general reaction on here as last season when Jackson was released generally the past week as more and more commentators have seemingly come around to the Eagles’ FO point of view as they have made some efforts to smear Mathis publicly since his release.
This was a voluntary OTA. It wasn’t Mathis not reporting for something mandatory let alone deciding to stick training camp either or the regular season.
Mathis has done things that probably aggravated his teammates and coach but big deal. Probably received poor advice and overplayed his hand but all this does is make the Eagles notably weaker going into the season at a position where they weren’t strong to begin with.
Agree with all that, though CK seems to think AB can fill Mathis’ shoes. If you’re winning games, as a leader, you have a ton of political capital, if Kelly was going 6-10 and dropping pro bowlers might be different.
I guess I don’t see what kind of impressive capital Kelly has especially as a GM.
They are coming off a so-so season that ended with them home again in Jan.
Kelly deserves this season and next to show what he can do when he has full control. If the Eagles don’t make the playoffs in either season, he should get fired even a year early though.
No, he shouldnt get fired. Of course so many circumstances go into that but you dont want to be constantly switching coaches. I never understand teams that do that when theres some growth and success. Of course a few awful seasons and it makes sense but that wouldnt be the case here.
If they don’t make the playoffs either of the next 2 seasons, that means they likely finished no better than 9-7 and likely worse.
That isn’t constantly switching coaches either. That will have been 4 consecutive years here without a single playoff victory and 3 home in Jan.
I can see the case for letting him have the final 3 years of his deal fully in charge too.
I don’t have any kind of expectation that it is ‘Super Bowl’ or bust but Lurie said again this offseason during his press conference that this is a ‘gold standard’ organization.
If what I described (home in Jan the next 2 years) takes place, it will have been 5 of the last 6 years the Eagles were home in Jan. It will also have been a decade since they won a single playoff game (’08).
Huge gap between what the owner is publicly-stating and the previous results over a considerable time period.
Chip’s been given an extraordinary amount of power and used it ruthlessly. His personnel decisions have often been bizarre as he continues to unload talent. He needs to get some results within the next couple seasons. I won’t complain about 10 wins a year, though.
What exactly has he done that you construe as “ruthless”? Please be specific.
“Ruthless” was just said for effect; “aggressive” or “bold” reflects my meaning more clearly. It is quite bold to get rid of fringe Pro-Bowlers like Jackson, McCoy, Foles, Mathis, and Maclin.
Bold, I’d agree.
False
Thanks for the useful and thoughtful reply.
Is MS2 a participant at mini-camp?
yes. He had a pulled something in the beginning but now is full participant.
Thanks
I meant he had a slight injury during the non-mandatory camp but I believe is fine now.
Pulled groin. These things tend to nag but he’s full go.
“Chip again on Mathis. Said not an issue of culture, issue of money. “It was a money decision. We weren’t on the same page” with contract.
Chip: we were in constant contact with Mathis’ agent (RE Evan saying he hadn’t asked for release since March).”
I guess they have to pay Cox and a QB next year…maybe we should be thinking about it that way. Maybe Mathis was def. getting cut after this year anyway.
Kelly is full of crap on this point.
Sounds like any other public divorce I’ve ever heard. CK really thinking “why would I tell any of you a$$holes the REAL story..?”
Understood and he doesn’t have to at all. Frankly if he did have a blow out with Mathis it wouldn’t really do him any good to publicly air dirty laundry.
So, the statement that you acknowledge is necessary untruth, which everyone should assume is a lie, and should be a lie for the good of the organization, you are declaring it a lie?
And your stupid nonsense rants that have no validity is full of crap at this point.
They were for sure cutting Mathis next yr if not this yr just based on the way the contract was structured
Chip: Rowe will play corner for foreseeable future.
Chip really raved about Rowe today. Said he forcing a lot of turnovers in OTA’s/mini camp, punching the ball out, getting his hands on INTs. Stripping WRs at the last second….. Prolly watching Thurmond and Byron closely.
..
chip also raved about Vinny Curry, Cox and Ryan Mathews
Chip: We’re excited about DL group, maybe our strongest group last year … Add Beau Allen and Taylor Hart improving, should be better.
Taylor Hart gained 20 lbs of muscle. MS2, Hart, and now I’m sure we’ll hear about others.
i love the Beau/Bennie tandem, and Cedric Thornton is our most underrated player and up next for his coming out party this year, we got them southern boys on our DL (Cox- Miss St, Thornton S. Arkansas and Bennie – LSU)
Plus, beating up on a weak OL in practice should help their confidence…
I’ll eat my words too if the Eagles play at G this year is solid too with Barbre and Tobin as the starters too.
Guy I am most worried is Peters though. He notably fell the last 2 seasons in the last month of the year and if you look at alot of his comps at LT they aren’t pretty.
Kelce is still move important for this line in terms of scheme and effectiveness but the Eagles don’t have an answer if Peters notably declines. Not uncommon that players at this age/experience at T get pushed or already moved instead.
False, pretty sure Peters is still serviceable and the whole injury argument is useable at any of the 53 roster spots available during the season…. mainly i just don’t get why guard is so highly coveted in your mind…. LT/C/RT for us are potential perennial Pro-Bowlers currently which helps our guard play….. the OL is about being a unit not individual players.
