Lowered Expectations
Posted: May 21st, 2016 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 79 Comments »Look what Jeff Lurie had to say about the Eagles.
“I encourage people to keep low expectations.”
Wait. What? Why haven’t we heard more about that quote? Mainly because it is from the summer of 1999. The Eagles were coming off a 3-13 season. They hired some guy named Andy Reid to be coach. He had never even been a coordinator at the NFL level and was now running a team.
The Eagles had brought in Doug Pederson, Charles Johnson and Torrance Small…to improve their offense. I repeat, to improve their offense. Read that sentence a few times and then let it sink in.
ESPN had the Eagles dead last in their Power Rankings.
| 31. Eagles (3-13) | And you thought Eagles fans were booing loudly on draft day. |
Zing!!!
(Why only 31st? The Texans didn’t exist yet.)
I stumbled across these goodies while doing some research for a piece comparing the 1999 Eagles and the 2016 team. Needless to say, I think the current group is a bit more talented.
Remember Sean Salisbury, the lousy football analyst for ESPN? He offered some brilliant insight into the 1999 team.
The Eagles are three to five years away from really doing anything. They just simply have too many holes.
I played with Doug Pederson in Miami, and I like him as a player. But to ask him to go from being a third-team quarterback his whole career to being a starter is too big a jump. Pederson has not played well in the preseason, and Donovan McNabb is not picking up the offense as quickly. I just don’t see what they’re going to be able to rely on offensively.
A reasonable goal for them right now is to try to develop McNabb. Young teams that aren’t going to compete for titles must try to develop their quarterbacks. Some people say not to throw the quarterback in too early — if they struggle a lot, they’ll lose their confidence. Well, if a QB loses his confidence, he shouldn’t be playing anyway. They shouldn’t coddle McNabb and should just work on getting him ready.
He actually got paid for that nonsense? Crazy.
I’m going to write a post on the predictions for this Eagles team, but it was fun to look back and see the thoughts on the past, knowing how that would turn out.
Football is the ultimate team game. You never know just how much of a difference coaching and togetherness can mean in this sport. The NBA is all about talent. The NFL is different. You can’t just throw together a bunch of good individuals and have them win. They need to play well together. And they need to be led by a strong head coach and good coaching staff.
Pederson is a huge X-factor for this team. I don’t know what to make of him. I hope he’s going to be good, but you really don’t know with a first time coach like him. There’s just not enough of a track record to make a strong prediction. I do think he’s done a good job to this point so that’s encouraging.
The first test for any coach is how you handle your own business. The Eagles have a couple of contract issues right now, but Pederson has handled them the right way. Chip Kelly seemed to take things personally. For some reason, he just couldn’t resist saying something inflammatory.
Pederson learned from Big Red. Let the players say whatever they want. Protect them from the media and then talk to them behind closed doors. That earned tremendous loyalty for Reid and Pederson being a former player knows just how much that can mean to players.
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[…] Tommy Lawlor Look what Jeff Lurie had to say about the Eagles. “I encourage people to keep low […]
Chip always seemed to have a (pardon the pun) chip in his shoulder, didn’t he? With players, the media, everyone. As smart s guy as he was, he had huge blind sides with certain things.
I’m with you, who knows what kind of coach Pederson is going to be. But he is authentic at least, which is refreshing. He doesn’t give the vibe that’s he’s in over his head to me at least. We shall see what develops.
After Chip left, this became more clear.
And about Pederson, we have a lot of unknown and I’m starting to think he doesn’t know how to command hard when required.
But seems to be a player’s coach.
There is no way to know much by now.
What leads you to believe that a guy who with two decades of NFL experience DOESNT know “how to command hard” and drop the Hammer when required?
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When has he łet you down in that regard to date? Has there even been a situation yet during involuntary OTAs that called for him “dropping the hammer” on a Player?
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After all his years around Andy, we may not even get to see that side of Doug too often. If you listen to any of the former players from the andy Reid golden years teams they all loved andy but claim that he knew when to kick a playërs ass, it’s just that he strongly believe in keeping that in house, and to take bullets for players in Front of the media. Is that the right or wrong way of going about things? Probably neither. Different coaches have different styles that we have seen succeed… Andy DIDNT rip playërs in the media, and in THIS CITY, that may be a smart way to go about it, knowing that the media and fans will do plenty of “ripping” on their own, no need for andy to pile on and throw gasoline on the fire. Heck we Rip playërs even when they don’t deserve it. For example the ignorance of wanting to replace Logan after a playoff loss to the saints in his rookie season.. Two years later he is beloved in this city
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But we have different coaching styles succeed.. Parcells loved to publically rip playërs and throw them under the bus as a motivational tool.. I remember when he coached the Cowboys, he used to refer to Terry Glenn as a “She” to the media insinuating a lack of toughness… We also see a guy with that Quiet fire like a Todd Bowles who doesn’t have to scream and flip out yet he still produces Discaplined well coached teams.
