More on Harris

Posted: April 19th, 2017 | Author: | Filed under: Philadelphia Eagles | 361 Comments »

Missouri DE Charles Harris has become a strange topic recently. There is a buzz around him now being a Top 15 pick, possibly even Top 10. The Eagles took a look at him and I mentioned he could be in the mix at pick 14.

People were not happy.

“This is Marcus Smith all over again.”

“Would be a wasted pick.”

“Why do the Eagles always draft busts?”

Etc.

I am not Charles Harris biggest fan, but I don’t get the hate toward him. He might be the most explosive pass rusher in the draft. That’s a good thing. In 2 years as a starter, he piled up 30.5 TFLs (16 sacks). Harris was productive and disruptive and played in the best conference in the nation.

He did have a poor showing at the Combine. That got everyone’s attention and made us wonder about his value. Harris then posted better numbers at his Pro Day. That’s the whole point in having a Pro Day. It allows you to bounce back after a bad Combine. CB Joe Haden had a bad Combine when he was coming out. He did much better at his Pro Day and ended up going 7th overall. Haden has been a terrific NFL player.

The poor showing by Harris in Indy made people think he would go late 1st or early 2nd. Prior to that, he was considered a solid 1st round pick. When Harris originally declared for the draft, Todd McShay had him ranked as the 11th overall prospect. Several other key sites had him in the 16 to 32 range. Back in mid-January, Daniel Jeremiah had him going 19th overall to the Bucs in a mock draft.

This isn’t some mid-round guy you’ve never heard of being talked about going early. Harris had an outstanding career and he’s been highly thought of by coaches and scouts all along. At his worst, Harris wasn’t going to fall out of the Top 45. He’s just too explosive for that.

His Pro Day, workouts and visits have gone well enough that teams now see him going early again. This isn’t just some Eagles thing.

Teams want pass rushers. They really want explosive pass rushers. Myles Garrett, Jonathan Allen and Solomon Thomas will all be Top 10 picks because they are explosive. Harris is explosive and that puts him in the conversation.

I would rather have Derek Barnett than Harris, but Barnett doesn’t have the explosive burst that Harris does. Some people covet that burst.

While Harris isn’t my ideal pick for the Eagles, I wouldn’t be upset with him. DE is a critical position in the NFL and Harris has the potential to be a difference-maker at that spot. I’m not trying to convince anyone to suddenly love Harris, but do understand this is a really talented football player and there are legitimate reasons that he could go in the Top 15. Watch the clips below. Not many guys in this draft class have that kind of get-off.

*****

I do need to put up a post sharing some thoughts on the different edge rushers. There are a lot of guys I like. I’m curious as to whether Jim Schwartz and the Eagles prefer size vs speed vs athleticism vs production. It will be interesting to see who they pick, whether he goes 14th overall or is a 4th round pick.

I also need to share which guys I do covet in the 1st round. One hint…none are QBs.

_


  • Anders

    Charles Harris Thread— Ben Natan (@TheBenNatan) 18. april 2017

    Watch this thread. Good break down of his highlights but also his terrible low lights.

    I think Harris will be one of those misses at the DE position that never become great.

    • Media Mike

      He just seems unwise and unworthy at 14.

      • Anders

        yea I would hate Harris at 14. Nothing about him scream worthy of a mid 1st round pick imo

        • Media Mike

          I did a mock the other day where I traded down with the Raiders to get 1-24 and 2-24 (fair value on the chart) for 1-14 and took Harris. It was more palatable.

          • Anders

            I much rather take what is left at 14 than do that.

          • Media Mike

            If there are certain guys I really like, Corey Davis for example, gone by 14; I have a hard time being excited with the result. Especially because it looks like Foster’s shoulder is going to drop him (and the Eagles might not go LB at 14 anyway) and OJ Howard or Jamaal Adams aren’t likely to be their pick.

            Do you have a specific guy you’d like at 14?

          • Anders

            Of guys likely to be there?

            Davis, Ross, McCaffrey, Conley, Humphrey, Barnett (I know his testing is bad, I just love watching him play)

          • Media Mike

            Davis is a slam dunk for me. I can’t get a good vibe on Conley and/or Humphrey as being a lockdown CB or not, but generally like both guys without loving either one. I’m on board with the “RB isn’t worth it at 14” gang, but think McCaffrey would be good here. I’m not a huge fan of Barnett.

          • Anders

            Barnett really reminds me of Trent Cole and Brandon Graham mix

          • Rellihcs

            Precisely. And again, I defer to Schwartz, Douglass, and Chris Wilson et al. when it comes to actually judging NFL projections of prospects like Barnett, Harris.. etc… Which is why – while I like Barnett over Harris (but I can see the enticement with Harris in terms of quickness, bend, and staying low), I trust that if they take Barnett or Harris at 14, we should defer to their expertise and see what they can do.

            We can’t underestimate the fact that this defensive scheme is predicated on very strong, and deep pass rushing from the DE position. We have some very quality run stoppers on the roster now – including Graham and Cox long term, and of course Hicks and Bradham are very good LBs… I can talk myself into Harris and would be very very happy with Barnett.

          • Media Mike

            My main worry with Barnett is his penchant for getting production via guessing / jumping snap counts. I’m scared that’ll translate to a lot of offside calls vs. smart OTs and QBs.

          • Rellihcs

            Do you think that a potential red-flag like that will completely evade our front office and coaching staff in decision making processes? That’s my point. Sure that could be a concern, but an experienced DL coach, and d-coordinator who’s notorious for success with a scheme that first and foremost is built upon attacking DL, and a (whatever Joe’s title is) who comes from a program with strong D drafting pedigrees – do you really think that fans like you and me have to worry about that with all of those factors in place? (I’m not saying we know that they like Barnett or will be drafting him of course).

          • Media Mike

            I like where we drafted Cole a lot more than where we’d need to take Barnett.

          • Rellihcs

            Mock drafting and “value championships” don’t translate to the field. Obviously Cole was a striking gold move value wise in hindsight, but if you get a very good to great DE with pick 14, in this defense? Come on man – if we draft Barnett and he pans out to be as good – and as early – as Cole – and we pair that with the line with have now – in this D – arguing about value would seem very very foolish in that situation. In fact, that would border (if not outright) on indicating mental illness.

          • Media Mike

            No, I want value because we only have some many picks. So “and” is my operative word with any guy we take. Can I get that guy later AND another good guy now?

          • Rellihcs

            Fair enough. But are you saying that we can draft a non-Barnett at 14 and actually get him or someone close to him as well? Remember, your “click here to trade back in an internet mock draft app” is just that an not reality…

          • kajomo

            You mean that’s his ceiling. If everything works out for him his is as good as those guys. If he doesn’t reach his full potential he’s Robert Ayers

          • Anders

            If you get prime Trent Cole, for a longer time, you have a great pick.

            You can say the same thing about every player, if he doesnt reach their potential they will only be X

          • kajomo

            No true. An superior athlete playing a 80% of his potential is often better than a limited athlete plying at 90%. There are exceptions to every rule, but explosive athletic traits increase your odds of success against other good-great atheletes. I don’t want to hope Barnett is the exception.

            Despite everyone saying tape is the most important thing we see teams covet explosive athletes at the top of the draft for this very reason.

            Louis Riddick was on the Fanatic yesterday and said he loves Barnett’s production, but is concerned it won’t translate to the NFL. I feel the exact same way. You know what will translate? Explosiveness!

          • Anders

            But who says the superior athlete will even come close to his potential? Yes the reward might be higher, but if they cant play to begin, what does it matter?

            Take Obi Melifonwu, great athlete, but everybody agrees that he wasnt very good, while a guy like Tabor tested poorly, but have great tape.
            Between the two I take Tabor 10 times out of 10.

          • kajomo

            We apparently just have very different philosophies. To me your way is the old way with a bunch of average to below average athletes. They are solid players that get dominated against better teams because they can’t match up physically. I want a team of explosive athletes that teams have to game plan around. There may be some misses, but the payoffs would be huge. I’m sure we ideally want a middle ground, but we lean in opposite directions. I’m just sick of taking the “safe” pick and being envious of the talent on other teams. We have Lane and Fletch as great athletes. Those 2 also happen to be our best players.

            I would take Obi and gaurentee that he will go rounds earlier. Obi won’t make it past Seattle and Atlanta. Those 2 teams focus on explosive athletic traits btw. How have those organizations done the last few years?

          • Anders

            Have you seen Seattles OL? Hell have you seen Seattles draft success the last few years?

            Ideally I want a Solomon Thomas or Jonathan Allen type. Back in 2013, I 100% hated Jarvis Jones as prospect because I thought he didnt win 1v1 in college and he had a terrible profile.

            My thoughts on Barnett would be different if he had only won by speed rush, but Barnett has great hands and an advanced rip and dip move. Most failed DEs fail because they won on just speed rush and never develop any moves.

            If the player is all athletisme and no substance, I want no part of them (or you get Curtis Marsh or Clay Harbor).

          • kajomo

            So your saying Harris has no substance? Harris isn’t some raw pass rusher. He has more moves than Barnett’s one. He also doesn’t need to guess the snap count to get the edge on an OT the way Barnett does.

            Also seattle’s OL is in rough shape due to lack of resources. They were forced to pay all the defensive talent they have (who won them a super bowl and went back to another btw). It’s the salary cap that has hamstrung them, not their philosophy.

            Atlanta has focused on adding explosive players. Freeman, Coleman, Beasley, Neal, etc. they should have won a super bowl.

            Dallas has added Byron Jones, Zeke, Tyron Smith, Dez. Go look at any roster. 95%+ of the best players will be guys that are explosive athletes. Edge rushers especially.

            Barnett to me is similar to Shaw Lawson from last year in that he was super productive and a consensus high pick. Once his lack of elite explosiveness was confirmed he fell to 19.

          • kajomo

            It’s ok that we have different philosophies in team building. It makes for a fun discussion.

            I truly love the draft. It may be my favorite football time of the year. I just enjoy the process and the anticipation. I already have started looking into prospects for 2018 because I’ve pretty much exhausted 2017 players. I follow it year round. I’m glad to have a place to talk with other Eagles fans about prospects.