Bob’s just a hater – just ignore his rants!
oddly enough I actually have no problem with GEAGLE’s rants half the time lol.
other half?
Really? I think my finger’s getting tendonitis from scrolling past GE’s verbiage.
GEAGLE is one of the guys I most want to have a beer with during the Super Bowl celebration. No lack of passion from him.
BS and the Eagles do have notably more depth at several position include ILB, RB, and even WR right now. Even Sanchez is a quality backup QB.
Agree on the whole unit, considering the number of times in past years that O Lines have been greatly appreciated.
eg. The Hawgs, The Doomsday bunch. both division rivals unfortunately. And linemen themselves say it’s important to know how the guy next to them plays.
A declining Peters is still better than most. We will see. I’m guessing he has a couple years left.
I think depth in general is an issue on the OL. If Peters goes down, I assume Johnson switches to LT, and Barbre to RT (what he was going to play for 4 games last year before that plan got destroyed by injury). But that leaves a hole at guard somewhere, as whoever lost the RG battle would then play there.
Chip said they are experimenting with Curry at OLB. Expanding his role…
i’ve wanted that since the switch. he’d make an amazing predator rotating in with BG (i’m ignorantly assuming his coverage limitations would keep him out of being the jack and naively hoping MSII can rotate in for barwin)
Kiko and Thurman can help Curry in the coverage scheme. Scary to thing of the mindgames the QB must contemplate. Could make the D even stronger.
I just want Curry on the field so I’ll take it lol
Makes sense (especially if MSII doesn’t impress). So was the original position of DE for Curry just because of numbers at OLB, or because they thought that was his best position? Seemed like many thought he’d move to OLB originally like Cole and Graham.
I think it is more of coverage ability.
The countdown has begun on Earl Wolff. Time for him to look at other opportunities.
I guarantee his personal timetable is to be full go for TC. I think hes trying to pretend to tough it out here by at least attempting to get out there. What one time, sort of, last week or was it Monday? Thats my guess
The coaching staff has concluded he is “soft” and not a team player. Tic, tic, tic goes his time with Philly. He’s close to getting cut but still has a chance.
yup, dont disagree there at all
Pretty brazen conclusion seeing how they mishandled his health last season.
don’t question OD
Just sayin’, if the staff feels that way they’ve got to take a longer look at how they handled his situation last season to understand where he may be coming from.
When your coaches feel you’re soft you are in a really crappy situation.
One good thing for Wolff. The league is so Safety-starved that he should have no problem getting a chance with a team that would take a closer look and trust his (outside) doctors’ judgement.
If they’ve written him off already, they are morons.
I agree. The worst of all outcomes of cutting him before he heals is that he shows us in another uniform that he wasn’t slacking, that he can play in this league as a starter, and that he turns out to be better than anybody still on the roster.
My hesitation with that is that is what they thought a lot of last year, when he really did have an injury which was not diagnosed. So it’s possible they had that mindset (which sounds like it was way off base) from last year (when they basically did call him soft).
Players do need to learn how to play hurt, but in this situation, it really makes no sense to cut him before the end of training camp. If he’s still this way in TC, then it either didn’t heal or he’s not going to play well, so cutting him then may make sense. But if he does recover, it could be throwing away a useful player. It’s kinda hard to know how much an injury is still serious and needs more recovery time; given last year they may be mishandling him again.
He had microfracture surgery he needs proper time to heal. Time that a 5th round draft pick can’t be afforded. Microfracture surgery is literally putting tiny fractures in the area you want to heal. The idea being that the injuries you caused by the surgery will stimulate new growth and blood flow to that area. As you may or may not know cartilage is extremely nutrient depleted in the first place because of its lack of blood supply. The surgery takes a LONG time to fully recover from a la Graham. That being said it was said to be “mini” microfracture surgery and he is a 5th round pick so I’m not sure why many make such a big deal over him anyway. Did he really show is amazing things when he actually got on the field?
thats fan desperation for anything resembling half decent safety play
congrats to the Golden state warriors to winning their first championship in 40 years.
Could we possibly see the NFL equivalent of the warriors win the championship this year? A team that plays an; exciting, fast paced style. A team with crazy, solid depth on offensive and defensive positions, a team that’s labelled as being finesse and completely offensively driven while actually being ranked as one of the best defensive teams in the league, A team who can score quickly and build huge leads forcing you to make mistakes the defense capitalizes on? A team with a fanbase starved for a championship for over 3 decades, a Team that…like the Warriors… is originally from Philadelphia?
Yes I can manage to compare, and/or draw parallels with my eagles to anything on this earth..
they did talk a lot last night about culture and having the right guys that want to win and practice hard, as being the big thing for the warriors, so yes!
we are the warriors
they also were talking about sports science with that team this morning. They fill out questionnaires every morning and monitor everything etc. Okay, lets keep it going
That team was/is loaded; stuffed with talent. Kerr brought their offense into the modern age (concentrating on 3s and layups and eschewing low-value midrange shots). It’s easy to look good when you have better players than the other teams.
and more versatility and depth. good point about Kerr bringing their offense in the modern age concentrating on 3s and layups.
It’s been said that the football equivalent to the “corner 3” is the play action pass. And teams that run the ball as heavily as we plan to, will be more successful completing those play action passes.