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Think more important than specific coaching style is to make sure you stay true to yourself and not try to fake it, trying to be something you are not. If Todd Bowles all of the sudden shows up to training camp this year flipping out and trying to act like his former mentor Parcells, it probably wouldn’t play well in the locker room because it obviously contradicts who he really is.
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Doug needs to just be himself, faking it won’t work. We will be able to tell his if his players coach style is successful by seeing the product on the field. Will we play as a Discaplined well coached unit? Or will we look like a bunch of undisciplined idiots who can’t get out of our own way like the Bills team Rex brought to philly last year? Rex Ryan tries to be a playërs coach, all the bills playërs raved about him, and then the walked all over him with their Undiscaplined play on the field.. The product on the field will tell the real story of whether or not Pedersons coaching style is effective
Sorry, I didn’t express myself well.
Considering all the things that I read and heard about him, I got that impression on him.
We still don’t know for sure what happened on the D-Jax cut. And that is the type of situations that I can’t antecipate how Doug will handle.
Even with this Bradford holdout (can we call it holdout right?) I have the feeling some lack of communication from him at the beginning. Maybe I’m wrong.
And you are right, we only know something concrete about Chip now. Who knows when we will know Doug better?
Maybe Chip lost confidence in himself or the team (he built). The mad scientist just never came out of the lab. I do think he is a smart guy. If he makes the same mistakes again, I’m going to have to change my mind about that.
I think he will figure it out.
So The Browns were already better than us before even playing a single game in “franchise history”!
How they ever lost a game with Tim Crotch at QB is beyond me………
What a great draft to reboot a franchise
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 1 Tim Couch QB Kentucky
2 32 Kevin Johnson WR Syracuse
2 45 Rahim Abdullah OLB Clemson
3 62 Daylon McCutcheon CB USC
3 76 Marquis Smith DB California
4 124 Wali Rainer MLB Virginia
5 148 Darrin Chiaverini WR Colorado
6 174 Marcus Spriggs DT Troy State
6 187 Kendall Ogle LB Maryland
6 191 James Dearth TE Tarleton State
7 207 Madre Hill RB Arkansas
Well played, Mr. Lawlor. Had me hook, line and sinker with that opening quote.
Its easy to forget that Pederson actually has faaaaar more NFL experience than Kelly did. He has not only coached there for years now he had a long career as a player. I would think this puts him light years ahead of Kelly in terms ability to deal with the contract issues and really any locker room issue. I think the guys will love him. All former player coaches seem pretty beloved.
As far as low expectations. Can’t really bring myself to do that.
Salisbury wasn’t really all that far off was he? I actually like him.
Not a Salisbury fan. Way too much fake tough guy in his commentary on things.
But agree on Pederson having a better knowledge on how to manage NFL players.
Plus Jim Schwartz >>>>>>>> Billy Davis
4-3 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3-4
Salisbury was The original Heath
Evans thought Kelly’s up tempo system would not work in NFL He had a low opinion of Kelly in general, this year he has been much more positive about the Eagles. He was very high on drafting Wentz. Now I am going to was my mouth out with soap for saying anything good about a guy I still feel is a douche.
I know, he has really been a lot more tolerable this year. Im sure part of it is because he isnt ripping our team every singke day any more. But even when he is ripping us, like the Bradford incident, it’s tough to really hate on him for anything he has said this offseason, and im sure the way Chip era crashed and burned somewhat Vindicated him… Im comparing Salisbury to Heath in the typical “ODOYLE Rules(billy Madison)” jock persona
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But it certainly doesn’t get much worse than Salisbury. I can’t even remember the last time I saw him, he seems to have really fallen off the face of the Earth..
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NFL Network hosts are so bad, if we are being honest Heath ISNT as bad these days compared to some of the dopes employed by NFL network… Guys like Lavar Arrington and Warren Sapp I find to be unbearable… But there are some guys who are tolerable like a Willie McGinnist or Eric Davis
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Shame that Showtimes inside The NFL is nosediving going the NFL network route. Half the time it’s so unprofessional the last two years, often you can’t even hear what’s going on because there is a host trying to talk over 4 former players laughing, hootin and Hollaring… Inside the NFL is getting worse and worse
The uptempo did work, that’s the thing.
http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/eagles-coach-chip-kelly-fired/
Yup, we had the fastest 3 and outs in the league!