            We will see shortly why HR and JD believe in. no matter what I think this draft will be hard to completely screw up. We have our QB. buolding around him should be much easier.

          • ChoTime

            Teams that rely too much on combine numbers get players like Ernie Sims, the Momatron, and Dorial Beckham-Green. Rarely do workout warriors all of a sudden learn to play football when they get to the big league.

          • kajomo

            I never said I wanted work out warriors. I just like guys with explosive traits. i care more about avoiding average or poor athletes than I do about having the freakiest athletes. Charles Harris is a good football player. So is Derek Barnett. I like Harris significantly more because he is a better athlete.

            I also believe in finding ideal traits for each position given the Eagles scheme. For DE maybe it’s broad jump, 10 yard split, and 3 cone as an example. There should be required targets for each of these in order to qualify as an Eagles DE. If a player doesn’t meet these required targets than they are not a fit. They are either off the board or significantly down graded. This thins the herd and makes sure your targets meet the minimum physical desired traits for that given position. Add tape and interviews to this and you get a much better feel for who the targets are.

            Average athletes that are star players are exceedingly rare. Even when playing well it is often required to scheme around their deficiencies. You are fighting the odds in those situations.

          • ChoTime

            I understand, you’re willing to pay a premium for the chance to get a star player.

          • laeagle

            I would add that I think the balance should be adjusted on a per-position basis. For example, pass rush is “easier” than being a CB. Which is easier than being on the OL. None of them are actually “easy”; all require some degree of technique and polish at a high level. But pure athleticism can reap quicker benefits at some positions than others. A raw athlete at DE can do a lot more damage (eg., JPP) than a raw CB prospect. And, obviously, a raw athlete at QB does damage for the team he plays for.

            Which is why I think going for raw, natural explosiveness is actually a good thing over technique when talking about a pass rusher like Harris.

            Let’s also not forget the fact that while everyone says Barnett is the “polished” guy, it’s not like Harris is Marcus Smith, either. He’s already got an arsenal of moves beyond just speed rush (listen to the Duffy podcast). That’s more than a lot of these guys have coming out of college. I think Harris is a great mix of potential and polish. The only question marks against him are how he plays against the run, and whether or not he can put on more effective weight.

          • Sb2bowl

            That’s worth a first

          • xmbk

            White should be in that conversation. Solid, all around game. Wore 18 for two seasons at LSU.

          • Rellihcs

            I think White’s ceiling isn’t high enough for pick 14 grade. I am fine with drafting him in the second (though I am higher on a few other 2nd round prospects), or a trade down, but I don’t think he’s 14 worthy.

          • xmbk

            Trade down might be hard this year, other teams have the same mindset. I doubt he lasts until 43. Most teams only have 1 pick per round, can’t worry too much about half round grades. If you like a guy, take him. Research is way more important than perfect value. Hopefully Douglas will help Howie with that.

          • kajomo

            When you don’t take good pass rushers early you are forced to reach for guys like Marcus Smith. Rushers go early. It’s all about positional value. Edge rushers impact QBs. Guys with Harris’s traits are difficult to find. It makes him more valueable than good players at other positions.

          • Sb2bowl

            I’d take that trade. Not optimal but we can build the depth and talent levels of this team that way.

          • bushisamoron

            Really does not seem that the Birds are feeling the “trade down” scenario. Really has worked poorly for them in the past and Roseman has commented on more than once occasion about that. I think someone they like will be there at 14 and they will choose him

      • Rellihcs

        Give Natan some slack, next year he will be 15.

  • bushisamoron

    BCA. Best Corner Available.

    • Media Mike

      That may well be what they do considering all of the DE and RB love being leaked from the team. And let me know what you think of the mock I’m about to post.

    • Rellihcs

      Unless someone other than a CB you love is available. That might be Barnett, Davis, Howard, one of the top safeties… etc…

    • ChoTime

      Sucks to be in a position where you basically need to draft a CB and hope they play at starter level to be any better next year.

  • Media Mike

    I’m starting to look at “how can I get comfortable with” various guys they may take at 14 that I don’t really like their value at 14.

    Here is one with Conley

    Round 1 Pick 14: Gareon Conley, CB, Ohio State (B-)
    Round 2 Pick 11: Jordan Willis, DE, Kansas State (B)
    Round 3 Pick 35 (COMP): Taywan Taylor, WR, Western Kentucky (A-)
    Round 4 Pick 12: Cameron Sutton, CB, Tennessee (A+)
    Round 4 Pick 32 (COMP): Julie’n Davenport, OT, Bucknell (B+)
    Round 5 Pick 11: John Johnson, FS, Boston College (A)
    Round 6 Pick 10: Matthew Dayes, RB, NC State (A)
    Round 7 Pick 12: Lorenzo Jerome, SS, Saint Francis (PA) (B+)

    • Media Mike

      And I know they’re not going to take (or have the chance to take) Howard, but I’d do something like this is he’s there at 14.

      Round 1 Pick 14: O.J. Howard, TE, Alabama (A+)
      Round 2 Pick 11: Tre’Davious White, CB, LSU (A-)
      Round 3 Pick 35 (COMP): Alex Anzalone, OLB, Florida (A)
      Round 4 Pick 12: Taywan Taylor, WR, Western Kentucky (A+)
      Round 4 Pick 32 (COMP): Tanoh Kpassagnon, DE, Villanova (B)
      Round 5 Pick 11: Jordan Morgan, OG, Kutztown (A)
      Round 6 Pick 10: Stevie Tu’ikolovatu, DT, Southern California (A-)
      Round 7 Pick 12: De’Angelo Henderson, RB, Coastal Carolina (A)

      • Sb2bowl

        Other than the Howard pick, I’d be content with both of these drafts.

      • D3FB

        You like Anzalone?

        You’ll have stroke when he misses time every season

        • Media Mike

          That’s a very strong consideration. Can’t have people laying down on the job.

  • xmbk

    I think Harris will be situational until he gets stronger, and it’s not a guarantee that he’ll get strong enough to Hold his own in the run game. Not worth a 14, though I agree that edge is like QB, teams are willing to take a risk in hopes of getting lucky.

    • Patrick

      I think its got more to do with footballs holy trinity – passer, pass protector and pass rusher – than a willingness to take a risk and getting lucky.

      If a guy can get after the QB, theres just plenty of teams who’ll be ecstatic about that, even if the player can just barely get to the point of being useable and not detrimental in the run game. Probably not worth a top 15 pick to have spend on a designated pass rusher who comes in on specific downs, but even if you’re detrimental at anything else, theres a spot on a team for a guy who can get sacks.

      • xmbk

        Agreed on all counts, that’s basically what I was trying to say (pre coffee).

    • kajomo

      Lane Johnson needed to get stronger. He went 4th overall. Von Miller is a rusher that needed to get stronger. Adding strength is easy. Adding explosiveness is difficult to impossible.

      • Rellihcs

        Duffy said he’s already gained 20 lbs since graduating…

        • CrackSammich

          So we should expect him out for 4 games this year then?

      • Sb2bowl

        Great point.

      • Mitchell

        Adding strength should in theory increase explosiveness. F=M(a) where force can be substituted for strength, mass is weight and Im gonna substitute explosiveness for acceleration. If strength increases so does acceleration and vise versa. I dont think explosiveness is impossible to add but like everything else some people are just born special.

        • ChoTime

          Sure you can make yourself a bit more explosive, but you can’t go up in class by lifting…world class sprinters do lift, but it’s a small difference, a matter of 10ths of a second. Some scrawny guys can burn rubber or jump out the gym. You can’t learn that.

          • Mitchell

            1. Good expansion on my last line. 2.10ths of seconds are EXTREMELY valuable in short distance athletics.

        • Ark87

          Explosiveness is about how quick your muscles can “twitch” or contract. And that’s one of those “god given” things. You can add mass to the muscles, but that’s more like adding extra hydraulic cylinders to a backhoe. It wont make the backhoe dig faster, but it will make it less likely to be stopped by a big rock it hits.

          It must be said that all of these men have the ability to squat 2 or so football players. Strength is a little over-rated because it’s very difficult to translate it all between 2 upright men. Which is why technique and leverage are so important. (for the trenches, everywhere else on the field the punch you pack is determined by mass and speed)

          • Mitchell

            True but in regards to the 2 muscle types and their subtypes: if you train for explosion, you will be more explosive. If you train for strength you will be stronger. If you give the back hoe hydraulics to make it move trough more rock it will however if you give it more hydraulics to dig faster it will.

          • Ark87

            That’s all true, and that is the big challenge for trainers. But most of these athletes are already at their leanest and most explosive most athletic form they will ever be. The big challenge for these trainers is to get them to add mass and strength without sacrificing any explosiveness or speed. Basically making sure that muscle mass is being made out of the right stuff. But the limitations of those explosive fibers still apply.

            In theory someone who say, played basketball or soccer and are coming over to football would benefit tremendously from training to emphasize the quick twitch muscles and de-emphasize the endurance side of muscles. But these life time football players’ muscles are already pretty fine-tuned to the demands of football by virtue of a life-time of football. It’s just a matter of bulking them up to grown man levels without slowing them down.

          • Mitchell

            I dont think the kids coming straight out of college are at their peak form. Again my argument is they will still improve and weaknesses can be worked on. Some people are better at certain thing s but can get better.

          • Ark87

            yeah, I’m just nit-picking for conversation’s sake 😀

          • A_T_G

            I can attest to this. I train to drink beer and I drink more beer. QED

        • Sb2bowl

          A lot of it has to do with types of muscle in the human body; some people are just naturally inclined to be quicker on their feet- some are more sturdy with a power base.

          Case in point- I’m not built for speed. I know that; but if you need me to pick up a 300lb load and put it on a pickup bed, I can do that for you. But ask me to play soccer and I look like an utter fool.

          In other words- trying to compare the body types of Barnett with Harris is like comparing apples and oranges. Both will win with their strengths, and lose with their weaknesses. It comes down to body type, and preference from the coaching staff for the individual.

          • Mitchell

            Exactly. Some people are more inclined to do certain things but it doesnt mean one cant strengthen a weakness. My main argument is just because someone isnt good at something now doesnt mean they cant improve in the future.