All I ask is we get to Foles 2013 kind of production.
even more than that, he was excellent rotating the players and mixing up the groupings. Great coaching job, he makes it look easy
Excellent comparison. But who is our steph curry?
hmm A quietly confident, low profile leader Who was Fun to watch in college, who’s dangerous but not physically intimidating, who’s strengths are accuracy, vision, intelligence and who suffered repeat injuries to his legs and was almost written off in some circles as being too brittle to last and/or take a team to a championship…for now based on those comparisons I’ve gotta say Sammy B
Absolutely agree. I just didn’t know if others felt the same way.
I like it. Strength in numbers!
How about the cross-state team? It took 40 years, new coaching, new GM and new drafting, then away they went.
Philadelphia has the Constitution, the Liberty Bell, George Washington’s early slave quarters, the Yellow Fever epidemic of 1793. Philly is where Mason and Dixon landed to start surveying the Line named for them. The city is where the early settlers started who became the Amish and Mennonites. Stetson made cowboy hats and some fine silversmiths and gunsmiths operated from Philadelphia PA. It’s about TIME for a Super Bowl. Or three. Or more!!
Btw, I am serious.
Now if we can take the parallel even further and get Steph’s cousin Vinny into the MVP conversation, we are totally winning the super bowl.
whats weird is ive been thinking were the hawks of the nfl
IMO, there is only one conclusion to “Drew” (sic) from this spat!
it really sounds like sanchez has a much better arm this year according to the practice reports.
that’s cool
yup, Huff making some plays, Jacorey even getting in the mix breaking up a pass. Cant wait for camp
eagles looking good in june
We have more catches than the cowboys, although their best player hasn’t been playing.
Damn Right we are looking good in June.. Have you looked around and notice the daily ACL of Achiles injuries around the league…so far. It has been an EXCELLENT Summer… get this roster to september Healthy, and that’s like a third of the Battle…
…
huff doesn’t get much press from the media but hopefully he is ready to handle a big role on the outside. most reports I saw are that Pope has almost exclusively been in the slot and hs gotten as many reps outside as originally assumed… if They are just going to leave the Pope in the Marques Colston Role, going to be interesting to see how the outside reps in games are divided between ArchBishop Agholor, Reverend Huff(he is married so he cant have a catholic nickname), Coop and old man Miles?
..
Hopefully Agholor grows to be indespensable on the outside and huff can wrestle more on more snaps away from Coop.
..
Although. If we lineup in 2 WR sets, can The Pope Really be on the bench? Interesting question I would like to hear the media ask Chip. Because Even tho Coop is the veteran starter on the outside, most Eagles I hear speak sound like they view The Pope as our top WR. Agholor, Byron Maxwell, Jenkins, Thurmond. When they spoke, they all sound like Jordan is the top Dog,.to hear Agholor talk sounds like he really looks up to jordan, Not Coop. he gives Coop his respect as a vet, but you can tell these players view the Pope as the Top WR and even if you want him to be your slot, he is big enough, talented enough and smart enough moving him outside so he isn’t on the bench when we are in two WR sets..
I like Sanchez, he seems to have come a long way from his days in New York. Probably isn’t THE guy, but I’m glad he’s here.
I was hard on him, but I’m definitely happy to have him in midnight Green, and no matter how successful Bradford is, hopefully Sanchez remain here as Insurance,,, If Sanchez has to play this year, I have no doubts he will be better then what we saw out of him last year…
you said “hard on” like a million times tho
did you read his background story where his mom worked 3 jobs etc.? impressive.
Big, fast explosive, and a knack for fumbling. Seems like a more physical/downhill, less durable version of Bryce brown. So much talent it’s frustrating. Hopefully this is where he can turn it all around and put it all together.
Speaking about bringing in a fresh bruiser on a gassed defense later in games, could you imagine what Chip could do with an early-career (pre-dancing period) Brandon Jacobs type runner. No body wants to tackle that kind of load when they are tired.
Yeah that would be crazy,, save Brandon Jacobs for the 4th Quarter and Only unleash him on gassed defenses to close the game..
…
murray and Mathews are great compliments for each other, same Bruising style and hopefully they can use each other to stay healthier then they have been in the past when they were used as work horses..
..
I think Because of Ryans talent, Murray will have less attempts then shady.. Gotta get Ryan 10-12 per game…give Sproles 2-3 carries but use him way more in the passing game..
..
I wonder if we could see something like Demarco gets two series, Ryan gets 1, Demarco Gets two, Ryan gets 1…with Sproles sprinkled in between mostly in the passing game?i
Shoulder all healed.
OPPORTUNITY might be Knocking Boys.. Retired(Drug problem) former All American G/C out of Wisconsin Mofit drafted in 2011 by seattle is looking to make a comeback… talented guy, probably dwarfs Vandervelde and Molk in terms of center ability.. Mauler type in the run game (320lbs).. Wouldn’t mind sniffing around the kid seeing where his head is at..
Moffit’s lead-footed.
MOLK isn’t an NFL player… Kelce’s backüp worries me more then the stRting Guards,.. MOLK and Vandervelde have to go!
Molk’s best quality is running — as you’ve said before.
Anchoring, not so much.
come stai?
Bäcküp is the most underrated black metal band of the 80s.