I really didn’t really like him at ESPN either. I like him more now. He is a regular call-in guy for a local radio show, so I followed him at his new spot some. He actually cried on air after Jr. Seau died. As lame as it is that might be why… thats real tough guy.
Right you are regarding Pederson’s experience. I’ll bet he understands the nature of an NFL roster and lockeroom a ton better than Kelly.
Forgot who it was but one of our young players was talking about how he was asking Jason Peters about the coaching hire and Jason was high on Pederson talking above how he learned everything from Andy who Peters adores and always credits him for jail breaking him out of Buffalo… With strong veterans like JP and Kelce in his corner, Dougie should be fine.
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Probably DOESNT hurt that there are a couple Eagles who were on the team when Pederson was the QB coach.
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Dougie should be fine in his handling of playërs. It probably helps him that playërs were used to chip who Wasnt the most liked coach on a human level.. Handling the media was probably one of the,bigger adjustments he had in front of him, and if you check out his recent press confrences, it’s crystal clear that he has already come a long way and is looking much more comfortable in his interactions with the media
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Sucks that we will never really know where Doug stood on Lurie’s coaching wish list, not that it really matters…. There were coaches I thought I would have preffered like a Hue Jackson, two momths later im thrilled that Hue is not our coach.. “FIT” also probably factors into who the,right man for the job is, and so far there is a lot to like about how Pederson is handling himself. Think it’s a promising sigń to see just how well Pederson has handled the Bradford situation. Im impressed.
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Can’t even imagine what life would be like with Chip Kelly right now having to deal with the Bradford/Condon Power play, SPROLES staying away til June, and Fletcher Cox not taking the coaches phone calls… Be fun to take a peak into an alternate universe and see how chip would have handled this offseason.
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Funny to see chip in San Fran. The media keeps asking him about how he has changed since Philly, and what he has learned.. And Chip keeps insisting that he hasn’t chamged anything and the media can ask the coaches he brought to San Fran from Philly and that they can attest to chip not having made any changes lol… Im Not sure Chip realizes that everyone isn’t looking at him NOT changing anything as a “Good Thing”
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Wonder how long until a veteran WR like Torrey Smith realizes how Incompetant Bicknell is and starts asking for his way out of San Fran,,, Azzinaro is legit, but Bicknell is atrocious, And I have a feeling that the results Greg Lewis gets from the young Wr is going to make Bicknell look really bad
Not to be disrespectful Tumtum but Salisbury was a douchebag. But I may like him slightly better than ESP…maybe.
Hey, its not disrespectful to me! You are entitled to your opinion of course. I think his post ESPN career has humbled him some and he is pretty entertaining to me these days. Maybe it is my dislike for the current crop of national guys.
Overall I hate the current state of the ESPN sports media, and the effect they have on everyone else. Really hard to follow anything nationally for me anymore.
Absolutely agree with that. ESPN is to sports news as the National Inquire is to regular news.
“You can’t just throw together a bunch of good individuals and have them win.”
Broncos did that and they’ve been in the playoffs ever since. Jaguars are doing this right now too but the results aren’t in yet for them.
“…They need to play well together. And they need to be led by a strong head coach and good coaching staff.”
It’s same in all sports really.
That goes for any type of group activity in life. The other comment regarding just throwing players together is more specific to the NFL. You can throw players together in Basketball and to a lesser extent Baseball and find success.
Doesn’t work in basketball without chemistry.
Yeah,you don’t win championships without chemistry in any team sport. Even when Shaq and Kobe relationship started to sour they still had geat chemistry on the court and were able to win, and then we saw how important chemistry is when their relationship reached the point of no return and they got Embarressed in the finals by the Pistons.
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The Warriors have loads of Talent, but they wouldn’t be as special if they didn’t have tremendous chemistry, team filled with guys who check their ego at the door, and make all sorts of individual Sacrafice for the good of that team…. That doesn’t happen without chemistry
Chemistry is a little overrated, I think. Basketball is the most obvious counter with all the super-teams. Still, it counts for something–the Spurs have always achieved due to what the fans call “corporate knowledge”. A lot of it was based on Duncan being the most unselfish superstar ever.
Bronco’s also drafted extremely well and the best of those players were home grown, unlike what we tried to do in 2011, 2015, and other teams have done for years. Think Dan Snyder and the Redskins not too long ago.
That’s also true but you don’t get a stud team without shelling out a ton of money for these great players at the time they signed them.
