Taking a Chance
Posted: June 8th, 2017 | Author: Tommy Lawlor | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 53 Comments »Chance Warmack was once a Top 10 pick. His size, power and athleticism impressed coaches and scouts all over the league. Warmack was expected to develop into a big time RG and Pro Bowl type player.
That didn’t happen.
Not even close, to be honest.
“The NFL is a relation-based business,” Warmack said. “When you’ve been with a guy for two years prior to coming to the NFL and had the success we had together, it was a no-brainer (signing with the Eagles).
“The offensive line is a developmental position. You can’t just jump in and play at a high level. You have to develop. I know what he gets out of players. He got a lot out of me at Alabama and he’s going to get a lot out of me here.”
Can a coach really make that much of a difference? Yes, but it doesn’t always happen.
Domo pointed out that Evan Mathis was a journeyman player until he got to the Eagles and was coached by Howard Mudd. That is a great example. Mathis was a perfect fit for Mudd’s system and played at a Pro Bowl level (I think he might be the first member of the PFF Hall of Fame).
There is a bid difference, though. Mathis had some odd circumstances and just couldn’t seem to get on the field regularly until he hit Philly. Warmack started for 3 years in Tennessee. He had the skills to play well for the Titans. He just didn’t do that.
Warmack does have talent.
@Eagles newest OL is @chancewarmack stoning @Haloti_Ngata92 on the game winning TD pass by @mariotanews8 in week 2..It's the key block pic.twitter.com/H3smCIIQSo
— Brian Baldinger (@BaldyNFL) March 9, 2017
Chance Warmack at right guard (No. 70). You can see he has the strength to create holes for backs in this league. Does an awesome job here. pic.twitter.com/Ce1czCP11Y
— Philly Nation (@Philly__Nation) April 2, 2017
OL Drive BLK via #Titans RG @chancewarmack :
Learn how OL unlock their power at https://t.co/dlJiwCi6wb pic.twitter.com/V5tut6XEdE
— The Scouting Academy (@TheScoutAcademy) August 19, 2016
If you put on some game tape from 2015, you will see talent. Warmack is big and powerful. He has quick feet. There are times when he looks nimble and shows good movement skills. He flashes big time ability on some plays.
Warmack also has major issues. He is on the ground way too much. Part of that is because he gets off balance way too easily. Sometimes he forgets to move his feet. There are some plays when he doesn’t use his hands well.
If you only watched his highlights, Warmack would look like a solid starter. If you watch his lowlights, you see a player who looks like a confused rookie. That’s not good for a player with plenty of experience. Can that be fixed?
Training Camp will be huge for Warmack. He needs to show he can be physical and beat up on defenders. He then has to show he can also pass protect well and be counted on to play with some consistency. Stoutland has a big challenge ahead of him, but Warmack has NFL talent. If Stoutland can “fix him”, Warmack could turn out to be a great signing.
I just wouldn’t bet a lot of money on that happening.
One thing that does help Warmack is that he seems to understand he is headed in the wrong direction and he’s got to play much better to save his career. He could have gone elsewhere for a bit more money, but he came to Philly to work with Stout and to try to fix his game. That’s smart for a young player.
*****
Opposing QBs like to avoid @Eagles linebacker @JordanHicks in coverage pic.twitter.com/Tl95zzmQAx
— Pro Football Focus (@PFF) June 7, 2017
Hicks should be even better his year. This will be his second year at MLB in the Eagles 4-3 scheme.
Of course, you could argue that Eagles CBs were so bad that QBs simply quit throwing over the middle and attacked the outside over and over.
_
After reading this post today, I have to give a shout out to my mom who always had my sisters and I singing “Take a Chance on Me” when ABBA came on the radio…
If you change your mind, I’m the first in line
Honey I’m still free
Take a chance on me
If you need me, let me know, gonna be around
If you’ve got no place to go, if you’re feeling down
If you’re all alone when the pretty birds have flown
Honey I’m still free
Take a chance on me
Gonna do my very best and it ain’t no lie
If you put me to the test, if you let me try
Take a chance on me
(That’s all I ask of you honey)
Take a chance on me
This reads like a recipe for being stuck in the friendzone.