Agree. Molk looked outmatched on nearly every down, and his demeanor in press conferences suggested that he was just happy to be there. I don’t think it’d be difficult to upgrade from him.
With Bradford in the game, I’ll be damned if we give some Defensive tackle the chance to throw MOLK back into Bradfords Knee.. keeping Molk sacrafices way too much strength in the name of athleticism.
..
Vandervelde has Guard versatility that MOLK doesn’t have, but I have never had a very positive impression about Vandervelde and we lost him last year to injury, and he is one of the guys like Wolff who have missed the most OTAs with injuries this year. I don’t know if he is good enough, and he may not even be durable enough….. It doesn’t have to be Mofit at all, but I do really hope we are able to find a player good enough to replaceVandervelde and Molk as Kelce’s backüp, and if he has Guard versatility, even better… I will feel so much better once we get a better back up Center..
We shouldn’t make the assumption that a player can never change or improve from one year to the next.
Is he really that lead-footed? Wasn’t he drafted by Seattle when they ran a zone blocking scheme? I don’t know much about him outside of the name and pedigree which is why I ask. I’ll defer to your opinion on this one.
Here’s his Combine numbers.
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/john-moffitt?id=2495204
They’re not bad.
But he always reminded me of this guy:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a7/Frankenstein's_monster_(Boris_Karloff).jpg
Wish Molk had a Leadfoot, maybe he wouldn’t have gotten thrown into FOles lap so easily
Denver also gave him a shot, so they must have thought he might be able to protect Manning.
That’s what I recall but Denver traded for him and they’ve always run a zone scheme similar to ours.
Switching from Mathis to Barbre just kicks the can down the road one more year. He’s going to need to be switched out after next year due to his age. Ideally, we should have his and Peters’ replacement on the team next year, or we’re in the same situation. (Or Johnson’s replacement when he kicks over)
Much easier to find a RT then a LT and Lane is viewed as the LT of the future. Guards are easier to replace you know when you actually draft them. I think the Eagles are fine this year but next years draft must focus on adding at the least 3 o-lineman.
Probable. First year, offensive “skill” positions and a couple of D guys. Second year, Defense. Third year, patch holes.
Oops. Sorry. Accidentally upvoted myself. I know I’m wonderful but really. Must stay classy. ;~D
Maybe not even that much, let’s see how the ones on this roster improve. By the end of the year, they may feel a couple of the backups are worth keeping as both backups and future starters. Last year they kept an extra lineman out of TC because they looked awesome in preseason, and played relatively well considering the injuries on the line.
If a stud is there for T, def take him. Outside of that, I think they want to see progression from the guys on the roster – but IMO that’s any position on the roster.
chip kelly raved about a bunch of players today, Ryan Mathews, Rowe, Cox, VINNY Curry, Thurmond and Ertz… He talked about how ERTZ had no offseason, he traveled around the country looking to learn and Improve on his craft to learn from the best….. ERTZ expanded on it a little bit….. This kid picked up the phone and cold called Tony Gonzales, asking him if he could fly out to meet with him.. And of course Tony was gracious enough to host him,, not to mention the other trainers its documented that he went to work on his blocking with… talented kid, with a work ethic chip Raved about.. I don’t know how long it will take, but sooner or later these are the type of kids that end up growing into Greatness…. I’m sure the pope has similar offseason stories…
…
If you want to listen to a good interview Check out the recent malcolm Jenkins one on PE… he spoke openly, answered all questions intelligently. It was really one of the more insiteful interviews you will hear from a player. he even interacted with guys like Moesher and was asking them questions.. MUST LISTEN, and he seems tongenuinly believe that we are a more Talemted team then we were last year. he explained the shady devision well for reporters… Just.one of the better interviews with a player you will hear during the offseason.
…
chip also gave some confidence towards possibly not losing VINNY in free agency. really like hearing the ey chip has spoke about VINNY this offseason..chip made sure to remind everyone how rare and special Cox is…
Well, it was JMatt throwing the extra practice balls to Ertz. No doubt learning how other positions work and/or practicing to be the emergency QB.
Is Tony G teaching Ertz how to block effectively?
Not sure, but he went to work with the Dallas OL coach of that 90s dynasty to learn how to block.. I assume Tony covered some small details of all aspects of playing the position
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/06/17/cowboys-seem-to-be-willing-to-call-dez-bryants-bluff/
hahaha good old cowboys
Kinda wish Kelly had just called Mathis’ bluff the same way…
how about the Phillies letting a positional player throw 43 pitches. Just when I think they have hit bottom, they surprise me again. They need to blow up the whole thing. If they just hire another Amaro clone I am keeping my boycott.
At least we know no one is going to hack the Phillies computer systems. It’s probably an IBM 386SX.
Or
http://theskunkpot.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/WITCH51.jpg
Maybe even older.
http://www.smsglitz.com/uploads/2013/04/Computer-10.jpg
Sometimes I miss 1998. The Internet was a place to learn new stuff but was also somewhat innocent fun. Not so much anymore. For example, Coca Cola’s website promised a new beverage holder when a particular button was activated. That action would cause the CD tray to open! It was possible to download embedded bits of music, and I could totally format my entire hard drive and re-install operating systems and software.Sounds silly now, but there were so few viruses or hackers or general vulgarity. Giant corporations hadn’t taken over all of our brain functions, so we could think for ourselves. Sigh. ;~)
“A bank that is too big to fail is too big to exist, in my opinion.” — Bernie Sanders. No corporation has Bernie
in their pocket. He’s out to bring democracy to the U.S.A.