Peyton Manning (HoF QB)
Aqib Talib (elite CB)
TJ Ward (top tier safety)
Demarcus Ware (elite pass rusher)
Emmanuel Sanders (a low-end #1 WR)
Terrance Knighton (stud NT)
While those players you listed are all very good players, nearly half of them were not on the Broncos team when they won a SB.
Talib, Ward, and Knighton were on different teams when the Broncos won it all. I may be incorrect but I believe that those 3 players were replaced by players that the Broncos drafted.
While Peyton did cost a lot he really didn’t get that team to the SB this past year. It actually goes to show that you shouldn’t pay an aging player a ridiculous amount of money regardless of the position.
You absolutely need to spend money to be a good team, however you do that to fix holes or to put you over the top, not to build your team. The draft is the backbone of NFL success.
It has been shown year in and year out that the more money you spend in FA doesn’t mean more success, it can actually be the opposite. The Giants will fall victim to that this upcoming season.
Teams that draft well, and build their teams through the draft are usually the best teams and Denver is an example of that.
I was talking about a span of 4 years instead of when they won it all this year. Peyton made them perennial SB contenders. With additions of high level talent every year, they just continued to be a stacked team despite them only winning one Super Bowl in that short window.
The Broncos have hit home runs with most of their first round picks this decade. That being said,, they are about average with drafting guys outside of the first two rounds. Although some of the later round guys like Malik Jackson, Julius Thomas, and Danny Trevathan exceeded expectations and were major contributors. What they lacked in depth, they made up with getting guys that that are top 5 at their position.
There is no single simple recipe for success. Most of the Broncos depth chart are veterans from other teams and recent prospects from within the last 3 years. The Broncos did a mix of drafting well and hiring mercenaries that wanted a ring.
That being said, the Jaguars are taking a similar approach so there’s another example to keep an eye on.
I don’t think the Giants fail this year just because they overpaid for vernon and Jenkins (as much as I hate to admit). Will they live up to their contracts? I hope not but that’s the price you pay to try to make to try to get over the hump. Eli is not getting younger, OBJ is locked in for another few years and the NFCE is wide open. Their OL is going to get destroyed by everyone though so they still suck.
All 3 are still in broncos
I don’t know what I was thinking. You are right in that Talib and Ward were with them last year but Knighton was with the Skins.
Talib and Ward were on the broncos last season
Yeah, idk what I was thinking.
Are the Patriots really in different when they won last year?
A guy like Revis got them over the top, guys like Amendola and Welker helped shape that offense.
Hell Green Bay who “never” spends in FA, had to get first Reggie White and then Charles Woodson to get them their Super Bowls.
The Eagles also mixed great drafting with big FAs when we were good (Runyan as highest paid tackle, Kearse, TO)
Kearse should be in jail for theft. F him. Dude took a ton of money and provided squat.
In 64 games the Eagles played in his time here, he “contributed”
22 sacks, 39 starts, and 45 games “played.”
All from an 8 year / $66 million contract.
What a bum.
I remember the excitement when we signed him. He was a huge disappointment. If your figures are right, he got paid $3 million/ sack.
He was paid just under $30 million for 4 years, so about $1.3 million/sack.
The injury is what got him. He had 7.5 sacks his first year, 7.5 his second, then 3.5 in just two games before shredding his knee in 2006. After that he wasn’t the same. He never saw the second half of that contract, which was not guaranteed. But he filled his part of the bargain as far as I was concerned.
If I remember correctly, there was concern he didn’t live up to his potential because his off-season was spent in major partying. I think he lived somewhere in Florida and was known for lavish parties on his yacht. He was single, rich and handsome, with a passion for the ladies. The problem was he showed up at camp lean and relaxed, built like a womanizer rather than a tough-as-nails D end.
I am reluctant to throw stones because if I was his age with his resources, my parties probably would have been even more outlandish. I can still argue, though, his time with the Eagles could have been more successful if he was more focused and dedicated to football.
Yeah, that was probably part of it, 2005 at least. In 2006 he looked great in preseason if memory serves, and it carried over to the start of the regular season, where he along with the rest of the DL was dominant. And so the injury probably prevented him from erasing that perception. Post-injury he wasn’t the same.
My memory is probably somewhat jaded as I was so psyched when we got “The Freak.” Plus, I’m probably jealous of the yacht.
Add Stacy Andrews to the All time Theif team..
You mean Shawn.
He played great his first year. He was the focus point for other OLs but it really opened up stuff for the rest of our DL.
2005… not as good although stats were OKish. But that was McNabb injury and the Owens soap opera, and kind of a lost year overall.