ABBA? HaHaHaba.
http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/55/55ba9e755d639581f06c4e087e4d00bfd44034ec2dd698f98cf377e8d7aedf19.jpg
Seems like Chance has more actual potential than DGB. He can make good plays at times but needs to be a lot more consistent.
He has good hands and runs sharp routes?
Ha. Exactly. Basically I was thinking about how he has this potential to be good, but hasn’t put it together at this level. Everyone talks or used to talk about DGBs potential too but that was based on his physical features not so much his flashes of good play. So my point was I think he has “actual” potential more than “assumed” potential as in the case of DGB.
Really liked him coming out of Alabama- say what you will, but the instability in his early professional career will cut short the most promising of career arcs.
If he works out, we have a good problem on our hands- keep him, or let him sign else where and look to recoup any comp picks available. If he doesn’t work out, let him go with no lingering cap hit on our future books.
Isn’t this the guy who that blowhard on Philly radio Ray Didinger insisted should be the #1 overall pick, or at least the guy the Eagles should have taken over Johnson that draft? lol
Playing 20/20 hindsight are we? That’s smart and courageous.
Not when the guy is consistently wrong.
He never claims to be sure of what will happen in the future. People ask for his opinions on draft prospect before the draft – essentially guesses – and he never presents them as anything but that – guesses.
Look, people tend to talk about Diddy like Jesus, God, and Reggie White, only much better. And I think that’s overboard.
But playing “gotcha” years later about pre-draft player opinions, is very weak.
Maybe he’s changed his approach recently, but I distinctly recall that he not only would insist on who he woudl draft, but also bash the Eagles FO for being incompetent at the same time. See Ricky “Can’t Miss” Williams.
Yes – he’s literally paid and put on the air to give his opinions – and that’s all they are. And he’s not arrogant and will always admit that it’s just his opinion. If he got on air and said, “well, I really don’t know, I don’t want to put anything out there that might get questioned… so…. I pass” – he would be terrible at his job. Luckily he’s the opposite.
Last year I remember how he was all about Stanley and criticizing the move to get Wentz. It pissed me off because I was hyped and super happy about Wentz, but I respected Diddy at the same time for having an informed opinion, and sticking to it. To this day, Diddy sticks to that opinion and we’ll see how it works out. But even when he bashes the team (basing it humbly on his opinions), he acknowledges that there are difference ways to looking at these situations, and he just disagrees. He says things like “what I would do”, “if I were Howie..” etc…
Hindsight is 50/50
no fuzz
Warmack was considered a “can’t miss/sure thing” prospect by just about every analyst, website, scout, etc. The only reason he wasn’t taken higher is that he is a guard and not an offensive tackle.
Exactly. Didinger went on and on about how the Eagles are fools for not taking him because he was a can’t miss stud OG. He hasn’t mentioned him since….
It’s the polar opposite of “exactly”. You are singling out Didinger for having the same opinion that every other person had about Warmack being a “can’t miss” prospect.
No. I’m singling out Didinger because he insisted that Warmack should be taken first overall, and bashed the Eagles for not taking him instead of Johnson when they had the chance that year.
In Didinger’s defense, Lane was a QB in high school. Then he was a QB and TE in junior college for his freshman year. After transferring to Oklahoma, he played TE and DE for his sophomore season. He didn’t actually move to offensive tackle until his junior year at college. Lane was a third-team all-American his senior season.
In contrast, Chance was an all-state offensive guard in high school and a starter at guard as a true freshman. He was recruited to play at Alabama where he started at guard for 3 seasons and won 3 national championships against the highest caliber players in college football. After his junior year, he was weighing his options to turn pro before deciding to return for his senior season. Chance was a unanimous first team all-American his senior year.
Lane was drafted by the Eagles based on his positional value and his potential. Warmack lasted until #10 due to his positional value at guard not being as great as a tackle.
Ray Diddy a blowhard? Really? I find Ray to be very knowledgeable, humble and understated in his opinions. Blowhard is literally the last descriptor of Ray that would cross my mind.
I always thought Didinger had a massive ego and his head was so big from his fan base.
He most certainly behaves humbly. He is no doubt opinionated, but that is literally his job and he’s very good at that.