          • Sb2bowl

            Correct, but as Ark pointed out- you can’t teach twitch. You can develop strength, but you can’t teach someone’s body to naturally bend to get around the OT corner if it isn’t in their genes.

            Barnett has superior hand technique, and will probably offer more impact in the NFL because his game is already sound. What he lacks in explosion, he makes up for in technique. Maybe that’s why he’s already so advanced in that stage of development.

            Harris offers a twitchy-ness that Barnett simply lacks. Not for trying, but Harris is a better athlete. Change of direction and fluidity are what I call “non-thinks”– in other words, he doesn’t have to necessarily process through what he’s about to do, his body will do it in instinct. A player like Barnett will have to make a concentrated (and well rehearsed/practiced) effort to move like Harris and even then, he will be deficient.

            I like Barnett because of his advanced technique and hustle. That’s my preference. Harris has traits that Barnett simply doesn’t possess. But he looks to have a higher ceiling, and has the traits that impact edge rushers all have in common. They need to be developed and coached.

          • laeagle

            Yikes. You should have a talk with whoever left a 300lb load laying around.

          • Sb2bowl

            Yeah, not a happy day. I pick things up and put them down- Lol

          • A_T_G

            Maybe she wasn’t laying around. Maybe she was just resting.

        • kajomo

          Strength doesn’t always add explosiveness. Muscles are more complex than that. Explosiveness can certainly be improved, but like everything people have naturally higher or lower ceilings. After a certain point gains become minimal or impossible to achieve.

      • xmbk

        Almost every rookie needs to get stronger in the NFL, and they will. But Harris coming out is nothing like either of those 2 guys. They didn’t get pushed around in college. He did.

        • kajomo

          1) Harris has apparently already added 20lbs of muscle

          2) he will be a situational pass rusher as a rookie. He will have another year before he is asked to play significant run down snaps

          3) we have plenty of good run defenders. We need pass rushers. As long as he can get to the QB I really don’t care about his run defense.

          4) he wasn’t bullied on a consistent basis. He was a drisruptive force who regularly played in the other side of the LOS. If we were 2 gapping I may feel differently. He is going to be a quick, first step penetrating rusher

          • xmbk

            If they take him, then I hope you are correct.

      • Dan

        For Johnson it was about inexperience, never about getting stronger. He wasn’t as polished and a career tackle like Joeckel or Fisher. He did more on the bench press than both of them and was more athletic in other drills. The reason we got him at 4 was he transferred from a junior college and played his first year as a TE/DE and then only had 2 years experience as a tackle.

        • kajomo

          So your claiming he took PEDs to gain experience?

          Joking aside he needed to gain weight and strength to better anchor and drive block. I don’t care what he benched. He needed more lower body strength

        • Ark87

          Yeah, all of these guys are strong enough to tip themselves over. None of them can use their actual full strength that they can display in a weight room because they aren’t anchored to anything on the field. They can only put as much of their strength into something as their technique allows or else they will put themselves off balance or go on roller skates.

          Lane’s problem was he has this huge frame which is really great for his reach, but your technique has to be really good because it’s easy for smaller guys to get leverage on you all day. Besides anchoring yourself with great technique and leverage, your goal as a big man is to put on as much weight as you can without slowing yourself down. Weight obviously helps you anchor so that you can use more of your strength. That’s where the PED’s came in.

    • bill

      My understanding is that the wide 9 is a scheme that allows you to use lighter, quicker guys on the edge. The wide stance gives them not only a better pass rush angle, but an advantage at setting the edge positionally. The key is to have playmakers at DT and solid LBs that fill the gap left by the wide alignment. Obviously, there’s some functional strength floor, but, at least in the past, I don’t think it has been a primary focus.

      Looking through his history of DEs, they tend to be 6’4″ or taller, and 275-280 pounds. Strength is valued less than quickness or explosion. For example, his defense in 2007 had Kyle Vanden Bosch (72% in bench press per mockdraftable) and Antwan Odom (31% in bench press) as his starting DEs. In contrast, KVB was 95% in 20yd shuttle, 84% in vertical. Odom was 87% in vertical (he had a horrible shuttle).
      Jason Jones and Ziggy Ansah, his starting DEs for his last year in Detroit, are similarly noticeable for their low BP numbers.

      Of course, Schwartz’s defense probably has changed to react to changes in offenses over the years, so it’s possible his preferences there have changed. But the evidence I’ve seen says strength isn’t a huge priority for him at DE.

      • xmbk

        For the foreseeable future, strong run stoppers are necessary against Dallas. It was a big part of the Giants success against them last year. And I don’t want to go into a season knowing that Dallas is going to run all over our D for 2 games.

        But I largely agree with what you’ve said. I just question whether Harris can be a 3-down lineman right now. I worry about him playing like Randy Gregory.

        • Rellihcs

          Who says he’s going to be the primary RDE for likely run-downs… We have Long, Curry for that etc… And if there were run plays where the DL was BG, Cox, Jernigan, Harris, that is one weak link, but 3 really really strong talented run stoppers with Hicks coming in support (maybe Jenkins too). So context is key.

          (Plus Carson to Alshon is going to make teams pass to catch up all the time, every game, anyhow!)

          • xmbk

            Could be. I worry that 3rd and 3 is a running down if Harris is in the game. Bottom line, we’ll be trusting the coaches on this.

          • D3FB

            3rd and 3 is a run down anyways

          • xmbk

            I don’t have stats on it, but it doesn’t feel that way anymore, not in the NFL.

          • Media Mike

            Andy Reid begs to differ.

        • bill

          I guess I would argue that good run stopping DEs in the wide 9 have different skillsets than good run-stopping DEs in a traditional 4-3. Being able to beat the T to the spot is as important, if not more so, than strength at the point of attack. Getting deep and around the T forces the RB inside, where your strong DTs and smart LBs are waiting. Or, in extreme cases, the DE is making the tackle in the backfield because he was essentially untouched.

          It’s true that they aren’t in wide 9 all the time (or perhaps even most of the time), so there’s a limit to how far you can take this. But I’m still strongly convinced that the strength ‘deficit’ of Harris is less important to Schwartz than it is to DCs who run a more traditional 4-3.

          • xmbk

            Agreed, less important in the wide 9. But if you aren’t strong enough to hold your ground and turn the run in, you aren’t doing any good. A guy like Harris could get moved from his spot, so that the off-tackle hole is too big to fill. Lots of hypotheticals here, but the gist is that Harris could do very well in the 9, but he could also be a liability. I’m willing to trust Schwartz to make that call. Like Conley and Witherspoon, I’m inclined to think that he’ll be leaning towards other players.

  • GermanEagle
    • Rellihcs

      Good. Saves the taxpayers money. That’s all I care to say or think about this.

      • iceberg584

        Unless his family sues the prison.

        • aron

          how bout you shut your face, im tired of you and your senseless posting

        • BlindChow

          Still might be cheaper.

    • P_P_K

      Wow. This after he was acquitted of the murder charges?

      • RobNE

        the newer ones but he still was in prison for life without parole for the other murder that he was found guilty of.

      • Rellihcs

        Only the second and third… Still considered found guilty of a murder.

      • CrackSammich

        acquitted of the 2-3, but was still under appeal for the 1st. Technically, this means the conviction of the first was vacated. Legally, this is huge for the inevitable civil proceedings against.

        TL;DR, he killed himself so his daughter could keep his money.

    • A_T_G

      It became clear long ago that the man’s actions were not understood rationally. This is final, definitive proof.

    • ChoTime

      RIP.

    • Sb2bowl

      My initial thought was that there is no way that a guy like him kills himself. The gang ties, money, control and influence that he still has- that kind of power doesn’t come easily. Throw in the statement “he attempted to block his door from the inside” and it looks like a perfect storm of apparent suicide.

      Truth is, this may be the truth or it could be the total opposite of what happened. What matters is that he’s dead, and 3 other men directly linked to him are dead as well. The life he lived is a tale of unfulfilled promise and talent.

  • Rellihcs

    Ok, now after listening to Fran Duffy’s podcast (short) with Josh Norris about Harris, I’m much more into the idea of taking him – being excited about it – and not looking back.

    http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/videos/audio/Eagle-Eye-A-Mock-Draft-Pick-Off-The-Edge/acf2da87-2b16-4088-af03-7e1c8868691a

    • kajomo

      Save yourself the trouble and just listen to me in the first place next time.

      I am kidding of course.

    • kajomo

      I have never followed Josh Norris before, but this was a great listen. We see edge rushers through the same lense. A few take aways for people that don’t want to listen.

      1) athleticism matters for edge rushers. (Crazy concept)

      2) college production can be misleading. College OTs are not great (just look at this draft) and often these stats don’t translate. He brought up Jarvis Jones as a productive SEC pass rusher that flopped.

      3) Barnett is a secondary pass rusher as his ceiling. Not someone you want as your primary rush guy. That is a pretty damning statement IMO.

      4) run defending for edge rushers is low on his list of priority traits. Run defenders are easy to find. Impact pass rushers are not.

      5) mocked Charles Harris to the eagles and doesn’t feel he is a reach. Said he is explosive with both a good primary and counter move. Feels he could be a great fit for Schwartz’s system.

      • Anders

        My problem with Harris is that point 1 does not fit him at all (I know it does not fit Barnett either).

        • Rellihcs

          You seem to rate underwear Olympics over tape in order of importance. Am i misunderstanding?

          • Dan

            You seem to be relying on tape without understanding the context, just like people do with stats which got us MSII

          • Rellihcs

            So to you, stats = tape? I think there’s a big difference.

          • laeagle

            I’m confused as well. Tape != stats, stats != combine numbers.

            Not to mention the fact that viewing tape is 100% about viewing context. It’s about seeing the actual thing happen rather than a number. Sure, there can be additional context applied, such as level of competition, but by and large, tape is the most context-laden means of judging a player. I’m not sure why it’s assumed that tape would be viewed in some sort of difficult-to-assemble vacuum.

          • Rellihcs

            Very well said. The context is EVERYTHING.

          • kajomo

            Yes you are misunderstanding.

            I use athletic testing to weed out players that can not physically match up in the NFL. Once I’ve identified which players meet these minimum requirements, I rank them based on tape.