2006… he started out playing fantastic. Then came the first time I really second-guessed Reid… we were pounding the Giants, but then a series of bad mistakes let the Giants back in the game (when it should have been impossible), and the Eagles lost in overtime. The worst part though, is that Kearse shredded his knee in overtime. An overtime which never should have happened. He wasn’t the same in 2007, and ended up getting released after that. The contract ended up being 4 years, and just under 30 million.
I know you basically blame guys emotionally when they get hurt, but it isn’t right — we got what we paid for in Kearse until that injury. We blew a 17-point lead in the 4th quarter — that game should have been over and that injury should never have happened. He had 3.5 sacks the first two games and likely would have had a monster year. Instead, you have a gut reaction of “bum” when you think of his name — I still remember that overtime instead, and think he was great until that point.
I appreciate the context of his injury (that game was so brutal for a variety of reasons), but his tenure here never provided the value it needed to.
I can’t agree with “great” in 2004 considering how any type of pass rush on Brady in the Super Bowl might have turned that game in our favor.
Kinda sucks when the Patriots probably knew the defensive calls. He was a big part of getting to that game though.
All of those guys, except Talib, gave Denver the luxury of signing below market contracts.
Von Miller
Demarius Thomas
Derek Wolfe
Malik Jackson
Sylvester Williams
Chris Harris
Bradley Roby
Danny Trevatham
Brandon Marshall
Shane Ray
Shaq Barret
CJ Anderson
Ronnie Hillman
Already addressed this down below.
Baseball does that model a lot…
2011 ring a bell?
While I get what Lurie was saying, it just sounds unusual to hear and a direct 180 from the norm.
That’s probably a message most don’t want to hear….
Lol, when you first see it then that is 100% what you think. When you think about it in context it makes sense, and he was simply just being honest.
In other words what they can be translated as is, “hope for the best, but be realistic and prepare for the worst.”
That ’99 Eagles team was actually semi-interesting to play with in Madden 2000 although it was the McNabb show on offense. Not much else besides Lewis because Staley was too slow in that game to really do anything.
Played some classic drunk late-night match ups of Bills-Eagles with one of my friends who was from Buffalo. Flutie vs. McNabb and two solid defenses although the Bills had the notably better defense that year and in Madden.
Shame that team still didn’t include Ricky Watters.
What are you talking about, I won the rushing title every time. Deuce! Deuce!
He had power but his speed and acceleration weren’t good. Those early Maddens is where speed really killed.
Surprisingly, semi-interesting, in a video game version.
That is definitely keeping expectations low.
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We dwarf the 99 team in terms of talent… Im confident that schwartz will whip the defense inital a quality unit. While the offensive is clearly an upgrade from last years team, I don’t know what to expect because of the scheme change. sometimes you have to wait Til year two to see an offense really get comfortable with the new scheme
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Hiring McAdoo should be adventageous for the Giants assuming he will build on the west coast offense he started to install two years ago…. Impossible to have an idea how the Eagles offense will perform year one in a new offense, but they have made some importan upgrades that certainly raise the talemt level and fill some of last years most glaring weakness
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Fipps ST unit should give us a boost
So odd to be back in that time of year when no news is good news for the team.
Outside of hearing about new deals for Cox and Logan; there isn’t much I need to hear.
All of they ways guys look “great” are pure BS until we see how they do in pre-season games; especially the backups.
I just want to get to the season opener without anybody important laying down on the job and unavailable to play.
General question for the group;
Out of those of you (I am one) who don’t have season tickets; do y’all feel any need to go and see a pre-season game to watch Wentz play in person?
I’m leaning “yes” on my end. The home game vs. the Jets on September 1st might see a full half (or more) of Wentz and be an easy ticket.
Do it, Mike–imagine if you had been there for Montana’s first preseason game, or Marino’s, or Peyton’s!
4th, but I get your point.
I’d tell you you’re better off going to training camp, but since it won’t be returning to Lehigh, which provided fans with full access, I imagine the preseason game would be better. Barring an injury, I imagine Wentz will play the entire game against the Jets.
Yeah, the camp “experience” at Nova Care doesn’t seem ideal.
Not any more. I am sure you will dutifully report back to the group.
I can handle that if people all lose their TV coverage.
According to PFF, 7 of the top 101 players in the league had their best game of the season against us last year… More than double what you would expect (101 “best games”/32teams = ~ 3 per team)
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4 offensive players and 3 defensive players.
Calvin Johnson
Rapist Winston
come to mind right away.
What do people think of Josh Rosen?
Best QB prospect in college right now.
How about compared to wentz and goff
Same level so far, others will disagree with me.
On par with Goff, who I have ahead of Wentz. He’ll be a very polished thrower coming into the league.
He posted pretty similar numbers to Christian Hackenberg his freshman year.