How is this responsive? Just curious.
MagsMama wrote something to the effect that “giant corporations have taken over our brain functions”, and that is a sentiment that I wholeheartedly endorse. Big corporations, like the NFL , like big pharma, and big oil, and big banks OWN our electoral process, and our 2 party system has given the American people 434 legislators who are content to watch the middle class just wither away. If you have heard a politician give lip service to ANY issue, I invite you to give a listen, if you are so inclined, to Bernie who is a huge underdog in the approaching presidential race. He doesn’t spin anything, he says exactly and specifically what he means to do, and he is beholden to nobody. It is not my intention to alienate any Eagles fans who do not share my perspective, so I make a point to endeavor not to proselytize in this forum. Thank you for the question.
How’s this for big?
http://s3.amazonaws.com/rapgenius/1344354316_BigTymers_cover.jpg
Bernie sanders is an avowed communist. Unhinged indeed…
Avow this. He’s for getting the filthy lucre out of the electoral process and having representatives represent voters – not billionaires and corporations.
I’m on a boycott as well. Or in my case, I just didn’t get the MLB package this year.
Watching the Phillies now is like when you first learn a video game and the computer kicks your ass. It’s not really that much fun -but it’s kinda fun just to see how badly a team can get beaten.
Computers are for nerds! Frenchy’s got grit, you don’t see that on the back of no baseball card!
sure sounds like MS2 is making a case for himself in practice right now.
who woulda thunk it?
I would have. He obviously has the athleticism. He should look good in no-pad practices. The question is does he have the strenght/mentality to succeed physically once pads go on.
Let’s hope the 20 lbs of muscle turns into that strength he needs.
He will be fine.. He will get to where we need him to be as a pro. he should be a real nice, well rounded OLB by his 3rd or 4th season but I do expect him to make some plays for us this season.. Coach McGovern does a fantastic job with our OLBs and not only has Barwin and BG really seem to be taking the kid under their wing and are helping to grow him, but even hall of fame Jason Peters takes the time to work with him which is just a friggin fantastic resources for a kid trying to make a living off battling with Offensive Tackles,,,when a kid the city was down on comes back the next year with an added 20 lbs of muscle, that says something to guys like Barwin and Peters,,, having felt the wrath of a philly fan and fight his way out of that “Bust” label, Brandon Graham is a great player for MS2 to play behind. Fought thru a bust label, change of scheme and position and played his way into an extension.. One thing about Brandon Graham, that kid had to REALLY EARN a starting spot in this league. MS2 couldn’t play behind a better guy.
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Barwin talked about his past, he was really referring to backup Guards getting a chance to step up but it also applies to MS2. “I was a backup, behind Mario Williams and was playing mostly special teams. Mario Williams got hurt, I was presented with an opportunity and I had 11 sacks. That’s what this league is about, put n the work and be ready when your opportunity comes”-Barwin
yup, seeing him shed blockers will only come once the pads are on as well as tackling instinct and angles. I think his cover skills and speed were his positives coming in
He needed to work on his technique bad. He was overly reliant on his athleticism in college for success. He really just needs to learn how to anchor to hold an edge and shed blocks to make a play (which is more about leverage and technique than strength) along with improve his arsenal of pass rush moves more than anything. The extra weight and strength will help, but the dude needs this off season so badly to take it to the next level. He was just way too raw last year, then lost his confidence and from there the season was a wash.
eagles lookin good in June
Have you noticed the daily ACL or Achilles injuries around the NFL this offseason? damn right we looking good in June! Every day we get in good work while remaining healthy is a damn good day..,. let’s get this group to September Healthy and that’s like a quarter of the battle…
it’s henry josey season.
Me!
Love hearing that, I Was happy when we drafted him and can’t wait to see him shine. Where did you see this info?
just reading the practice updates on BGN and Phillymag.
cool, thanks
it’s a little soon but i’m starting to feel ready to call out the suddenly-missing “MSII is a bust” crowd. they’re melting away as fast as they did after BG started to contribute
I don’t think it’s fair to call anyone a bust after their rookie year, but similalry it’s not smart to be thinking of calling people out for doubting a guy who has yet to make a tackle in the NFL.
It’s June. The time of year when folks get excited about Basketts and Joseys.
thinking of calling out is fine. i’m not calling out yet.
Agreed in both directions. If Smith was taken at the end of the 2nd round we wouldn’t even be that worked up over it. I loved the guy going into the draft and hope to see him progress.
Yep. Don’t think we got good value at 26 but I still think there’s a decent chance he becomes a good player, and it’s not like he chose where to be drafted so no point hating on him for it.
If he works out, great. If not, the mature thing to do is blame Howie or caseymatthews or Henery or whatever and move on.
Blame Chip, but I get your point.
I still think he’s going to be good though, so hopefully at the end of the year he has 8 sacks and we’re not blaming anybody.
caseymatthews is due another 12 months of hate at least. If it goes wrong with MSII I’m blaming him regardless.
Those people were bad enough, but, it’s the folks who were calling a rookie ‘bust’ after 6 games were really tiresome.