            Tape is most important. Just because a guy beats a college OT and gets a sack doesn’t mean it’s a translatable play. Tape is important, but I think many people confuse results for tape.

            I love Harris on tape, but I had downgraded him significantly due to his combine performance. I was still somewhat encouraged by his drill work. I gave him a late 1st round/2nd round grade similar to Barnett. His pro day erased my concerns about his athletic ability. I now have him as a top 15 pick.

          • Anders

            To a large degree yes, but its based on this:
            http://settingedge.com/movement

            and then Im still a big believer in Barnett for us at 14

          • kajomo

            While I am unfamiliar with this metric I do follow a similar thought process. I am going to dive into what this guy is doing though. You cannot ignore what the data is shouting.

            Btw, Barnett could prove to be everything you think he is, but the odds are against you. When using metrics like think you will miss out on good football players occasionally, but that ok. its about minimizing risk and landing impact (or force) players.

          • Anders

            Yeah it’s hard to ignore the data. Football outsiders also do something similar for pass rushes

          • Rellihcs

            Interesting. I appreciate the response with your sources. (And the post above). Interesting stuff. I agree about Barnett but have warmed up to Harris in favor of Barnett too.

            Thanks

        • kajomo

          It does though. He isn’t an elite athlete like Von Miller or JJ Watt, but he has some real explosive traits. His jump numbers are good. Those show short area explosiveness. His 10yard split is 1.65. Not elite, but good. It proves he has a good get off. (Barnett was at a pedestrian 1.70)

          I’ve also said this multiple times, but he is extremely fluid for his size. Watching him at the combine do LB drills convinced me that he is a much better athlete than his test numbers show. His improvement at his pro day further confirmed that. Don’t let the combine cloud your judgement. It made me re-evaluate him, but I still came back to the conclusion that he is an explosive dude.

    • RC5000

      Mel Kiper > Josh Norris

  • Sifter

    I think what would bother me about picking Harris is nothing personal at all – it’s the large number of pass rushers available in the top 100 picks of this draft. Same with safety and WR/TE. When you have a deep class, it seems a waste to pick a guy at one of those deep positions who you might call a reach. Wait for later rounds and sweep up the gold still remaining.
    Harris seems like a great fit though, it’s just value for pick #14 that holds me back from getting too interested at this stage.

    • kajomo

      So we need CB, DE, RB, and WR. All of these positions are considered deep to extremely deep in this draft. So you want a kicker in round 1.

      Harris is talented enough for 14 an his positional value (unlike RB) warrants and early selection.

      My short list of realistic targets is:

      John Ross
      Gareon Conley
      Charles Harris

      • Sifter

        Hah, never a kicker…I think the Eagles are lucky this year since almost all the positions they need are deep. I’m talking more generally, that reaching for a deep position isn’t good strategy in normal circumstances.

        Just on Harris too, he’s got top 15 talent as a pass rusher, but I don’t think it’s particularly smart for us to pick a guy who doesn’t play the run well when we are fighting with Dallas for the division. I think the Zeke Elliott and the Dallas O-line will be happy to run at him alll day.

    • aron

      listen stifler, the next time you post how bout doing some research first, the next time I come on here it wont be good for you,

      • Nailed It!

        Why are you the way that you are?

        • RobNE

          do you mean “blocked”?

      • Sifter

        Merry Christmas aron 🙂

  • kajomo

    “I would rather have Derek Barnett than Harris, but Barnett doesn’t have the explosive burst that Harris does. Some people covet that burst.”

    I am very much one of those people that covet burst. I have Harris, McKinley, and Watt ahead of Barnett for this reason. DE is one position where explosiveness really really matters. Look at all the top rushers. They are explosive.

  • P_P_K

    Iggles Blitz is the only blog or forum I read where I am as interested in the reader comments as the original writing. Thanks, guys.

    • Sb2bowl

      Both keep me coming back, but this is the best online blogging community I’ve encountered.

      Took some time off of commenting (life) but it’s great to be back. Looking forward to the draft and the upcoming season.

  • A_T_G

    The final tally, wth corrections, updated comps, and analysis. Not to oversell it, but I’d imagine this will put an end to all pre-draft debate.
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/e6417b6af95677ac2416b00971032e560259639b93b8aca6e6696053ac43cf70.png

    Analysis:
    1. Positions of need players Christian McCaffrey, Derek Barnett, and Corey Davis fall in the “might be too good to be true” range. This proves negadelphia is real.

    2. Unpopular players include Cook, Trubinsky, Ramczyk, Njoku, and McDowell. This proves IgglesBlitzers are not fans of scrabble, second best Maliks, or misogyny.

    3. The least popular player was Deshaun Watson. This proves IgglesBlitzers are not Browns fans.

    4. Players in the sweet spot include OJ, Reuben, and Taco. This proves IgglesBlitzers read the comments before lunch.

    5. It is possible Hasson Reddick’s rankings are entirely based on peoples interest in the prospect of Cox/Curry/Reddick puns.

    6. John Ross will be the pick. He is the 14th ranked guy. Half the fans think he is a reach and everyone will be worried.

    • bill

      Nice work. Color coded and all. Hopefully you got enough upvotes to retire now.

    • A Roy

      Deserves yet another upvote. I’d be happy with any (except one) of the first 13 and at least two outside that group. Bottom line is that if one or two QBs are drafted early, I should be GTG with their pick.

      • A_T_G

        …until the guy you want is sitting right there for the taking and they draft Brandon Graham instead. Not that I am bitter.

    • Chiptomylou

      Bravo sir…bra-freaking-vo

  • GermanEagle

    So you guys still want Mixon. Shame on you..

    • Rellihcs

      I only want him if the team did it’s homework and feels as though he’s unlikely to repeat. And I’d justify it with my twisted logic of the fact that he’s likely to risk major long term injury and quality of life issues as an NFL back. And by no means would I ever respect him as a person unless he demonstrated a very consistent turn-around character wise, and even that would take a lot of time.

      • GermanEagle

        Even after rumours about his high school incident?!

        • Rellihcs

          Yes – key words in your sentence – High school, and rumors.

          I think judging people’s professional projections based off of rumors of their lowest moments in high school is foolish. I bet if we counted rumored high school low-lights with high weight, most NFL stars would be disqualified.

          • GermanEagle

            Fair enough.

            For me a man who happens to beat women is scum. And yes he’d qualify for that term even since high school.

          • Rellihcs

            Fair enough. For me he may be scum – or he might be potentially a rehabbed, mature person who formerly behaved like scum. I don’t like permanent labels for human beings or all-or-nothing thinking. AND, to me this has little to do with football. I don’t like a lot of the people who play football. I think a lot of them are not good people. I don’t watch football for humanitarianism, role models of good behavior, etc…

            Now, if he truly is a POS and has proven to be consistently, and careful analysis shows that he’s not worth the risk, or has recently been a POS, that’s obviously worth consideration. And if in the NFL he commits another act, he should get the Ray Rice treatment.

            But to each their own.

          • A_T_G

            Okay, does this sound like a rehabbed guy?

            https://twitter.com/BradyVardeman/status/681893171836628993

            “Whadda mean, ‘What did I learn?'”

          • Rellihcs

            No, but I don’t know that a kid surrounded by reporters and tv cameras, with a lawyer, in this context reflects how he will be in August of this year.

          • ChoTime

            I agree. If you’re not used to that kind of spotlight, you just aren’t going to look good. Period.

          • Media Mike

            Flippant, petulant, insubordinate, POS

          • Media Mike

            Correct. You’ve kind of got what you’ve got at that point in terms of a person’s overall values, etc.

      • laeagle

        I can respect him as a person after a remarkable turnaround, wish him the best in his personal journey of rehabilitation, and still think that someone shouldn’t hand him a multi-million dollar contract to play a game for a living.

        His redemption would be wonderful, but it doesn’t have to involve the remarkable reward of an NFL career. He may be able to earn the benefit of the doubt, but then let him earn a living the way the rest of us do.

        • Rellihcs

          I respect that opinion. He’s probably going to get drafted somewhere and get that NFL contract regardless. If you don’t want that to be the Eagles, so be it.

    • Rellihcs
      • Insomniac

        1. either got paid
        2. or the dad is dumb

        • Rellihcs

          Knowledge or assumptions?

          And if it’s option 2, yeah he may have acted dumb in that instance, but I also give him credit for his statement about acting emotionally as a father in that instance. If that’s really the case, I blame the media for jumping on unsubstantiated and/or later refuted info and jumping to conclusions, so that people like German Eagle can jump to those same conclusions as a result.

          Look – I don’t know what happened, and I don’t claim to. And I don’t think that draft decisions should be made by fans based off of internet posts about rumors (let alone rumors posted on a website that self identifies as a rumor mill.

          If the Eagles determine his behavior is a prohibitive problem, I’ll trust them. And if they F up, I’ll support holding them accountable.

          • Insomniac

            Assumptions.

            It just seems odd to me that he just retracted his story now and instead of when he got the details straightened out. There must have been a lot of miscommunication or the dad has no impulse control what so ever. Then again it could just be the media not publishing the story until now because of views/timing.

          • Rellihcs

            That’s fair. Bottom line is I don’t know so I choose not to judge. I do judge him on the videoed incident and it should be part of the evaluation – without doubt.

      • GermanEagle

        Next time, don’t believe everything that Mike Florio posts. Lol

        • Rellihcs

          That’s for the both of us right?

          Rumors about rumors doesn’t make good intel…

          • A Roy

            Next thing you’ll say is that Jackson never had gang ties.

          • Rellihcs

            Ha. I don’t have much respect for Jackson primarily for a) showboating, b) admitting that he took of a lot of plays for no go reasons, and c) his rap video showing his priorities and what he cared about at the time. Now, I loved what he did do for the Eagles in many ways.

            Same with Shady who I have very little respect for as a person. Opposite as a football player…

          • A Roy

            just making a point about rumors about rumors…

    • Rellihcs

      Next time, don’t trust everything you read on the internet as fact, and then base opinions off of that fact so quickly perhaps?

  • Mitchell

    I still want Carlos Henderson….