R Diddy .. aah finally got it
“Of course, you could argue that Eagles CBs were so bad that QBs simply quit throwing over the middle and attacked the outside over and over.”
Statistics without context are glorious, I feel like PFF have a mastery of that.
I think taking a Chance on Warmack is worth the roll of the dice. If he pans out, we get a talented, cheap and still youngish OL which is gold in the NFL. If he doesn’t, we paid him for one year and can cut bait. I’ve not been that impressed with Stoutland’s work on our other young OL, but he knows Warmack better than anyone else and so taking a shot is ok.
I like Hicks, but he has got to stay healthy this season. That is the only knock, otherwise he is a very good and versatile player.
I would go beyond “good” and say that Hicks is a Pro-bowl type player!
I said very good and versatile….what else do you want? 😉
Pro bowl nods are no longer fairly awarded imo; mostly a popularity contest unfortunately
Jason Kelce would disagree; )
I would go beyond “Pro-bowl type player” and say HOF type (just for his plays against the Cowboys).
Did you just say take a Chance on Warmack on purpose or by accident?
Was the 16 games Hicks played last season not enough for you?
I’d like to see 20.
https://twitter.com/Eagles/status/872815794287202304?s=09
Howie just wants to see Blount truck Maxwell and Kiko.
Stats for Hicks are like stats for Asomugha in Oakland. Is the player that good or other parts of the defense that bad? At least we know Hicks is great from other statistics.
I think he was really that good in Oakland. And Hick is that good here.
I kinda think so too, but its a little misleading of a stat.
Does anyone know where to find the QB rating when throwing on him (and that of other LBs for context)? That would provide insight into whether he was good or just not as bad as the rest, but I don’t know where to go for that.
Good thought. No idea though. I’m sure somewhere has it. I’ve heard it mentioned for cornerbacks.
https://twitter.com/PFF/status/862316308704223233
It’s epic. And imo much more telling than the stat Tommy posted in this article. Not throwing at him when you can throw at McKelvin or Mills is a no brainer.
Yeah, Asomugha was an amazingly good CB in Oakland. Don’t rewrite history. I was so stoked when we, shockingly, landed him. He got paid. He quit. Sucked. But he was, at one point in time, among the elite at his position.
You’re overthinking it in my opinion. Hicks isn’t a “I learned he was a really good player from stats” guy…. He’s a consistent “dayum!” guy. And the stats just document for historic integrity. The HOF will need it someday for reference purposes.
Agreed, we all know he’s great. Should have said: at least other stats, can easily back up his greatness.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/2760b865f063919153589c3c50338cc22761d18843bd2e4aba8900e417d0ae6d.png
http://phi.247sports.com/Bolt/Jason-Kelce-gets-involved-in-fight-during-Eagles-OTA-practice-53092004
Is this edge new for Kelce? I don’t femember this side to him. Maybe he feel the pressure? Maybe it will improve the product?
KC has a write-up on Greg Lewis the player. Pretty good stuff. As for Greg Lewis the coach, I’ll leave you with his own words from the article…“I thought (in Philly), our guys came and worked tremendously hard everyday,” Lewis said. “We didn’t get the results we wanted, but it is what it is”.
http://www.kansascity.com/sports/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs/article155155259.html
Loved the player… I’ll leave it at that.
Completely OT but re-looking at our schedule this year. First seven games—with the exception of the Chargers—are tough (maybe even brutal). Here’s hoping both sides of the ball have it together by the end of preseason because there won’t be time to breath in those first seven weeks.
I don’t care that it’s only OTAs, I’m not too thrilled with these Wentz reports.
好好学习，天天向上
@ T-Law
Imo the much more impressive coverage stat about Hicks is this one:
https://twitter.com/PFF/status/862316308704223233
He just dominated in that regard at his position. And unlike Targets, which are clearly influenced by the other players around him (especially CBs), as you wrote, too, passer rating is more individual to Hicks skills.
Of course, passer rating is also influenced by CBs and the Pass Rush, but not as much as targets.
Put Chance in on short yardage situations. Seems like his biggest problem is pass protection from the tape i saw. Moving the guy in front of him (like in goal line) he could do.