You mean – they are disappearing faster than the people jumping on the MSII bandwagon….
oh it’s a bandwagon now? cautious optimism about a player’s second season (which has always been understood to be the point where the most improvement can happen) is a bandwagon? for the record, my position last season was that we don’t know what MSII is going to become. i wasn’t calling him a future star or a bust. just another rookie who will hopefully improve over time.
:). It’s always a bandwagon(either for or against). Those on either side, jump to the other side. We are fickle fans….
Damn, Weddle really publically put the Chargers on Blast!
..
jason Pierre Paul hasnt practiced with the Giants yet
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Dez is threatening to sit out of regular season games,.
..
how bout that culture?
they shall be released
Any day now, any day now…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l22dGvbyYs8
Thanks. There’s no faking that kind of soul.
oh man
The Chargers are telling all you need to know about Weddle/Sehorn via this contract negotiation.
Did you hear what Weddle said to the media? I know how much you love him, figured you would get a kick out of his little speech
Indeed.
If one Of chips players tries that, you would see chip crash the press conference and announce that Weddle as been cut before he could even finish his statememt
..
We could be in a good position with our safety troubles. let’s say none of our young safeties win ownership of the safety spot and Thurmond plays safety all year and does a solid job. We could choose to bring him back in that safety role again Next year, but it gives us leverage in that if Boykin ends up walking (which I’m not ready to assume), we could have Thurmond replace Boykin easily and then we would end up with an opening at safety again… Well Next offseason could be a good year for us to need a safety.
..
how Landon Collins is a Horribke fit for our defense, there are two Safeties in the NFL who would be DREAM,fits for our defense and it looks like both will play out the last year on their deal without An extension. THis means we have two chances for one of these kids to turn down the extension he is being offered after the season and end up reaching Free agency, We were aggressive trying to sign McCourty, but that Patrios ring made it hard to compete with them…. Well The Bengals don’t have any great Superbowk ring to entice George Illoka into not leaving them for Philly, and if Tashun Gipson turns down our money because he doesn’t want to leave friggin Cleveland, we should just off ourselves in shame…
.,
George Illoka and Tashuan Gipson don’t have these big names that will impress our average fans and even some media, but they are both probably easily top 5 safeties in coverage..the type of S/CB hybrids our scheme loves.. I know Gipson is a high character, well respected captain type out of Wyoming. I’m not sure what the reputation of Illokas Charecter is, but he is a tall, Long, safety who if I’m not mistaken was rated the #1 Safety in coverage next year…
..
so If some team is crazy enough to offer 5’9 boykin, quality outside starter money when they don’t have more then 5 plays on tape of Boykin playing outside in 4 years, then God Bless him, next man up, Move Thurmond back to Nickel, sigń one of the young stud cover safeties away from Bengals/Browns amd we are finally Talking about what could truely be an ELITE SECONDARY ready to match our insane front 7.. This secondary would take us to top 5 defensive status!:
..
Byron Maxwell….Jenkins…..Illoka/Gipson……Rowe
Boykin/Nolan or Thurmond/Nolan in Nickel and Dime..
..
That’s a secondary that we can really go to war with…
Dez’s situation, although funny as hell, is somewhat different I think. He doesn’t want to play for the tag and Dallas isn’t being realistic about his value. Dez, at the same point in his career, has the same numbers as Megatron going into his 2nd deal. Dallas can claim “different rookie contract and CBA” all they’d like, but Dez shouldn’t take a penny less than $15 mil a year.
If I were him, I’d bet on myself and play for the $13 this year, $15.6 next year, and possibly the $18.72 in 2017 before hitting the market at 28 years old, free and clear of Dallas, and working under a $165-$170 million salary cap.
Dallas needs to bite the bullet and give him the Megatron deal.
I can see both sides in the Dez thing. Can’t doubt his talent, but he’s bat-shizzy crazy, so I can understand the team wanting clauses in there about behaviour etc.
Also, not many contenders make a habit of tying up cap $s at WR. That Megatron deal is crazy.
I agree that the $ in the Megatron deal is nuts, but it’s market. You’re 100% correct that Dallas needs to build some protections in there =for behavioral transgressions from Dez, but teams have been beating the butts of players in court for quite some time on recouping bonus money as a result of naughty behavior. I just think it behooves Dallas to write up a 6 year / $90 mil right now and plan accordingly for the impact of that contract. The cap isn’t going to stop jumping up each year, so the earlier the better when it comes to getting these deals done.
I can see that Megatron deal becoming the market in a few years but right now it still seems insane. He’s on Peyton Manning money. He’s a Riley Cooper contract away from Aaron Rodgers money!!
I mean, he’s good and all, but if Chad Henne were throwing him the ball he wouldn’t be worth much of anything.
6 @ 90m sounds a bit rich but not far off. Be surprised if they aren’t close on money, but far apart on get out clauses for the team if Dez goes nuts (or Schefter ever gets to finish that story he’s been working on since September).
Maybe I’m listening to the wrong people, but from what the dudes on Sirius are reporting the “far apart” is cash not clauses.
Ah, fair enough. Probably a case of team leaking one thing, agent leaking another.