    • Insomniac

      Same but that has to be in the third round. I’d settle with Taywan Taylor if we can’t get those two. Maybe Isaiah Ford, Stacey Coley, and Josh Reynolds later if all three of those guys are gone.

      • Mitchell

        I’m good with Isiah Ford and I actually like Reynolds quite a bit. He could probably learn a lot from Alshon, similar body types and play style.

        • Insomniac

          Don’t see the Alshon comparison. I think he’ll just be a lesser version of Tyrell Williams.

          • Mitchell

            Both bigger guys whos calling card isn’t speed but winning at PoC.

      • Mitchell

        Can probably add ArDarius Stewart to the list as well. Tons of good WR depth this year with limited stars.

    • Media Mike

      Zay Jones being the anti-Matthews in terms of aggressively hands catching the football would be an amazing addition.

  • Henly125

    Hey Tommy, are you and Jimmy Bama doing another predraft podcast? I’m looking forward to hearing what your thoughts are this year. Gets me pumped right before the draft every time haha! You guys really know how to do great work.

    • Mitchell

      Its been too long since Ive heard Tommy berate Bama.

      • Rellihcs

        That’s what I said the minute I finished listening to it the last time they made one…

  • izzylangfan

    Since nobody asked, I thought I would give you my analysis of the Eagles draft situation at 14.

    In my view there are12 players who are definitely worth a 14 based on general value, they are in no particular order:

    Miles Garret

    Solomon Thomas

    Jonathan Allen

    Marshon Lattimore

    Mike Williams

    Cory Davis

    Derek Barnett

    Christian McCaffrey

    Leonard Fournette

    Jamal Adams

    Malik Hooker

    O J Howard

    While the last four have the correct general worth I do not want the Eagles to draft them: Howard and Fournette because the Eagles would have to totally reorient their offense to get the most of their talent, Adams and Hooker because Safety would not be the a good use of resources for the Eagles given the more than solid starting two. However, this should not be an issue since I believe all four of these players will be gone when the Eagles pick.

    However, you can see that with only 12 names on the worth a 14 list the Eagles could be in a bit of trouble if two teams in front of the Eagles do not draft a quarterback or other players not on this list. You can also surmise that based on general expectations that the Eagles might end up with McCaffrey or Barnett who seem more likely to be available than Davis, Williams, or Lattimore. Thus, very possibly no CB no WR will be drafted by the Eagles at 14. My general priority would be DL but in this particular case I am hoping that Cory Davis falls – which seems moderately but not highly probable. Also possible is that the Eagles get completely skunked. But wait; there is another list of guys who might be worth a 14 – in general and particularly to the Eagles:

    They are in no partucular order:

    Tredavious White

    Charles Harris

    Gareon Conley

    John Ross

    Marlon Humphrey

    Hasson Reddick

    Kevin King

    Of these I am concerned about Ross because microfracture surgury seems to indicate that he lost all his knee cartilage already at this young age. I don’t like Marlon Humphrey because I can no longer bear to watch CBs who stick to their man but then can’t track the ball. If two or more of these guys can make the cut to be worth a 14 then the Eagles are guaranteed a worthwhile pick and do not need to trade down. This seems to be likely so the Eagles should get someone they really like who is fully worth a 14.

    Then based on preference and reasonable likelihood of being available at 14 my top hopes for the Eagles would be in order of preference:

    Cory Davis

    Mike Williams

    Charles Harris

    Gareon Connely

    Derek Barnett

    Kevin White

    Cristian McCaffrey

    Kevin King

    Tradavious White

    But after Davis my order of preference is subject to frequent fluctuation.

    Note: The assessment of whether a player is worth a 14 or might be worth a 14 is based on my assessment of the consenses, my assesment of whether the Eagles might like a particular player, and the degree to which I like the player based on scouting reports I have read – though sometimes from unreliable and inconsistent sources its the best I can do without dedicating my life to watching tape.

    • A_T_G

      Well explained and a fair assessment.

    • GermanEagle

      ” I don’t like Marlon Humphrey because I can no longer bear to watch CBs who stick to their man but then can’t track the ball”

      Preach brother, preach!

      • Dave

        Please let Dallas take him and have Nolan Carroll mentor him.

        • GermanEagle

          Haha. I was thinking of Carroll as well…

    • Ark87

      sound reasoning and well thought. I generally agree, just nit-picking for conversation sake.

      Draft picks don’t have an inherent value that the players available live up to or don’t, rather the pick’s value is determined by the value of the prospects available. What you are describing is the dreaded tier of players dropping off just before our pick. So our pick is going to look real similar in value to 13-20. Basically we end up with a player from a pool we associate with the back half of the first round, rather than the first. Which is a bummer. Again, it’s nitpicking, but we don’t run the risk of picking a player not worth the 14th overall pick (unless we reach) so much as the value of 14 rides on the teams ahead of us blowing their picks in the QB lottery and leaving us a great player.

      • A_T_G

        Luckily, Cleveland picks twice…

        • Ark87

          maybe they’ll pick 2 QB’s!

    • deg0ey

      My preference at 14 with reasonable likelihood of being available would be this:

      Gareon Conley

      Trade Down

      Malik McDowell

      Kevin King

      Charles Harris

  • A_T_G
    • A Roy

      11. “We here in Dallas feel we’re ready to challenge for the Super Bowl this year.”

      • laeagle

        That quote is worth another first round pick

    • Ark87

      “He’s/I’m in the best shape of his/my life” variant of 7 8 and 9 gets a groan out of me as reliably as “he’s the first one in the building and last one out”

  • Sean Stott

    Aaron Hernandez committed suicide… wow.

  • RobNE

    Giselle must have really given Tom some sh$t.

  • Gian GEAGLE

    I’m still,holding onto my irrational pipe dream hope that Roseman has a trade up his sleeve for a young corner, someone who like Jernigan a team might want to get value for before having to sign the player to a big extension. Someone like Bradley Roby who the Broncos just picked up the 5th year option on his rookie contact. needs to be a team that can lose a talented CB but still have enough in place at the position like Denver has with Talib (who isn’t going to be suspended) and the Harris kid. I could live with Roby for a 2nd rd pick, an offensive lineman and a conditional 5th or something
    ..
    I want to believe that an established young starting corner is on the way via trade so we only need to find 1 corner in the draft to compete with Mills and P Robinson on the other side. Wishful thinking? Probably. I just want to believe that Roseman has a better plan than going into a draft desperate to not only draft, but more importantly, Hit on two Corners who can play in the not so distant future, Maybe im overestimating Roseman, but I can’t shake the feeling of trade up his sleeve for a young corner.
    ..
    Butler, Darby, Slay, Roby… HOWIE needs to pull a gem out of his ass,via trade

    • Patrick

      Why would Darby or Slay be on the block?

      We know Butler is, and I can see Roby, with Talib being acquitted of his charges, but both of those are gonna cost #14 which I can’t se us doing.

      Think it’ll be more likely to find a much less prolific CB during the draft, probably a older guy on with 1/2 year left, but a big cap number.

      • Gian GEAGLE

        “Irrational pipedream”.. Wrote it in the first sentence bruh

    • Nick C

      We don’t have a second next year compadre.

      • Gian GEAGLE

        Talking bout this years 2nd. I assume if we get lucky enough to trade for a starting caliber corner a team will want a draft pick they can use in this draft and maybe a conditional 4th or 5th in next years draft depending on the caliber of corner we try to acquire.
        ..
        mentally Im just not ready to accept going into next season with Mills, P-Rob and two rookies competing to start on the outside, so im holding on to what is probably irrational hope. Likely this turns out to be nothing more than wishful thinking, but I don’t want to believe that Roseman and Joe Douglas are doing something as egregious as going into Next season with either Mills or Patrick Robinson as our best corner with NFL experience, I really like Brooks but I only view him as a slot corner

  • scratcherk

    So who plays MIKE if we draft Foster? Does Hicks move to SAM/WILL? Can Foster and Hicks be the 2 LBs in Nickel?

    • Gian GEAGLE

      Yes they are both 3’down LB capable Of playing in Nickel, so is Bradham. With as much nickel as teams play in TODAYS NFL, it wouldn’t suck to have 3 quality 3 down LB rotating in the two nickel spots
      ..
      Im not sure it matters in that my understanding is Foster can play WIL or MIKE, And while Hicks has already shown capable of playing in the middle, people like Seth Joyner swear that Hicks could be even better at WIL.
      ..
      If both can play either role, then I’d guess they just leave Hicks in the middle and let him build on the Experience he got calling the defense from the middle all last season. If they decide to go the Foster route at 14,’Kendricks would probably be traded during day two or three of the draft, and I imagine the Eagles would keep Bradham in place until his contract expires (think only has 1 more year on dontract right?), łet him walk, and eventually draft another LB to be our 3rd starter in base package (unless Joe Walker comes back strong from the injury and shows starting potential)
      ..
      I don’t feel too confident saying Foster will be the next luke Keachly caliber impact LB, but even if he just ends up being a Bobby Wagner or Lavonte David caliber NFL LB, I think that would provide more than enough value for the 14th pick
      ..
      Of course it’s always complicated to talk about what a team should do in the draft without knowing what will be available for them to choose from. Personally as Long as they hit on a kid who will go on to validate being drafted in the top 15, I’ll be thrilled no matter what position he plays

    • GermanEagle

      We won’t draft him. Next question.

      • anon

        true we love drafting dissapointments in round 1

    • Insomniac

      WILL. Foster isn’t smart enough to be a MIKE.

    • Crus57

      Foster at MIKE, Dr James Andrews at WILL?

    • xmbk

      If Foster is drafted, he’s certainly not sitting down in the Nickel. But Hicks would still call the ball. I worry about similarities between Kendricks and Foster.

  • Mitchell

    My take on Harris: I can see the appeal of Harris. He has a pretty sweet spin move. Bends the edge well has good ankle mobility. As other have said, he doesn’t look the most stout against the run but he isn’t the worst I have seen either. He really looks the part of a first rounder in most of the Draftbreakdown clips I watched. The only one concerning me is the LSU game where he seems to struggle against the LT but does a phenomenal job against TE, easily wicking them away. You want to see a DE destroy TE’s. Later in the game he does do the phenomenal spin move and gets to the qb. His terrible 3-cone is justified when you watch him stunt. So slow and clunky. I think a great fit is in the wide 9 were he can come out of the 4 point stance. It seems he has the most success with both hands in the dirt, where he cant fire off the snap and employ one of his many rush moves. I think he is worth 14 only if Douglass, Howard, and Gym Shorts are confident they can use his skills.

  • kajomo

    From the Josh Norris interview:

    “It’s a great question, and I know Barnett had a ton of production in the SEC, but to me it’s how they get production. It’s how that production was achieved on the field. And I like Derek Barnett, but I think Derek Barnett’s ceiling is a secondary pass rusher on an NFL team. I think he has very good bend for his size, and I think he has an outstanding motor. But is he going to win consistently in his first three steps? Those are pivotal for a pass rusher. I’m going to say no. I don’t think he can consitently beat left tackles like that in the NFL, especially ones who are athletic that can mirror and occupy him on the outside. But again, he has very great bend and a very good motor. So I think he’s going to to be a secondary rusher and rack up a ton of coverage sacks. But if we’re talking about individual, isolated, one-on-one situations, I think Charles Harris’ ability tops that of Derek Barnett’s.”

    • GermanEagle

      THat just got my vote.

    • A_T_G

      Convincing stuff.

    • Gian GEAGLE

      a secondary edge rusher would be poor value for the 14th pick, Im friggin tired of drafting good but not great edge rushers in round 1. If we are going to go the DE route at 14, they better be confident they are getting a talent that can be molded into one of the best DE’s in the NFL a few years down the road. I don’t know if Barnett or Harris fit that bill but the next DE we draft in round 1 Bettet be special.

      • kajomo

        It’s why I’m against Barnett. Not because he isn’t good. He just isn’t good enough

  • Ark87

    I think if you like to line guys up wide you can get away with having an undersized guy as a passing down role player for a year. Lining up wide let’s you turn your explosive speed into power, which is why you’ll ocassionally see a much smaller OLB put a huge tackle on roller skates.

    Long run he might be able to get stout against the run like Trent Cole did, but who knows. All top prospect have the tools to be great. The question is always can you as a team get that player to the next level and use those tools correctly.

    Harris isn’t my first choice but I wouldn’t be surprised if he was picked. As I said before, there is a real chance when we watch Mills line up 10 yards deep and still gets roasted on a go route we say “omfg we need a corner” but Schwartz says “where the hell is my pass rush, we need a pass rusher”

    • Media Mike

      I 100% agree you can get away with a smaller dude there IF his pass rush translates to what it takes to beat NFL OTs. I’m just not convinced that Harris is a guy who safely translates his pass rush to the NFL. I need to feel a lot safer at 14.

      • Ark87

        Yeah, pass rushers in general are a terrifying thing to pick anyway, so when you see a crystal clear version of a particular pass rusher being a bust it’s…not ideal.

        Not only is MS2 fresh on our minds, but a guy that produced with his athleticism but didn’t show that athleticism at the combine is enough to make me prefer a lot of other players.

  • xmbk

    It occurred to me that a trade down in 2 might be more feasible than the 1st. Be a great way to pick up Sidney Jones. I would love to pair Jones and Humphrey, give the D a physical presence for years.

    • Dave

      Daniel Jeremiah just said on NFL Network that he is hearing Adoree Jackson will be gone in the first 20 picks and some teams have him as the #2 CB in the draft. He has the one thing I want in a CB, ball awareness.

      From what I’m reading, Humphrey is a more talented version of Nolan Carroll with limited ball awareness.

      I’m not advocating taking Jackson at #14, but CBs without ball awareness is like a QB without accuracy, if they don’t have them coming out of college, they are not likely to develop them in the pros.

      • ColorSgt

        I can’t agree more about the ball awareness. So much more important than measurables. CBs need to have speed to run with receivers but not height/arm length/vert. jump etc. Knowing where the ball is, positioning, knowing where the receiver is, body control are all more important. I actually think most of the taller/longer CBs struggle with body control. Give me the guy that can locate the ball, run the wr off his route and make a play over 6’+ everytime.

      • xmbk

        Ball awareness is certainly an important cb skill. I think that at this time of year we tend to think of real players in very black and white terms, though. Jackson has good ball awareness, but mostly because he had almost no receiver awareness. The guy is a major work in progress, right now he gets burned a ton. I like him, but he’s a high risk reward pick. Humphreys ability to track the deep ball may turn out to be a significant pro weakness. But overall he has great cb attributes, and matches up well with what the Eagles do.

  • scratcherk

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BIeT8U_m3pA

    I was hoping to watch this and feel better about drafting this kid but can’t say that happened. There was a level of remorse that Vick had that I don’t see with mixon. Maybe that’s what a couple years in prison will do for you… But the team has way more info than me so I’ll go with whatever they say

    • Media Mike

      The arrogance on this dude is unreal.

      • Rellihcs

        Other arrogant RBs:

        – Zeke
        – Murray
        – Lynch
        – Peterson
        – Shady

        … just saying, it’s usually a correlation… Sure there are humble, heady RBs too – Westbrook was a great example. But these guys need to feel invincible and unstoppable – kind of goes hand in hand with arrogance.

    • Sean Stott

      “I could have done better”. “I was fine with it.” “I really didn’t prepare for anything.”

      Hate that attitude.

      • Mitchell

        He then says he trained for a month and a half before hand.

    • Mitchell

      I hear remorse. I think its just clouded behind anxiety and less than a genius I.Q.

      • scratcherk

        very possible. tough call on him.

      • kajomo

        People hear what they want to hear. If they think he is scum that’s what they hear. If they are willing to give him a shot they hear remorse. None of us know who Joe Mixon is. It’s pointless trying to label him. I’m trying to keep an open mind. Once he’s in the league and under the spotlight his true colors will shine through.

    • scratcherk

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIoupXWhdrY

      This is more what i expected. full disclosure: did not watch the whole thing.

    • RC5000

      “Are you the best back?” Wow what a great question!

  • Eagles4Life

    Let’s pick in the top half of Round 1 and take a guy who will only be a 3rd down pass rush specialist because he can’t set the edge for jack. Sounds like a good idea. Maybe 1/3 of the defensive snaps? Great use of a premium pick lol.

  • nopain23

    Must admit that the myriad of commentors on here have convinced me that barnett will be the next jarvis jones. Great college player who turns out to be a not so great pro.
    That being said Harris at 14 is underwhelming to say the least. Great first step but pathetic against the run. So on 3rd and forever all dallas has to do is audible to a run play and game over. Who knows maybe he can be coached up to set the edge.It’s sobering to know that MS2 at a similar height and weight posted better numbers in the underwear olympics. Their draft profiles are eeriely similar. Quick first step , no run support. Yet i’m supposed to be convinced that harris will somehow be better…hmmm..ok
    Draft fatigue is setting in…are the iggles on the clock yet???

    • Rellihcs

      Might want to keep an open mind. Being convinced that a prospect “will be the next _____” is a fools errand. It’s the draft. All projection and prognostication at this point.

      But I hear you – especially on the fatigue part.

      Personally, I’m now favoring Davis, Conley, or Harris.

      • scratcherk

        I’ve changed my mind about McCaffreyl. So I would add him to that list for me.

        • Rellihcs

          Fair enough and I’ll suck it up and justify it/be OK as long as the rest of the draft gets us a DE and some solid secondary help. But I still don’t like the value there of any RB round 1 with major holes in more premium positions…

  • meteorologist

    Conley or Ross please. Shutdown CB or electric deep threat

  • Anders

    2017 folks pic.twitter.com/tvNBs5wdiv— Justis Mosqueda (@JuMosq) 15. april 2017

    This is a top 50 by the guy who promotes atletisme for pass rush above everything else and a big believer in positional value (why he is so low on Jamaal Adams).

    I have to be honest, Im surprised he has Harris as his 12th best prospect despite his combine. Seems more and more like Im missing something with Harris.

    • eagleyankfan

      who is Justis Mosqueda? Have no idea who he is but if I’m to use that as a gauge — there are a lot of people guessing about this draft and who to pick at 14…

      • D3FB

        Pretty well respected member of draft twitter. If you’ve ever seen the Force Player Metric for DL, that’s his creation. Does DEs for NFL1000 on B/R, and I believe has also done stuff for Optimum Scouting. Currently hosts the Setting the Edge Podcast

        • eagleyankfan

          Thanks. Do the colors indicate a drop in talent?

          • D3FB

            That’s how he’s coding tiers

      • unhinged

        He was a thumbs down on Wentz before the Senior Bowl, but I never saw any retraction or revision afterward.

        http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2609709-dont-buy-the-hype-on-rising-small-school-qb-carson-wentz

    • kajomo

      I don’t know who that guy is, but I like it. Thanks for sharing this.

      I don’t agree with every ranking, but I here is what I like.

      1) Charles Harris top 15, Derek Barnett late 1st
      2) Garrett Bolles going high. I think he’s a top 20-15 pick. He has him going even earlier.
      3) marlon Humphrey in the 2nd.
      4) Hassan reddick at 15. That guy could be special
      5) Rueben Foster and OJ Howard not BPA when Eagles pick. Both are good players, but poor positional value. I do think Foster is a bit low in his projections.

      It’s a new day in draft scouting. Metrics, analytics, and trend analysis are becoming much larger parts of evaluation, and for good reason. The draft is always a gamble due to a large variety of variables. Improving your odds of success by avoiding outliers and poor positional value selections is becoming increasingly important. This isn’t about work out warriors, but maximizing value while minimizing risks.

    • James

      Wow Conley is highly rated for him. Seems like a good pick up for us at 14!

    • xmbk

      Meh, it’s easy to criticize. But some of this is crazy. Not worth much stock in my book.

      • kajomo

        I didn’t see much that would constitute as crazy. Some things I might disagree with, but nothing outlandish. Care to elaborate?

        • xmbk

          Sure:

          1) Charles Harris top 15, Derek Barnett late 1st
          2) Garrett Bolles going high. I think he’s a top 20-15 pick. He has him going even earlier.
          3) marlon Humphrey in the 2nd.
          4) Hassan reddick at 15. That guy could be special
          5)
          Rueben Foster and OJ Howard not BPA when Eagles pick. Both are good
          players, but poor positional value. I do think Foster is a bit low in
          his projections.