I still say all of us should set up Twitter accounts as ‘allas fans and tweet support to Dez in his quest for $$$s. Anything we can do to make this as ugly as possible needs to be done.
they already gave romo the megatron deal
While what you say is true,, you are leaving out a possible key factor.. Dez has kept his nose pretty clean, but to achieve that Jerry Jones has babysitters, handlers, whatever you want to call it. While it seems Dez has cleaned himself up,,the Cowboys may be aware of all types of worrisome ability that they have been able to cover Up until now, but still give them concern about how he might act in the,future… If he was really squeaky clean as it seems the past 3 years, would he still have those babysitters two and three years later?…
..
Just speculating of course…
Sal Pal has really soured on the Eagles in one year. What happened? He and Mikey Miss seem to think CK is Darth Vader, and that his ego gets bruised too easily.
thank goodness I dont have to listen to the Philly locals per leaving the state. Sal Pal gave my buddy the “do you know who I am” card when he was working the field for a game. Nothing worse
Your buddy should have replied “Sure I know who you are. A prick who hasn’t been relevant since 1998.”
Sal Pal is easily readable. New regime, he sucks up for a while trying to gain the access he had with the mid-90s Eagles. Then once he doesn’t get it, all of a sudden he’s a ripper. Now of course there are things that legitimately should be ripped on, but that’s not Palantonio’s game. Don’t feed me info so I can be known as the go to guy for Eagles news, well then I’ll still get my radio air time by being purposefully controversial. Happened with the Reid regime, now happening with Kelly.
sal is no pal
vengeful prick
He really seems to hate Chip… Did infer isn’t a chip fan either
Sal Pal is the worst. 3rd hand news and no analysis.
Anal Piano Stool
Best way to guarantee ratings: Get people fired up about what you say. Steve A. Smith and Skip Bayless mastered the art of the professional troll… Sal Pal is on their level, just not quite as notorious.
I am beginning to believe that Chip’s emphasis on character is less of a moral requisite than a fiscal one. Chip loves self-motivators and committed, humble work horses, and these are typically folks for whom monetary reward may not be as big a motivation as pride and stature. Money is certainly a measure of success, and I don’t for a second mean to imply that Chip wants to get off cheap, but he strikes me as being very focused on the team economy. He wants no position to eat up too much revenue, and he works like no HC I have ever seen to closely scrutinize every player he recruits into his fold so that his back-ups are “wired right” just like his starters. Joe Banner may have been the cap czar, but Chip, I think, is taking his money management goals to the playing field. He’s finding the personalities that want to be part of something special, that will accept their rookie contracts as “appropriate”, and almost certainly not rock the boat, which will make structuring the team fiscally much less of a challenge. When Kelly says he wants players who put the team before themselves, he’s cleverly preempting potential headaches, which in turn will allow him to spend more time doing what he clearly loves.
It is certainly an interesting approach. We’re going to have a fun time analyzing it over the next few years as this team progresses, treads water, or regresses.
that makes sense.
I sure like having a team with a bunch guys that are fun to rot for, and fun to watch succeed.
It was never a morality play.
So true, but “character” is a morally-weighted term as is “humble” and “committed”. One could be forgiven for concluding that Chip Kelly is on a crusade on behalf of all that are righteous.
Kelly and the other professional athletes on the team should have one goal. Win. Total commitment and extra hard work have always been praised as stepping stones to victory.
unhinged – Your observations jive with mine and with those who know Chip well. I suspect there he has a value equation that includes those parameters outlined by Mano plus a weighting based on overall D dollar allocation and O allocation.
Fans and pundits tend to oversimplify personnel decisions by Chip. It isn’t all about culture or personality. Sometimes the value proposition just does not pen out for the player.
Interesting take… and hard to argue with. I would say, at this stage of the game, that Chip’s approach is more than defensible – they’re not challenging for a SB at this point, so why not double down on culture and process?
Compromising on this front is inevitable, however – it’s darn near impossible to put together a championship team (in any sport) without a few divas. We’ll see in the next couple years how far Chip is willing to take this approach, and under what circumstances he’s willing to compromise (if any!).
“it’s darn near impossible to put together a championship team (in any sport) without a few divas”.
For me “diva” is almost totally pejorative, but I get your point. Maxwell may be demonstrative with swagger, Cary was a bit, and I could even see Jordan Matthews talking some smack. Did you catch the miked sideline in last year’s game against the Texans? “88 (JJ Watt), why you taking a knee, 88?”
I can’t think of one diva on San Antonio Spurs since Greg P. has been there. Of course when you have a Tim Duncan (world class AND low key) divas don’t seem so necessary.
so why have they spent up to cap for the 1st time since forever?
I wasn’t suggesting that Kelly wants a Lombardi trophy on the cheap. Cap management isn’t simply about always having capital in reserve. A tougher nut to crack, it seems to me, is achieving some semblance of balance among positions and units, while still striving for excellence in performance. The emphasis on character can help target over-achievers who will outwork the opposition without necessarily announcing individual superiority. As an example, DeSean, Shady and Sanchez all had career seasons playing for Chip, and close observation would explain that by something more than simply “player superiority”. But I’m not offering this as an unqualified factor. When looking at Fletcher Cox, he ticks the character and hard worker boxes, but his dominance in the trenches is more than simply over-achievement, imo. Chip is going to have to pony up big money to retain Cox’s services I think, but he should be in a position to do that because he’s maintaining a degree of revenue balance across the team.