          Adams. The qb’s (I know he has a value metric. But sometimes the attempt to quantify real life amuses me). Sidney Jones. Foster (though I am open to the possibility that his interviews sucked). Humphrey. Bolles. Barnett.

          • kajomo

            Ha nice.

            Adams is the one that really sticks out and I agree that QBs should not be included in a metric system like this. I’ve had Bolles going early for months now. It’s a supply and demand thing. With his athleticism someone will bite.

          • xmbk

            Maybe, premium position. But age and strength are flags for him. Experience could go either way.

          • xmbk

            Sidney Jones at 20 right now it’s kinda crazy.

          • Anders

            1) I bet you that he is not the only one who has Harris higher than Barnett
            2) If you think he is worth pick 15, not much different from been worth pick 10 if you disagree on a few other players.
            3) I have seen a lot of mock drafts (I know I know) where Humphrey is not in the 1st round.
            4) What is wrong with Reddick at 15? Sounds about his normal range in reports right now
            5) OJ Howard is a TE, if you believe strongly in positional value in the draft, pick 21 is around optimal value even for a great TE prospect.
            Regarding Foster, some guys on here (D3FB and Tommy) are not as high on Foster as others and now he might go in the 3rd round.

          • xmbk

            It was a joke (j/k).

    • RC5000

      Was Harris combine that good? This doesn’t account for all the drills so maybe he was great in other drills.
      https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/charles-harris

  • Dave

    Since we are in the need for 2 starting corners, I thought it would be interesting to see Lito and Sheldon’s USA Today scouting reports from 2002.

    Lito Sheppard, CB – Florida

    Sheppard by the numbers

    Ht: 5’10”
    Wt: 194
    40-time: 4.47
    Vertical jump: 38″
    Broad jump: 10’0″
    Bench press: 300

    Positives: Exceptionally quick athlete who has outstanding range in deep coverage… Explosive out of his cuts, showing a strong drive on the ball…Excels in press coverage and is very effective coming up to jam the receivers at the line of scrimmage…Very smooth in the turn-&-run and positions himself well in run support…Reacts quickly to receivers’ cuts, adjusting fluidly to the ball in deep coverage..

    Negatives: Gets a little sloppy in run support, trying to strip the ball carrier from the pigskin rather than extending his arms to wrap and secure his man…Gets a good jump on the ball, but will allow a little too much cushion on underneath routes…Needs to use his hands with more authority to prevent blockers from attacking his feet.

    REMINDS ME OF…SAM MADISON, Miami Dolphins: Fitting, as Sheppard may be the best deep coverage corner in this class.

    CAREER NOTES: A true junior, Lito is regarded as one of the the nation’s premier cornerbacks and punt returners… He has started 22 of the 34 games he’s appeared in, twice earning All-American honors…He became only the fourth sophomore in school annals to earn first-team All-American honors (2000 by the Football Writers Association of America)…He finished his career with 87 tackles (64 solos), 13 pass deflections and eight interceptions…He also has never allowed a touchdown reception in his time as a Gator…Returned 21 kickoffs for 472 yards (22.5 avg) and 49 punts for 559 yards (11.4 avg) with a pair of touchdowns…Only Ricky Nattiel (589, 1983-86), Ivory Curry (631, 1980-82) and Jacquez Green (766, 1995-97) gained more yards via punt returns in school history.

    Sheldon Brown, CB – South Carolina

    Brown by the numbers

    Ht: 5’10”
    Wt: 196
    40-time: 4.47
    Vertical jump: 37″
    Broad jump: 10’0″
    Bench press: 325

    Positives: Very instinctive reading and reacting to the play…Shows incredible toughness in man coverage, shadowing the receiver very tight…Smoothly switches off in the zone, anticipating the pass while playing the ball high…Has a sharp burst coming out of his backpedal and the range to quickly recover…Displays superb flexibility and leaping ability, easily adjusting his body to the ball in flight..

    Negatives: Has a smaller than ideal frame, but compensates with quickness and a well-defined physique..Tends to stay high in his backpedal and shows a slight hesitation with his hip turn coming out of it, but shows the ability to plant quickly and the deep acceleration to recover.

    CAREER NOTES: A semifinalist for the 2001 Jim Thorpe Award, he collected 204 tackles (151 solos) with ten interceptions and 37 pass deflections during his collegiate career…Only player in school history to lead the team in interceptions in three seasons (1999-2001)…His 206 yards in interception returns rank behind school record-holder Patrick Hinton’s 240 yards (1987-90).

    • Mitchell

      That Shep bench press doe!!! Did they just go for max weight back then?

      • A_T_G

        You don’t think that was 325 reps?

    • P_P_K

      Blast from the past.

    • ChoTime

      Two instinctive players who actually already knew how to play the game, both with some physical dings. But look at the results.

  • A_T_G

    Apparently the Roseman/Douglas presser will stream live shortly: http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com

    • D3FB

      Preview:

      Joe Douglass: FUCK THIS NERD! I AM FOOTBALL MAN! LOOK AT ME THROW A LIP! MMMMMM TOBACCO! *rips off shirt*

      Howie: Well let’s just take a quick look at this deck I’ve made of Joe’s internet history

      Joe: GODDAMNIT! JASON LICHT SAID YOU WOULD DO THIS TO ME! HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO BE A FOOTBALL GUY LIKE HIM AND TRADE UP IN THE SECOND ROUND TO DRAFT A KICKER NOW LIKE A FOOTALL GUY!!!!!!

      • A_T_G

        Can Samuel L. Jackson and Steve Buscemi play Joe and Howie in the movie, respectively?

        • D3FB

          I was thinking Cumberbatch and John Cena personally

          • laeagle

            Cena would have to play it like he did in “Trainwreck”.

        • Gian GEAGLE

          DJ Qualles as Howie, Domenick Lonbardozzi as Joe Douglas

  • A_T_G

    In the press conference, the non-verbal communication between them and rye smiles when they get the questions they anticipated make Howie and Joe look like a very comfortable pairing.

    • laeagle

      Were the rye smiles they wryly shared a marbled rye, or a basic caraway?

  • A_T_G

    Joe: We are trying to find the things that you can’t measure – mind, body, soul.

    Howie: That should be on a teeshirt.

  • A_T_G

    Howie: “We had a situation a few years ago where we thought we had a trade in place the day before and we get there and the other teams says ‘No, we’re out’.”

    Anyone know what this is about? Dix instead of MSII, maybe?

    • scratcherk

      i thought he said last year?

      • A_T_G

        Did he? Could be.

        • scratcherk

          thought so but i closed the window. slow day at work for me…

      • FairOaks

        Can’t imagine it was last year. We did make a pre-draft trade last year, if memory serves.

        • scratcherk

          ok never mind, i re-watched, he said “a couple years ago”

    • D3FB

      I believe so. I’ve long felt that it was either Miami or Arizona who fucked us.

      Miami made a weird pick at 19 by taking Ju’wan James, who was more of a fringe top 40 guy (they may have spooked last minute because the Cardinals also needed a T). And the Cardinals got a 3 from the saints to move 7 spots. We weren’t going to be able to give a 3 for two spots.

  • Dave
    • Rellihcs

      Indeed it is. Thanks.

      It’s a shame all these professional scouts don’t know things for a fact about draft prospects like many fans on the internet do.

      • Sean Stott

        Mike Mayock pretends to know things.

        • Rellihcs

          Nope. You just like to hate on him. He hedges his statements and will be forthright about not being sure. He develops opinions based on research.

          • Sean Stott

            Remember when Johnny Manziel was the next Steve Young?

            I ‘member.

          • Rellihcs

            You mean this quote?

            “The kind of projection I want to make with Manziel is Steve Young.”

            “kind of projection”
            “want to make”

            – those words do NOT equal “is” or “will be”.

          • Ark87

            you’re delusional if you thing predicting how a prospect turns out is much more than guessing the odds when you place a bet. Is he kind to most prospects? Yeah, but better than crapping on a player before they ever play a practice snap in the NFL

        • laeagle
    • kajomo

      “You’re supposed to be looking for what the tape says they can become,” NFL.com’s Lance Zierlein told me. “The biggest mistake an evaluator can make is assuming that whoever the player is in college is who they’re going to be in the pros.”

  • scratcherk

    Joe Douglas on Conley: pic.twitter.com/Pg8x5UOFeb— Zach Berman (@ZBerm) April 20, 2017

    • RC5000

      Is this smoke or real life?

      • scratcherk

        shrug.

      • Rellihcs

        Yes

      • Ryan Rambo

        Both!!

  • Insomniac
    • A_T_G

      This also confirms my own personal belief that the only things that prevented me from being able to play corner at the highest level were speed, strength, athleticism, and ball skills.

      Well, that and the fact that my high school didn’t have a football team.

      • Insomniac

        Is that you Bradley Fletcher?

  • A Roy

    I guess Harris must’ve done really bad in the Wonderlich for Tommy to be calling him a MoreOn.

  • Nailed It!

    I’ve heard whispers that the schedule will be announced today. Anyone else here anything about when it will be?

    • Dave

      Its tonight…

      How to watch

      Date: Thursday, April 20

      Time: 8 p.m. ET

      TV channel: NFL Network

      Streaming: NFL Mobile from Verizon or the Watch NFL Network application on tablet, PC, Apple TV, Android TV, Amazon fire TV, PlayStation 4, Xbox One and Xbox 360.

      http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/nfl-2017-schedule-release-time-tv-streaming-042017

      • Nailed It!

        Oh well thanks

    • Sean Stott

      Yea, word out of Novacare is that it will be out tonight.

      • kajomo

        I know we bust on you for your NovaCare comments, but have you had a chance to watch practice there yet? The cafeteria is overlooking the practice fields. I’ve been there a few times and it’s a cool experience. I remember watching Sturgis his first week and Philly and just knew he was going to struggle early on.

      • GermanEagle

        lol…

  • Insomniac

    Going to do my best Mike Mayock tea leaf reading impression from today’s press conference.

    The seven or eight scenarios in the first round that Douglas mentioned could be

    Gareon Conley
    Christian McCaffery
    OJ Howard
    Marshon Lattimore
    Leonard Fournette
    Jonathan Allen
    Jamal Adams
    Malik Hooker

    Douglas also said there’s a deep class of CBs, TEs, and OL. Going to throw out names just for the hell of it.

    CB

    Gareon Conley – 1st
    Marshon Lattimore – 1st
    Sidney Jones – 1st (pre-injury)
    Chidobe Awuzie – 1st
    Fabian Moreau – 1st-2nd
    Kevin King – 1st-2nd
    Tre’Davious White – 1st-2nd
    Adoree Jackon – 2nd
    Marlon Humphrey – 2nd
    Ahkello Witherspoon – 2nd
    Cordrea Tankersly – 2nd
    Quincy Wilson – 3rd
    Shaquill Griffin – 3rd
    Cameron Sutton – 3rd
    Damontae Kazee – 4th
    Jalen Myrick – 4th

    RB

    Leonard Fournette – 1st
    Joe Mixon – 1st
    Christian McCaffery – 1st
    Dalvin Cook – 2nd
    Alvin Kamara – 2nd
    James Connor – 3rd
    Kareem Hunt – 3rd
    Jeremy McNichols – 3rd
    Wayne Gallman – 4th
    Marlon Mack – 4th

    TE

    OJ Howard – 1st
    David Njoku – 1st-2nd
    Evan Engram – 1st-2nd
    Gerald Everret – 3rd
    Bucky Hodges – 3rd
    Jake Butt – 3rd
    Adam Shaheen – 3rd
    Jeremy Sprinkle – 4th

    OG

    Forrest Lamp – 1st
    Dan Feeney – 2nd
    Dorian Johnson – 2nd
    Dion Dawkins – 3rd
    Isaac Asiata – 3rd
    Nico Siragusa – 3rd

    OT

    Garrett Bolles – 1st-2nd
    Ryan Ramzcyk – 1st-2nd
    Cam Robinson – 1st-2nd
    Taylor Moton – 2nd
    Antonio Garcia – 2nd
    Roderick Johnson – 3rd
    David Sharpe – 3rd

    • Gian GEAGLE

      Joe Douglas gavee a press Confrence where he mentioned prospects by name?

      • Insomniac

        Yes we all know you can’t read now run along.

        • Gian GEAGLE

          Where did you write “Joe” Douglas? but thanks for the Info even if being a rude dick sucker is uncalled for

          • Insomniac

            Take your own advice buddy.

    • xmbk

      RB: Perine, Foreman, Brian Hill.

      • Insomniac

        Added

    • CrackSammich

      How did you forget about Corn Elder?

    • D3FB

      Sharpe isn’t draftable. He’s this years Willie Beavers

      • Insomniac

        Probably the most damning thing to say about an OL.

  • Gian GEAGLE

    7 corners amongst the top 40 and not much seperation bêtween them according to Kiper/McShay, but I assume it’s unlikely that the top 7 corners all fit schwartz scheme perfectly, So can we narrow down the list of top corners by some not being suited to do what schwartz asks of his corners?
    Which of the first round corner prospects ARENT great fits for schwartz defense?

  • Gian GEAGLE

    Apparently we play in Washington week 1

    • iceberg584

      – Home vs. Oakland on MNF on Christmas.
      – Home vs. Chicago on Nov. 26.

      • Gian GEAGLE

        At home vs Chicago week 12 NOV 26 aka Alshons Revenge!

  • Gian GEAGLE

    Week 1 @ washington
    Week 2 Giants
    Week 12 Bears
    Week 13 @ Seahawks
    Week 14 @ Rams
    Week 15 @ Giants
    Week 17 Dallas

    Playing @ seattle two years in a row? Wouldn’t this be 3 years in a row playing the seahawks?
    ..
    Wentz @ Goffs house should be fun

    • Ark87

      No.

      Wentz @ Robert Quinn and Aaron Donald’s house.

      That will not be fun at all. Especially traveling to the west coast the second week in a row to face a murderous defense. I’ll be praying we don’t have to be looking at Nick Foles at the end of the season for all the wrong reasons.

      • laeagle

        It’s going to be fun to watch a game live for a change.

  • Dave
    • GermanEagle

      Lol. Good bye money.

      • Dave

        more like…Hello Cowboys

        • Insomniac

          Redskins*

          Jerry doesn’t run the draft anymore.

        • ChoTime

          Bengals like players like that too.

    • Insomniac

      Lets count the red flags

      1. Saban didn’t have too much praise for him.
      2. Injury history (concusccion, etc)
      3. Violent play style
      4. On the smaller side as a LB
      5. Seems like an idiot

      This isn’t good for us considering that we probably want someone ahead of us to take him so someone else could fall to us.

      • GermanEagle

        Mate, he should be off the Eagles’ draft board. Full. Stop.

        • Insomniac

          Just saying that it’ll probably be less likely to grab someone that we like more since other teams might be moving players up their board now due to Foster being a dumb dumb.

        • CrackSammich

          Sounds like a perfect spot for a 7th rounder.

      • Dave

        6. Physically threatened combine medical worker
        7. Reportedly hit a girl in high school

      • Rellihcs

        Over pursues, a lot of his big hits are due to having to lunge to still make the play. Shoulder issues…

      • xmbk

        At this point, it’s a question of what round does he go in, not whether he goes before 14.

        • Insomniac

          He’ll likely still be a first round pick, just not top 15.

          • xmbk

            Maybe. He probably is the poster child for risk/reward in this draft.

          • Insomniac

            Bradley Roby was supposed to be a high pick too. Roby did some dumb things before the draft albeit his mistakes are not on the same scale as Foster. He still got drafted in the first round but different positions and circumstances.

          • Tdoteaglefan

            Definitely. I honestly still wouldn’t be surprised to see the Bengals take him at 9.

            It’s funny, during the combine I was showing my barber his highlights telling and then told him he was sent home for arguing with a hospital worker, immediately My barber was like “he’s on juice”. We both laughed and said it was a possibility, now in light of this new development ..seems like something to seriously consider. And if the diluted sample didn’t have traces of PED’s and simply had traces of narcotics then that’s still a red flag.

            Its a shame, He’s easily one of my favorite prospects in this draft. Hopefully if the birds were considering him..they may move Haason Reddick ahead of him instead..I think he may be the same calibre of player at the next level with better coverage skills

          • GermanEagle

            What’s wrong with you?!

          • Insomniac

            I always had Haason ahead of Foster. Haason is going to be a great LB if he gets the right coaching. My biggest gripe with drafting a LB at 14 is that we would have to put him at WILL or SAM. Both positions are sneaky needs but I feel like we could get one later in the draft.

      • BobSmith77

        Correction – Is an idiot. No way I can see him coordinating and setting the defense.

  • Rellihcs

    My giants fan cousin (like a brother) just texted me one of the leaked match-up dates. My response:

    “I know, I saw an ad for Eli autographed game used helmet for that game online a few minutes ago”.

  • A_T_G
  • Steve Smegal

    247 did a 7 round mock. Easily the darkest timeline I’ve seen

    Mike Williams
    Cordrea Tankersley
    Corn Elder
    James Conner
    Noah Brown
    Tarik Cohen
    Garrett Sickels

    • xmbk

      I’d take that, though I think the team can and will do better in the first.

    • Media Mike

      Ew; that’s bad.

      But thank you for sharing it.

      • Ryan Rambo

        That’s what she said!

    • D3FB

      First four are pretty nice picks

      • meteorologist

        Corn in the 3rd? Conner in the 4th? Push those back a round and I could be fine with it.

        I’d say 1st 2 picks are decent, though hate the “low end athletes as our premium picks” thing
        https://3sigmaathlete.com/rankings/cb/

        • D3FB

          If you switch the order between Conner and Corn it’s pretty in line with expectation

  • Dave

    Just as a reminder since Wonderlic scores are currently being leaked, Carson Wentz had the 14th highest score ever in the NFL and highest in the 2016 draft of 41/50.

    • GermanEagle

      What does that mean??

      • Dave

        He correctly answered 40 out of 50 questions in 12 minutes (I mistakenly typed 41).

        https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonderlic_test

      • A_T_G

        Since it is a slow news day and we are sharing, what does that notation mean with all the quotes and equal signs?

      • GermanEagle

        iPhone sucks.

    • ChoTime

      If that mattered so much, we’d have a lot more Harvard players dominating the NFL.*

      *daily dose of negativity

  • GermanEagle

    With then Eagles schedule coming out there’s no doubt that Philly will go 14-2.

  • A_T_G
  • A_T_G
    • A_T_G

      At Seattle, at LA, at NY is a lot of traveling, and we didn’t get the LA games back to back, but the bye week 10 and before Dallas is nice.

      • xmbk

        NY? They could stay West for Seattle/LA, similar deal.

        • A_T_G

          Maybe. Seattle and LA aren’t exactly Philly/Camden though. NY is just a third straight road game after a lot of travel and an important game.

          • Sb2bowl

            Bus ride instead of a plane

          • laeagle

            Not unless you want to be in a bus for 2 days.

          • Sb2bowl

            From philly to New York; sorry, should have explained that in my original post. Even though NY is an away game, it gives the guys a chance to return to a more normal schedule after the west coast games. They’ll be able to stay at home throughout the week before hopping on a bus and traveling to play the giants

          • laeagle

            Big difference between a 2 1/2 hour flight and a 5-6 hour flight. Seattle and LA bunched together isn’t that bad.

  • Dragon_Eagle

    Regardless of order – both Western divisions (which have good teams) plus 3 West Coast away games, makes this a tough schedule.

    And very, very, very important…

    Dallas sucks.

    Haven’t seen that mantra enough lately.

    • daveH

      D all ass sucks

    • BobSmith77

      Yeah I was kind of bummed to see 3 West Coast games too along with playing in Seattle again.

  • 时间飞快,转眼年中就要到来,祝你天天愉快!

  • BobSmith77

    I’d love to see the NFC East on the line on New Year’s Eve vs Boys.

  • Pingback: 2017 Eagles Draft Guide - 1st Round()