Not to subject change too badly, but is anybody else enjoying the Women’s World Cup as much as I am? I needed a refuge from the Phillies poor play and that turd Iguodala.
I wish more women’s sports would play under the same rules/conditions as the men’s because I really do enjoy women’s soccer a lot.
Rapinoe > Wenger
Klingenberg > Fabinho
Morgan > anything
Not a huge fan of Klingons. Warf is the obvious exception. Ferrengi are the worst though.
I tried to watch the Nigeria game but the feed on my Xfinity was so awful it was unwatchable.
So is that team’s level of organization. They’re also a bunch of cheap shot artists. US was lucky to get out of the game without anybody injured.
The game was played in Vancouver. Something like 40,000 people in attendance. Many Americans drove or flew up. Some were interviewed on local TV. Quite a few from the West Coast , but others from all over. Thank you for the tourist dollars,. ;~). Actually Vancouver is the starting point for all those Alaska cruises, 4 or 5 sailings per week. Plus many TV shows and movies are shot here, so we are used to tourists and “celebrities”. In fact, the Peace Arch border crossing has up to 12 million vehicles a year going back and forth. That doesn’t count the truck traffic, which has it’s own crossing. We tend of think of each other as neighbours on this coast, frequently shopping or attending rock concerts in each others’ countries. It’s not publicized in the U.S., but Boeing flies new aircraft up to Vancouver to deliver to the airlines. It somehow saves taxes.
It’s legit, and they don’t fake injuries to draw fouls, it actually makes the sport enjoyable.
The Eagles should offer Mathis a one year deal for 3-4 million
why not?
The Eagles will not give any more money or time to someone who so publicly disrespected the head Coach. Get real.
Revenge is a dish best served cold.
Not to drink the kool-aid or whatever it is.. The new guys stepping in are big question marks.. See alot of people saying Eagles will be fine n saying Mathis wasnt that good or a fit.. The guys that are now playing G are not on Mathis level.. Him being cut to me is just Chip wanting players who all want to be there.. Voluntary or mandatory he wants you there.. Last year the backup OL was getting schooled.. Molk pushed back like he was a kid.. Talking it up i think coz we all fans of the Eagles
I thought it was interesting that Chip—in regards to Evan saying he hadn’t recently asked for a release—said they were in constant contact with Evans agent. If you read between the lines, maybe Chip was saying: Evan, you need a new agent. He did you dirty.
Yeah man that agent tryna squeeze some money out for his client had the opposite effect n they just cut him
Ironically the new agent only would have been paid had Evan signed a new deal.
Bold out of nowhere statements due to boredom
Ryan Mathews could end up as the main back while Murray is the change of pace back.
Tobin will be the LG and Barbre will be the RG
Watkins will be the #3 outside CB and Thurmond the #4 CB
Couplin and Reynolds will make the roster, Wolff won’t
Curry will get another 10 sacks this season
Hart will still ride the bench for another year
We’ll carry 6 WRs. Agholor, Matthews, Cooper, Austin, Huff, Davis. Practice squad WR would be Harris.
Demeco might be part of the cut down from 90 if Hicks plays well in pre-season
Eric Tomlinson might make the roster as a blocker and ST player
Bold, dude, bold…except I highly doubt DeMeco will get cut from the team. He just got a contract extension, too.
I thought Thurmond was our 1 candidate for safety right now
He is right now but things can drastically change in a few months.
You think Tutu won’t make the team? That’s bold alright.
Yup. I think the young buck UDFAs will outplay him for a roster spot.
I feel sorry for Mathis allowing himself to be a tool for Rosenhaus.
Can anyone like D3FB tell me why if Barbre is good enough to start for us this is his 8th season and he only has about 7 starts? I am not denying he can be a good starter, I just want to be told something to make me feel better about this.
He has a lot of tread left on the tires?
Which is convenient because I’m sure it turns out that guards in this scheme are nothing but stacks of tires for our awesome center and tackles to maneuver around. Keep an eye on trash can, he’s out to compete, it a very trash can friendly scheme I’m told.
http://iheartinspiration.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Calm-you-shall-keep-and-carry-on-you-must-yes-hmmmm.jpg
As a side note, @D3FB:disqus had mentioned that he had 75(?) snaps last year. But I’m sure he has some more info about some other snaps he’s had. I’m Googling now to see if I can find any All-22s that mention Barbre.
Mathis was a 3rd round pick
Barbre was a 4th round pick
Mathis started 22 games before coming to the Eagles
Barbre started 7 games before coming to the Eagles
Both were journeymen players before landing with the Eagles.
Last one, I promise! 🙂
You’ll have to wait on analysis from D3FB, but here’s what I was able to find searching the Internets.
Here is Barbre downfield blocking a defensive back in 2013:
http://www.phillymag.com/birds247/2013/11/12/22-mccoy-run-game-get-track/
Evan Mathis last year saying Barbre is a starting caliber G in the league (foreshadowing?):
http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2013/7/16/4526486/bgn-exclusive-eagles-q-a-with-evan-mathis
Jimmy Kempski’s film breakdown of Barbre last year when he filled in for Johnson:
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/sports/eagles/Film-breakdown-Can-the-Eagles-survive-with-Allen-Barbre-at-RT-for-four-weeks.html